For the ryanbs of this world
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Yes, I'm aware that he's a comedian. But I didn't think it was funny, just stupid. Making fun at the expense of other people is never funny, just stupid. I understand you think it's funny and that's ok. But please remember, not every joke is funny to all people. He's also an avowed atheist. Which is ok, BTW, people can believe what they want as far as I am concerned. Just allow others the same privilege and respect.
If your actions inspire others to dream more, learn more, do more and become more, you are a leader." - John Quincy Adams
You must accept one of two basic premises: Either we are alone in the universe, or we are not alone in the universe. And either way, the implications are staggering” - Wernher von BraunYou are way overreacting: the whole point of comedy is to entertain people using jokes and satire. He is satirical. I would suggest that perhaps the reason you don't find it funny is because, like Ryan, you simply do not get it.
ahmed zahmed wrote:
But please remember, not every joke is funny to all people.
So I shouldn't laugh at or tell a joke in case it offends someone?
ahmed zahmed wrote:
He's also an avowed atheist.
So what? He tells plenty of secular jokes: I don't get offended.
"If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur." Red Adair. nils illegitimus carborundum me, me, me
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You are way overreacting: the whole point of comedy is to entertain people using jokes and satire. He is satirical. I would suggest that perhaps the reason you don't find it funny is because, like Ryan, you simply do not get it.
ahmed zahmed wrote:
But please remember, not every joke is funny to all people.
So I shouldn't laugh at or tell a joke in case it offends someone?
ahmed zahmed wrote:
He's also an avowed atheist.
So what? He tells plenty of secular jokes: I don't get offended.
"If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur." Red Adair. nils illegitimus carborundum me, me, me
I don't think I'm overreacting at all. Yes, I know it's satire. And I can see the satire, hence my comments. Here's the definition of satire: 1. The use of humor, irony, exaggeration, or ridicule to expose and criticize people's stupidity or vices, etc. I don't find it funny because he's making fun of, and ridiculing people like me who believe in God and that He created the universe. I'm not offended by his "humor", because that's a choice. But I also don't find his "humor" humorous. I find it sad and a waste of talent. So tell me what am I not getting.
mark merrens wrote:
So I shouldn't laugh at or tell a joke in case it offends someone?
I didn't say that. I said not every joke is funny to all people. Maybe sometimes people will be offended, and that should be a concern, perhaps. I tell jokes to my wife that she finds unfunny, but at the same time my kids find them funny. No offensiveness involved.
mark merrens wrote:
So what?
This refers to my original point that he's preaching his religion: hate and contempt of anything not atheistic.
If your actions inspire others to dream more, learn more, do more and become more, you are a leader." - John Quincy Adams
You must accept one of two basic premises: Either we are alone in the universe, or we are not alone in the universe. And either way, the implications are staggering” - Wernher von Braun -
I don't think I'm overreacting at all. Yes, I know it's satire. And I can see the satire, hence my comments. Here's the definition of satire: 1. The use of humor, irony, exaggeration, or ridicule to expose and criticize people's stupidity or vices, etc. I don't find it funny because he's making fun of, and ridiculing people like me who believe in God and that He created the universe. I'm not offended by his "humor", because that's a choice. But I also don't find his "humor" humorous. I find it sad and a waste of talent. So tell me what am I not getting.
mark merrens wrote:
So I shouldn't laugh at or tell a joke in case it offends someone?
I didn't say that. I said not every joke is funny to all people. Maybe sometimes people will be offended, and that should be a concern, perhaps. I tell jokes to my wife that she finds unfunny, but at the same time my kids find them funny. No offensiveness involved.
mark merrens wrote:
So what?
This refers to my original point that he's preaching his religion: hate and contempt of anything not atheistic.
If your actions inspire others to dream more, learn more, do more and become more, you are a leader." - John Quincy Adams
You must accept one of two basic premises: Either we are alone in the universe, or we are not alone in the universe. And either way, the implications are staggering” - Wernher von Braunahmed zahmed wrote:
I don't find it funny because he's making fun of, and ridiculing people like me who believe in God and that He created the universe.
