Texas Theocracy Part Deux
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States run by conservative Republicans are doing exceedingly well considering the overall economic condition of the entire country. Conversely, liberal Democrats have consistently run their states into the ground. Let's see..a governor who prays on TV but lets you flourish and do so as free as a bird, or a government that leads its people to squalor (more of the same). Take your pick
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States run by conservative Republicans are doing exceedingly well considering the overall economic condition of the entire country. Conversely, liberal Democrats have consistently run their states into the ground. Let's see..a governor who prays on TV but lets you flourish and do so as free as a bird, or a government that leads its people to squalor (more of the same). Take your pick
False. http://www.taxfoundation.org/research/show/22685.html[^] or the original source of it only for 2009 at http://www.census.gov/prod/2010pubs/fas-09.pdf[^] Right or left wing blogs aren't a source of fact unless they use facts to point to reality and not just opinion. These things don't follow one political part or another. http://www.gallup.com/poll/114016/state-states-political-party-affiliation.aspx[^]See the map below or any of the maps at their sources here[^]
Well, who doesn't release stuff like that ? Microsoft software is just as bad. Christian Graus That's called seagull management (or sometimes pigeon management)... Fly in, flap your arms and squawk a lot, crap all over everything and fly out again... by _Damian S_
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False. http://www.taxfoundation.org/research/show/22685.html[^] or the original source of it only for 2009 at http://www.census.gov/prod/2010pubs/fas-09.pdf[^] Right or left wing blogs aren't a source of fact unless they use facts to point to reality and not just opinion. These things don't follow one political part or another. http://www.gallup.com/poll/114016/state-states-political-party-affiliation.aspx[^]See the map below or any of the maps at their sources here[^]
Well, who doesn't release stuff like that ? Microsoft software is just as bad. Christian Graus That's called seagull management (or sometimes pigeon management)... Fly in, flap your arms and squawk a lot, crap all over everything and fly out again... by _Damian S_
Ooh facts! You know they just get in the way of ideology. ;P
Panic, Chaos, Destruction. My work here is done. Drink. Get drunk. Fall over - P O'H OK, I will win to day or my name isn't Ethel Crudacre! - DD Ethel Crudacre I cannot live by bread alone. Bacon and ketchup are needed as well. - Trollslayer Have a bit more patience with newbies. Of course some of them act dumb - they're often *students*, for heaven's sake - Terry Pratchett
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False. http://www.taxfoundation.org/research/show/22685.html[^] or the original source of it only for 2009 at http://www.census.gov/prod/2010pubs/fas-09.pdf[^] Right or left wing blogs aren't a source of fact unless they use facts to point to reality and not just opinion. These things don't follow one political part or another. http://www.gallup.com/poll/114016/state-states-political-party-affiliation.aspx[^]See the map below or any of the maps at their sources here[^]
Well, who doesn't release stuff like that ? Microsoft software is just as bad. Christian Graus That's called seagull management (or sometimes pigeon management)... Fly in, flap your arms and squawk a lot, crap all over everything and fly out again... by _Damian S_
There is no arguing that the big liberal states (NY, California, Michigan, NJ(has reason for hope), Rhode Island, Illinois, Wisconsin, Connecticut) have bankrupted themselves so their political leaders could derived power from the government spending. Others states Arizona and Nevada in the most trouble found by a Pew study have huge illegal-immigration issues. And, your links are irrelevant, as they simply provide an indication of the fact that red states have poorer citizens--a historical condition. So what? Mathematically, the net loss/gain to the federal government is insignifant when compared to certain state governments' deliberate policy steps taken to solidify a voter base which ends up driving away or hampering private businesses. Also, your gallup poll on political affiliations means nothing to this conversation. The types of policies put in place the state level are cold hard fact. They need no poll to interpret.
