Out of Control (tm)
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Does anyone else think this Travon Martin thing is spinning WAY out of control? A Latino shoots a black kid (happens every day all around the country), and people are calling it a hate crime, posting bounties, and even posting the (wrong) address and phone number for the shooter. Obama thinks it's his son, Maxine Waters claims it's a hate crime, and everybody not directly involved with the case seems to think the stand your ground law in Florida should be waved just this once. There were NO EYE-WITNESSES, and Florida law merely states that you have to have a reasonable belief that your life is in danger. Unfortunately, we only have the shooter's description of events, and NOBODY CAN COME FORWARD AND REFUTE THOSE CLAIMS. It's real handy when a criminal gets off on a technicality, and everyone on the side of the criminal applauds and claims the system is working, but when the same thing happens to the good guys, it's a travesty, an injustice, and racially motivated. What a crock of shit. ------ I'm not saying the guy was right in shooting the kid, but at the same time, I can't say he was wrong either.
".45 ACP - because shooting twice is just silly" - JSOP, 2010
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You can never have too much ammo - unless you're swimming, or on fire. - JSOP, 2010
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"Why don't you tie a kerosene-soaked rag around your ankles so the ants won't climb up and eat your candy ass." - Dale Earnhardt, 1997What I want to know is where is the Rev. Jesse Jackson when there's a drive by shooting in a predominately black neighborhood that kills an 8 year girl? Happens here about 2ce a year, or more.
VS2010/Atmel Studio 6.0 ToDo Manager Extension
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Shameel wrote:
If you read the case carefully, certain degree of racism is indeed involved and JSOP's comment was not appropriate. It is never right to kill someone based solely on suspicions.
According to Zimmerman, he was on his way back to his car when he was attacked by Martin. How is that "based on suspicion"?
".45 ACP - because shooting twice is just silly" - JSOP, 2010
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You can never have too much ammo - unless you're swimming, or on fire. - JSOP, 2010
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"Why don't you tie a kerosene-soaked rag around your ankles so the ants won't climb up and eat your candy ass." - Dale Earnhardt, 1997The shooting was not based on suspicion, but the chase was. Zimmerman had specifically asked the people in the neighborhood to lookout for "young black boys". This stereotyping behavior is what landed him in this trouble neck deep. I'm not advocating execution to this guy, may be he was overzealous and wanted to prove his worth, but the self-defense plea is unacceptable. If you follow someone unnecessarily and without acceptable reasons and he beats you up, then it means you deserve it. At least I would have done the same if he had followed me.
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Of course not, but that's not what happened. Martin attacked him, was beating him up, banging his head on the ground, and broke his nose. Apparently there was a struggle with the gun. Zimmerman says it was self defense. And the cops who investigated it at the time and the DA all concurred that the evidence backed Zimmerman's story. For all we know it was an accidental shooting where the gun went off during the struggle.
If your actions inspire others to dream more, learn more, do more and become more, you are a leader." - John Quincy Adams
You must accept one of two basic premises: Either we are alone in the universe, or we are not alone in the universe. And either way, the implications are staggering” - Wernher von Braunahmed zahmed wrote:
Zimmerman says it was self defense.
They moment he admitted to following Martin, he lost his plea of self defense.
ahmed zahmed wrote:
And the cops who investigated it at the time and the DA all concurred that the evidence backed Zimmerman's story.
According to Wikipedia, the cop who is investigating this case was already reprimanded for racial bias in another case.
ahmed zahmed wrote:
For all we know it was an accidental shooting where the gun went off during the struggle.
We still do not know how a gun can go off accidentally exactly in the chest, that too when the shooter was face down on the ground and the the victim was on top of him.
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His job was quite literally to "look for trouble", or don't you understand the nature of Citizen Patrol?. He was legally licensed to carry the weapon. If it had been me, I would have been carrying as well. Like I said, NOBODY knows the whole story except Zimmerman. Essentially, it's his word against - well - nobody.
".45 ACP - because shooting twice is just silly" - JSOP, 2010
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You can never have too much ammo - unless you're swimming, or on fire. - JSOP, 2010
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"Why don't you tie a kerosene-soaked rag around your ankles so the ants won't climb up and eat your candy ass." - Dale Earnhardt, 1997John Simmons / outlaw programmer wrote:
His job was quite literally to "look for trouble", or don't you understand the nature of Citizen Patrol?