Is your belief so weak as to be so easily offended by a comedian?
ahmed zahmed wrote:
I tell jokes to my wife that she finds unfunny
I think we must be married to the same woman.
ahmed zahmed wrote:
This refers to my original point that he's preaching his religion: hate and contempt of anything not atheistic.
You're definitely over reacting: he makes money doing this; simple as that. You cannot know that he hates you or your beliefs; that is ridiculous, it isn't personal and you taking it personally gives his comedy far more power than it deserves or asks for.
"If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur." Red Adair. nils illegitimus carborundum me, me, me
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ahmed zahmed wrote:
I don't find it funny because he's making fun of, and ridiculing people like me who believe in God and that He created the universe.
Is your belief so weak as to be so easily offended by a comedian?
ahmed zahmed wrote:
I tell jokes to my wife that she finds unfunny
I think we must be married to the same woman.
ahmed zahmed wrote:
This refers to my original point that he's preaching his religion: hate and contempt of anything not atheistic.
You're definitely over reacting: he makes money doing this; simple as that. You cannot know that he hates you or your beliefs; that is ridiculous, it isn't personal and you taking it personally gives his comedy far more power than it deserves or asks for.
"If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur." Red Adair. nils illegitimus carborundum me, me, me
mark merrens wrote:
Is your belief so weak as to be so easily offended by a comedian?
LOL. Like I said, I'm not offended. I just find his work unfunny. Banal. Not worth listening to.
mark merrens wrote:
You're definitely over reacting: he makes money doing this; simple as that. You cannot know that he hates you or your beliefs; that is ridiculous, it isn't personal and you taking it personally gives his comedy far more power than it deserves or asks for.
I never said he hated me personally. TV "Evangelists" make money from their work too. It's clear he hates and ridicules religion and people who adhere to religion. I've read up a bit on him. I give him no power. He does nothing for or to me. I just find it sad and telling that someone of such obvious intelligence and talent would stoop to making fun of other people just to make money. The people who pay him and listen to him and agree with him and then go on to spread hs "word" are the ones who give him power.
If your actions inspire others to dream more, learn more, do more and become more, you are a leader." - John Quincy Adams
You must accept one of two basic premises: Either we are alone in the universe, or we are not alone in the universe. And either way, the implications are staggering” - Wernher von Braun -
mark merrens wrote:
Is your belief so weak as to be so easily offended by a comedian?
LOL. Like I said, I'm not offended. I just find his work unfunny. Banal. Not worth listening to.
mark merrens wrote:
You're definitely over reacting: he makes money doing this; simple as that. You cannot know that he hates you or your beliefs; that is ridiculous, it isn't personal and you taking it personally gives his comedy far more power than it deserves or asks for.
I never said he hated me personally. TV "Evangelists" make money from their work too. It's clear he hates and ridicules religion and people who adhere to religion. I've read up a bit on him. I give him no power. He does nothing for or to me. I just find it sad and telling that someone of such obvious intelligence and talent would stoop to making fun of other people just to make money. The people who pay him and listen to him and agree with him and then go on to spread hs "word" are the ones who give him power.
If your actions inspire others to dream more, learn more, do more and become more, you are a leader." - John Quincy Adams
You must accept one of two basic premises: Either we are alone in the universe, or we are not alone in the universe. And either way, the implications are staggering” - Wernher von Braunahmed zahmed wrote:
TV "Evangelists" make money from their work too
Fair point cos I'm certainly offended by the way they manipulate the stupids to make money.
ahmed zahmed wrote:
The people who pay him and listen to him and agree with him and then go on to spread hs "word" are the ones who give him power.
Atheists don't have a 'word'. That's the whole point: we have nothing and are really rather happy about it and I've yet to come out of a comedy club after having listened to someone like him and got involved in evangelistic atheism or run across to the local religious center and heckled the priest. The very thought is too funny for words.
"If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur." Red Adair. nils illegitimus carborundum me, me, me
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ahmed zahmed wrote:
TV "Evangelists" make money from their work too
Fair point cos I'm certainly offended by the way they manipulate the stupids to make money.
ahmed zahmed wrote:
The people who pay him and listen to him and agree with him and then go on to spread hs "word" are the ones who give him power.
