Learning a language using an IDE or text editor.
-
IDE - no contest. It helps you at every turn: it prompts you with method names and properties, it helps remind you of function parameters, and it tells you when you misspell something as you go along. It handles indentation, and it works exactly the same when debugging as it does when you are editing. Ignore the purists: I started with text editors and I wouldn't go back!
Those who fail to learn history are doomed to repeat it. --- George Santayana (December 16, 1863 – September 26, 1952) Those who fail to clear history are doomed to explain it. --- OriginalGriff (February 24, 1959 – ∞)
My first computer[^] didn't differentiate between entering a basic program one (numbered) line at a time and the command prompt used for everything else.
Did you ever see history portrayed as an old man with a wise brow and pulseless heart, waging all things in the balance of reason? Is not rather the genius of history like an eternal, imploring maiden, full of fire, with a burning heart and flaming soul, humanly warm and humanly beautiful? --Zachris Topelius Training a telescope on one’s own belly button will only reveal lint. You like that? You go right on staring at it. I prefer looking at galaxies. -- Sarah Hoyt
-
Well, technically I didn't start with text editors: it was punched cards, which were like text editors with bad attitude and no "backspace" key... :laugh:
Those who fail to learn history are doomed to repeat it. --- George Santayana (December 16, 1863 – September 26, 1952) Those who fail to clear history are doomed to explain it. --- OriginalGriff (February 24, 1959 – ∞)
Yes but you could read the holes and it made good confetti. Just don't drop the tray. :-D
-
OriginalGriff wrote:
punched cards
:cringe:, painful. Mine was vi, tough at first until you learned the commands, but not bad for what we were doing. However, it sure as hell beats punched cards.
vi was a good editor: loads better than the DOS "equivalent" Edlin[^] which was like punched cards, but with backspace.
Those who fail to learn history are doomed to repeat it. --- George Santayana (December 16, 1863 – September 26, 1952) Those who fail to clear history are doomed to explain it. --- OriginalGriff (February 24, 1959 – ∞)
-
Yes but you could read the holes and it made good confetti. Just don't drop the tray. :-D
djj55 wrote:
it made good confetti
Dropped bits! :laugh:
Those who fail to learn history are doomed to repeat it. --- George Santayana (December 16, 1863 – September 26, 1952) Those who fail to clear history are doomed to explain it. --- OriginalGriff (February 24, 1959 – ∞)
-
Sure I use an IDE everyday. But when I learned, the ability to look things up, read the instructions, search the web, and think out my problem without typing were invaluable. I suppose the difference is will you be a technician or a master? Ignoring the pro's and con's of an IDE it is fundamentally a tool for facilitating writing code not for learning to write the code. If you learn to program you will never know why the below code is wrong:
Int32.Parse(Session["someInteger"].ToString());
Need custom software developed? I do custom programming based primarily on MS tools with an emphasis on C# development and consulting. "And they, since they Were not the one dead, turned to their affairs" -- Robert Frost "All users always want Excel" --Ennis Lynch
...when clearly it should be Int64.Parse... ;)
Those who fail to learn history are doomed to repeat it. --- George Santayana (December 16, 1863 – September 26, 1952) Those who fail to clear history are doomed to explain it. --- OriginalGriff (February 24, 1959 – ∞)
-
Sure I use an IDE everyday. But when I learned, the ability to look things up, read the instructions, search the web, and think out my problem without typing were invaluable. I suppose the difference is will you be a technician or a master? Ignoring the pro's and con's of an IDE it is fundamentally a tool for facilitating writing code not for learning to write the code. If you learn to program you will never know why the below code is wrong:
Int32.Parse(Session["someInteger"].ToString());
Need custom software developed? I do custom programming based primarily on MS tools with an emphasis on C# development and consulting. "And they, since they Were not the one dead, turned to their affairs" -- Robert Frost "All users always want Excel" --Ennis Lynch
:rolleyes:
If your actions inspire others to dream more, learn more, do more and become more, you are a leader.-John Q. Adams
You must accept one of two basic premises: Either we are alone in the universe, or we are not alone in the universe. And either way, the implications are staggering.-Wernher von Braun
Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former.-Albert Einstein -
Yoda was born? Wow. I can't imagine him young... :laugh:
Those who fail to learn history are doomed to repeat it. --- George Santayana (December 16, 1863 – September 26, 1952) Those who fail to clear history are doomed to explain it. --- OriginalGriff (February 24, 1959 – ∞)
-
Well, technically I didn't start with text editors: it was punched cards, which were like text editors with bad attitude and no "backspace" key... :laugh:
Those who fail to learn history are doomed to repeat it. --- George Santayana (December 16, 1863 – September 26, 1952) Those who fail to clear history are doomed to explain it. --- OriginalGriff (February 24, 1959 – ∞)
-
Sure I use an IDE everyday. But when I learned, the ability to look things up, read the instructions, search the web, and think out my problem without typing were invaluable. I suppose the difference is will you be a technician or a master? Ignoring the pro's and con's of an IDE it is fundamentally a tool for facilitating writing code not for learning to write the code. If you learn to program you will never know why the below code is wrong:
Int32.Parse(Session["someInteger"].ToString());
Need custom software developed? I do custom programming based primarily on MS tools with an emphasis on C# development and consulting. "And they, since they Were not the one dead, turned to their affairs" -- Robert Frost "All users always want Excel" --Ennis Lynch
Hmmm, let's see:
Sessioncould benullif session state is disabled for the application or the request;Session["someInteger"]could benullif the session's timed out (or you've misspelled the key);- If you stored an
Int32inSession["someInteger"], drop the.ToString/.Parseand just unbox the value; - If you didn't store an
Int32inSession["someInteger"](why the elephant not?!) thenInt32.Parsecould throw aFormatExceptionor anOverflowException; - Even if you did store an
Int32inSession["someInteger"], the current culture settings might* preventInt32.Parsefrom correctly parsing the result of the.ToString()call; - If you're not already doing it, this should be hidden behind a façade class;
Did I miss any? :) * I don't know for certain whether there are any culture settings that could do this, but since I don't know for certain that there aren't, it's safest to assume there are.
"These people looked deep within my soul and assigned me a number based on the order in which I joined." - Homer
-
vi was a good editor: loads better than the DOS "equivalent" Edlin[^] which was like punched cards, but with backspace.
Those who fail to learn history are doomed to repeat it. --- George Santayana (December 16, 1863 – September 26, 1952) Those who fail to clear history are doomed to explain it. --- OriginalGriff (February 24, 1959 – ∞)
-
Hi, I'm very new to object oriented programming. Having just read Text editor Vs IDE[^] do folks think from the start it would be better to learn using a text editor rather than an IDE (Honest question...don't want to start any arguments :) )?
"Depends" :-) #include Depends how you learn. An IDE can help you along by getting you up and running faster. So if you're going to get discouraged by not having results quick, then I'd say use an IDE that will help you along and get you to a project that will run quickly. Then tinker with it from there. The problem a lot of IDEs have is that they frequently put boilerplate code in for you. Sometimes that's good, sometimes it's bad as it may give you a false sense of what's really required and what is really going on. A text editor on the other hand demands you really "start from scratch." You have to navigate configuration of the tool chain (compilers, linkers, library paths, build options, etc.) BUT you get the satisfaction of knowing that if you didn't write it, it ain't in there. Personally I'd much rather WORK with a text editor (I've no doubt my .emacs file is older than most people here.) But for learning a new language or platform, I like starting in an IDE with samples, then tinkering my way to enough knowledge to dispense with them entirely.
-
Like you, the first sort algorithm I learnt was the floor sort. :sigh:
Or "Heap sort" as it was also known! :laugh:
Those who fail to learn history are doomed to repeat it. --- George Santayana (December 16, 1863 – September 26, 1952) Those who fail to clear history are doomed to explain it. --- OriginalGriff (February 24, 1959 – ∞)
-
Sure I use an IDE everyday. But when I learned, the ability to look things up, read the instructions, search the web, and think out my problem without typing were invaluable. I suppose the difference is will you be a technician or a master? Ignoring the pro's and con's of an IDE it is fundamentally a tool for facilitating writing code not for learning to write the code. If you learn to program you will never know why the below code is wrong:
Int32.Parse(Session["someInteger"].ToString());
Need custom software developed? I do custom programming based primarily on MS tools with an emphasis on C# development and consulting. "And they, since they Were not the one dead, turned to their affairs" -- Robert Frost "All users always want Excel" --Ennis Lynch
Not only is it wrong (i.e. unsafe), it's not required since the value of the successfully parsed integer isn't used anywhere. ;P /ravi
My new year resolution: 2048 x 1536 Home | Articles | My .NET bits | Freeware ravib(at)ravib(dot)com
-
Hi, I'm very new to object oriented programming. Having just read Text editor Vs IDE[^] do folks think from the start it would be better to learn using a text editor rather than an IDE (Honest question...don't want to start any arguments :) )?