It wasn't his job, it was a position he had awarded himself. And the guidelines for someone doing what he claimed he was doing say that he should not carry a gun when doing so.
Every man can tell how many goats or sheep he possesses, but not how many friends.
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The shooting was not based on suspicion, but the chase was. Zimmerman had specifically asked the people in the neighborhood to lookout for "young black boys". This stereotyping behavior is what landed him in this trouble neck deep. I'm not advocating execution to this guy, may be he was overzealous and wanted to prove his worth, but the self-defense plea is unacceptable. If you follow someone unnecessarily and without acceptable reasons and he beats you up, then it means you deserve it. At least I would have done the same if he had followed me.
Unless you can produce an eye-witness, all the cops have to go on is Zimmerman's account of events. THAT is what I'm trying to say. And yeah, it's amazing that in this world of hyper-surveillance, I'm REALLY surprised it wasn't caught on camera. And finally, you're going to believe the news media even after they initially claimed zimmerman was white, when in fact, he's a latino? The news media isn't trustworthy. The activists want the guy's skin, regardless of the facts. There are no eye-witnesses. Nobody's gonna win.
".45 ACP - because shooting twice is just silly" - JSOP, 2010
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You can never have too much ammo - unless you're swimming, or on fire. - JSOP, 2010
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"Why don't you tie a kerosene-soaked rag around your ankles so the ants won't climb up and eat your candy ass." - Dale Earnhardt, 1997 -
I find it amusing that all people seem to care about is hanging this guy without knowing anything about the facts. I have no idea what happened so am content to let due process take place and I have to have some faith (however misplaced) that the authorities will get it more right than wrong. If it does go to court it means that his story didn't stack up and then a jury of his peers will render a verdict based upon the facts as heard in court.
"If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur." Red Adair. nils illegitimus carborundum me, me, me
The problem seems to be that whatever due process is wasn't be followed at the start. The police office investigating the original incident thought he was lying and wanted to pursue it and was told not to. That then gets construed as a cover up, momentum swings towards doing things properly and then the inevitable happens with momentum, it swings the other way until there is just a prevailing mood to get the bloke banged up. If your balance goes off at the start then it is very difficult to snap things back to an even keel without swaying one way and then the other for a while.
Every man can tell how many goats or sheep he possesses, but not how many friends.
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John Simmons / outlaw programmer wrote:
His job was quite literally to "look for trouble", or don't you understand the nature of Citizen Patrol?
It wasn't his job, it was a position he had awarded himself. And the guidelines for someone doing what he claimed he was doing say that he should not carry a gun when doing so.
Every man can tell how many goats or sheep he possesses, but not how many friends.
If he was part of an organized Citizen's Patrol, it *was* his job. I was part of the neighborhood Citizen's Patrol before we moved, but we were specifically told not to carry weapons. We were there to observe and report, and were prohibited from conducting pursuits of ANY kind. Since our neighborhood was relatively peaceful, not carrying was not an issue.
".45 ACP - because shooting twice is just silly" - JSOP, 2010
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You can never have too much ammo - unless you're swimming, or on fire. - JSOP, 2010
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"Why don't you tie a kerosene-soaked rag around your ankles so the ants won't climb up and eat your candy ass." - Dale Earnhardt, 1997 -
If he was part of an organized Citizen's Patrol, it *was* his job. I was part of the neighborhood Citizen's Patrol before we moved, but we were specifically told not to carry weapons. We were there to observe and report, and were prohibited from conducting pursuits of ANY kind. Since our neighborhood was relatively peaceful, not carrying was not an issue.
".45 ACP - because shooting twice is just silly" - JSOP, 2010
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You can never have too much ammo - unless you're swimming, or on fire. - JSOP, 2010
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"Why don't you tie a kerosene-soaked rag around your ankles so the ants won't climb up and eat your candy ass." - Dale Earnhardt, 1997John Simmons / outlaw programmer wrote:
If he was part of an organized Citizen's Patrol
Well it was organised. He organised it, and made himself its chief. It wasn't affiliated to any wider scheme.
Every man can tell how many goats or sheep he possesses, but not how many friends.
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RJOberg wrote:
someone begging for their life
The police say it was Zimmerman begging for help.