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There is no arguing that the big liberal states (NY, California, Michigan, NJ(has reason for hope), Rhode Island, Illinois, Wisconsin, Connecticut) have bankrupted themselves so their political leaders could derived power from the government spending. Others states Arizona and Nevada in the most trouble found by a Pew study have huge illegal-immigration issues. And, your links are irrelevant, as they simply provide an indication of the fact that red states have poorer citizens--a historical condition. So what? Mathematically, the net loss/gain to the federal government is insignifant when compared to certain state governments' deliberate policy steps taken to solidify a voter base which ends up driving away or hampering private businesses. Also, your gallup poll on political affiliations means nothing to this conversation. The types of policies put in place the state level are cold hard fact. They need no poll to interpret.
puromtec1 wrote:
The types of policies put in place the state level are cold hard fact.
Cold hard facts are ones that can actually be demonstrated in some measurable way. So perhaps you could provide information that states the actual stats to support your view and describe in detail the methodology used to arrive at those numbers.
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States run by conservative Republicans are doing exceedingly well considering the overall economic condition of the entire country. Conversely, liberal Democrats have consistently run their states into the ground. Let's see..a governor who prays on TV but lets you flourish and do so as free as a bird, or a government that leads its people to squalor (more of the same). Take your pick
I haven't seen you provide anything more than your opinion on this. Explain why, as of June 2011, Texas has a higher unemployment rate than New York. Texas also has one of the highest rates of it citizens without health insurance in the entire country. Nevada, Florida, Mississippi, South Carolina, Georgia, Alabama, Tennessee, Kentucky and Arkansas all have higher unemployement rates than New York. Another interesting factiod - 9 of the 10 biggest freeloading states - those that get more money from the Federal government than they pay in taxes - are red states.
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IdUnknown wrote:
It would not surprise me if he gets elected.
"As bad as this President may be, his opposition are largely created from the same mold, the same lobbyist infested cesspool, and are unprincipled servants to power - beholden to the creeps, crooks, and sociopaths who pay them and reward them with power, to the detriment of the American republic." - Jesse's Café Américain[^] So, better the creep, crook, and sociopath you know than ... . :)
IdUnknown wrote:
Yes, the American public is that stupid.
As are the electorates of all democracies - perhaps not Iceland.
Truth, Justice ... or the American way? - Trad.
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puromtec1 wrote:
The types of policies put in place the state level are cold hard fact.
Cold hard facts are ones that can actually be demonstrated in some measurable way. So perhaps you could provide information that states the actual stats to support your view and describe in detail the methodology used to arrive at those numbers.
Response intended for Majerus below, as well. Firstly, NY's raw unemployment rate provides a very incomplete picture. The state government has a Frakenstein of a workforce: described here at NY Times[^]. The state work force has continually increased and they don't even know how big it really is, and so the employment rate is skewed by this un-natural growth. Additionally, the make up of the workforce is not as pretty as you might assume, see NY Daily News.[^]. The poor condition of NY state in economic terms is clearly apparent when you look closer at the population's ebb and flow: why they leave.[^] Another clear indicator of health is the state's revenue coupled with the current state policies. If a state can balance their budget without tax increases or more borrowing, there is less strain on the private sector. This known by Bob McDonnell (future POTUS) in his rebuttal[^] to this[^] article. Also, our next POTUS has demonstrated this in his state described here[
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I haven't seen you provide anything more than your opinion on this. Explain why, as of June 2011, Texas has a higher unemployment rate than New York. Texas also has one of the highest rates of it citizens without health insurance in the entire country. Nevada, Florida, Mississippi, South Carolina, Georgia, Alabama, Tennessee, Kentucky and Arkansas all have higher unemployement rates than New York. Another interesting factiod - 9 of the 10 biggest freeloading states - those that get more money from the Federal government than they pay in taxes - are red states.
