Do you think math people are the best programmers?
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Hi, i have a theory...that is that people with math studies are the best in the programming field (if you don't trust me, check Dennis Ritchie, Bjarne Stroustup, Alan Kay, etc)...what is your opinions about this? Is convenient study math books instead of programming books?
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Hi, i have a theory...that is that people with math studies are the best in the programming field (if you don't trust me, check Dennis Ritchie, Bjarne Stroustup, Alan Kay, etc)...what is your opinions about this? Is convenient study math books instead of programming books?
Quite simply, the best programmers are programmers. I've *never* worked with a mathematician who was a great programmer, but I have met plenty of programmers who were great at maths. If people are primarily interested in programming, that's what makes them good. If they are primarily interested in Maths or Engineering or Art, then they will be (by definition) less interested in programming and therefore less good at it than they could be. Historically computing was used primarily for mathematical problem solving, so of course it involved a lot of maths and mathematicians. The names you quote are ancient history in the computing world. But we are increasingly standing on the shoulders of giants. We don't need to be able to calculate a fourier transform on paper in order to be capable of *using* an FFT in our programs. We can write a physics-based game with no ability to do physics calulations on paper. We can produce a website with complex financial graphs without having a degree in statistics. We have tools (libraries), and we need only understand how and when to use them, not how to build them from scratch.
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Hi, i have a theory...that is that people with math studies are the best in the programming field (if you don't trust me, check Dennis Ritchie, Bjarne Stroustup, Alan Kay, etc)...what is your opinions about this? Is convenient study math books instead of programming books?
A programmer who is not qualified in mathematics is akin to a surgeon who is not qualified in anatomy.
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Most of the best programmers I know studied Geography or Geology at college, including myself - although I'm not counting myself as the best. And most of them want to be chefs.
Every man can tell how many goats or sheep he possesses, but not how many friends. Shed Petition[^]
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Hi, i have a theory...that is that people with math studies are the best in the programming field (if you don't trust me, check Dennis Ritchie, Bjarne Stroustup, Alan Kay, etc)...what is your opinions about this? Is convenient study math books instead of programming books?
Doesn't matter... Programming today is not only about some lines of code... its to do with business understanding too...
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Doesn't matter... Programming today is not only about some lines of code... its to do with business understanding too...
It depends on what you are programming. if you program signal processing you need math. If you do some image maker you need thins thiks like Kanji (Steve Jobs) If you program Android you need think like usability etc.... dropped out of college after six months and spent the next 18 months dropping in on creative classes, including a course on calligraphy.[42] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steve\_Jobs#Early\_life\_and\_education
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Hi, i have a theory...that is that people with math studies are the best in the programming field (if you don't trust me, check Dennis Ritchie, Bjarne Stroustup, Alan Kay, etc)...what is your opinions about this? Is convenient study math books instead of programming books?
Math and programming are not related as far as I can tell.
x=x+1
Is not a mathematical statement. Programming is writing directions for an idiot to follow precisely. Which is why I credit my childhood model building as a primer for programming. ;P Now I use math, usually to piss managers off because I use it to explain why their silly idea won't work or find out why the design specs the salesman has promised cannot be achieved. But most of the math I have dealt with has been in time/motion studies. I've computed how many milliseconds I have between interrupts, how fast can the hardware react to commands given to it, how much data can be shoved through a port. Simple math really, but I am always surprised by the number of people who will not take the time to do even that. In the '80s, after WarGames came out and every kiddie with a computer went home and started writing sequential phone dialers, there was an uproar because "everyone knew" computers could dial thousands of phones a minute and everyone's phones would be ringing incessantly off the hook, that they wanted laws passed to make it illegal to write sequential dialers. I made myself unpleasant by timing how long it took for the hardware to go off hook, wait for dialtone, dial the digits, and then wait three rings. I laid out all the math and demonstrated that it was not that big a deal. But that was not what they wanted to hear. I didn't need a degree in math to do that. I needed a logical view of how things had to happen and in what order. That is programming, not math.
Psychosis at 10 Film at 11 Those who do not remember the past, are doomed to repeat it. Those who do not remember the past, cannot build upon it.
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I would agree but in some cases you can even be more generic in that Engineers are good programmers. There is one catch though. I have noticed that Engineers don't always look to new technology where the CS folks try to stay more up to date. With that some of the engineers are using old patterns and out dated technology, and by choice simply because they know how to do it that way.
