I Guess It Had To Happen...
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John Simmons / outlaw programmer wrote:
specifically, the Boston Tea Party as if it were a terrorist act.
...and the teaching of creationism, banning the teaching of Darwinian evolution (or at least down-grading it to an unproven hypotheses). Fundamentalism (be it religous or otherwise) is a dangerous path, but it doesn't half look like the first few bricks on that (very long) road from outside. For the 10 years I've known more about America than that I learnt in school (very little) via visiting for work and seeing relatives, I cannot but help feel that there is an almost endless number of pockets of fundamentalist style behaviour all over the place, kinda frightening tbh. (If anyone is at all offended, please accept my apologies, it was not my intent, it's just an observation)
Mike-MadBadger wrote:
that there is an almost endless number of pockets of fundamentalist style behaviour all over the place, kinda frightening tbh.
Might help to keep in mind that the extremism you see now is there because that is the only place it exists now. In the past much of that extremism was considered mainstream.
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It's not what anyone has done directly, it's a number of indirect things. Take a terror attack and assume for a moment the motivation for said attack was fundamentalist, you then have a fear of said type of thing happeneing again, your chance of being involved is slim but real. Now take teaching, kids grow up with poor discrimination between opinion, belief and fact which can lead to misinformed viewpoints and hence substantial differences of opionion between peoples of the world. Drop that difference into a string religious or political context and you have an increased risk of 'incidents', war, terror, trade disputes, all harmful (from my opionion). For clarity 'poor discrimination between opinion, belief and fact' is not a value judgement it simply notes that whatever you choose to believe afterwards is no longer driven primarily by whatever your own sound rartional judgement basis is. Then jump to politics, which in many places in the world is more divided within countries than for a long time since. Such internal differences tend to lead parties to 'stronger' policies that are heavily influenced by some dogma or belief system etc., this drives greater political differences between countries which at a minimum is bad for international relationships and the world is unquestionably a global place today, few countries are internally sustainable, relaying on trade for some major element of infrastructure (food, eneergy generation etc.) and beyond the minimum, well we have plenty of examples on-going now and in the past 30 years. How about the instability that always accompanies global and regional power balance changes, both of which are underway? They usually don't make the world a better place to live. Etc. All of which, from my opinion, makes the world a less fun place to live, often with more fear.
Mike-MadBadger wrote:
Then jump to politics, which in many places in the world is more divided within countries than for a long time since
So in comparison it was much better in the 70's when there at least appeared to be a real chance that the USSR and USA would start lobbing nukes at each other? Or say during the 60's when China made a very specific effort to kill basically everyone that had anything like an education? Or the USSR Stalin era which either directly or indirectly lead to millions of deaths by some estimates 60 million and most certainly above 10? Or WWII where quite literally most of the world was involved in the war?
Mike-MadBadger wrote:
few countries are internally sustainable, relaying on trade for some major element of infrastructure
Which is quite likely the best thing possible to insure stability. If I don't need anything at all from you then I need to respect you, care about you nor even talk to you. If I consider you essential to my well being then I am much more likely to take an active interest in your well being. And isolation is probably more likely to increase distrust.
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Texas schools are teaching US History - specifically, the Boston Tea Party (what I consider to be the tipping point toward the American Revolution) - as if it were a terrorist act. At the root of every country's origins, one would more than likely be able to discover what would now be called a "terrorist act". [moved to the Soapbox to let the discussion open up a little. - Chris Maunder.]
