Why Windows Phone just lost a developer
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I'm beginning to get into Windows "Metro" (What do they call it now?) development and I figured, "Hey, why not port those apps to Windows Phone?" Then I looked at the Windows Phone website... Oh, $99? Forget it. :wtf: This, in a nutshell, is why I believe WP doesn't fly with developers: Microsoft charges as much as Apple charges to develop for the IOS, but have an astronomically smaller user base. Why would any developer want to do that? :thumbsdown:
If $99 keeps you from doing business I don't know if you have much of a business. I don't mean that to sound rude. From my perspective, I think a $99 fee up front is the absolute smallest portion of your investment. I grew up with software being developed and distributed on cartridges so the current model is like a dream come true for start up shops. It used to cost thousands to get software distributed so the $99 sounds like a freakin' awesome deal to me. You couldn't get a lemonade stand set up for that price. Seriously.
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I'm beginning to get into Windows "Metro" (What do they call it now?) development and I figured, "Hey, why not port those apps to Windows Phone?" Then I looked at the Windows Phone website... Oh, $99? Forget it. :wtf: This, in a nutshell, is why I believe WP doesn't fly with developers: Microsoft charges as much as Apple charges to develop for the IOS, but have an astronomically smaller user base. Why would any developer want to do that? :thumbsdown:
If you have an MSDN. dreamspark, or bizspark account you can get into the phone developer system for free. There are many ways to get into the dev program without paying for it. Microsoft sponsors many local community events where they give away phones and developer accounts. Last year i gave away over 60 phones for Microsoft and many free accounts.
Steve Maier
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If $99 keeps you from doing business I don't know if you have much of a business. I don't mean that to sound rude. From my perspective, I think a $99 fee up front is the absolute smallest portion of your investment. I grew up with software being developed and distributed on cartridges so the current model is like a dream come true for start up shops. It used to cost thousands to get software distributed so the $99 sounds like a freakin' awesome deal to me. You couldn't get a lemonade stand set up for that price. Seriously.
You're right about that. :thumbsup: I just don't have much capital and prefer to make a little profit before I spend more.
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GeekForChrist wrote:
Why would any developer want to do that?
Part of the theory is that the Apple market is saturated, so this is a new and potentially lucrative market to get into for developers. The reality, of course, is that sales of WP8 devices has been somewhat less than stellar.
*pre-emptive celebratory nipple tassle jiggle* - Sean Ewington
"Mind bleach! Send me mind bleach!" - Nagy Vilmos
CodeStash - Online Snippet Management | My blog | MoXAML PowerToys | Mole 2010 - debugging made easier
Pete O'Hanlon wrote:
Part of the theory is that the Apple market is saturated, so this is a new and potentially lucrative market to get into for developers.
That's a good theory.
Pete O'Hanlon wrote:
sales of WP8 devices has been somewhat less than stellar
That's why I don't want to put a lot of capital up for potential loss (in this case).
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GeekForChrist wrote:
Why would any developer want to do that?
Part of the theory is that the Apple market is saturated, so this is a new and potentially lucrative market to get into for developers. The reality, of course, is that sales of WP8 devices has been somewhat less than stellar.
*pre-emptive celebratory nipple tassle jiggle* - Sean Ewington
"Mind bleach! Send me mind bleach!" - Nagy Vilmos
CodeStash - Online Snippet Management | My blog | MoXAML PowerToys | Mole 2010 - debugging made easier
Pete O'Hanlon wrote:
The reality, of course, is that sales of WP8 devices has been somewhat less than stellar.
Yea, since they had the launch event yesterday for WP8, they really have not sold that many since then.
Steve Maier
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If you have an MSDN. dreamspark, or bizspark account you can get into the phone developer system for free. There are many ways to get into the dev program without paying for it. Microsoft sponsors many local community events where they give away phones and developer accounts. Last year i gave away over 60 phones for Microsoft and many free accounts.
Steve Maier
I do have DreamSpark but I've been told left and right "For education only" Also, maybe you know, can I keep selling an app after my 1 year membership expires or will it go off the store?
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I'm beginning to get into Windows "Metro" (What do they call it now?) development and I figured, "Hey, why not port those apps to Windows Phone?" Then I looked at the Windows Phone website... Oh, $99? Forget it. :wtf: This, in a nutshell, is why I believe WP doesn't fly with developers: Microsoft charges as much as Apple charges to develop for the IOS, but have an astronomically smaller user base. Why would any developer want to do that? :thumbsdown:
Correct me if I'm wrong... but in both cases (Windows Phone OS & Apple iOS) you can develop all you want for free. The $99 is to submit apps for inclusion in the app store. If true, seems like a heck of a deal considering the exposure and distribution... no?