Computers have been intelligent for a long time now. It just so happens that the program writers are about as effective as a room full of monkeys trying to crank out a copy of Hamlet.
I think for engineers, what it boils down to is discipline. The engineering fields require rigorous discipline that is pounded into you from the very first engineering class you take as a freshman. It is the lack of that level of discipline that makes engineers scoff at the notion of a CS graduate (myself included) calling themselves a software engineer. That said, IMHO, the best programmers are born, not made - good programming requires a blend of creativity, abstract thinking, and problem solving skills that the great programmers have long before they even reach post-secondary education.
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Hi, i have a theory...that is that people with math studies are the best in the programming field (if you don't trust me, check Dennis Ritchie, Bjarne Stroustup, Alan Kay, etc)...what is your opinions about this? Is convenient study math books instead of programming books?
You can't pigeon hole a programmer based on their background. Howeever, in my experience, my old loss/lead had a math background can solve the most complex problem brillantly, but his code is unmaintainable (except by himself). Most coding "no no", he did it. - Copy/Paste code because he can tweak one code without affecting the other - Magic numbers because he knows exactly what they mean - Random variable names because it makes sense to HIM - Amasing code optimization... without explanation comments His code runs well, but there was no way it can be maintained by someone else. To him, the code IS the documentation/functionalities because "If you can program, you can read code"
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Hi, i have a theory...that is that people with math studies are the best in the programming field (if you don't trust me, check Dennis Ritchie, Bjarne Stroustup, Alan Kay, etc)...what is your opinions about this? Is convenient study math books instead of programming books?
It's all about aptitude...
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Hi, i have a theory...that is that people with math studies are the best in the programming field (if you don't trust me, check Dennis Ritchie, Bjarne Stroustup, Alan Kay, etc)...what is your opinions about this? Is convenient study math books instead of programming books?
Engineers do a lot of math and I don't think there is that much difference between the two. Especially EE, all the circuit theory they do is very heavy on math. I think it's safe to say something like math ability and the ability to program co-relate well. People with good math ability do not always choose it as a career. C.A.R. Hoare, the inventor of the QuickSort was a Humanities student before he saw the light and turned to statistics and CS. AS to a course of study, I think it's the man, not the training.
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what's a mathematic?
It has since been renamed "calculator". Similar to how a thingamatic is now a whatchamacallit and a peelamatic is now just called a paring knife.
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I think learning math is not enough for the best programmers.The best programmer need to learn also data structure, program design and systems flow design.But it is my option only.
I think so dude, but people who studies math as a career generally know all of this stuff (algorithms, data structures, etc.) and is easiest to learn because it's very linked with math (p.e. graphs, trees, nodes, etc). and eventually are the best programmers (in general terms. May be exist some who studies geography and be a good programmer but only a few guys).
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Hi, i have a theory...that is that people with math studies are the best in the programming field (if you don't trust me, check Dennis Ritchie, Bjarne Stroustup, Alan Kay, etc)...what is your opinions about this? Is convenient study math books instead of programming books?
Since programming is an application of mathematics, math people have a solid basis. That doesn't neccesarily mean every math person is better at programming than every non-math person, but there's a greater chance that (s)he is, because math provides a more profound understanding to programming. When I studied math+CS, I've found there were both good and bad programmers among math students. But among CS students, there were usually even worse ones. That said, there was an even stronger correlation between C=64 / Apple II users and bad programming, because their programming style was spoiled by too much BASIC programming before starting their formal education... Personally I believe that math provides a very solid basis for good programming, as it teaches you how to deal with abstract concepts. Having said that, I have to acknowledge what Erudite_Eric said: math people may also tend to stick too much to the abstract problems, and in the end have trouble getting a usable product finished. People from the applied sciences, such as EE or physics tend to be more pragmatic about this. Being a mathematician myself, I usually get the best results when closely working wtih EEs or physicicists. At least that is my experience. OTOH, when I work on my own, I get fantastic results - but the product never gets finished... (which reminds me I need to get back to working on my product now!)
