Agile the end of the developer.
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My agency just put my work group and some select clients through an Agile Boot camp. Early on we were told that everyone is a developer and those sub humans who write code are just um… coders. Then my supervisor jumps up and says so anyone can be a coder. We can have testers or anyone be the coders. So from this we get if everyone is a developer then no one is the developer, and code if written at all can be written by any warm body if we bother to write it at all. Anyone interested in pipe welding as a career? I hear it pays well.
It's always darkest before it goes completely black.
In all seriousness, I'm not that convinced by Agile yet - I suspect it's "just another fad" that is going to get dropped in a couple of years when "working code" starts being "not-working code" and the maintenance headache of not having any idea how it works (and no documentation) starts to bite. A problem made worse by an attitude of "any warm body will do". Pipe welding doesn't pay that well in the UK - the country is apparently full of Polish plumbers who can do it for a cup of tea and a fiver... :laugh:
Bad command or file name. Bad, bad command! Sit! Stay! Staaaay...
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My agency just put my work group and some select clients through an Agile Boot camp. Early on we were told that everyone is a developer and those sub humans who write code are just um… coders. Then my supervisor jumps up and says so anyone can be a coder. We can have testers or anyone be the coders. So from this we get if everyone is a developer then no one is the developer, and code if written at all can be written by any warm body if we bother to write it at all. Anyone interested in pipe welding as a career? I hear it pays well.
It's always darkest before it goes completely black.
Disclaimer: Note that the following applies to Scrum, not necessarily all of Agile. " In Scrum, Development Team members are called “developers,“ regardless of their background, job title, or skill set. Development Team members may have experience in software engineering, testing, architecture and design, graphic design, database administration, business analysis, technical writing, or other similar specialties. Regardless of what their resume says, they are now “developers“ as far as Scrum is concerned. They should burn their business cards and focus on delivering value in the form of working software. Also, there are no subteams in Scrum, such as testing or QA. The Development Team performs all of the work required to deliver the done increment of the software product. It’s important to note that just because a team member is called a developer, this does not necessarily mean that they will be developing (writing) code. Depending on the task, they may be developing architecture, developing user interface or design, developing test cases, developing database objects, developing installers, or developing documentation, etc. Everyone develops something. " -- Professional Scrum Development with Microsoft® Visual Studio® 2012, Richard Hundhausen
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Aspirin cures headaches. Oh, good, then it cures broken arm pain and toothache pain and every other ailment also. Manager: We need a process. Let's try Agile. 6 weeks later... Manager: After all that time spent learning Agile, we have learned that Agile is the be-all end-all. It has to be or else we just wasted a lot of time and money learning a process we could've learned in a few hours. Developer: Now you're on to something. Could've learned it in a few hours. The truth is you cannot write a book about something you learn in a few hours. So books on Agile wouldn't sell unless they are long. Also, Contracting and Training groups need long subjects to teach so they can charge vast amounts of money. The heart of Agile is simple. But it has been falsely inflated for monetary gain. Ugh. If you've ever developed a substantial piece of software by yourself you probably found that you adhered to the basic principles of Agile. It's really that easy. Everyone is a developer. Up until someone goes to do maintenance on their code.
newton.saber wrote:
Everyone is a developer. Up until someone goes to do maintenance on their code.
Then what do they become?
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newton.saber wrote:
Everyone is a developer. Up until someone goes to do maintenance on their code.
Then what do they become?
A maintainer that sustains the code. It's called sustaining engineering. :rolleyes: Ugh.
If your actions inspire others to dream more, learn more, do more and become more, you are a leader.-John Q. Adams
You must accept one of two basic premises: Either we are alone in the universe, or we are not alone in the universe. And either way, the implications are staggering.-Wernher von Braun
Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former.-Albert Einstein -
My agency just put my work group and some select clients through an Agile Boot camp. Early on we were told that everyone is a developer and those sub humans who write code are just um… coders. Then my supervisor jumps up and says so anyone can be a coder. We can have testers or anyone be the coders. So from this we get if everyone is a developer then no one is the developer, and code if written at all can be written by any warm body if we bother to write it at all. Anyone interested in pipe welding as a career? I hear it pays well.
It's always darkest before it goes completely black.
Earl Owens wrote:
... code if written at all can be written by any warm body if we bother to write it at all.
Sure, any coder can write code, but your team will need a Code Developer to develop code. Everyone is a developer, but not all developers are Code Developers.
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In all seriousness, I'm not that convinced by Agile yet - I suspect it's "just another fad" that is going to get dropped in a couple of years when "working code" starts being "not-working code" and the maintenance headache of not having any idea how it works (and no documentation) starts to bite. A problem made worse by an attitude of "any warm body will do". Pipe welding doesn't pay that well in the UK - the country is apparently full of Polish plumbers who can do it for a cup of tea and a fiver... :laugh:
Bad command or file name. Bad, bad command! Sit! Stay! Staaaay...