Government is not reason; it is not eloquent; it is force. Like fire, it is a dangerous servant and a fearful master. ~ George Washington
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Pete O'Hanlon wrote:
The reality, of course, is that sales of WP8 devices has been somewhat less than stellar.
Yea, since they had the launch event yesterday for WP8, they really have not sold that many since then.
Steve Maier
:laugh: I didn't catch that
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Correct me if I'm wrong... but in both cases (Windows Phone OS & Apple iOS) you can develop all you want for free. The $99 is to submit apps for inclusion in the app store. If true, seems like a heck of a deal considering the exposure and distribution... no?
Government is not reason; it is not eloquent; it is force. Like fire, it is a dangerous servant and a fearful master. ~ George Washington
I suppose you have a point there.
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I do have DreamSpark but I've been told left and right "For education only" Also, maybe you know, can I keep selling an app after my 1 year membership expires or will it go off the store?
Even with a Dreamspark, the MS team was telling all of the students that they can put apps in the store. And you have a store account for a year. After that, you would have to renew the store account (at $99). Of course hopefully you can make that much with that app, or just don't renew it.
Steve Maier
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Pete O'Hanlon wrote:
The reality, of course, is that sales of WP8 devices has been somewhat less than stellar.
Yea, since they had the launch event yesterday for WP8, they really have not sold that many since then.
Steve Maier
Indeed - my mind has now switched (in true Apple fanboi fashion) from the version that's on the market to the one that's coming out, so all references to WP7/WP7.5 are now WP8.
*pre-emptive celebratory nipple tassle jiggle* - Sean Ewington
"Mind bleach! Send me mind bleach!" - Nagy Vilmos
CodeStash - Online Snippet Management | My blog | MoXAML PowerToys | Mole 2010 - debugging made easier
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Correct me if I'm wrong... but in both cases (Windows Phone OS & Apple iOS) you can develop all you want for free. The $99 is to submit apps for inclusion in the app store. If true, seems like a heck of a deal considering the exposure and distribution... no?
Government is not reason; it is not eloquent; it is force. Like fire, it is a dangerous servant and a fearful master. ~ George Washington
Mike Mullikin wrote:
you can develop all you want for free
...if you already have a Mac (in case of iOS) or a Windows machine (in case of WP).
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Correct me if I'm wrong... but in both cases (Windows Phone OS & Apple iOS) you can develop all you want for free. The $99 is to submit apps for inclusion in the app store. If true, seems like a heck of a deal considering the exposure and distribution... no?
Government is not reason; it is not eloquent; it is force. Like fire, it is a dangerous servant and a fearful master. ~ George Washington
Mike Mullikin wrote:
The $99 is to submit apps for inclusion in the app store.
Not quite. If you need to test on a physical device then you have to pay for your subscription, otherwise you won't be able to submit your apps to the devices to test. And bear in mind that this is the cost, even if you are giving your programs away for free - it's definitely a barrier to entry for some.
*pre-emptive celebratory nipple tassle jiggle* - Sean Ewington
"Mind bleach! Send me mind bleach!" - Nagy Vilmos
CodeStash - Online Snippet Management | My blog | MoXAML PowerToys | Mole 2010 - debugging made easier
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Indeed - my mind has now switched (in true Apple fanboi fashion) from the version that's on the market to the one that's coming out, so all references to WP7/WP7.5 are now WP8.
*pre-emptive celebratory nipple tassle jiggle* - Sean Ewington
"Mind bleach! Send me mind bleach!" - Nagy Vilmos
CodeStash - Online Snippet Management | My blog | MoXAML PowerToys | Mole 2010 - debugging made easier
I definately understand. I wish I had gotten the WP8 SDK early but could not get it. But it should be available today. I figured he meant WP7/7.5 but wanted to catch him anyways. :-D Many Apple fanbois would actually take that as true that the sales of WP8 has been bad until now, ignoring the fact that you cant get them yet.
Steve Maier
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Mike Mullikin wrote:
The $99 is to submit apps for inclusion in the app store.
Not quite. If you need to test on a physical device then you have to pay for your subscription, otherwise you won't be able to submit your apps to the devices to test. And bear in mind that this is the cost, even if you are giving your programs away for free - it's definitely a barrier to entry for some.