".45 ACP - because shooting twice is just silly" - JSOP, 2010
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You can never have too much ammo - unless you're swimming, or on fire. - JSOP, 2010
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"Why don't you tie a kerosene-soaked rag around your ankles so the ants won't climb up and eat your candy ass." - Dale Earnhardt, 1997They should also teach the Indian wars. With proper references to "genocide". :wtf:
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But since there is no voting, I will say it again. No citizen of the U.S. is capable of being a terrorist against the U.S. based on the founding doctrines of our country. Allowing anything else, pollutes the original ideal of our country (applies to U.S.). Those ideals are the right to revolt, to overthrow a tyrannical regime, the right to fight for what is right even if it is the government that is wrong. Calling citizens a terrorist allows history books to call patriots terrorists and tyrannical monarchs righteous. Down vote me if you want (HAH) but I am right. What Timothy McVeigh did was wrong, illegal, immoral, and killed my step sister, but was it terrorist? Not to me, did he deserve to be convicted and punished like he was, most likely. But, I still don't call him a terrorist.
Need custom software developed? I do custom programming based primarily on MS tools with an emphasis on C# development and consulting. I also do Android Programming as I find it a refreshing break from the MS. "And they, since they Were not the one dead, turned to their affairs" -- Robert Frost
To revolt means to renounce of allegiance, thought it is also used specifically in the case of an armed uprising. I'm not sure how killing a bunch of innocent, unarmed office workers with a bomb counts as an armed uprising. I'm also not sure the US government counts as a tyrannical regime - though don't get me started on the whole issue of software patents, else I'll be asking for a torch and a pitchfork. Not that I'm in the US. I also can't believe I'm actually replying, either, but your response is, well, incredibly open minded and well thought and it's that sort of debate I do enjoy and admire.
cheers, Chris Maunder The Code Project | Co-founder Microsoft C++ MVP
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Spot on.
People say nothing is impossible, but I do nothing every day.
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I voted for people that didn't vote for this crap. I was simply out-voted by other people that voted for the other side. In essence, I'm reaping what everyone else sowed. "Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety." Benjamin Franklin, 1759
".45 ACP - because shooting twice is just silly" - JSOP, 2010
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You can never have too much ammo - unless you're swimming, or on fire. - JSOP, 2010
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"Why don't you tie a kerosene-soaked rag around your ankles so the ants won't climb up and eat your candy ass." - Dale Earnhardt, 1997To quote from a disputed source, (Alexis de Tocqueville, Joseph de Maistre)... 'We get the government we deserve and deserve the government we get'
Rhys "If you ever start taking things too seriously, just remember that we are talking monkeys on an organic spaceship flying through the Universe"
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Texas schools are teaching US History - specifically, the Boston Tea Party (what I consider to be the tipping point toward the American Revolution) - as if it were a terrorist act. At the root of every country's origins, one would more than likely be able to discover what would now be called a "terrorist act". [moved to the Soapbox to let the discussion open up a little. - Chris Maunder.]
".45 ACP - because shooting twice is just silly" - JSOP, 2010
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You can never have too much ammo - unless you're swimming, or on fire. - JSOP, 2010
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"Why don't you tie a kerosene-soaked rag around your ankles so the ants won't climb up and eat your candy ass." - Dale Earnhardt, 1997Could you provide some links to this fact? Having seen previous postings about FEMA death camps etc, I am reluctant to take this at face value
==================================== Transvestites - Roberts in Disguise! ====================================
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John Simmons / outlaw programmer wrote:
Texas schools are teaching US History - specifically, the Boston Tea Party ... as if it were a terrorist act.
This means the whole country is going to start teaching it this way, because normally everyone else follows Texas's choice of textbooks... :| EDIT: Also, I'm interested to hear what our neighbo(u)rs across the pond think of this...
The United States invariably does the right thing, after having exhausted every other alternative. -Winston Churchill America is the only country that went from barbarism to decadence without civilization in between. -Oscar Wilde Wow, even the French showed a little more spine than that before they got their sh*t pushed in.[^] -Colin Mullikin
Colin Mullikin wrote:
EDIT: Also, I'm interested to hear what our neighbo(u)rs across the pond think of this...
We have enough history not to be obsessed with an act that happened a little over 200 years ago; we can obsess about things that happened 1000 to 2000 years ago. Maybe when your country grows up a bit, you'll have other things to remember.