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Quite simply, the best programmers are programmers. I've *never* worked with a mathematician who was a great programmer, but I have met plenty of programmers who were great at maths. If people are primarily interested in programming, that's what makes them good. If they are primarily interested in Maths or Engineering or Art, then they will be (by definition) less interested in programming and therefore less good at it than they could be. Historically computing was used primarily for mathematical problem solving, so of course it involved a lot of maths and mathematicians. The names you quote are ancient history in the computing world. But we are increasingly standing on the shoulders of giants. We don't need to be able to calculate a fourier transform on paper in order to be capable of *using* an FFT in our programs. We can write a physics-based game with no ability to do physics calulations on paper. We can produce a website with complex financial graphs without having a degree in statistics. We have tools (libraries), and we need only understand how and when to use them, not how to build them from scratch.
Yeah, i agree with you perhaps "best programmers are programmers" but thing this...the people who studies math (p.e. google guys) first are maths and then programmers...in my perspective be a good programmer is more than typing code on an editor... much of the times is work with a piece of paper an pen doing numbers, calculations, diagrams, graphs, etc. And for ultimate instance cames the computer.
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A programmer who is not qualified in mathematics is akin to a surgeon who is not qualified in anatomy.
jajaja thats not true dude...well...first, i agree with you ;) but the reality says the opposite; how many people is coding every day without doing math or a lack of this...for example web developers are programmers, but do you think all of the web developers know math or worse the "pythagoras theorem"??
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Doesn't matter... Programming today is not only about some lines of code... its to do with business understanding too...
Yeah in ultimate instance. I think that programmers must know economics, math, graphic design, accounting, etc. etc. But in math is the pillar to economics, financial, accountings, physics, business (strongly linked to economics).
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Hi, i have a theory...that is that people with math studies are the best in the programming field (if you don't trust me, check Dennis Ritchie, Bjarne Stroustup, Alan Kay, etc)...what is your opinions about this? Is convenient study math books instead of programming books?
Interesting question! I think that defining a "good programmer" is a very subjective matter. There are many valid, applicable metrics and they usually contradict each other. However, I believe that math-skilled programmers have a very strong advantage when it comes to implementing novel algorithms in certain fields like image processing and pattern recognition. Most academic documents I've seen detailing powerful algorithms in those fields are explained in a strongly mathematical fashion, and the gap between "the math" and "the code", at least for me, is sometimes abysmal - especially after I stumble upon a concrete implementation and see the code that was actually derived from the mathematical formulations described in the paper. ;P
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Having a BSEE degree myself, I can explain why EEs tend to be better at it than others. A lot of us, especially software/firmware types, have to twiddle bits in assembly and get down to the true bare metal. We cut our teeth on that. So, when we move up to the other areas of programming like desktop and web apps, it is so much easier. I have also found that when you have to program without a nice IDE and lots of debugging tools like exist in and around Visual Studio, you tend to be a LOT more careful with what you are doing and typing.
It depends on what you define as a good programmer. Is it Someone who writes unreadable/unmaintainable code at super fast speed Someone who thinks about testing before they write a program Someone who documents their code before writing it Someone who can pick up anyone else's code and run with it Someone who knows lots of techniques but doesn't apply any of them in their code Someone who writes highly maintainable code Someone who write great documentation and rubbish code Someone who can explain someone else's code and what they were thinking when they wrote it ...
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Hi, i have a theory...that is that people with math studies are the best in the programming field (if you don't trust me, check Dennis Ritchie, Bjarne Stroustup, Alan Kay, etc)...what is your opinions about this? Is convenient study math books instead of programming books?
My major was computer engineering, aka specialized electrical engineering. I always loved to program but didn't want to be stuck on the high level so I chose engineering. Now, I seem to suck at Calculus. I mean, regular math, statistics I can do with my eyes shut. Now come calculus... That was my Achilles heel during whole college. Worse because it's used in almost all other grades during the 5 year course. Calculus though, made my mind much sharper, which obviously helped a lot on programming. Fast and logical thinking can get the benefits of a mind trained in math. But then I sometimes wonder if I actually suck at calculus or if it's because I'm lazy. I mean, I never do homework, ever. So I don't practice and practice is what makes you memorize all those theories, formulas and develops the way of thinking to solve complex equations. I have a terrible memory, so all those formulas for La Place, Integrals never really made to my brain. On the other hand I never had any problem with physics. From relativity to mechanics. The only problem I had was with electromagnetism, that again, hundreds of formulas and scenarios. So, sometimes I wonder... Do I really hate and suck and math? Or do I really enjoy not bringing college home?
To alcohol! The cause of, and solution to, all of life's problems - Homer Simpson ---- Our heads are round so our thoughts can change direction - Francis Picabia