Planetary orbit problems again
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How do you google "sounds" like a raging homosexual? By delicately typing with a lisp?
".45 ACP - because shooting twice is just silly" - JSOP, 2010
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When you pry the gun from my cold dead hands, be careful - the barrel will be very hot. - JSOP, 2013 -
My last few days have been blighted with doubts about why things often seem to happen on a flat plain in space. As I understand it, which isn't very well, the planets orbit the sun on pretty much a flat plane. I'm wondering why this is, and why shouldn't there being planets going over and under the sun rather than obediently around it. (I think Pluto may make some vein attempt at this). I suspect the reason is the same for the rings of Saturn (why not a sphere) or Galaxies apparently also being quite flat. I have a number of theories, all crap. Anyone cast some light on this?
Regards, Rob Philpott.
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That's going too far. Toodles!
I wanna be a eunuchs developer! Pass me a bread knife!
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My last few days have been blighted with doubts about why things often seem to happen on a flat plain in space. As I understand it, which isn't very well, the planets orbit the sun on pretty much a flat plane. I'm wondering why this is, and why shouldn't there being planets going over and under the sun rather than obediently around it. (I think Pluto may make some vein attempt at this). I suspect the reason is the same for the rings of Saturn (why not a sphere) or Galaxies apparently also being quite flat. I have a number of theories, all crap. Anyone cast some light on this?
Regards, Rob Philpott.
It looks like you're failing to undrestand the gravity of the situation. I always wear my coat, guess why?
Geek code v 3.12 GCS d--- s-/++ a- C++++ U+++ P- L- E-- W++ N++ o+ K- w+++ O? M-- V? PS+ PE- Y+ PGP t++ 5? X R++ tv-- b+ DI+++ D++ G e++>+++ h--- r++>+++ y+++* Weapons extension: ma- k++ F+2 X
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If you get sufficiently drunk and lie down, you will find the room rotates instead. There is a solution to this: tie the room down. Get some rope, tie one end to the room, and the other to the only stable thing in the universe - youself. A foot is good. Now when you lie down, the room will be unable to rotate because it can't drag you round and it all stays still. Try it, it works. Important note: try to remember about the rope round your ankle before you make a trip to the loo in the dark...
Bad command or file name. Bad, bad command! Sit! Stay! Staaaay...
I actually enjoyed the ride when I got home and fell into bed. :)
The language is JavaScript. that of Mordor, which I will not utter here
This is Javascript. If you put big wheels and a racing stripe on a golf cart, it's still a fucking golf cart.
"I don't know, extraterrestrial?" "You mean like from space?" "No, from Canada." -
I actually enjoyed the ride when I got home and fell into bed. :)
The language is JavaScript. that of Mordor, which I will not utter here
This is Javascript. If you put big wheels and a racing stripe on a golf cart, it's still a fucking golf cart.
"I don't know, extraterrestrial?" "You mean like from space?" "No, from Canada." -
No, I never did this at the Medical Technology Management Institute.
The language is JavaScript. that of Mordor, which I will not utter here
This is Javascript. If you put big wheels and a racing stripe on a golf cart, it's still a fucking golf cart.
"I don't know, extraterrestrial?" "You mean like from space?" "No, from Canada." -
If you get sufficiently drunk and lie down, you will find the room rotates instead. There is a solution to this: tie the room down. Get some rope, tie one end to the room, and the other to the only stable thing in the universe - youself. A foot is good. Now when you lie down, the room will be unable to rotate because it can't drag you round and it all stays still. Try it, it works. Important note: try to remember about the rope round your ankle before you make a trip to the loo in the dark...
Bad command or file name. Bad, bad command! Sit! Stay! Staaaay...
Phww, you wouldn't know a planetary orbit even if you saw one from earth. :laugh: http://csep10.phys.utk.edu/astr161/lect/retrograde/aristotle.html[^]
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My last few days have been blighted with doubts about why things often seem to happen on a flat plain in space. As I understand it, which isn't very well, the planets orbit the sun on pretty much a flat plane. I'm wondering why this is, and why shouldn't there being planets going over and under the sun rather than obediently around it. (I think Pluto may make some vein attempt at this). I suspect the reason is the same for the rings of Saturn (why not a sphere) or Galaxies apparently also being quite flat. I have a number of theories, all crap. Anyone cast some light on this?
Regards, Rob Philpott.
well one can imagine a bunch of planet have the stupidest orbit around their sun.. indeed one planet in our solar system is not in the same plane as the other! http://cnx.org/resources/9e49b805527d2cdca109afcb51e660a9/graphics8.png[^] However solar systems begin as cloud of dust. Motes above that plane as they cross it / fall keep hitting motes from below the plan which are going up ending up nullifying each other. And when they finally merge into planets and suns, this process has already flattened everything!!
