Live coding?
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I've been wanting to experiment with something that would probably be called "live coding". These days, it's not uncommon for gamers to live stream their game play. So I can't help but wonder if there's someone out there, possibly a junior level developer, who might want to see what it looks like when a seasoned ASP MVC developer plugs away at the terminal. Or maybe another seasoned developer who typically works alone might want to see what it looks like when someone else is writing code. There's the potential to learn a lot, but for the people watching me, and myself. I can explain the design decisions I made, but I'm also interested in taking recommendations on my existing design decisions. I'm interested in sharing my workflow, but also learning from others where my workflow has gaps. Google+ Hangouts seem to be the best way to facilitate this kind of live coding because you can see my screen and we can communicate together. Yesterday, during my first test, I had two people stop in to see what I was doing, but they didn't stay for long. I think maybe if I schedule it here in advance that I might get more people watching/contributing. Thoughts, anyone?
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I've been wanting to experiment with something that would probably be called "live coding". These days, it's not uncommon for gamers to live stream their game play. So I can't help but wonder if there's someone out there, possibly a junior level developer, who might want to see what it looks like when a seasoned ASP MVC developer plugs away at the terminal. Or maybe another seasoned developer who typically works alone might want to see what it looks like when someone else is writing code. There's the potential to learn a lot, but for the people watching me, and myself. I can explain the design decisions I made, but I'm also interested in taking recommendations on my existing design decisions. I'm interested in sharing my workflow, but also learning from others where my workflow has gaps. Google+ Hangouts seem to be the best way to facilitate this kind of live coding because you can see my screen and we can communicate together. Yesterday, during my first test, I had two people stop in to see what I was doing, but they didn't stay for long. I think maybe if I schedule it here in advance that I might get more people watching/contributing. Thoughts, anyone?
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I've been wanting to experiment with something that would probably be called "live coding". These days, it's not uncommon for gamers to live stream their game play. So I can't help but wonder if there's someone out there, possibly a junior level developer, who might want to see what it looks like when a seasoned ASP MVC developer plugs away at the terminal. Or maybe another seasoned developer who typically works alone might want to see what it looks like when someone else is writing code. There's the potential to learn a lot, but for the people watching me, and myself. I can explain the design decisions I made, but I'm also interested in taking recommendations on my existing design decisions. I'm interested in sharing my workflow, but also learning from others where my workflow has gaps. Google+ Hangouts seem to be the best way to facilitate this kind of live coding because you can see my screen and we can communicate together. Yesterday, during my first test, I had two people stop in to see what I was doing, but they didn't stay for long. I think maybe if I schedule it here in advance that I might get more people watching/contributing. Thoughts, anyone?
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I've been wanting to experiment with something that would probably be called "live coding". These days, it's not uncommon for gamers to live stream their game play. So I can't help but wonder if there's someone out there, possibly a junior level developer, who might want to see what it looks like when a seasoned ASP MVC developer plugs away at the terminal. Or maybe another seasoned developer who typically works alone might want to see what it looks like when someone else is writing code. There's the potential to learn a lot, but for the people watching me, and myself. I can explain the design decisions I made, but I'm also interested in taking recommendations on my existing design decisions. I'm interested in sharing my workflow, but also learning from others where my workflow has gaps. Google+ Hangouts seem to be the best way to facilitate this kind of live coding because you can see my screen and we can communicate together. Yesterday, during my first test, I had two people stop in to see what I was doing, but they didn't stay for long. I think maybe if I schedule it here in advance that I might get more people watching/contributing. Thoughts, anyone?
I genuinely hate having people constantly being able to stare at my screen. Experience taught me that my efficiency actually goes down when people are able to look at my screen. So not for me thank you. ;P
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Thanks for the feedback, David. I plan on doing it again once or twice this week, so I'll be sure to post in all relevant places ahead of time. What day/time works best for you, by the way?