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Response intended for Majerus below, as well. Firstly, NY's raw unemployment rate provides a very incomplete picture. The state government has a Frakenstein of a workforce: described here at NY Times[^]. The state work force has continually increased and they don't even know how big it really is, and so the employment rate is skewed by this un-natural growth. Additionally, the make up of the workforce is not as pretty as you might assume, see NY Daily News.[^]. The poor condition of NY state in economic terms is clearly apparent when you look closer at the population's ebb and flow: why they leave.[^] Another clear indicator of health is the state's revenue coupled with the current state policies. If a state can balance their budget without tax increases or more borrowing, there is less strain on the private sector. This known by Bob McDonnell (future POTUS) in his rebuttal[^] to this[^] article. Also, our next POTUS has demonstrated this in his state described here[
puromtec1 wrote:
States run by conservative Republicans are doing exceedingly well considering the overall economic condition of the entire country. Conversely, liberal Democrats have consistently run their states into the ground.
I'm still waiting for you to make your case. Now to your response - You've suggested that New York's unemployment rate is lower than all these red states I've mentioned because of emmigration. It's an interesting suggestion, but you haven't provided numbers that would support a large enough outflow to significantly impact the unemployment rate. And you haven't addressed at all why these red states are in the bottom half of the country as far as their unemployment rates are concerned. If Republican leadership were so effective one would expect to see a significant concentration of red states in the top half with the lowest unemployment rates. (The NYT article you linked to is actually the New York Post - a Murdoch rag, which leaves it lacking in the credibility. And you realize you linked to the same article twice, right?) An opinion piece written by a the govenor of Virginia is just that - the opinion of a politician. It doesn't advance your case. The Conor Dougherty article makes the obvious point that given an unchanged tax rate and improving economy will bring in more revenues to the state. But it doesn't make the point that these increases on concentrated in red states. This doesn't advance your case. A speech by Perry is still just a speech by a politician - it doesn't advance your case. the stimulus cost $278,000 per job is just a zombie lie that I won't bother to refute here, nor will I spend any time refuting the case that the stimulus did not work, because the stimulus is not relevant to your case.
puromtec1 wrote:
This again is merely a result of more poor people living in those states. Governors can't wave a magic wand and change this fact. Therefore, it has very little to do with a discussion of the state level policies.
Interesting couple of sentences. Poverty is not some natural phenomenon like a tornado or earthquake or flood. State level policies do have an impact and poverty has very much to do with this discussion. If red states are so good for the economy, then where are all the jobs that would have a direct impact on poverty in the state? And the fact that these states are getting a Federal subsidy is quite signif
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States run by conservative Republicans are doing exceedingly well considering the overall economic condition of the entire country. Conversely, liberal Democrats have consistently run their states into the ground. Let's see..a governor who prays on TV but lets you flourish and do so as free as a bird, or a government that leads its people to squalor (more of the same). Take your pick
The guy is a fraud. He was a registered democrat for 20 years, has never run a business, and most of the jobs created in his state were the result of using future tax revenues to bribe companies to relocate from other states. As a result, Texas is experiencing the largest budget deficit in its history. We don't need another big government RINO like this guy.
"People who bite the hand that feeds them usually lick the boot that kicks them." Eric Hoffer "The failure mode of 'clever' is 'asshole'" John Scalzi
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Response intended for Majerus below, as well. Firstly, NY's raw unemployment rate provides a very incomplete picture. The state government has a Frakenstein of a workforce: described here at NY Times[^]. The state work force has continually increased and they don't even know how big it really is, and so the employment rate is skewed by this un-natural growth. Additionally, the make up of the workforce is not as pretty as you might assume, see NY Daily News.[^]. The poor condition of NY state in economic terms is clearly apparent when you look closer at the population's ebb and flow: why they leave.[^] Another clear indicator of health is the state's revenue coupled with the current state policies. If a state can balance their budget without tax increases or more borrowing, there is less strain on the private sector. This known by Bob McDonnell (future POTUS) in his rebuttal[^] to this[^] article. Also, our next POTUS has demonstrated this in his state described here[
I see nothing in all of that even comes close to showing real numbers (and methodologies) which support your original assertion of "States run by conservative Republicans are doing exceedingly well" Actually I can't see that any of it is related to that. Rather it is a mishmash of opinion and unrelated random indicators.
