Further Thoughts on the "End of Days"
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In an earlier post The Lounge[^] I noted that a useful member of IT staff was abruptly terminated and, as of yesterday, they grim reaper harvested another. Meanwhile, some thoughts: IT, per say, was put on notice by the New Kids on the Block that are reorganizing the company, that if a certain program isn't completed by a (demanded) hard date than we're all history. Personally, I think they were simply setting up a pretext, but let's assume not. OK - so these guys come around (and they're IT-clueless, unlike the predecessor), demand a hard deadline and make threats. Two scenario's open up. 1 - we don't make their deadline - and we're replaced by "smarter younger programmers" 2 - we do make this deadline. Now we've set a precdedent that the seriously understaffed development group can be intimidated into results. So - now I can look forward to a slightly early retirement or working continuously under the gun. That does not go well with my personality in the least. The other 'real' developer is quite good and wouldn't bat an eye at seeking employment elsewhere. About half the company's operations are running on the stuff we built. We'll both go on making the best stuff we can while we can. But - thrown out to you lot - comments?
"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." - Albert Einstein
"If you are searching for perfection in others, then you seek disappointment. If you are seek perfection in yourself, then you will find failure." - Balboos HaGadol Mar 2010
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In an earlier post The Lounge[^] I noted that a useful member of IT staff was abruptly terminated and, as of yesterday, they grim reaper harvested another. Meanwhile, some thoughts: IT, per say, was put on notice by the New Kids on the Block that are reorganizing the company, that if a certain program isn't completed by a (demanded) hard date than we're all history. Personally, I think they were simply setting up a pretext, but let's assume not. OK - so these guys come around (and they're IT-clueless, unlike the predecessor), demand a hard deadline and make threats. Two scenario's open up. 1 - we don't make their deadline - and we're replaced by "smarter younger programmers" 2 - we do make this deadline. Now we've set a precdedent that the seriously understaffed development group can be intimidated into results. So - now I can look forward to a slightly early retirement or working continuously under the gun. That does not go well with my personality in the least. The other 'real' developer is quite good and wouldn't bat an eye at seeking employment elsewhere. About half the company's operations are running on the stuff we built. We'll both go on making the best stuff we can while we can. But - thrown out to you lot - comments?
"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." - Albert Einstein
"If you are searching for perfection in others, then you seek disappointment. If you are seek perfection in yourself, then you will find failure." - Balboos HaGadol Mar 2010
Find another job; it will only get worse, so it seems.
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In an earlier post The Lounge[^] I noted that a useful member of IT staff was abruptly terminated and, as of yesterday, they grim reaper harvested another. Meanwhile, some thoughts: IT, per say, was put on notice by the New Kids on the Block that are reorganizing the company, that if a certain program isn't completed by a (demanded) hard date than we're all history. Personally, I think they were simply setting up a pretext, but let's assume not. OK - so these guys come around (and they're IT-clueless, unlike the predecessor), demand a hard deadline and make threats. Two scenario's open up. 1 - we don't make their deadline - and we're replaced by "smarter younger programmers" 2 - we do make this deadline. Now we've set a precdedent that the seriously understaffed development group can be intimidated into results. So - now I can look forward to a slightly early retirement or working continuously under the gun. That does not go well with my personality in the least. The other 'real' developer is quite good and wouldn't bat an eye at seeking employment elsewhere. About half the company's operations are running on the stuff we built. We'll both go on making the best stuff we can while we can. But - thrown out to you lot - comments?
"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." - Albert Einstein
"If you are searching for perfection in others, then you seek disappointment. If you are seek perfection in yourself, then you will find failure." - Balboos HaGadol Mar 2010
You essentially have two choices: 0) Tell them where they can put their "hard deadline" (and don't omit the depth or force of insertion requirements) 1) Work until they fire you and leave without so much as a whimper. Don't forget to thank them for the opportunity to get screwed on your way out the door.