If your actions inspire others to dream more, learn more, do more and become more, you are a leader." - John Quincy Adams
You must accept one of two basic premises: Either we are alone in the universe, or we are not alone in the universe. And either way, the implications are staggering” - Wernher von Braun -
Although quite a few witnesses say it wasn't. And one witness says she was told by the police to say it was.
Every man can tell how many goats or sheep he possesses, but not how many friends.
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Geez walking around with a loaded gun looking for trouble ended badly. Who woulda thought?
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Unless you can produce an eye-witness, all the cops have to go on is Zimmerman's account of events. THAT is what I'm trying to say. And yeah, it's amazing that in this world of hyper-surveillance, I'm REALLY surprised it wasn't caught on camera. And finally, you're going to believe the news media even after they initially claimed zimmerman was white, when in fact, he's a latino? The news media isn't trustworthy. The activists want the guy's skin, regardless of the facts. There are no eye-witnesses. Nobody's gonna win.
".45 ACP - because shooting twice is just silly" - JSOP, 2010
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You can never have too much ammo - unless you're swimming, or on fire. - JSOP, 2010
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"Why don't you tie a kerosene-soaked rag around your ankles so the ants won't climb up and eat your candy ass." - Dale Earnhardt, 1997Wasn't there a 911 call saying he was following the guy? And would confront him? I thought that through "Stand your ground law" out the window.
Computers have been intelligent for a long time now. It just so happens that the program writers are about as effective as a room full of monkeys trying to crank out a copy of Hamlet.
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ahmed zahmed wrote:
Zimmerman says it was self defense.
They moment he admitted to following Martin, he lost his plea of self defense.
ahmed zahmed wrote:
And the cops who investigated it at the time and the DA all concurred that the evidence backed Zimmerman's story.
According to Wikipedia, the cop who is investigating this case was already reprimanded for racial bias in another case.
ahmed zahmed wrote:
For all we know it was an accidental shooting where the gun went off during the struggle.
We still do not know how a gun can go off accidentally exactly in the chest, that too when the shooter was face down on the ground and the the victim was on top of him.
Shameel wrote:
They moment he admitted to following Martin, he lost his plea of self defense.
Yeah that was my understanding. Thought there was even a 911 call with him saying he was following and planned on "confronting" him. Thats not self defence. That his him getting is arse kicked and then thinking he can justifyably shoot someone. If I walk up to you on the street in a threatening manner and you decide to shoot me you can plead self defence. However if you start beating the snot out of me (cause I confronted you), I can not justifiably claim self defence as I was the confrontor.
Computers have been intelligent for a long time now. It just so happens that the program writers are about as effective as a room full of monkeys trying to crank out a copy of Hamlet.
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If he was a carrying legally (as Zimmerman was), yes. My point was that everyone is flying off the handle, and black activists are stepping solidly over the line of acceptable in their actions and words WITH NO SUBSTANTIVE PROOF that Zimmerman broke any laws. Calling for a bounty on him, and posting what they thought was his address/phone number on Twitter is by-god-wrong. I'm sure the elderly couple that lives at the posted address and that has NO ASSOCIATION with Zimmerman AT ALL would agree. Everyone just needs to settle down and let the system "work".
".45 ACP - because shooting twice is just silly" - JSOP, 2010
-----
You can never have too much ammo - unless you're swimming, or on fire. - JSOP, 2010
-----
"Why don't you tie a kerosene-soaked rag around your ankles so the ants won't climb up and eat your candy ass." - Dale Earnhardt, 1997Yes. Kind of nutz. Unfortunate incident, but why is everyone so steamy about it?
Computers have been intelligent for a long time now. It just so happens that the program writers are about as effective as a room full of monkeys trying to crank out a copy of Hamlet.
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Does anyone else think this Travon Martin thing is spinning WAY out of control? A Latino shoots a black kid (happens every day all around the country), and people are calling it a hate crime, posting bounties, and even posting the (wrong) address and phone number for the shooter. Obama thinks it's his son, Maxine Waters claims it's a hate crime, and everybody not directly involved with the case seems to think the stand your ground law in Florida should be waved just this once. There were NO EYE-WITNESSES, and Florida law merely states that you have to have a reasonable belief that your life is in danger. Unfortunately, we only have the shooter's description of events, and NOBODY CAN COME FORWARD AND REFUTE THOSE CLAIMS. It's real handy when a criminal gets off on a technicality, and everyone on the side of the criminal applauds and claims the system is working, but when the same thing happens to the good guys, it's a travesty, an injustice, and racially motivated. What a crock of shit. ------ I'm not saying the guy was right in shooting the kid, but at the same time, I can't say he was wrong either.
