Science ? Marketing ? Reality ?
-
These guys claim that microprocessors put electrical noise on the lines in your home and especially the lines in your business. I have never heard of such a thing. But then, there's a lot I don't know. This is the: Two Minute YouTube Video[^] that presents a simplified science view of their stuff. They claim that their device takes an ugly noisy 60 Hz line and changes it back into a smooth nearly pure signal again, with the result being lower electrical bills. I will thank anyone who really knows about electricity for an opinion on this.
Two words: B S .
-
These guys claim that microprocessors put electrical noise on the lines in your home and especially the lines in your business. I have never heard of such a thing. But then, there's a lot I don't know. This is the: Two Minute YouTube Video[^] that presents a simplified science view of their stuff. They claim that their device takes an ugly noisy 60 Hz line and changes it back into a smooth nearly pure signal again, with the result being lower electrical bills. I will thank anyone who really knows about electricity for an opinion on this.
The point is lower power bills? BULL. SHIT. The real point is giving them the money you're supposed to be saving.
A guide to posting questions on CodeProject
Click this: Asking questions is a skill. Seriously, do it.
Dave Kreskowiak -
These guys claim that microprocessors put electrical noise on the lines in your home and especially the lines in your business. I have never heard of such a thing. But then, there's a lot I don't know. This is the: Two Minute YouTube Video[^] that presents a simplified science view of their stuff. They claim that their device takes an ugly noisy 60 Hz line and changes it back into a smooth nearly pure signal again, with the result being lower electrical bills. I will thank anyone who really knows about electricity for an opinion on this.
Marketing... (In a few words...Harmonics are created on a line, because different devices draw current in different patterns...It is true that at certain level harmonics need more current, but simply 'removing' those harmonics can not help...The most common solution in case of know difference between devices is to connect them to different power sources...)
Skipper: We'll fix it. Alex: Fix it? How you gonna fix this? Skipper: Grit, spit and a whole lotta duct tape.
-
These guys claim that microprocessors put electrical noise on the lines in your home and especially the lines in your business. I have never heard of such a thing. But then, there's a lot I don't know. This is the: Two Minute YouTube Video[^] that presents a simplified science view of their stuff. They claim that their device takes an ugly noisy 60 Hz line and changes it back into a smooth nearly pure signal again, with the result being lower electrical bills. I will thank anyone who really knows about electricity for an opinion on this.
Actually, it's not entirely BS (but definitely overhyped). IF this device works as advertised it would be doing it by 'power factor correction'. For an explanation of power factor and how it affects the useful power you get vs what you pay for, see What is Power Factor?[^] The upshot is that filtering out harmonics would do little or nothing for you. What would need fixing is the angle, or lag, between the voltage & current waveforms. Even this though wouldn't often helps your bills, at least for domestic consumers. In the UK at least, suppliers charge for electricity in KWh (the useful energy you get out). If the power factor drops below a certain value they will add a 'reactive supplement' or just charge in KVA instead of KWh - which would reflect the energy they're having to generate instead of the useful output you're getting. This situation would only arise for industrial customers though - the low power factor would only be cause by loads such as large electric motors that generate significant inductive loads, residential customers would not be affected.
-
These guys claim that microprocessors put electrical noise on the lines in your home and especially the lines in your business. I have never heard of such a thing. But then, there's a lot I don't know. This is the: Two Minute YouTube Video[^] that presents a simplified science view of their stuff. They claim that their device takes an ugly noisy 60 Hz line and changes it back into a smooth nearly pure signal again, with the result being lower electrical bills. I will thank anyone who really knows about electricity for an opinion on this.
Well, just stop plugging your CPU directly into the lines. Me, I put a power supply and motherboard in the middle. Things seem to work much better that way, if not as entertainingly.
We won't sit down. We won't shut up. We won't go quietly away. YouTube and My Mu[sic], Films and Windows Programs, etc.
-
These guys claim that microprocessors put electrical noise on the lines in your home and especially the lines in your business. I have never heard of such a thing. But then, there's a lot I don't know. This is the: Two Minute YouTube Video[^] that presents a simplified science view of their stuff. They claim that their device takes an ugly noisy 60 Hz line and changes it back into a smooth nearly pure signal again, with the result being lower electrical bills. I will thank anyone who really knows about electricity for an opinion on this.
Reminds me of all of the "power conditioners" that they market to video/audiophiles for their AV systems. Those are for better quality though, and not reduced energy bills.
The United States invariably does the right thing, after having exhausted every other alternative. -Winston Churchill America is the only country that went from barbarism to decadence without civilization in between. -Oscar Wilde Wow, even the French showed a little more spine than that before they got their sh*t pushed in.[^] -Colin Mullikin
-
These guys claim that microprocessors put electrical noise on the lines in your home and especially the lines in your business. I have never heard of such a thing. But then, there's a lot I don't know. This is the: Two Minute YouTube Video[^] that presents a simplified science view of their stuff. They claim that their device takes an ugly noisy 60 Hz line and changes it back into a smooth nearly pure signal again, with the result being lower electrical bills. I will thank anyone who really knows about electricity for an opinion on this.