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Response intended for Majerus below, as well. Firstly, NY's raw unemployment rate provides a very incomplete picture. The state government has a Frakenstein of a workforce: described here at NY Times[^]. The state work force has continually increased and they don't even know how big it really is, and so the employment rate is skewed by this un-natural growth. Additionally, the make up of the workforce is not as pretty as you might assume, see NY Daily News.[^]. The poor condition of NY state in economic terms is clearly apparent when you look closer at the population's ebb and flow: why they leave.[^] Another clear indicator of health is the state's revenue coupled with the current state policies. If a state can balance their budget without tax increases or more borrowing, there is less strain on the private sector. This known by Bob McDonnell (future POTUS) in his rebuttal[^] to this[^] article. Also, our next POTUS has demonstrated this in his state described here[
Perry is a fraud, a big government RINO, ex-Democrat that has used State funds and future revenues to bribe companies to relocate from other states (resulting in a net loss for the US, even if a gain for Texas). He won't get my primary vote, and shouldn't get yours. Take a deeper look, he is not what he would like you to think he is.[^], and he is not a fiscal conservative[^]
"People who bite the hand that feeds them usually lick the boot that kicks them." Eric Hoffer "The failure mode of 'clever' is 'asshole'" John Scalzi
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IdUnknown wrote:
Yes, the American public is that stupid.
Speak for yourself.
"People who bite the hand that feeds them usually lick the boot that kicks them." Eric Hoffer "The failure mode of 'clever' is 'asshole'" John Scalzi
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Perry is a fraud, a big government RINO, ex-Democrat that has used State funds and future revenues to bribe companies to relocate from other states (resulting in a net loss for the US, even if a gain for Texas). He won't get my primary vote, and shouldn't get yours. Take a deeper look, he is not what he would like you to think he is.[^], and he is not a fiscal conservative[^]
"People who bite the hand that feeds them usually lick the boot that kicks them." Eric Hoffer "The failure mode of 'clever' is 'asshole'" John Scalzi
Good links, this type of thing is common I know, but I wonder if there is any real study of the long term effects of a state effectively investing in companies to bring their operations to their states. In contrast, Nikki Haley of SC took the opposite position recently, I can't recall the company, it was a large online company I think.
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puromtec1 wrote:
States run by conservative Republicans are doing exceedingly well considering the overall economic condition of the entire country. Conversely, liberal Democrats have consistently run their states into the ground.
I'm still waiting for you to make your case. Now to your response - You've suggested that New York's unemployment rate is lower than all these red states I've mentioned because of emmigration. It's an interesting suggestion, but you haven't provided numbers that would support a large enough outflow to significantly impact the unemployment rate. And you haven't addressed at all why these red states are in the bottom half of the country as far as their unemployment rates are concerned. If Republican leadership were so effective one would expect to see a significant concentration of red states in the top half with the lowest unemployment rates. (The NYT article you linked to is actually the New York Post - a Murdoch rag, which leaves it lacking in the credibility. And you realize you linked to the same article twice, right?) An opinion piece written by a the govenor of Virginia is just that - the opinion of a politician. It doesn't advance your case. The Conor Dougherty article makes the obvious point that given an unchanged tax rate and improving economy will bring in more revenues to the state. But it doesn't make the point that these increases on concentrated in red states. This doesn't advance your case. A speech by Perry is still just a speech by a politician - it doesn't advance your case. the stimulus cost $278,000 per job is just a zombie lie that I won't bother to refute here, nor will I spend any time refuting the case that the stimulus did not work, because the stimulus is not relevant to your case.
puromtec1 wrote:
This again is merely a result of more poor people living in those states. Governors can't wave a magic wand and change this fact. Therefore, it has very little to do with a discussion of the state level policies.
