Mark Duggan
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No need for laws or courts or evidence or any of that other silly stuff. Extra judicial killing is the way to go, huh?
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Majerus wrote:
I'm all for universal health care, a more generous Social Security, a strong minimum wage - in short a strong social safety net.
The only problem with socialism is that sooner or later, you run out of other people's money. TANSTAAFL.
“Reality is merely an illusion, albeit a very persistent one." ~ Albert Einstein
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Majerus wrote:
No free lunch is involved, so you response is meaningless.
It isn't? I guess I didn't get the memo about currency growing on trees. :sigh:
“Reality is merely an illusion, albeit a very persistent one." ~ Albert Einstein
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One doesn't follow the other. If all you have is cute little one-liners , were done. You can go back to sorting your sock drawer.
I'll leave you with this thought: If you don't want me to laugh at you, I suggest you stop responding to posts I am directing to others. You wanted my attention, you got it, and now you are upset because I find your thoughts amusing. :rolleyes:
“Reality is merely an illusion, albeit a very persistent one." ~ Albert Einstein
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I'll leave you with this thought: If you don't want me to laugh at you, I suggest you stop responding to posts I am directing to others. You wanted my attention, you got it, and now you are upset because I find your thoughts amusing. :rolleyes:
“Reality is merely an illusion, albeit a very persistent one." ~ Albert Einstein
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David Kentley wrote:
I was debating debate tactics on talk.origins back when your grandchildren were still in diapers!
Oh wow, I am now so impressed. Talk.origins??? Gee, you should warn a guy.
“Reality is merely an illusion, albeit a very persistent one." ~ Albert Einstein
Oakman wrote:
Talk.origins??? Gee, you should warn a guy.
:laugh: Back in the day there was nowhere better to learn how to argue unwinnable arguments on the internet. I wouldn't be surprised if that newsgroup inspired Godwin's law. You nazi.
And sometimes when you're on, you're really f***ing on And your friends they sing along and they love you But the lows are so extreme that the good seems f***ing cheap And it teases you for weeks in its absence Rilo Kiley - "A Better Son/Daughter"
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Oakman wrote:
every democracy, sooner or later, becomes a state where those without wealth or the willingness to work for it discover they can vote to have it given to them. ...It is my estimation that neither in Britain or in America is there, any longer, a hope of turning back the tide
I sure don't see it, but I sure do hope you are right. What I have seen is the rich waging a war against the rest of us and they are winning. Increased income inequality, the hollowing out of the middle class, a unrelenting attack against workers and a 2-tiered system of justice. I'm all for universal health care, a more generous Social Security, a strong minimum wage - in short a strong social safety net.
Majerus wrote:
Increased income inequality, the hollowing out of the middle class, a unrelenting attack against workers and a 2-tiered system of justice.
I tend to believe in a meritocracy, the odd reason that there is a a hollowing of the middle class is two things are happening. The stronger/luckier/smarter/harder working are rising in society and those that are either lazier/weaker/unluckier/dumber are sinking. This is exacerbated by the degree lock in the job market and the lack of work ethic prevalent in many communities. In America anyway with the way things are now it is hard to just stay in one spot. That has been the beauty of America you have the chance to improve yourself at the risk of loosing everything. This just happened to me the other day, (I am 21 by the way) I was at a bonfire with my friends and my friends younger brother's friends. We were talking and out of those 16-18 year olds only 2 of them had ever had a job. The older (group my friends we are 20 - 22) had been working since we were 13 (the legal age around here) in after school jobs of various sorts. They were asking me why I have a good job at such a young age and wanted to know know how to score one like I got. I told them that all it work was work and a bit of networking. They did not even know how to respond this was a great revelation to them that seemed more like common sense to us not even 5 years ago. Completely true story. The problem around here is we have so many damned labor unions that allow for slovenly behavior that would lead anyone in a normal job to be fired. Another true story, my girlfriends dad was head of service at a GM dealership, on more than one occasion he found lost tools inside the cars. Not just a socket or some small bit like socket racks or impact drivers. On a few occasions he found bottles with a note saying "How long did it take you idiots to find this?" inside brand new high end cars. At one point 100 years ago they did good things but something happened somewhere along the way and they lost sight of their goals.