Atheists don't have a 'word'. That's the whole point: we have nothing and are really rather happy about it and I've yet to come out of a comedy club after having listened to someone like him and got involved in evangelistic atheism or run across to the local religious center and heckled the priest. The very thought is too funny for words.
"If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur." Red Adair. nils illegitimus carborundum me, me, me
I know most atheists couldn't give a rats ass what someone else believes or does with their time so long as it doesn't effect them. Frankly, I feel the same. However, there is a new atheist "movement" and groups of atheists that are virulently anti-religion. And that's ok. Free speech and all. At the same time, it seems that it's in vogue and considered politic to make fun of people of faith. Yes, it would be very funny to see an atheist evangelizing over at the local Presbyterian church.
If your actions inspire others to dream more, learn more, do more and become more, you are a leader." - John Quincy Adams
You must accept one of two basic premises: Either we are alone in the universe, or we are not alone in the universe. And either way, the implications are staggering” - Wernher von Braun -
Yes, I'm aware that he's a comedian. But I didn't think it was funny, just stupid. Making fun at the expense of other people is never funny, just stupid. I understand you think it's funny and that's ok. But please remember, not every joke is funny to all people. He's also an avowed atheist. Which is ok, BTW, people can believe what they want as far as I am concerned. Just allow others the same privilege and respect.
If your actions inspire others to dream more, learn more, do more and become more, you are a leader." - John Quincy Adams
You must accept one of two basic premises: Either we are alone in the universe, or we are not alone in the universe. And either way, the implications are staggering” - Wernher von Braunahmed zahmed wrote:
Making fun at the expense of other people is never funny, just stupid
Pretty sure if that if you try to eliminate comedy like that then you are going to be eliminating a lot of comedy.
ahmed zahmed wrote:
Just allow others the same privilege and respect.
I am rather certain that if it was kept in the church rather than constantly being pushed into the public that in fact no one would make fun of it because neither they nor the audience would have any context. But since it is constantly being pushed publicly it is certainly ok for others to push back.
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I know most atheists couldn't give a rats ass what someone else believes or does with their time so long as it doesn't effect them. Frankly, I feel the same. However, there is a new atheist "movement" and groups of atheists that are virulently anti-religion. And that's ok. Free speech and all. At the same time, it seems that it's in vogue and considered politic to make fun of people of faith. Yes, it would be very funny to see an atheist evangelizing over at the local Presbyterian church.
If your actions inspire others to dream more, learn more, do more and become more, you are a leader." - John Quincy Adams
You must accept one of two basic premises: Either we are alone in the universe, or we are not alone in the universe. And either way, the implications are staggering” - Wernher von Braunahmed zahmed wrote:
However, there is a new atheist "movement" and groups of atheists that are virulently anti-religion. And that's ok. Free speech and all.
As an atheist I've not seen this. I get approached all the time in the street by religious people: never once been approached by an atheist.
ahmed zahmed wrote:
At the same time, it seems that it's in vogue and considered politic to make fun of people of faith.
Try being Jewish: we've had the shit kicked out of us for thousands of years and you don't hear us complaining when someone tells a Jewish joke.
ahmed zahmed wrote:
Yes, it would be very funny to see an atheist evangelizing over at the local Presbyterian church.
:-)
"If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur." Red Adair. nils illegitimus carborundum me, me, me
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ahmed zahmed wrote:
However, there is a new atheist "movement" and groups of atheists that are virulently anti-religion. And that's ok. Free speech and all.
As an atheist I've not seen this. I get approached all the time in the street by religious people: never once been approached by an atheist.
ahmed zahmed wrote:
At the same time, it seems that it's in vogue and considered politic to make fun of people of faith.
Try being Jewish: we've had the shit kicked out of us for thousands of years and you don't hear us complaining when someone tells a Jewish joke.
ahmed zahmed wrote:
Yes, it would be very funny to see an atheist evangelizing over at the local Presbyterian church.