Interesting couple of sentences. Poverty is not some natural phenomenon like a tornado or earthquake or flood. State level policies do have an impact and poverty has very much to do with this discussion. If red states are so good for the economy, then where are all the jobs that would have a direct impact on poverty in the state? And the fact that these states are getting a Federal subsidy is quite signif
Very few states have been run by conservative Republican legislatures and governors for a significantly long history. I may to this thread a later date, I don't specifically know off hand the legislature histories of many states, but I do know there are "red" states are still reeling from bad policies set forth by Democrat legislatures. About austerity: you have completely mis-understood the youtube video I published, or didn't watch it. On a more general note, what guides me in deciding what is good policy or not, is simple, does it improve productivity or add workers to the workforce? Those are the only ways economies expand. Anything else is just a waste or causes of hinderence. Therefore, I see a lot of bad in Democrat economic policies.
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puromtec1 wrote:
States run by conservative Republicans are doing exceedingly well considering the overall economic condition of the entire country. Conversely, liberal Democrats have consistently run their states into the ground.
I'm still waiting for you to make your case. Now to your response - You've suggested that New York's unemployment rate is lower than all these red states I've mentioned because of emmigration. It's an interesting suggestion, but you haven't provided numbers that would support a large enough outflow to significantly impact the unemployment rate. And you haven't addressed at all why these red states are in the bottom half of the country as far as their unemployment rates are concerned. If Republican leadership were so effective one would expect to see a significant concentration of red states in the top half with the lowest unemployment rates. (The NYT article you linked to is actually the New York Post - a Murdoch rag, which leaves it lacking in the credibility. And you realize you linked to the same article twice, right?) An opinion piece written by a the govenor of Virginia is just that - the opinion of a politician. It doesn't advance your case. The Conor Dougherty article makes the obvious point that given an unchanged tax rate and improving economy will bring in more revenues to the state. But it doesn't make the point that these increases on concentrated in red states. This doesn't advance your case. A speech by Perry is still just a speech by a politician - it doesn't advance your case. the stimulus cost $278,000 per job is just a zombie lie that I won't bother to refute here, nor will I spend any time refuting the case that the stimulus did not work, because the stimulus is not relevant to your case.
puromtec1 wrote:
This again is merely a result of more poor people living in those states. Governors can't wave a magic wand and change this fact. Therefore, it has very little to do with a discussion of the state level policies.
Interesting couple of sentences. Poverty is not some natural phenomenon like a tornado or earthquake or flood. State level policies do have an impact and poverty has very much to do with this discussion. If red states are so good for the economy, then where are all the jobs that would have a direct impact on poverty in the state? And the fact that these states are getting a Federal subsidy is quite signif
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Very few states have been run by conservative Republican legislatures and governors for a significantly long history. I may to this thread a later date, I don't specifically know off hand the legislature histories of many states, but I do know there are "red" states are still reeling from bad policies set forth by Democrat legislatures. About austerity: you have completely mis-understood the youtube video I published, or didn't watch it. On a more general note, what guides me in deciding what is good policy or not, is simple, does it improve productivity or add workers to the workforce? Those are the only ways economies expand. Anything else is just a waste or causes of hinderence. Therefore, I see a lot of bad in Democrat economic policies.
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puromtec1 wrote:
The types of policies put in place the state level are cold hard fact.
Cold hard facts are ones that can actually be demonstrated in some measurable way. So perhaps you could provide information that states the actual stats to support your view and describe in detail the methodology used to arrive at those numbers.
I'm tired of pundits and their true believers. If he wants to believe his partisan quackery he can. I was merely trying to point out that there is some facts missing in his link, like any. I expected the response I got. His link is only opinion. California is mostly run by ballot initiatives. It's hard to raise or lower taxes or anything else for that matter when you have to run a ballot to ask the people if they can do it. No other state I'm aware of is run like this.
Well, who doesn't release stuff like that ? Microsoft software is just as bad. Christian Graus That's called seagull management (or sometimes pigeon management)... Fly in, flap your arms and squawk a lot, crap all over everything and fly out again... by _Damian S_