PayPal Hell
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I am caught up in PayPal hell and want to warn others. Our website has been merrily accepting PayPal payments for about a year - no problem. Recently PayPal sent me an email about PayPal Here and I thought I would take a quick look at it even though it probably did not suit our business. BIG mistake. This has triggered an "Information Request" for our business and the last two weeks have been a spiral into hell. What started out as a small request has led to a series of about 10 requests and a progressive limiting of our account (I now cannot withdraw or spend money) even though every request has been responded to quickly and correctly. We currently have about $1000 stuck in the account that we cannot access. I have had to remove PayPal as a payment option (which isn't popular with our customers) as we can't get the money. Luckily I got to this fairly early otherwise it could have been a lot more money locked up. It has now descended into farce with the latest request for information being for information already requested and is clearly sitting on THEIR server with a big green "Accepted" next to it. More frighteningly, they have also insisted that a certificate have a registration number on it that DIDN'T EXIST when the certificate was created (here the company is being penalized for being 25 years old!) They want the number to be on the certificate... I tell them that that numbering system didn't exist then... they want the number to be on the certificate... I tell them that I can provide other documentation showing the number issued after the number was actually created (2 years after the certificate)... they want the number to be on the certificate... I rant and ask for escalation... they want the number to be on the certificate. You have been warned. Be VERY careful with PayPal.
Paul Hooper If you spend your whole life looking over your shoulder, they will get you from the front instead.
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I am caught up in PayPal hell and want to warn others. Our website has been merrily accepting PayPal payments for about a year - no problem. Recently PayPal sent me an email about PayPal Here and I thought I would take a quick look at it even though it probably did not suit our business. BIG mistake. This has triggered an "Information Request" for our business and the last two weeks have been a spiral into hell. What started out as a small request has led to a series of about 10 requests and a progressive limiting of our account (I now cannot withdraw or spend money) even though every request has been responded to quickly and correctly. We currently have about $1000 stuck in the account that we cannot access. I have had to remove PayPal as a payment option (which isn't popular with our customers) as we can't get the money. Luckily I got to this fairly early otherwise it could have been a lot more money locked up. It has now descended into farce with the latest request for information being for information already requested and is clearly sitting on THEIR server with a big green "Accepted" next to it. More frighteningly, they have also insisted that a certificate have a registration number on it that DIDN'T EXIST when the certificate was created (here the company is being penalized for being 25 years old!) They want the number to be on the certificate... I tell them that that numbering system didn't exist then... they want the number to be on the certificate... I tell them that I can provide other documentation showing the number issued after the number was actually created (2 years after the certificate)... they want the number to be on the certificate... I rant and ask for escalation... they want the number to be on the certificate. You have been warned. Be VERY careful with PayPal.
Paul Hooper If you spend your whole life looking over your shoulder, they will get you from the front instead.
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I am caught up in PayPal hell and want to warn others. Our website has been merrily accepting PayPal payments for about a year - no problem. Recently PayPal sent me an email about PayPal Here and I thought I would take a quick look at it even though it probably did not suit our business. BIG mistake. This has triggered an "Information Request" for our business and the last two weeks have been a spiral into hell. What started out as a small request has led to a series of about 10 requests and a progressive limiting of our account (I now cannot withdraw or spend money) even though every request has been responded to quickly and correctly. We currently have about $1000 stuck in the account that we cannot access. I have had to remove PayPal as a payment option (which isn't popular with our customers) as we can't get the money. Luckily I got to this fairly early otherwise it could have been a lot more money locked up. It has now descended into farce with the latest request for information being for information already requested and is clearly sitting on THEIR server with a big green "Accepted" next to it. More frighteningly, they have also insisted that a certificate have a registration number on it that DIDN'T EXIST when the certificate was created (here the company is being penalized for being 25 years old!) They want the number to be on the certificate... I tell them that that numbering system didn't exist then... they want the number to be on the certificate... I tell them that I can provide other documentation showing the number issued after the number was actually created (2 years after the certificate)... they want the number to be on the certificate... I rant and ask for escalation... they want the number to be on the certificate. You have been warned. Be VERY careful with PayPal.