".45 ACP - because shooting twice is just silly" - JSOP, 2010
-----
You can never have too much ammo - unless you're swimming, or on fire. - JSOP, 2010
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"Why don't you tie a kerosene-soaked rag around your ankles so the ants won't climb up and eat your candy ass." - Dale Earnhardt, 1997Saw an interesting thread on g+ that showed how the media is using imagery to conjure this spectical. Images of both involved are about 5 years old. They compared it to more recent images which shows the shooter clean, smiling, and in a suite where as the boy is showing a gang symbol with his pants around his ankles and a bandanna on his head. Paints a diferent picture. Not saying the shooting was justified. I am just saying that it seems the situation was spun to be hyped up. If the more recent pictures were used would anyone even care?
Computers have been intelligent for a long time now. It just so happens that the program writers are about as effective as a room full of monkeys trying to crank out a copy of Hamlet.
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Shameel wrote:
They moment he admitted to following Martin, he lost his plea of self defense.
Yeah that was my understanding. Thought there was even a 911 call with him saying he was following and planned on "confronting" him. Thats not self defence. That his him getting is arse kicked and then thinking he can justifyably shoot someone. If I walk up to you on the street in a threatening manner and you decide to shoot me you can plead self defence. However if you start beating the snot out of me (cause I confronted you), I can not justifiably claim self defence as I was the confrontor.
Computers have been intelligent for a long time now. It just so happens that the program writers are about as effective as a room full of monkeys trying to crank out a copy of Hamlet.
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Saw an interesting thread on g+ that showed how the media is using imagery to conjure this spectical. Images of both involved are about 5 years old. They compared it to more recent images which shows the shooter clean, smiling, and in a suite where as the boy is showing a gang symbol with his pants around his ankles and a bandanna on his head. Paints a diferent picture. Not saying the shooting was justified. I am just saying that it seems the situation was spun to be hyped up. If the more recent pictures were used would anyone even care?
Computers have been intelligent for a long time now. It just so happens that the program writers are about as effective as a room full of monkeys trying to crank out a copy of Hamlet.
Collin Jasnoch wrote:
I am just saying that it seems the situation was spun to be hyped up. If the more recent pictures were used would anyone even care?
No one cared about it for aabout a month It wasn't until something was needed to distract folks from other things that it somehow made it into the wider Press.
No dogs or cats are in the classroom. My Mu[sic] My Films My Windows Programs, etc.
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ahmed zahmed wrote:
Zimmerman says it was self defense.
They moment he admitted to following Martin, he lost his plea of self defense.
ahmed zahmed wrote:
And the cops who investigated it at the time and the DA all concurred that the evidence backed Zimmerman's story.
According to Wikipedia, the cop who is investigating this case was already reprimanded for racial bias in another case.
ahmed zahmed wrote:
For all we know it was an accidental shooting where the gun went off during the struggle.
We still do not know how a gun can go off accidentally exactly in the chest, that too when the shooter was face down on the ground and the the victim was on top of him.
He was following until they told him not to. He was returning to his car when Martin attacked. Witnesses saw him being pummeled by Martin. The gun went off, during that fight.
If your actions inspire others to dream more, learn more, do more and become more, you are a leader." - John Quincy Adams
You must accept one of two basic premises: Either we are alone in the universe, or we are not alone in the universe. And either way, the implications are staggering” - Wernher von Braun -
Of course not, but that's not what happened. Martin attacked him, was beating him up, banging his head on the ground, and broke his nose. Apparently there was a struggle with the gun. Zimmerman says it was self defense. And the cops who investigated it at the time and the DA all concurred that the evidence backed Zimmerman's story. For all we know it was an accidental shooting where the gun went off during the struggle.
If your actions inspire others to dream more, learn more, do more and become more, you are a leader." - John Quincy Adams
You must accept one of two basic premises: Either we are alone in the universe, or we are not alone in the universe. And either way, the implications are staggering” - Wernher von BraunThere was a clip on TV of Zimmerman walking into the police station. No visible marks on his face. Does not jibe with
ahmed zahmed wrote:
Martin attacked him, was beating him up, banging his head on the ground, and broke his nose.
Schenectady? What am I doing in Schenectady?