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I think the key to Saturn's rings at least is accretion discs. I.e the material that makes up both the planet and its discs was a rotating mass before the planet formed. Once rotating, the equator of a body has a larger circumference than one that passes through each of the poles. This then helps to keep the rings bound to the same plane as the equator. Not sure about galaxies or solar systems though - however I suspect that similar forces are at play. -- On a side note, while looking for an answer I discovered that one of Saturn's moons is emitting some 1000kg/s of water vapour from it's South pole, which is then ionized and rotates around Saturn. Neat stuff. Thanks:thumbsup: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magnetosphere_of_Saturn[^]
"When I was 5 years old, my mother always told me that happiness was the key to life. When I went to school, they asked me what I wanted to be when I grew up. I wrote down 'happy'. They told me I didn't understand the assignment, and I told them they didn't understand life." - John Lennon
enhzflep wrote:
the equator of a body has a larger circumference than one that passes through each of the poles
That seems to me to require that body in question be an oblate spheroid.
«I'm asked why doesn't C# implement feature X all the time. The answer's always the same: because no one ever designed, specified, implemented, tested, documented, shipped that feature. All six of those things are necessary to make a feature happen. They all cost huge amounts of time, effort and money.» Eric Lippert, Microsoft, 2009
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My last few days have been blighted with doubts about why things often seem to happen on a flat plain in space. As I understand it, which isn't very well, the planets orbit the sun on pretty much a flat plane. I'm wondering why this is, and why shouldn't there being planets going over and under the sun rather than obediently around it. (I think Pluto may make some vein attempt at this). I suspect the reason is the same for the rings of Saturn (why not a sphere) or Galaxies apparently also being quite flat. I have a number of theories, all crap. Anyone cast some light on this?
Regards, Rob Philpott.
I don't wonder why any more but chalk up the true reason as being due to the accretion-disk theory explanation that attributes attitude to energy state as that is related to the passage of vast amounts of time. When I did wonder about the apparent flatness, I was looking at only our solar system and that was the cause of the mystification. Once I saw that galaxies were helterskelter out-of-sorts in the cosmically planar way, I realized that what I was confused about was actually this question: why don't the planes of the star-planet-orbital-systems all align to galactic spiral orientation? Etc. If you could show me a relatively good representation of a 2-D model of the solar system from which you are having this problem, preferably after punching some numbers into a Mandelbrot/Julian Set simulator, I would be willing to help you out by aiding you further. But I'm afraid this question is better posted here: http://www.codeproject.com/Forums/1712597/Uncategorised-posts.aspx[^] :thumbsup:
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My last few days have been blighted with doubts about why things often seem to happen on a flat plain in space. As I understand it, which isn't very well, the planets orbit the sun on pretty much a flat plane. I'm wondering why this is, and why shouldn't there being planets going over and under the sun rather than obediently around it. (I think Pluto may make some vein attempt at this). I suspect the reason is the same for the rings of Saturn (why not a sphere) or Galaxies apparently also being quite flat. I have a number of theories, all crap. Anyone cast some light on this?
Regards, Rob Philpott.
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I watched the movie 'Interstellar' yesterday (good movie) and they depicted a black whole as a sphere. I thought it was a nice switch from the usual flat disk that sucks everything up. As to your question: No clue :)
Tom
I haven't seen Interstellar but have read some articles about the science. The depiction of the black hole was quite interesting. The accretion disk is actually fairly flat. In the movie it looks like a sphere because of the bending of light around the black hole. As I understand it, the light from the far side of the accretion disk that you would expect to go over the top of the black hole and not enter your eye is bent by the warping of space around the hole. The light from the far side enters your eye but appears to be coming from above the black hole and so it looks like there is accretion disk above. -- A little like a normal mirage where light from the sky is bent and appears to be on the road ahead. -- Apparently, they had to write their own rendering software because all existing software assumes light travels in straight lines, which is vastly not true near a black hole. The story goes that they set their new software an overnight rendering job to see what the accretion disk would look like. There was surprise at first when they saw the result but worked out why they got the result when they thought carefully about how light would be bent near the hole. (Found a link http://www.wired.com/2014/10/astrophysics-interstellar-black-hole/[^])
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enhzflep wrote:
the equator of a body has a larger circumference than one that passes through each of the poles
That seems to me to require that body in question be an oblate spheroid.