Paul Hooper If you spend your whole life looking over your shoulder, they will get you from the front instead.
Paul Hooper wrote:
This has triggered an "Information Request" for our business
May I ask what exactly an "information request" is, and what it's for?
The difficult we do right away... ...the impossible takes slightly longer.
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Paul Hooper wrote:
This has triggered an "Information Request" for our business
May I ask what exactly an "information request" is, and what it's for?
The difficult we do right away... ...the impossible takes slightly longer.
Basically they are trying to determine if we really are who we say we are. The root cause is an Australian Government law to prevent criminals using things like PayPal for money laundering. I actually don't disagree with the concept, just the execution by PayPal. 1. If the law is so important, why was I able to do business for so long without providing this identification to PayPal? Why has asking to look at PayPal Here suddenly prompted this review? I would have MUCH preferred having to provide all this information up front, before PayPal was backed into our processes. This has come out of nowhere and is causing havoc with established processes. 2. Most importantly, be reasonable about things and only lock up money if they have a suspicion that something wrong is happening. In our case, they asked for identifying information (copies of Certificates of Incorporation etc) and locked our account so we couldn't close it. After three request rounds (including things like a "Mission Statement" for the company) where we had provided everything they had asked for, they suddenly increased our limitation to prevent us moving money out of the account and started the farce discussed earlier. Worst of all, it is like fighting the Hydra. I have never had two communications from the same person. Grrrrr.
Paul Hooper If you spend your whole life looking over your shoulder, they will get you from the front instead.
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I am caught up in PayPal hell and want to warn others. Our website has been merrily accepting PayPal payments for about a year - no problem. Recently PayPal sent me an email about PayPal Here and I thought I would take a quick look at it even though it probably did not suit our business. BIG mistake. This has triggered an "Information Request" for our business and the last two weeks have been a spiral into hell. What started out as a small request has led to a series of about 10 requests and a progressive limiting of our account (I now cannot withdraw or spend money) even though every request has been responded to quickly and correctly. We currently have about $1000 stuck in the account that we cannot access. I have had to remove PayPal as a payment option (which isn't popular with our customers) as we can't get the money. Luckily I got to this fairly early otherwise it could have been a lot more money locked up. It has now descended into farce with the latest request for information being for information already requested and is clearly sitting on THEIR server with a big green "Accepted" next to it. More frighteningly, they have also insisted that a certificate have a registration number on it that DIDN'T EXIST when the certificate was created (here the company is being penalized for being 25 years old!) They want the number to be on the certificate... I tell them that that numbering system didn't exist then... they want the number to be on the certificate... I tell them that I can provide other documentation showing the number issued after the number was actually created (2 years after the certificate)... they want the number to be on the certificate... I rant and ask for escalation... they want the number to be on the certificate. You have been warned. Be VERY careful with PayPal.
Paul Hooper If you spend your whole life looking over your shoulder, they will get you from the front instead.