:-)
"If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur." Red Adair. nils illegitimus carborundum me, me, me
mark merrens wrote:
Try being Jewish: we've had the sh*t kicked out of us for thousands of years and you don't hear us complaining when someone tells a Jewish joke.
Indeed. And yes, I have heard complaining about Jewish jokes from Jewish people.
mark merrens wrote:
As an atheist I've not seen this.
Richard Dawkins is one of that kind. I really don't wish to debate the atheist thing. It's just all getting a little tiring and boring. Can't these "comedians" come up with some new material?
If your actions inspire others to dream more, learn more, do more and become more, you are a leader." - John Quincy Adams
You must accept one of two basic premises: Either we are alone in the universe, or we are not alone in the universe. And either way, the implications are staggering” - Wernher von Braun -
ahmed zahmed wrote:
Making fun at the expense of other people is never funny, just stupid
Pretty sure if that if you try to eliminate comedy like that then you are going to be eliminating a lot of comedy.
ahmed zahmed wrote:
Just allow others the same privilege and respect.
I am rather certain that if it was kept in the church rather than constantly being pushed into the public that in fact no one would make fun of it because neither they nor the audience would have any context. But since it is constantly being pushed publicly it is certainly ok for others to push back.
jschell wrote:
eliminating a lot of comedy
I'm not advocating elimination of anything. But you're probably right that if people stopped making fun of others then a lot of so-called "comedy" would disappear.
jschell wrote:
I am rather certain that if it was kept in the church rather than constantly being pushed into the public that in fact no one would make fun of it because neither they nor the audience would have any context
Well that's true. If you'll agree to stop talking about atheism and promoting it then I'll agree to stop talking about and promoting religion.
jschell wrote:
ok for others to push back.
Sure, of course. No reason said pushing back can't be respectful.
If your actions inspire others to dream more, learn more, do more and become more, you are a leader." - John Quincy Adams
You must accept one of two basic premises: Either we are alone in the universe, or we are not alone in the universe. And either way, the implications are staggering” - Wernher von Braun -
mark merrens wrote:
Try being Jewish: we've had the sh*t kicked out of us for thousands of years and you don't hear us complaining when someone tells a Jewish joke.
Indeed. And yes, I have heard complaining about Jewish jokes from Jewish people.
mark merrens wrote:
As an atheist I've not seen this.
Richard Dawkins is one of that kind. I really don't wish to debate the atheist thing. It's just all getting a little tiring and boring. Can't these "comedians" come up with some new material?
If your actions inspire others to dream more, learn more, do more and become more, you are a leader." - John Quincy Adams
You must accept one of two basic premises: Either we are alone in the universe, or we are not alone in the universe. And either way, the implications are staggering” - Wernher von Braunahmed zahmed wrote:
I have heard complaining about Jewish jokes from Jewish people
Quite surprising.
ahmed zahmed wrote:
Richard Dawkins is one of that kind.
What, he comes up to you in the street and starts banging on about jesus? I call bullshit.
ahmed zahmed wrote:
Can't these "comedians" come up with some new material?
When taking the piss out of religion stops getting laughs I'm sure they will. ps You one voting me?
"If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur." Red Adair. nils illegitimus carborundum me, me, me
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ahmed zahmed wrote:
I have heard complaining about Jewish jokes from Jewish people
Quite surprising.
ahmed zahmed wrote:
Richard Dawkins is one of that kind.
What, he comes up to you in the street and starts banging on about jesus? I call bullshit.
ahmed zahmed wrote:
Can't these "comedians" come up with some new material?
When taking the piss out of religion stops getting laughs I'm sure they will. ps You one voting me?
"If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur." Red Adair. nils illegitimus carborundum me, me, me
mark merrens wrote:
What, he comes up to you in the street and starts banging on about jesus? I call bullsh*t
Come now, I didn't say that. I said there are atheist organizations agitating against religionists.
mark merrens wrote:
You one voting me?
No.