There are 2 main "mini-problems" that are caused by all of the "microprocessors" in use nowadays: [1] Many devices, including most electronics (not just "microprocessors") use switching power supplies to provide low voltage power. Switching power supplies can generate high frequency noise on the incoming power lines, but the noise is not typically narrow spectrum and the effects are generally subtle. Some more modern power supply devices have ways of reducing this noise. Solution for the end user: if it is a problem, use a power conditioner or surge suppressor instead of plain power strip or plug direct to wall. [2] Some power supplies can also cause a shift in power factor. About the only problem for the end user is you can see incorrect billing if your house power meter is defective. Other than that, it is more of a power transmission problem that the typical end user can ignore. Solution: let the power utility worry about it. Nothing in your house is going to create a problem big enough to compensate for. Ask Google about the difference between Volt Amps ("VA") and Watts.
I'm retired. There's a nap for that... - Harvey
-
These guys claim that microprocessors put electrical noise on the lines in your home and especially the lines in your business. I have never heard of such a thing. But then, there's a lot I don't know. This is the: Two Minute YouTube Video[^] that presents a simplified science view of their stuff. They claim that their device takes an ugly noisy 60 Hz line and changes it back into a smooth nearly pure signal again, with the result being lower electrical bills. I will thank anyone who really knows about electricity for an opinion on this.
Yes, modern switching power supplies cause harmonic currents on the power lines. Per US regulations, all such devices are required to have filters installed on the incoming power supply cords to prevent them from interfering with the power system. Sadly, the problem persists. A properly designed electric meter measures and reports only kWh values, and much of the harmonic energy consumed by and created by electronic devices is not recorded. But since some portion of that energy is probably real, it will get recorded. You can filter it yourself, and you really should - it's not the power company's fault - and save yourself some money. More importantly, you could be saving yourself from the inconvenience of a power outage caused by circulating harmonic currents overheating the transformer at your local substation. When that happens, the transformer burns, and it takes a year or two to get a new one. That's a long time to play Farmville by candle light...
Will Rogers never met me.
-
Yes, modern switching power supplies cause harmonic currents on the power lines. Per US regulations, all such devices are required to have filters installed on the incoming power supply cords to prevent them from interfering with the power system. Sadly, the problem persists. A properly designed electric meter measures and reports only kWh values, and much of the harmonic energy consumed by and created by electronic devices is not recorded. But since some portion of that energy is probably real, it will get recorded. You can filter it yourself, and you really should - it's not the power company's fault - and save yourself some money. More importantly, you could be saving yourself from the inconvenience of a power outage caused by circulating harmonic currents overheating the transformer at your local substation. When that happens, the transformer burns, and it takes a year or two to get a new one. That's a long time to play Farmville by candle light...
Will Rogers never met me.
Roger Wright wrote:
But since some portion of that energy is probably real, it will get recorded
Power meters are motors that run off the strength of the magnetic field produced by the power running through your house. So those harmonics would have to have to cause an increase in the magnetic field that the motor sees and therefore make it spin faster. Spinning faster and slower is the key here -- its spin rate isn't locked to the power frequency, only the magnetic field strength. As a homeowner, if the harmonics are strong enough to affect the magnetic field strength, I think you have bigger problems than a higher electric bill.
We can program with only 1's, but if all you've got are zeros, you've got nothing.
-
These guys claim that microprocessors put electrical noise on the lines in your home and especially the lines in your business. I have never heard of such a thing. But then, there's a lot I don't know. This is the: Two Minute YouTube Video[^] that presents a simplified science view of their stuff. They claim that their device takes an ugly noisy 60 Hz line and changes it back into a smooth nearly pure signal again, with the result being lower electrical bills. I will thank anyone who really knows about electricity for an opinion on this.
You don't have to study the Feynman Lectures on Physics to come to a conclusion. "It's a passive electromagnetic device..." In other words, a *coil* - like the one in the utility step-down transformer, except useless (except perhaps as a line noise filter). Those who really know about electricity usually say "get rid of incandescent bulbs, and turn off things you're not using". If you're already doing that, save up and buy stock in the utility.
-
These guys claim that microprocessors put electrical noise on the lines in your home and especially the lines in your business. I have never heard of such a thing. But then, there's a lot I don't know. This is the: Two Minute YouTube Video[^] that presents a simplified science view of their stuff. They claim that their device takes an ugly noisy 60 Hz line and changes it back into a smooth nearly pure signal again, with the result being lower electrical bills. I will thank anyone who really knows about electricity for an opinion on this.
It's fraudulent.
-
Actually, it's not entirely BS (but definitely overhyped). IF this device works as advertised it would be doing it by 'power factor correction'. For an explanation of power factor and how it affects the useful power you get vs what you pay for, see What is Power Factor?[^] The upshot is that filtering out harmonics would do little or nothing for you. What would need fixing is the angle, or lag, between the voltage & current waveforms. Even this though wouldn't often helps your bills, at least for domestic consumers. In the UK at least, suppliers charge for electricity in KWh (the useful energy you get out). If the power factor drops below a certain value they will add a 'reactive supplement' or just charge in KVA instead of KWh - which would reflect the energy they're having to generate instead of the useful output you're getting. This situation would only arise for industrial customers though - the low power factor would only be cause by loads such as large electric motors that generate significant inductive loads, residential customers would not be affected.