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Are you thinking about pair programming / XP development? I've been involved in pair programming a few times. Not sure if it works well.
It's a little like pair programming, except "pair" usually means "two", and Google+ Hangouts supports quite a bit more than two people at the same time. And more than likely, I'd be the only on with access to the IDE. Would still share my thought process and accept feedback along the way though.
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Very cool! 18,000 views is inspiring, though I have no way of knowing whether or not that's because the video is two years old and/or there are a lot of people interested in development of that game. Still, this leaves me feeling like there's some chance of this experiment being successful.
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I genuinely hate having people constantly being able to stare at my screen. Experience taught me that my efficiency actually goes down when people are able to look at my screen. So not for me thank you. ;P
I understand the feeling, V. Having someone, let alone a LOT of people, staring over your shoulder definitely seems to increase the chances of making mistakes. I've experienced that in the past, myself. However, I feel like I've been doing this long enough that it's not as much of an issue as it used to be. And sure, it can be scary... I'm effectively exposing my abilities to the world for all to see and judge. But I'm fine with that. I've come to realize that we're all human. We all make mistakes. And very few of us developers are actually as skilled as I wish I was. I truly believe this will be an excellent learning experience.
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Just last week I saw a presentation of something along these lines. Check out Andrew Sorensen[^]
Wow! Thanks for this link! I've learned so much about live coding from this thread already (it exists, for one!), but this video is a true gem! Thanks!
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I've been wanting to experiment with something that would probably be called "live coding". These days, it's not uncommon for gamers to live stream their game play. So I can't help but wonder if there's someone out there, possibly a junior level developer, who might want to see what it looks like when a seasoned ASP MVC developer plugs away at the terminal. Or maybe another seasoned developer who typically works alone might want to see what it looks like when someone else is writing code. There's the potential to learn a lot, but for the people watching me, and myself. I can explain the design decisions I made, but I'm also interested in taking recommendations on my existing design decisions. I'm interested in sharing my workflow, but also learning from others where my workflow has gaps. Google+ Hangouts seem to be the best way to facilitate this kind of live coding because you can see my screen and we can communicate together. Yesterday, during my first test, I had two people stop in to see what I was doing, but they didn't stay for long. I think maybe if I schedule it here in advance that I might get more people watching/contributing. Thoughts, anyone?
I'm with others on this. Unlike gaming, where most of what happens is on the screen, when writing software most of what happens is between my ears. Just watching the screen when I'm coding wouldn't be much more interesting than watching paint dry. However, I've been wrong about what kinds of things people want to watch before, so I say do like you've done.. give it a try and see if there's any interest.
We can program with only 1's, but if all you've got are zeros, you've got nothing.
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I understand the feeling, V. Having someone, let alone a LOT of people, staring over your shoulder definitely seems to increase the chances of making mistakes. I've experienced that in the past, myself. However, I feel like I've been doing this long enough that it's not as much of an issue as it used to be. And sure, it can be scary... I'm effectively exposing my abilities to the world for all to see and judge. But I'm fine with that. I've come to realize that we're all human. We all make mistakes. And very few of us developers are actually as skilled as I wish I was. I truly believe this will be an excellent learning experience.
It´s not about making mistakes, it´s just a constant annoyance ;P
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It´s not about making mistakes, it´s just a constant annoyance ;P
You'll do much better as a developer if you can work past that issue. :)
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Thanks for the feedback, David. I plan on doing it again once or twice this week, so I'll be sure to post in all relevant places ahead of time. What day/time works best for you, by the way?
Evening's Us eastern time. Or weekends. Someone suggested A Screen cast, and I think that would be better. But either way thank You.