If your actions inspire others to dream more, learn more, do more and become more, you are a leader." - John Quincy Adams
You must accept one of two basic premises: Either we are alone in the universe, or we are not alone in the universe. And either way, the implications are staggering” - Wernher von Braun -
ahmed zahmed wrote:
However, there is a new atheist "movement" and groups of atheists that are virulently anti-religion. And that's ok. Free speech and all.
As an atheist I've not seen this. I get approached all the time in the street by religious people: never once been approached by an atheist.
ahmed zahmed wrote:
At the same time, it seems that it's in vogue and considered politic to make fun of people of faith.
Try being Jewish: we've had the shit kicked out of us for thousands of years and you don't hear us complaining when someone tells a Jewish joke.
ahmed zahmed wrote:
Yes, it would be very funny to see an atheist evangelizing over at the local Presbyterian church.
:-)
"If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur." Red Adair. nils illegitimus carborundum me, me, me
mark merrens wrote:
I get approached all the time in the street by religious people: never once been approached by an atheist.
It's different here in the UK then (well, not being approached by atheists in the street - mind you, I've not been approached by the religionists in the street either). We have an organisation called the National Secular Council that has a fairly high profile political approach. Details of the council can be found here[^].
*pre-emptive celebratory nipple tassle jiggle* - Sean Ewington
"Mind bleach! Send me mind bleach!" - Nagy Vilmos
My blog | My articles | MoXAML PowerToys | Mole 2010 - debugging made easier - my favourite utility
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jschell wrote:
eliminating a lot of comedy
I'm not advocating elimination of anything. But you're probably right that if people stopped making fun of others then a lot of so-called "comedy" would disappear.
jschell wrote:
I am rather certain that if it was kept in the church rather than constantly being pushed into the public that in fact no one would make fun of it because neither they nor the audience would have any context
Well that's true. If you'll agree to stop talking about atheism and promoting it then I'll agree to stop talking about and promoting religion.
jschell wrote:
ok for others to push back.
Sure, of course. No reason said pushing back can't be respectful.
If your actions inspire others to dream more, learn more, do more and become more, you are a leader." - John Quincy Adams
You must accept one of two basic premises: Either we are alone in the universe, or we are not alone in the universe. And either way, the implications are staggering” - Wernher von Braunahmed zahmed wrote:
If you'll agree to stop talking about atheism and promoting it then I'll agree to stop talking about and promoting religion.
Of course "stop talking" means that all of those christian programs must stop broadcasting, all politicians must stop making religious promises and all celebrities of any sort must stop bringing up their beliefs.
ahmed zahmed wrote:
No reason said pushing back can't be respectful.
Are you claiming that the religious pundits, especially the ones that get the most public face time, are "respectful" of others beliefs?
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ahmed zahmed wrote:
If you'll agree to stop talking about atheism and promoting it then I'll agree to stop talking about and promoting religion.
Of course "stop talking" means that all of those christian programs must stop broadcasting, all politicians must stop making religious promises and all celebrities of any sort must stop bringing up their beliefs.
ahmed zahmed wrote:
No reason said pushing back can't be respectful.
Are you claiming that the religious pundits, especially the ones that get the most public face time, are "respectful" of others beliefs?
jschell wrote:
Of course "stop talking" means that all of those christian programs must stop broadcasting, all politicians must stop making religious promises and all celebrities of any sort must stop bringing up their beliefs.
Yeah, and while we're at it why don't we burn all the books, close and demolish all the schools, libraries and universities and send everyone back to the fields to farm. All the meanwhile nobody will be allowed to say anything or think anything that hasn't been approved of by the "government".
jschell wrote:
Are you claiming that the religious pundits, especially the ones that get the most public face time, are "respectful" of others beliefs?
I wouldn't really know. I don't pay them any mind. But I doubt they're always respectful.
If your actions inspire others to dream more, learn more, do more and become more, you are a leader." - John Quincy Adams
You must accept one of two basic premises: Either we are alone in the universe, or we are not alone in the universe. And either way, the implications are staggering” - Wernher von Braun -
jschell wrote:
Of course "stop talking" means that all of those christian programs must stop broadcasting, all politicians must stop making religious promises and all celebrities of any sort must stop bringing up their beliefs.