You have my deep sympathies, Paul. Over a decade ago, for a few years I dabbled in dealing in S.E. Asian art, mainly to finance my own collection. Going into business resulted in a nightmare with my US PayPal, account, like something out of Kafka. They still have about US $90 of mine, now locked up for eleven (?) years, or so. And, often, when a collector-client come to the country I lived in, and hired me to negotiate for them using my skills (gained at very high cost) in bargaining in the country's native language with dealers, and helping them avoid scammers, and fakes, the visiting client had their PayPal account frozen just because they were "in" S.E. Asia, with the same kind of Catch-22 demands for information the client couldn't possibly send them proof of, since the documents were back in America, or Europe. I thought perhaps PayPal had really evolved after its acquisition by eBay, but, reading your story, it sounds like the same-old. bill
Google CEO, Erich Schmidt: "I keep asking for a product called Serendipity. This product would have access to everything ever written or recorded, know everything the user ever worked on and saved to his or her personal hard drive, and know a whole lot about the user's tastes, friends and predilections." 2004, USA Today interview
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You have my deep sympathies, Paul. Over a decade ago, for a few years I dabbled in dealing in S.E. Asian art, mainly to finance my own collection. Going into business resulted in a nightmare with my US PayPal, account, like something out of Kafka. They still have about US $90 of mine, now locked up for eleven (?) years, or so. And, often, when a collector-client come to the country I lived in, and hired me to negotiate for them using my skills (gained at very high cost) in bargaining in the country's native language with dealers, and helping them avoid scammers, and fakes, the visiting client had their PayPal account frozen just because they were "in" S.E. Asia, with the same kind of Catch-22 demands for information the client couldn't possibly send them proof of, since the documents were back in America, or Europe. I thought perhaps PayPal had really evolved after its acquisition by eBay, but, reading your story, it sounds like the same-old. bill
Google CEO, Erich Schmidt: "I keep asking for a product called Serendipity. This product would have access to everything ever written or recorded, know everything the user ever worked on and saved to his or her personal hard drive, and know a whole lot about the user's tastes, friends and predilections." 2004, USA Today interview
I hope it doesn't go on that long! Lots of our customers want to use PayPal and the loss of PayPal as a payment option would be difficult to manage - far worse than the $1000. One good factor is that they are "attacking" me under Australian Law. Australia also has a Financial Ombudsman who would be very interested in this sort of thing. All of this for a business that has been running for 25 years with basically no complaints from anyone. We sell to schools and teachers. I cannot imagine a less threatening scenario!
Paul Hooper If you spend your whole life looking over your shoulder, they will get you from the front instead.
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Basically they are trying to determine if we really are who we say we are. The root cause is an Australian Government law to prevent criminals using things like PayPal for money laundering. I actually don't disagree with the concept, just the execution by PayPal. 1. If the law is so important, why was I able to do business for so long without providing this identification to PayPal? Why has asking to look at PayPal Here suddenly prompted this review? I would have MUCH preferred having to provide all this information up front, before PayPal was backed into our processes. This has come out of nowhere and is causing havoc with established processes. 2. Most importantly, be reasonable about things and only lock up money if they have a suspicion that something wrong is happening. In our case, they asked for identifying information (copies of Certificates of Incorporation etc) and locked our account so we couldn't close it. After three request rounds (including things like a "Mission Statement" for the company) where we had provided everything they had asked for, they suddenly increased our limitation to prevent us moving money out of the account and started the farce discussed earlier. Worst of all, it is like fighting the Hydra. I have never had two communications from the same person. Grrrrr.
Paul Hooper If you spend your whole life looking over your shoulder, they will get you from the front instead.
If you have the stamina it may be worth following this through with your government - on a slightly separate note I have followed some of Senator Nick Xenophon's campaigning and have been very impressed with what he has achieved with regards to a certain money making religion. I have had a bad experience with paypal where they allowed someone to pay for my software then withdraw the payment claiming it was fraudulent hence gaining the key to my software and distributing it online. Anything that can help clean up their act is a good thing in my opinion - they have a huge amount of power and need to learn to be responsible with this power.
“That which can be asserted without evidence, can be dismissed without evidence.”
― Christopher Hitchens
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I am caught up in PayPal hell and want to warn others. Our website has been merrily accepting PayPal payments for about a year - no problem. Recently PayPal sent me an email about PayPal Here and I thought I would take a quick look at it even though it probably did not suit our business. BIG mistake. This has triggered an "Information Request" for our business and the last two weeks have been a spiral into hell. What started out as a small request has led to a series of about 10 requests and a progressive limiting of our account (I now cannot withdraw or spend money) even though every request has been responded to quickly and correctly. We currently have about $1000 stuck in the account that we cannot access. I have had to remove PayPal as a payment option (which isn't popular with our customers) as we can't get the money. Luckily I got to this fairly early otherwise it could have been a lot more money locked up. It has now descended into farce with the latest request for information being for information already requested and is clearly sitting on THEIR server with a big green "Accepted" next to it. More frighteningly, they have also insisted that a certificate have a registration number on it that DIDN'T EXIST when the certificate was created (here the company is being penalized for being 25 years old!) They want the number to be on the certificate... I tell them that that numbering system didn't exist then... they want the number to be on the certificate... I tell them that I can provide other documentation showing the number issued after the number was actually created (2 years after the certificate)... they want the number to be on the certificate... I rant and ask for escalation... they want the number to be on the certificate. You have been warned. Be VERY careful with PayPal.