David
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I've been wanting to experiment with something that would probably be called "live coding". These days, it's not uncommon for gamers to live stream their game play. So I can't help but wonder if there's someone out there, possibly a junior level developer, who might want to see what it looks like when a seasoned ASP MVC developer plugs away at the terminal. Or maybe another seasoned developer who typically works alone might want to see what it looks like when someone else is writing code. There's the potential to learn a lot, but for the people watching me, and myself. I can explain the design decisions I made, but I'm also interested in taking recommendations on my existing design decisions. I'm interested in sharing my workflow, but also learning from others where my workflow has gaps. Google+ Hangouts seem to be the best way to facilitate this kind of live coding because you can see my screen and we can communicate together. Yesterday, during my first test, I had two people stop in to see what I was doing, but they didn't stay for long. I think maybe if I schedule it here in advance that I might get more people watching/contributing. Thoughts, anyone?
DoubleFine do the "Amnesia Fortnight". Yes it's game development - but it gives quite an insight to how it all pulls together, from concept to "final" product. You do get live streams of some of the coding too (as multiple projects are all developing at once).
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I'm not sure - but then I only have my coding style to go on: long periods of thinking, then typing, testing and repeat until cut to CP and / or the coffee plunger :laugh:
Pretty much what I'm doing too. Typing actual code is less than 1% of my work, not counting hacks in response to a question on CP or elsewhere. I think a lot, sketch a lot, eventually do some UML designs (which might in fact be somewhat interesting to someone who knows UML), and at some point have my UML tool generate some code. Only then I'll start fill in some blanks until I either get it to work or realize I've missed an important aspect - at which point I return to step one :cool: Perhaps I should add that as a mathematician I'm more concerned with creating new, optimized algorithms for very specific applications than cranking out what I like to refer to as "fluff code". ;P
GOTOs are a bit like wire coat hangers: they tend to breed in the darkness, such that where there once were few, eventually there are many, and the program's architecture collapses beneath them. (Fran Poretto)
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Evening's Us eastern time. Or weekends. Someone suggested A Screen cast, and I think that would be better. But either way thank You.
David
Giving this a try right now. If you're available, see if you can join in. https://plus.google.com/events/cukcjnoh97pltobk42771sv294s[^]
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I've been wanting to experiment with something that would probably be called "live coding". These days, it's not uncommon for gamers to live stream their game play. So I can't help but wonder if there's someone out there, possibly a junior level developer, who might want to see what it looks like when a seasoned ASP MVC developer plugs away at the terminal. Or maybe another seasoned developer who typically works alone might want to see what it looks like when someone else is writing code. There's the potential to learn a lot, but for the people watching me, and myself. I can explain the design decisions I made, but I'm also interested in taking recommendations on my existing design decisions. I'm interested in sharing my workflow, but also learning from others where my workflow has gaps. Google+ Hangouts seem to be the best way to facilitate this kind of live coding because you can see my screen and we can communicate together. Yesterday, during my first test, I had two people stop in to see what I was doing, but they didn't stay for long. I think maybe if I schedule it here in advance that I might get more people watching/contributing. Thoughts, anyone?
I think it can work. I am a trainer, and I often make demo where I code and ask questions at the same time in live, so I make them aware of design problems they might come to. (Sometimes, they find cleaner solution than me) Most of the time, everybody is very attentive. Sometimes I do it on the very database they are using for the program they are developing. (I almost never use stupid training example you can find in books, always real use case) The interactivity is what make it interesting, not the fact that you are coding. However, they ask a lot of question that's why they are interested, and I think it is essential they can communicate by chat or speak during your live.
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I think it can work. I am a trainer, and I often make demo where I code and ask questions at the same time in live, so I make them aware of design problems they might come to. (Sometimes, they find cleaner solution than me) Most of the time, everybody is very attentive. Sometimes I do it on the very database they are using for the program they are developing. (I almost never use stupid training example you can find in books, always real use case) The interactivity is what make it interesting, not the fact that you are coding. However, they ask a lot of question that's why they are interested, and I think it is essential they can communicate by chat or speak during your live.
Thanks for the positive input and advice, Nicolas. I'm still experimenting with the idea and will let you know when I've figured out how to do it successfully.