Yeah, and while we're at it why don't we burn all the books, close and demolish all the schools, libraries and universities and send everyone back to the fields to farm. All the meanwhile nobody will be allowed to say anything or think anything that hasn't been approved of by the "government".
jschell wrote:
Are you claiming that the religious pundits, especially the ones that get the most public face time, are "respectful" of others beliefs?
I wouldn't really know. I don't pay them any mind. But I doubt they're always respectful.
If your actions inspire others to dream more, learn more, do more and become more, you are a leader." - John Quincy Adams
You must accept one of two basic premises: Either we are alone in the universe, or we are not alone in the universe. And either way, the implications are staggering” - Wernher von Braunahmed zahmed wrote:
Yeah, and while we're at it why don't we burn all the books, close and demolish all the schools, libraries and universities and send everyone back to the fields to farm. All the meanwhile nobody will be allowed to say anything or think anything that hasn't been approved of by the "government".
You are the one that put forward the suggestion that speech should be limited. I then responded to your suggestion.
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ahmed zahmed wrote:
Yeah, and while we're at it why don't we burn all the books, close and demolish all the schools, libraries and universities and send everyone back to the fields to farm. All the meanwhile nobody will be allowed to say anything or think anything that hasn't been approved of by the "government".
You are the one that put forward the suggestion that speech should be limited. I then responded to your suggestion.
jschell wrote:
You are the one that put forward the suggestion that speech should be limited.
Actually you were the one suggesting limiting speech...
jschell wrote:
I am rather certain that if it was kept in the church
If your actions inspire others to dream more, learn more, do more and become more, you are a leader." - John Quincy Adams
You must accept one of two basic premises: Either we are alone in the universe, or we are not alone in the universe. And either way, the implications are staggering” - Wernher von Braun -
jschell wrote:
You are the one that put forward the suggestion that speech should be limited.
Actually you were the one suggesting limiting speech...
jschell wrote:
I am rather certain that if it was kept in the church
If your actions inspire others to dream more, learn more, do more and become more, you are a leader." - John Quincy Adams
You must accept one of two basic premises: Either we are alone in the universe, or we are not alone in the universe. And either way, the implications are staggering” - Wernher von Braunahmed zahmed wrote:
Actually you were the one suggesting limiting speech...
The point of that statement is that in a society with free speech that publicly expressed opinions allow for dissenting opions. HOWEVER if one keeps their opinions in their church then there is little point in expressing dissenting opinions nor would there be any context for which dissenting opinions would be meaningful. However if you are suggesting that it is perfectly ok for religions to publicly promote their ideology and that others should not be allowed to respond to that (regardless of how they respond) then it is you who are attempting to limit speech.
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ahmed zahmed wrote:
Actually you were the one suggesting limiting speech...
The point of that statement is that in a society with free speech that publicly expressed opinions allow for dissenting opions. HOWEVER if one keeps their opinions in their church then there is little point in expressing dissenting opinions nor would there be any context for which dissenting opinions would be meaningful. However if you are suggesting that it is perfectly ok for religions to publicly promote their ideology and that others should not be allowed to respond to that (regardless of how they respond) then it is you who are attempting to limit speech.
I never suggested anyone should not be allowed to respond to someone's religious speech (or any other speech, for that matter). I merely wished and desired for that response, dissenting or otherwise, to be respectful. And, yeah, everyone on all sides should be respectful. You went on and then said (and now you repeated it) if they kept it in their church (and by extension, whomever would keep their opinions, ideas, thoughts to themselves) then nobody would have any context in which to respond or comment whether respectful or not. I never once suggested anyone should be disallowed to respond, dissent or say something to someone else's speech. It was you who suggested religious people's speech should be confined to their church and out of the public square. Hence you are limiting peoples speech. There's enough animosity and hatred in the world. I'm merely objecting to hate speech.
If your actions inspire others to dream more, learn more, do more and become more, you are a leader." - John Quincy Adams
You must accept one of two basic premises: Either we are alone in the universe, or we are not alone in the universe. And either way, the implications are staggering” - Wernher von Braun