Paul Hooper If you spend your whole life looking over your shoulder, they will get you from the front instead.
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They're just making up bullshit, knowing they hold all the cards. Their goal is to make you give up, so they can steal your money.
IMHO, Harold aptroot is correct, Hooper! BTW, don't get too optimistic about Ombudsman business in Australia. It is another farce with entirely different Hydra monster.
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I am caught up in PayPal hell and want to warn others. Our website has been merrily accepting PayPal payments for about a year - no problem. Recently PayPal sent me an email about PayPal Here and I thought I would take a quick look at it even though it probably did not suit our business. BIG mistake. This has triggered an "Information Request" for our business and the last two weeks have been a spiral into hell. What started out as a small request has led to a series of about 10 requests and a progressive limiting of our account (I now cannot withdraw or spend money) even though every request has been responded to quickly and correctly. We currently have about $1000 stuck in the account that we cannot access. I have had to remove PayPal as a payment option (which isn't popular with our customers) as we can't get the money. Luckily I got to this fairly early otherwise it could have been a lot more money locked up. It has now descended into farce with the latest request for information being for information already requested and is clearly sitting on THEIR server with a big green "Accepted" next to it. More frighteningly, they have also insisted that a certificate have a registration number on it that DIDN'T EXIST when the certificate was created (here the company is being penalized for being 25 years old!) They want the number to be on the certificate... I tell them that that numbering system didn't exist then... they want the number to be on the certificate... I tell them that I can provide other documentation showing the number issued after the number was actually created (2 years after the certificate)... they want the number to be on the certificate... I rant and ask for escalation... they want the number to be on the certificate. You have been warned. Be VERY careful with PayPal.
Paul Hooper If you spend your whole life looking over your shoulder, they will get you from the front instead.
My sympathies, I moved recently and on hell of a time changing all my PayPal information and I don't think I got it all straightened out but I can use it for purchases. I can only imagine what you're going though.
VS2010/Atmel Studio 6.1 ToDo Manager Extension The problem with the gene pool is that there is no lifeguard. -Steven Wright
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I am caught up in PayPal hell and want to warn others. Our website has been merrily accepting PayPal payments for about a year - no problem. Recently PayPal sent me an email about PayPal Here and I thought I would take a quick look at it even though it probably did not suit our business. BIG mistake. This has triggered an "Information Request" for our business and the last two weeks have been a spiral into hell. What started out as a small request has led to a series of about 10 requests and a progressive limiting of our account (I now cannot withdraw or spend money) even though every request has been responded to quickly and correctly. We currently have about $1000 stuck in the account that we cannot access. I have had to remove PayPal as a payment option (which isn't popular with our customers) as we can't get the money. Luckily I got to this fairly early otherwise it could have been a lot more money locked up. It has now descended into farce with the latest request for information being for information already requested and is clearly sitting on THEIR server with a big green "Accepted" next to it. More frighteningly, they have also insisted that a certificate have a registration number on it that DIDN'T EXIST when the certificate was created (here the company is being penalized for being 25 years old!) They want the number to be on the certificate... I tell them that that numbering system didn't exist then... they want the number to be on the certificate... I tell them that I can provide other documentation showing the number issued after the number was actually created (2 years after the certificate)... they want the number to be on the certificate... I rant and ask for escalation... they want the number to be on the certificate. You have been warned. Be VERY careful with PayPal.
Paul Hooper If you spend your whole life looking over your shoulder, they will get you from the front instead.