«I'm asked why doesn't C# implement feature X all the time. The answer's always the same: because no one ever designed, specified, implemented, tested, documented, shipped that feature. All six of those things are necessary to make a feature happen. They all cost huge amounts of time, effort and money.» Eric Lippert, Microsoft, 2009
Yup. Sorry for being imprecise. :-O
"When I was 5 years old, my mother always told me that happiness was the key to life. When I went to school, they asked me what I wanted to be when I grew up. I wrote down 'happy'. They told me I didn't understand the assignment, and I told them they didn't understand life." - John Lennon
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I haven't seen Interstellar but have read some articles about the science. The depiction of the black hole was quite interesting. The accretion disk is actually fairly flat. In the movie it looks like a sphere because of the bending of light around the black hole. As I understand it, the light from the far side of the accretion disk that you would expect to go over the top of the black hole and not enter your eye is bent by the warping of space around the hole. The light from the far side enters your eye but appears to be coming from above the black hole and so it looks like there is accretion disk above. -- A little like a normal mirage where light from the sky is bent and appears to be on the road ahead. -- Apparently, they had to write their own rendering software because all existing software assumes light travels in straight lines, which is vastly not true near a black hole. The story goes that they set their new software an overnight rendering job to see what the accretion disk would look like. There was surprise at first when they saw the result but worked out why they got the result when they thought carefully about how light would be bent near the hole. (Found a link http://www.wired.com/2014/10/astrophysics-interstellar-black-hole/[^])
Interesting. The movie has a few scenes in it with the black whole. At first it was very strange and somewhat difficult to understand what your looking at. I like movies that challenge the way you think :)
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My last few days have been blighted with doubts about why things often seem to happen on a flat plain in space. As I understand it, which isn't very well, the planets orbit the sun on pretty much a flat plane. I'm wondering why this is, and why shouldn't there being planets going over and under the sun rather than obediently around it. (I think Pluto may make some vein attempt at this). I suspect the reason is the same for the rings of Saturn (why not a sphere) or Galaxies apparently also being quite flat. I have a number of theories, all crap. Anyone cast some light on this?
Regards, Rob Philpott.
Magnetism I think, not sure
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I haven't seen Interstellar but have read some articles about the science. The depiction of the black hole was quite interesting. The accretion disk is actually fairly flat. In the movie it looks like a sphere because of the bending of light around the black hole. As I understand it, the light from the far side of the accretion disk that you would expect to go over the top of the black hole and not enter your eye is bent by the warping of space around the hole. The light from the far side enters your eye but appears to be coming from above the black hole and so it looks like there is accretion disk above. -- A little like a normal mirage where light from the sky is bent and appears to be on the road ahead. -- Apparently, they had to write their own rendering software because all existing software assumes light travels in straight lines, which is vastly not true near a black hole. The story goes that they set their new software an overnight rendering job to see what the accretion disk would look like. There was surprise at first when they saw the result but worked out why they got the result when they thought carefully about how light would be bent near the hole. (Found a link http://www.wired.com/2014/10/astrophysics-interstellar-black-hole/[^])
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The angular momentum wasn't evenly distributed, and one specific direction "won". The rest cancelled out by collision.
This is the correct answer. And the same answer applies to all systems: why most of the mass of our solar system orbits near the ecliptic; why Saturn's rings are flat; why galaxies are flat; why most moons orbit in the same direction and plane as their planet's equator; etc. That which has not yet "canceled out by collision" remains spherically distributed, i.e., the Oort cloud on the outer reaches of our solar system. And, of course, there were local maxima and minima in the original distribution of angular momentum, which could explain, for example, retrograde orbits and why Uranus and its largest moon Triton rotate and revolve in a different plane from most of the rest of the solar system.
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My last few days have been blighted with doubts about why things often seem to happen on a flat plain in space. As I understand it, which isn't very well, the planets orbit the sun on pretty much a flat plane. I'm wondering why this is, and why shouldn't there being planets going over and under the sun rather than obediently around it. (I think Pluto may make some vein attempt at this). I suspect the reason is the same for the rings of Saturn (why not a sphere) or Galaxies apparently also being quite flat. I have a number of theories, all crap. Anyone cast some light on this?
Regards, Rob Philpott.
here take a look youtube - MinutePhysics[^]
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My last few days have been blighted with doubts about why things often seem to happen on a flat plain in space. As I understand it, which isn't very well, the planets orbit the sun on pretty much a flat plane. I'm wondering why this is, and why shouldn't there being planets going over and under the sun rather than obediently around it. (I think Pluto may make some vein attempt at this). I suspect the reason is the same for the rings of Saturn (why not a sphere) or Galaxies apparently also being quite flat. I have a number of theories, all crap. Anyone cast some light on this?
Regards, Rob Philpott.
Happened to see a talk by Dr. Neil DeGrasse Tyson last week. While discussing the many things he admits we don't know much about yet (dark matter, dark energy, etc), I want to say he mentioned something along this line. I think I remember him saying that we don't know what causes the rotation of the gas cloud to start in the first place. Once it starts, though, the material in the cloud will accrete into a more-or-less planar structure. I think that was also part of why Pluto was reclassified; they feel that, it was one of these Kuyper belt objects which got dislodged from its normal planar orbit by a passing object, probably another star. But I'm probably way off on what I think I remember and know.