*pre-emptive celebratory nipple tassle jiggle* - Sean Ewington
"Mind bleach! Send me mind bleach!" - Nagy Vilmos
CodeStash - Online Snippet Management | My blog | MoXAML PowerToys | Mole 2010 - debugging made easier
Pete O'Hanlon wrote:
If you need to test on a physical device then you have to pay for your subscription, otherwise you won't be able to submit your apps to the devices to test.
Ahhhh... thanks for the information. I suppose we also need to consider the cost of the device (plus any contract or usage fees).
Pete O'Hanlon wrote:
And bear in mind that this is the cost, even if you are giving your programs away for free - it's definitely a barrier to entry for some.
True, but anyone who can't afford the $99 should probably not be giving the apps away for free... just saying. :-D
Government is not reason; it is not eloquent; it is force. Like fire, it is a dangerous servant and a fearful master. ~ George Washington
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I definately understand. I wish I had gotten the WP8 SDK early but could not get it. But it should be available today. I figured he meant WP7/7.5 but wanted to catch him anyways. :-D Many Apple fanbois would actually take that as true that the sales of WP8 has been bad until now, ignoring the fact that you cant get them yet.
Steve Maier
Steve Maier wrote:
I wish I had gotten the WP8 SDK early but could not get it
Same here. The silence from MS surrounding the rather bizarre decision to only offer the API to a tiny few has definitely harmed their standing with the faithful, especially as they are going to want to have WP8 apps in the store for day 1 of release. I know that you can still use WP7.5 apps with it, but that's no consolation for those of us who want to experience the new features the phone has available.
*pre-emptive celebratory nipple tassle jiggle* - Sean Ewington
"Mind bleach! Send me mind bleach!" - Nagy Vilmos
CodeStash - Online Snippet Management | My blog | MoXAML PowerToys | Mole 2010 - debugging made easier
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Even with a Dreamspark, the MS team was telling all of the students that they can put apps in the store. And you have a store account for a year. After that, you would have to renew the store account (at $99). Of course hopefully you can make that much with that app, or just don't renew it.
Steve Maier
Sounds nice. I guess I will look into this some more.
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Even with a Dreamspark, the MS team was telling all of the students that they can put apps in the store. And you have a store account for a year. After that, you would have to renew the store account (at $99). Of course hopefully you can make that much with that app, or just don't renew it.
Steve Maier
Steve Maier wrote:
Even with a Dreamspark, the MS team was telling all of the students that they can put apps in the store.
Not only that, they specifically disallow using anything obtained through Dreamspark (e.g. Visual Studio) for commercial purposes, with the sole exception being apps in their app store. So you can use free Visual Studio (Ultimate even) and any other tools they provide, along with a free store account and potentially even make some money.
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Mike Mullikin wrote:
The $99 is to submit apps for inclusion in the app store.
Not quite. If you need to test on a physical device then you have to pay for your subscription, otherwise you won't be able to submit your apps to the devices to test. And bear in mind that this is the cost, even if you are giving your programs away for free - it's definitely a barrier to entry for some.
*pre-emptive celebratory nipple tassle jiggle* - Sean Ewington
"Mind bleach! Send me mind bleach!" - Nagy Vilmos
CodeStash - Online Snippet Management | My blog | MoXAML PowerToys | Mole 2010 - debugging made easier
Hi Pete, Do you have any idea how the Company Hub will work in this regard? I can't seem to find any info on it, but if a company could develop their own 'in house' app, not for the marketplace, but put it their Company Hub then devices using the hub would be able to install and use the app - that would get rid of the need for 'developer unlocking' the device and the $99 - unless they wanted to release the app publicly of course. I can see that as not only being a workaround, but a very good use of the Company Hub, which is why I'm guessing that's not the way it will work!
Dave
Binging is like googling, it just feels dirtier. Please take your VB.NET out of our nice case sensitive forum. Astonish us. Be exceptional. (Pete O'Hanlon)
BTW, in software, hope and pray is not a viable strategy. (Luc Pattyn) -
Mike Mullikin wrote:
The $99 is to submit apps for inclusion in the app store.
Not quite. If you need to test on a physical device then you have to pay for your subscription, otherwise you won't be able to submit your apps to the devices to test. And bear in mind that this is the cost, even if you are giving your programs away for free - it's definitely a barrier to entry for some.
*pre-emptive celebratory nipple tassle jiggle* - Sean Ewington
"Mind bleach! Send me mind bleach!" - Nagy Vilmos
CodeStash - Online Snippet Management | My blog | MoXAML PowerToys | Mole 2010 - debugging made easier
Pete O'Hanlon wrote:
it's definitely a barrier to entry for some
Seeing the huge number of development done for mobile devices, I don't think that is really a barrier.
Nihil obstat