Is that what Maciej is doing these days?
Life is like a s**t sandwich; the more bread you have, the less s**t you eat.
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newton.saber wrote:
Everyone is a developer. Up until someone goes to do maintenance on their code.
Then what do they become?
Dead if I get my way.
Life is like a s**t sandwich; the more bread you have, the less s**t you eat.
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newton.saber wrote:
Everyone is a developer. Up until someone goes to do maintenance on their code.
Then what do they become?
Annoyed. Angry. Disturbed. Confused. Miserable. :wtf: Suspicious. Late to dinner. Bald. Edit... Oh, wait, that's what you become when you go to do maintenance on their code. They become...uh...err... Unavailable.
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In all seriousness, I'm not that convinced by Agile yet - I suspect it's "just another fad" that is going to get dropped in a couple of years when "working code" starts being "not-working code" and the maintenance headache of not having any idea how it works (and no documentation) starts to bite. A problem made worse by an attitude of "any warm body will do". Pipe welding doesn't pay that well in the UK - the country is apparently full of Polish plumbers who can do it for a cup of tea and a fiver... :laugh:
Bad command or file name. Bad, bad command! Sit! Stay! Staaaay...
Griff, at some level I'd agree with you - we've all seen the new new thing come and go. Back in my Science Systems days we sometimes used a formal methodology called Dynamic System Development Methodology (DSDM) where appropriate. It was great for stuff like web pages and user interfaces. Not so great for database design and complex real-time stuff. It was agile before Agile ... another tool in our toolbox to use for the right widget. I don't believe that agile works in all cases, in others it's a no brainer and doesn't need a fancy title. As soon as someone takes a common-sense idea, gives it a fancy newspeak title, publishes a book or two and commends it's universal use I'm turned off (what was that Universal something or other that was all the rage 10 years ago?!!!) I used to belong to the Anarchy Society, but I didn't like the rules.
Life is like a s**t sandwich; the more bread you have, the less s**t you eat.
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My agency just put my work group and some select clients through an Agile Boot camp. Early on we were told that everyone is a developer and those sub humans who write code are just um… coders. Then my supervisor jumps up and says so anyone can be a coder. We can have testers or anyone be the coders. So from this we get if everyone is a developer then no one is the developer, and code if written at all can be written by any warm body if we bother to write it at all. Anyone interested in pipe welding as a career? I hear it pays well.
It's always darkest before it goes completely black.
Don't freak out. I have been working in an Agile w/Scrum for about 2.5 years now, and trust me, the Engineers are the coders/developers/engineer and no one else. When I got my taste of agile "bootcamp" I saw/heard the same crap. All is good. ;)
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newton.saber wrote:
Everyone is a developer. Up until someone goes to do maintenance on their code.
Then what do they become?
-
My agency just put my work group and some select clients through an Agile Boot camp. Early on we were told that everyone is a developer and those sub humans who write code are just um… coders. Then my supervisor jumps up and says so anyone can be a coder. We can have testers or anyone be the coders. So from this we get if everyone is a developer then no one is the developer, and code if written at all can be written by any warm body if we bother to write it at all. Anyone interested in pipe welding as a career? I hear it pays well.
It's always darkest before it goes completely black.
Earl Owens wrote:
Early on we were told that everyone is a developer
A rose by any other name...still pricks you. The only thing I've learned from the agile community is how agile the muscles responsible for laughing can be. Marc
Imperative to Functional Programming Succinctly Higher Order Programming
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In all seriousness, I'm not that convinced by Agile yet - I suspect it's "just another fad" that is going to get dropped in a couple of years when "working code" starts being "not-working code" and the maintenance headache of not having any idea how it works (and no documentation) starts to bite. A problem made worse by an attitude of "any warm body will do". Pipe welding doesn't pay that well in the UK - the country is apparently full of Polish plumbers who can do it for a cup of tea and a fiver... :laugh:
Bad command or file name. Bad, bad command! Sit! Stay! Staaaay...
At my company we use the agile dev process lightly - it's mainly common sense and good planning that allows us to identify and work on small pieces of functionality that can be safely integrated into our product without causing instability. Task estimates are set by developers and vetted by dev managers (all of whom have been hard-core devs in the past and still know their s---). Our daily status meetings are brief (10 mins for a team of 10) and to the point, and everyone on the team has a pretty good idea of what the others are working on. Our public APIs are well documented (the MSDN-style documentation is produced as part of the nightly build) and all check-ins undergo a brief code review. I know we're not the only team that works like this, but posts at CP sure make me think so sometimes. :-D /ravi
My new year resolution: 2048 x 1536 Home | Articles | My .NET bits | Freeware ravib(at)ravib(dot)com
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In all seriousness, I'm not that convinced by Agile yet - I suspect it's "just another fad" that is going to get dropped in a couple of years when "working code" starts being "not-working code" and the maintenance headache of not having any idea how it works (and no documentation) starts to bite. A problem made worse by an attitude of "any warm body will do". Pipe welding doesn't pay that well in the UK - the country is apparently full of Polish plumbers who can do it for a cup of tea and a fiver... :laugh:
Bad command or file name. Bad, bad command! Sit! Stay! Staaaay...