*pre-emptive celebratory nipple tassle jiggle* - Sean Ewington
"Mind bleach! Send me mind bleach!" - Nagy Vilmos
CodeStash - Online Snippet Management | My blog | MoXAML PowerToys | Mole 2010 - debugging made easier
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Texas schools are teaching US History - specifically, the Boston Tea Party (what I consider to be the tipping point toward the American Revolution) - as if it were a terrorist act. At the root of every country's origins, one would more than likely be able to discover what would now be called a "terrorist act". [moved to the Soapbox to let the discussion open up a little. - Chris Maunder.]
".45 ACP - because shooting twice is just silly" - JSOP, 2010
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You can never have too much ammo - unless you're swimming, or on fire. - JSOP, 2010
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"Why don't you tie a kerosene-soaked rag around your ankles so the ants won't climb up and eat your candy ass." - Dale Earnhardt, 1997That is just stupid! It wasn't a terrorist attack, it wasn't even much of an attack of any kind. As you know the background was that in order to compete with the price of tea being smuggled in by American pirates the govt removed tax on the tea they sold. The pirates got pissed off and dumped a load of govt tea into the river. They also disguised themselves as natives in order to try to damage the good relationship the govt had with them. Hardly terror, more a business issue really.
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Well, the stupid pillocks were wearing red. Is that why guys in the woods wearing flouro jackets are still getting shot these days?
If your neighbours don't listen to The Ramones, turn it up real loud so they can.
Mark H2 wrote:
Well, the stupid pillocks were wearing red.
You cant see the blood if you wear red! :)
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John Simmons / outlaw programmer wrote:
Texas schools are teaching US History - specifically, the Boston Tea Party ... as if it were a terrorist act.
This means the whole country is going to start teaching it this way, because normally everyone else follows Texas's choice of textbooks... :| EDIT: Also, I'm interested to hear what our neighbo(u)rs across the pond think of this...
The United States invariably does the right thing, after having exhausted every other alternative. -Winston Churchill America is the only country that went from barbarism to decadence without civilization in between. -Oscar Wilde Wow, even the French showed a little more spine than that before they got their sh*t pushed in.[^] -Colin Mullikin
Colin Mullikin wrote:
EDIT: Also, I'm interested to hear what our neighbo(u)rs across the pond think of this...
As there isn't a link to the text, I don't know what was actually said, but that isn't going to stop me pontificating wildly. If this is the case then it's pretty stupid. This is the ultimate emotive language example, isn't it: Freedom Fighter ---> Guerilla ---> Terrorist Agree ---------------------------> Disagree I don't blame the then US colonies from rebelling, they were treated pretty shoddily by the government from what little I understand of the situation. Even if I was against it, I'd still fail to see where the "Terror" part slips in, it wasn't designed as an act to strike fear but as part of an legitimate protest (even if their actions were illegal).
Sort of a cross between Lawrence of Arabia and Dilbert.[^]
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A Dead ringer for Kate Winslett[^] -
Or rewriting.
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Could you provide some links to this fact? Having seen previous postings about FEMA death camps etc, I am reluctant to take this at face value
==================================== Transvestites - Roberts in Disguise! ====================================
Huffington Post article (citing an article by Glenn Beck)[^]
".45 ACP - because shooting twice is just silly" - JSOP, 2010
-----
You can never have too much ammo - unless you're swimming, or on fire. - JSOP, 2010
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"Why don't you tie a kerosene-soaked rag around your ankles so the ants won't climb up and eat your candy ass." - Dale Earnhardt, 1997 -
Texas schools are teaching US History - specifically, the Boston Tea Party (what I consider to be the tipping point toward the American Revolution) - as if it were a terrorist act. At the root of every country's origins, one would more than likely be able to discover what would now be called a "terrorist act". [moved to the Soapbox to let the discussion open up a little. - Chris Maunder.]