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Basically they are trying to determine if we really are who we say we are. The root cause is an Australian Government law to prevent criminals using things like PayPal for money laundering. I actually don't disagree with the concept, just the execution by PayPal. 1. If the law is so important, why was I able to do business for so long without providing this identification to PayPal? Why has asking to look at PayPal Here suddenly prompted this review? I would have MUCH preferred having to provide all this information up front, before PayPal was backed into our processes. This has come out of nowhere and is causing havoc with established processes. 2. Most importantly, be reasonable about things and only lock up money if they have a suspicion that something wrong is happening. In our case, they asked for identifying information (copies of Certificates of Incorporation etc) and locked our account so we couldn't close it. After three request rounds (including things like a "Mission Statement" for the company) where we had provided everything they had asked for, they suddenly increased our limitation to prevent us moving money out of the account and started the farce discussed earlier. Worst of all, it is like fighting the Hydra. I have never had two communications from the same person. Grrrrr.
Paul Hooper If you spend your whole life looking over your shoulder, they will get you from the front instead.
Paul Hooper wrote:
1. If the law is so important, why was I able to do business for so long without providing this identification to PayPal?
Perhaps because this represents an account change and thus they must now get it. Or because of the account change they just noticed they never got the information when they should have and now they are playing catch up.
Paul Hooper wrote:
Worst of all, it is like fighting the Hydra
They are basically an unregulated bank. The option of course is to stop using them entirely. There are other mobile payment providers.
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I am caught up in PayPal hell and want to warn others. Our website has been merrily accepting PayPal payments for about a year - no problem. Recently PayPal sent me an email about PayPal Here and I thought I would take a quick look at it even though it probably did not suit our business. BIG mistake. This has triggered an "Information Request" for our business and the last two weeks have been a spiral into hell. What started out as a small request has led to a series of about 10 requests and a progressive limiting of our account (I now cannot withdraw or spend money) even though every request has been responded to quickly and correctly. We currently have about $1000 stuck in the account that we cannot access. I have had to remove PayPal as a payment option (which isn't popular with our customers) as we can't get the money. Luckily I got to this fairly early otherwise it could have been a lot more money locked up. It has now descended into farce with the latest request for information being for information already requested and is clearly sitting on THEIR server with a big green "Accepted" next to it. More frighteningly, they have also insisted that a certificate have a registration number on it that DIDN'T EXIST when the certificate was created (here the company is being penalized for being 25 years old!) They want the number to be on the certificate... I tell them that that numbering system didn't exist then... they want the number to be on the certificate... I tell them that I can provide other documentation showing the number issued after the number was actually created (2 years after the certificate)... they want the number to be on the certificate... I rant and ask for escalation... they want the number to be on the certificate. You have been warned. Be VERY careful with PayPal.
Paul Hooper If you spend your whole life looking over your shoulder, they will get you from the front instead.
Not BS, not to be dismissed just because it's only $1000.00 (US), not an issue over which one should lose sleep. From experience then, but unfortuneatly America not Australia, the Better Business Bureau is the easiest place to make a query about any situation with a company. Next find the state's district attorney's office, online and "way easy" to find a surface address to which a letter of inquiry can be sent. Include all corporate flags found in any "who we are" page of the PayPal corporate listing, a list of chief officers their street addresses, their legal reprentation by name and by street address, the periods of personal business transaction with the organisation, and any other logistical innformation, and be sure to state what you think is your legal right given the circumstance. Chances are you'll get a very fast reply. And if you're lucky a statement to the effect that the company is currently under investigation, if not a legal document case number, presumeably to which your own information has now been added. Don't expect instant results from either of these contact. Cases take time to go to court. And now for the downside of contacting BBB and State's Attourney. You open yourself up to subpeona in crimnal proceedings. And although I'll start talking through my hat now that the the word "civil" comes up, how anyone really expects to proceed on gaining access to $1000.00 of their own money based upon "just because it's my money" kind-of-logic, might be something that determines whether you just cut your loses and move on. Today. That last bit of advice should be taken to heart by anyone who has better things to do than pursue hours/weekks/months/years of fruitless doggedness getting what's owed to them by a company. In short, drop PayPal. And forgettaboutit.