There's nothing wrong with agile per se, but idiots are a problem no matter what system you implement.
I wanna be a eunuchs developer! Pass me a bread knife!
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Disclaimer: Note that the following applies to Scrum, not necessarily all of Agile. " In Scrum, Development Team members are called “developers,“ regardless of their background, job title, or skill set. Development Team members may have experience in software engineering, testing, architecture and design, graphic design, database administration, business analysis, technical writing, or other similar specialties. Regardless of what their resume says, they are now “developers“ as far as Scrum is concerned. They should burn their business cards and focus on delivering value in the form of working software. Also, there are no subteams in Scrum, such as testing or QA. The Development Team performs all of the work required to deliver the done increment of the software product. It’s important to note that just because a team member is called a developer, this does not necessarily mean that they will be developing (writing) code. Depending on the task, they may be developing architecture, developing user interface or design, developing test cases, developing database objects, developing installers, or developing documentation, etc. Everyone develops something. " -- Professional Scrum Development with Microsoft® Visual Studio® 2012, Richard Hundhausen
It doesn't take a genius to realise that if a term is already used for something else within a system (in this case "developer"), you have to name your new thing with a different word. One would think that anyone who worked in software would realise that without having to be told (unless they believe in using just one variable name in each program). We call them "scrum teams" -- and yes, there are developers in the teams. And testers, etc.
I wanna be a eunuchs developer! Pass me a bread knife!
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My agency just put my work group and some select clients through an Agile Boot camp. Early on we were told that everyone is a developer and those sub humans who write code are just um… coders. Then my supervisor jumps up and says so anyone can be a coder. We can have testers or anyone be the coders. So from this we get if everyone is a developer then no one is the developer, and code if written at all can be written by any warm body if we bother to write it at all. Anyone interested in pipe welding as a career? I hear it pays well.
It's always darkest before it goes completely black.
I am Spartacus!
I wanna be a eunuchs developer! Pass me a bread knife!
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My agency just put my work group and some select clients through an Agile Boot camp. Early on we were told that everyone is a developer and those sub humans who write code are just um… coders. Then my supervisor jumps up and says so anyone can be a coder. We can have testers or anyone be the coders. So from this we get if everyone is a developer then no one is the developer, and code if written at all can be written by any warm body if we bother to write it at all. Anyone interested in pipe welding as a career? I hear it pays well.
It's always darkest before it goes completely black.
Earl Owens wrote:
So from this we get if everyone is a developer then no one is the developer, and code if written at all can be written by any warm body if we bother to write it at all.
Label doesn't matter to me. What matters to me is what I do during the day and what I get paid to do it. If they want to throw someone in with little experience I can usually find the time to mentor them which I enjoy doing. And I still get paid to do it.
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My agency just put my work group and some select clients through an Agile Boot camp. Early on we were told that everyone is a developer and those sub humans who write code are just um… coders. Then my supervisor jumps up and says so anyone can be a coder. We can have testers or anyone be the coders. So from this we get if everyone is a developer then no one is the developer, and code if written at all can be written by any warm body if we bother to write it at all. Anyone interested in pipe welding as a career? I hear it pays well.
It's always darkest before it goes completely black.
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newton.saber wrote:
Everyone is a developer. Up until someone goes to do maintenance on their code.
Then what do they become?
A Roto-Rooter [^].
« I am putting myself to the fullest possible use which is all, I think, that any conscious entity can ever hope to do » HAL (Heuristically programmed ALgorithmic computer) in "2001, A Space Odyssey"
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My agency just put my work group and some select clients through an Agile Boot camp. Early on we were told that everyone is a developer and those sub humans who write code are just um… coders. Then my supervisor jumps up and says so anyone can be a coder. We can have testers or anyone be the coders. So from this we get if everyone is a developer then no one is the developer, and code if written at all can be written by any warm body if we bother to write it at all. Anyone interested in pipe welding as a career? I hear it pays well.
It's always darkest before it goes completely black.
If they're coming out with crap like that they don't know anything about Agile. In other news, your supervisor sounds like an idiot. :doh: But...if you want to learn what Agile is really about, watching conference sessions from Agile on the Beach[^] (a great conference; can heartily recommend it if you're in range) is a pretty good way to start.
Anna (@annajayne) Tech Blog | Visual Lint "Why would anyone prefer to wield a weapon that takes both hands at once, when they could use a lighter (and obviously superior) weapon that allows you to wield multiple ones at a time, and thus supports multi-paradigm carnage?"