Majerus wrote:
I'm all for universal health care, a more generous Social Security, a strong minimum wage - in short a strong social safety net.
In the US our founders wanted the right to "Life, Liberty, and the pursuit of happiness" I still don't see how our nation came to having social safety nets. We used
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Majerus wrote:
Increased income inequality, the hollowing out of the middle class, a unrelenting attack against workers and a 2-tiered system of justice.
I tend to believe in a meritocracy, the odd reason that there is a a hollowing of the middle class is two things are happening. The stronger/luckier/smarter/harder working are rising in society and those that are either lazier/weaker/unluckier/dumber are sinking. This is exacerbated by the degree lock in the job market and the lack of work ethic prevalent in many communities. In America anyway with the way things are now it is hard to just stay in one spot. That has been the beauty of America you have the chance to improve yourself at the risk of loosing everything. This just happened to me the other day, (I am 21 by the way) I was at a bonfire with my friends and my friends younger brother's friends. We were talking and out of those 16-18 year olds only 2 of them had ever had a job. The older (group my friends we are 20 - 22) had been working since we were 13 (the legal age around here) in after school jobs of various sorts. They were asking me why I have a good job at such a young age and wanted to know know how to score one like I got. I told them that all it work was work and a bit of networking. They did not even know how to respond this was a great revelation to them that seemed more like common sense to us not even 5 years ago. Completely true story. The problem around here is we have so many damned labor unions that allow for slovenly behavior that would lead anyone in a normal job to be fired. Another true story, my girlfriends dad was head of service at a GM dealership, on more than one occasion he found lost tools inside the cars. Not just a socket or some small bit like socket racks or impact drivers. On a few occasions he found bottles with a note saying "How long did it take you idiots to find this?" inside brand new high end cars. At one point 100 years ago they did good things but something happened somewhere along the way and they lost sight of their goals.
Majerus wrote:
I'm all for universal health care, a more generous Social Security, a strong minimum wage - in short a strong social safety net.
In the US our founders wanted the right to "Life, Liberty, and the pursuit of happiness" I still don't see how our nation came to having social safety nets. We used
The very first item in my quote that you selected is 'income inequality'. In the past 30 years middle class incomes have been stagnant in real terms but the incomes of the wealthy have soared. The income of the top 1% have increased over 120% and the top 20% have increased about 30%. The bottom 80% have actually seen declines. That's the hollowing out of the middle class.
Kyle Sponable wrote:
That has been the beauty of America you have the chance to improve yourself at the risk of loosing everything.
Then I guess you'll be suprised to learn that there is actually more social mobility is those european "socialist" countries. You obviously have a very bad impression of unions and seem to think that you and your father and your grandfather got everything you have without any help from anyone. Well, you are very, very wrong. Why do you think you have a 40 hour work week, workmans comp, unemployment insurance, work place safety rules, work provided health insurance, paid sick time, vacation time and holidays? Unions. Do you really wish that you and your father and grandfather had to work 12-16 hours a day, 6 days a week just to get by? Are you familiar with the Triangle Shirtwaist factory fire_[^]? Do you really want to go back to the days of child labor?
Kyle Sponable wrote:
My parents, and grandparents were good people and never had any of that stuff
I don't know your story, but in all likelihood, your grandparents, at least, did receive SS and medicare.
Kyle Sponable wrote:
Why should I be forced to spend my money on a system I want no part of?
You're not being forced. Your free to vote with your feet or the ballot. You can leave the country or you can vote for people who will eliminate those programs. Why do you think SS was created in the first place? Are you familiar with the rates of poverty for the elderly prior to SS?
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The very first item in my quote that you selected is 'income inequality'. In the past 30 years middle class incomes have been stagnant in real terms but the incomes of the wealthy have soared. The income of the top 1% have increased over 120% and the top 20% have increased about 30%. The bottom 80% have actually seen declines. That's the hollowing out of the middle class.