".45 ACP - because shooting twice is just silly" - JSOP, 2010
-----
You can never have too much ammo - unless you're swimming, or on fire. - JSOP, 2010
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"Why don't you tie a kerosene-soaked rag around your ankles so the ants won't climb up and eat your candy ass." - Dale Earnhardt, 1997Thank you for posting something to Soapbox that is not a joke! Although the school systems these days might be called that. - OUT! Damn Spot!
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Colin Mullikin wrote:
EDIT: Also, I'm interested to hear what our neighbo(u)rs across the pond think of this...
As there isn't a link to the text, I don't know what was actually said, but that isn't going to stop me pontificating wildly. If this is the case then it's pretty stupid. This is the ultimate emotive language example, isn't it: Freedom Fighter ---> Guerilla ---> Terrorist Agree ---------------------------> Disagree I don't blame the then US colonies from rebelling, they were treated pretty shoddily by the government from what little I understand of the situation. Even if I was against it, I'd still fail to see where the "Terror" part slips in, it wasn't designed as an act to strike fear but as part of an legitimate protest (even if their actions were illegal).
Sort of a cross between Lawrence of Arabia and Dilbert.[^]
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A Dead ringer for Kate Winslett[^]Keith Barrow wrote:
As there isn't a link to the text, I don't know what was actually said, but that isn't going to stop me pontificating wildly.
Isn't that the heart and soul of The Lounge...? :laugh:
The United States invariably does the right thing, after having exhausted every other alternative. -Winston Churchill America is the only country that went from barbarism to decadence without civilization in between. -Oscar Wilde Wow, even the French showed a little more spine than that before they got their sh*t pushed in.[^] -Colin Mullikin
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Colin Mullikin wrote:
EDIT: Also, I'm interested to hear what our neighbo(u)rs across the pond think of this...
We have enough history not to be obsessed with an act that happened a little over 200 years ago; we can obsess about things that happened 1000 to 2000 years ago. Maybe when your country grows up a bit, you'll have other things to remember.
*pre-emptive celebratory nipple tassle jiggle* - Sean Ewington
"Mind bleach! Send me mind bleach!" - Nagy Vilmos
CodeStash - Online Snippet Management | My blog | MoXAML PowerToys | Mole 2010 - debugging made easier
Still a little sore about it, I see... ;P
The United States invariably does the right thing, after having exhausted every other alternative. -Winston Churchill America is the only country that went from barbarism to decadence without civilization in between. -Oscar Wilde Wow, even the French showed a little more spine than that before they got their sh*t pushed in.[^] -Colin Mullikin
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Still a little sore about it, I see... ;P
The United States invariably does the right thing, after having exhausted every other alternative. -Winston Churchill America is the only country that went from barbarism to decadence without civilization in between. -Oscar Wilde Wow, even the French showed a little more spine than that before they got their sh*t pushed in.[^] -Colin Mullikin
Of course. I'd hate to think that Pee Wee Herman was an Englishman.
*pre-emptive celebratory nipple tassle jiggle* - Sean Ewington
"Mind bleach! Send me mind bleach!" - Nagy Vilmos
CodeStash - Online Snippet Management | My blog | MoXAML PowerToys | Mole 2010 - debugging made easier
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Huffington Post article (citing an article by Glenn Beck)[^]
".45 ACP - because shooting twice is just silly" - JSOP, 2010
-----
You can never have too much ammo - unless you're swimming, or on fire. - JSOP, 2010
-----
"Why don't you tie a kerosene-soaked rag around your ankles so the ants won't climb up and eat your candy ass." - Dale Earnhardt, 1997Ah - Glen Beck - Fox News' paragon of truthful reportage!
==================================== Transvestites - Roberts in Disguise! ====================================
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Mark H2 wrote:
Well, the stupid pillocks were wearing red.
You cant see the blood if you wear red! :)
the french wore brown trousers for a similar reason
You cant outrun the world, but there is no harm in getting a head start Real stupidity beats artificial intelligence every time.
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the french wore brown trousers for a similar reason
You cant outrun the world, but there is no harm in getting a head start Real stupidity beats artificial intelligence every time.