Check that link, will you ? It screws up over here.
-
Check that link, will you ? It screws up over here.
-
Check that link, will you ? It screws up over here.
-
Actually, it's not entirely BS (but definitely overhyped). IF this device works as advertised it would be doing it by 'power factor correction'. For an explanation of power factor and how it affects the useful power you get vs what you pay for, see What is Power Factor?[^] The upshot is that filtering out harmonics would do little or nothing for you. What would need fixing is the angle, or lag, between the voltage & current waveforms. Even this though wouldn't often helps your bills, at least for domestic consumers. In the UK at least, suppliers charge for electricity in KWh (the useful energy you get out). If the power factor drops below a certain value they will add a 'reactive supplement' or just charge in KVA instead of KWh - which would reflect the energy they're having to generate instead of the useful output you're getting. This situation would only arise for industrial customers though - the low power factor would only be cause by loads such as large electric motors that generate significant inductive loads, residential customers would not be affected.
pt1401 wrote:
Actually, it's not entirely BS (but definitely overhyped)...This situation would only arise for industrial customers though
However the video is obviously directed at consumers. For which it is pointless. Presuming that the equipment actually does anything at all, which is not guaranteed, that itself would consume some amount of power. Thus increasing, probably a small amount, costs.
-
These guys claim that microprocessors put electrical noise on the lines in your home and especially the lines in your business. I have never heard of such a thing. But then, there's a lot I don't know. This is the: Two Minute YouTube Video[^] that presents a simplified science view of their stuff. They claim that their device takes an ugly noisy 60 Hz line and changes it back into a smooth nearly pure signal again, with the result being lower electrical bills. I will thank anyone who really knows about electricity for an opinion on this.
C-P-User-3 wrote:
I will thank anyone who really knows about electricity for an opinion on this.
Pointless even presuming it actually does anything. Following is about something that literally didn't do anything. The story of the fake bomb detectors - BBC News[^]
-
C-P-User-3 wrote:
I will thank anyone who really knows about electricity for an opinion on this.
Pointless even presuming it actually does anything. Following is about something that literally didn't do anything. The story of the fake bomb detectors - BBC News[^]
My friend and I built a Gonkulator way back when. It detected airplanes in the sky. It worked. We demonstrated it to the kids in the neighborhood.
-
Marketing... (In a few words...Harmonics are created on a line, because different devices draw current in different patterns...It is true that at certain level harmonics need more current, but simply 'removing' those harmonics can not help...The most common solution in case of know difference between devices is to connect them to different power sources...)
Skipper: We'll fix it. Alex: Fix it? How you gonna fix this? Skipper: Grit, spit and a whole lotta duct tape.
Surely a harmonic would be a multiple of the base fequency, i.e. 60Hz in this case. The term is incorrectly used. They should be talking about noise which has been added to the line because of incorrectly suppressed equipment. Computer noise would be a very low level signal superimposed on the a.c. waveform and would not affect the power factor, carbon footprint or any of the other items mentioned in this nonsense. The most significant source of line noise is usually an electric carbon brush motor, such as an electric drill. This noise should be treated at source as it may interfere with sensitive equipment, e.g. computers. Conclusion, the correct term for this product is B.S. I may not last forever but the mess I leave behind certainly will.
-
These guys claim that microprocessors put electrical noise on the lines in your home and especially the lines in your business. I have never heard of such a thing. But then, there's a lot I don't know. This is the: Two Minute YouTube Video[^] that presents a simplified science view of their stuff. They claim that their device takes an ugly noisy 60 Hz line and changes it back into a smooth nearly pure signal again, with the result being lower electrical bills. I will thank anyone who really knows about electricity for an opinion on this.
-
Actually, it's not entirely BS (but definitely overhyped). IF this device works as advertised it would be doing it by 'power factor correction'. For an explanation of power factor and how it affects the useful power you get vs what you pay for, see What is Power Factor?[^] The upshot is that filtering out harmonics would do little or nothing for you. What would need fixing is the angle, or lag, between the voltage & current waveforms. Even this though wouldn't often helps your bills, at least for domestic consumers. In the UK at least, suppliers charge for electricity in KWh (the useful energy you get out). If the power factor drops below a certain value they will add a 'reactive supplement' or just charge in KVA instead of KWh - which would reflect the energy they're having to generate instead of the useful output you're getting. This situation would only arise for industrial customers though - the low power factor would only be cause by loads such as large electric motors that generate significant inductive loads, residential customers would not be affected.
Plus, even if a household manages to drop its power factor, the solution would be a capacitor bank to keep the power factor up even during heavy machinery use.
To alcohol! The cause of, and solution to, all of life's problems - Homer Simpson ---- Our heads are round so our thoughts can change direction - Francis Picabia