Kyle Sponable wrote:
That has been the beauty of America you have the chance to improve yourself at the risk of loosing everything.
Then I guess you'll be suprised to learn that there is actually more social mobility is those european "socialist" countries. You obviously have a very bad impression of unions and seem to think that you and your father and your grandfather got everything you have without any help from anyone. Well, you are very, very wrong. Why do you think you have a 40 hour work week, workmans comp, unemployment insurance, work place safety rules, work provided health insurance, paid sick time, vacation time and holidays? Unions. Do you really wish that you and your father and grandfather had to work 12-16 hours a day, 6 days a week just to get by? Are you familiar with the Triangle Shirtwaist factory fire_[^]? Do you really want to go back to the days of child labor?
Kyle Sponable wrote:
My parents, and grandparents were good people and never had any of that stuff
I don't know your story, but in all likelihood, your grandparents, at least, did receive SS and medicare.
Kyle Sponable wrote:
Why should I be forced to spend my money on a system I want no part of?
You're not being forced. Your free to vote with your feet or the ballot. You can leave the country or you can vote for people who will eliminate those programs. Why do you think SS was created in the first place? Are you familiar with the rates of poverty for the elderly prior to SS?
Majerus wrote:
Why do you think SS was created in the first place? Are you familiar with the rates of poverty for the elderly prior to SS?
To help single mothers and orphans mainly, the rest came afterwards. None of this you retire you get Social Security crap.
Majerus wrote:
You obviously have a very bad impression of unions and seem to think that you and your father and your grandfather got everything you have without any help from anyone. Well, you are very, very wrong. Why do you think you have a 40 hour work week, workmans comp, unemployment insurance, work place safety rules, work provided health insurance, paid sick time, vacation time and holidays? Unions.
Do you really wish that you and your father and grandfather had to work 12-16 hours a day, 6 days a week just to get by? Are you familiar with the Triangle Shirtwaist factory fire_[^]?
Do you really want to go back to the days of child labor?Actually I said they did good things 100 years ago but now they are different and as bad as the people they at one time fought. As to my family they were inventors and entrepreneurs they had no union support and did just fine. I am proud to follow in those footsteps. As to the incomes, as I said, people in degree'd fields IT being one of them are increasing in pay, however those in non degree fields are staying the same. With the rise of inflation the value of their work decreases
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Majerus wrote:
Why do you think SS was created in the first place? Are you familiar with the rates of poverty for the elderly prior to SS?
To help single mothers and orphans mainly, the rest came afterwards. None of this you retire you get Social Security crap.
Majerus wrote:
You obviously have a very bad impression of unions and seem to think that you and your father and your grandfather got everything you have without any help from anyone. Well, you are very, very wrong. Why do you think you have a 40 hour work week, workmans comp, unemployment insurance, work place safety rules, work provided health insurance, paid sick time, vacation time and holidays? Unions.
Do you really wish that you and your father and grandfather had to work 12-16 hours a day, 6 days a week just to get by? Are you familiar with the Triangle Shirtwaist factory fire_[^]?
Do you really want to go back to the days of child labor?Actually I said they did good things 100 years ago but now they are different and as bad as the people they at one time fought. As to my family they were inventors and entrepreneurs they had no union support and did just fine. I am proud to follow in those footsteps. As to the incomes, as I said, people in degree'd fields IT being one of them are increasing in pay, however those in non degree fields are staying the same. With the rise of inflation the value of their work decreases
Kyle Sponable wrote:
To help single mothers and orphans mainly, the rest came afterwards.
Completely wrong. It was about old-age benefits from the very beginning. If you actually believe that you can eliminate unions and keep the gains they have made - that benefit us all - you are very naive and very uniformed when it comes to today's politics.
Kyle Sponable wrote:
As to the incomes, as I said, people in degree'd fields IT being one of them are increasing in pay, however those in non degree fields are staying the same. With the rise of inflation the value of their work decreases
You are clearly making stuff up as you write. Oh, and one last thing concerning how you have never gotten anything from others - your entire education has been subsidized by the state.