IDE. Except that then you have to learn two things. :sigh: I learned with a text editor and I still prefer that for writing actual code -- but not when a drag-and-drop designer is required. And IDEs tend to have a debugger as well. Back in college everyone (even me) preferred to use Turbo Pascal's IDE (on a 386 PC clone) rather than use VAX Pascal with a VT100. However you shouldn't get to point where you don't think you could possibly write a simple console app in a text editor and compile it on the command line. Learn it with an IDE by all means, but come play on the fun side once in a while. :cool:
This space intentionally left blank.
-
Hi, I'm very new to object oriented programming. Having just read Text editor Vs IDE[^] do folks think from the start it would be better to learn using a text editor rather than an IDE (Honest question...don't want to start any arguments :) )?
The IDE will mostly help learn the API syntax, but not the language itself.
I'd rather be phishing!
-
Or "Heap sort" as it was also known! :laugh:
Those who fail to learn history are doomed to repeat it. --- George Santayana (December 16, 1863 – September 26, 1952) Those who fail to clear history are doomed to explain it. --- OriginalGriff (February 24, 1959 – ∞)
Hee hee. At college we used punched cards, because the lecturer was a b'tard, for machine code projects. By the time I started working the world had moved on to mag tapes and 'washing machine' removable disk platters. Thems was the days. :nostalgicSigh:
-
IDE - no contest. It helps you at every turn: it prompts you with method names and properties, it helps remind you of function parameters, and it tells you when you misspell something as you go along. It handles indentation, and it works exactly the same when debugging as it does when you are editing. Ignore the purists: I started with text editors and I wouldn't go back!
Those who fail to learn history are doomed to repeat it. --- George Santayana (December 16, 1863 – September 26, 1952) Those who fail to clear history are doomed to explain it. --- OriginalGriff (February 24, 1959 – ∞)
OriginalGriff wrote:
It helps you at every turn: it prompts you with method names and properties, it helps remind you of function parameters, and it tells you when you misspell something as you go along. It handles indentation, and it works exactly the same when debugging as it does when you are editing.
When they're in a cooperative mood otherwise it's; crash, design editor problems, gets hung in a, what I like to call PMS mode, etc. otherwise it's great. :)
-
Hi, I'm very new to object oriented programming. Having just read Text editor Vs IDE[^] do folks think from the start it would be better to learn using a text editor rather than an IDE (Honest question...don't want to start any arguments :) )?
IDE helps to save the time and brings you all at your perusal. However for a beginner, i wont recommend IDE.
-
Hi, I'm very new to object oriented programming. Having just read Text editor Vs IDE[^] do folks think from the start it would be better to learn using a text editor rather than an IDE (Honest question...don't want to start any arguments :) )?
For HTML, still I prefer Notepad. Hand coding!
thatraja
Code converters | Education Needed No thanks, I am all stocked up. - Luc Pattyn When you're wrestling a gorilla, you don't stop when you're tired, you stop when the gorilla is - Henry Minute
-
Hi, I'm very new to object oriented programming. Having just read Text editor Vs IDE[^] do folks think from the start it would be better to learn using a text editor rather than an IDE (Honest question...don't want to start any arguments :) )?
IDE will maybe help you along the way but will also make your life difficult along the way. It does a lot of things for you, and it is good to know those things it does. With a text editor, you have to do those things yourself, thus you learn more. IDEs is not supported by all platforms so if the day arrives that you have to develop on a platform which doesn't support an IDE you'll be struggling coz you've been using a IDE. Personally if I was you, I'd start off using text editor and later move to IDE. You get some kick ass text editors these days which can do exactly what IDEs can do.
"Program testing can be used to show the presence of bugs, but never to show their absence." << please vote!! >>