".45 ACP - because shooting twice is just silly" - JSOP, 2010
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You can never have too much ammo - unless you're swimming, or on fire. - JSOP, 2010
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When you pry the gun from my cold dead hands, be careful - the barrel will be very hot. - JSOP, 2013 -
In an earlier post The Lounge[^] I noted that a useful member of IT staff was abruptly terminated and, as of yesterday, they grim reaper harvested another. Meanwhile, some thoughts: IT, per say, was put on notice by the New Kids on the Block that are reorganizing the company, that if a certain program isn't completed by a (demanded) hard date than we're all history. Personally, I think they were simply setting up a pretext, but let's assume not. OK - so these guys come around (and they're IT-clueless, unlike the predecessor), demand a hard deadline and make threats. Two scenario's open up. 1 - we don't make their deadline - and we're replaced by "smarter younger programmers" 2 - we do make this deadline. Now we've set a precdedent that the seriously understaffed development group can be intimidated into results. So - now I can look forward to a slightly early retirement or working continuously under the gun. That does not go well with my personality in the least. The other 'real' developer is quite good and wouldn't bat an eye at seeking employment elsewhere. About half the company's operations are running on the stuff we built. We'll both go on making the best stuff we can while we can. But - thrown out to you lot - comments?
"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." - Albert Einstein
"If you are searching for perfection in others, then you seek disappointment. If you are seek perfection in yourself, then you will find failure." - Balboos HaGadol Mar 2010
W∴ Balboos wrote:
we do make this deadline. Now we've set a precdedent that the seriously understaffed development group can be intimidated into results
If you can do that you deserve to be sacked. Sorry, it is your DUTY to the company to produce a quality product as fast as possible.
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Find another job; it will only get worse, so it seems.
If they all found other jobs (and quit on the same day) their employer would have an direct problem. Would serve them right! Employees hold the power, unfortunately it's a lot harder to make a bunch of employees work together than it is for management to work against all of them :sigh:
Best, Sander arrgh.js - Bringing LINQ to JavaScript SQL Server for C# Developers Succinctly Object-Oriented Programming in C# Succinctly
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W∴ Balboos wrote:
we do make this deadline. Now we've set a precdedent that the seriously understaffed development group can be intimidated into results
If you can do that you deserve to be sacked. Sorry, it is your DUTY to the company to produce a quality product as fast as possible.
Munchies_Matt wrote:
it is your DUTY to the company to produce a quality product as fast as possible.
Yes, but within reason.
There are two kinds of people in the world: those who can extrapolate from incomplete data. There are only 10 types of people in the world, those who understand binary and those who don't.
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Find another job; it will only get worse, so it seems.
Alas, I'm rather old by developers' standards - old enough to be two. One of my pet lines is to get a job as a programmer you need to be 25 years old and have 30 years experience. Maybe some local contract work? Fortunately - I put in the preparation and am essentially immune from any real damage. Time to get back into some serious photography? (!) The thing is, I love coding - but, then again, I learned to do it and did it years before someone would pay me.
"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." - Albert Einstein
"If you are searching for perfection in others, then you seek disappointment. If you are seek perfection in yourself, then you will find failure." - Balboos HaGadol Mar 2010
-
In an earlier post The Lounge[^] I noted that a useful member of IT staff was abruptly terminated and, as of yesterday, they grim reaper harvested another. Meanwhile, some thoughts: IT, per say, was put on notice by the New Kids on the Block that are reorganizing the company, that if a certain program isn't completed by a (demanded) hard date than we're all history. Personally, I think they were simply setting up a pretext, but let's assume not. OK - so these guys come around (and they're IT-clueless, unlike the predecessor), demand a hard deadline and make threats. Two scenario's open up. 1 - we don't make their deadline - and we're replaced by "smarter younger programmers" 2 - we do make this deadline. Now we've set a precdedent that the seriously understaffed development group can be intimidated into results. So - now I can look forward to a slightly early retirement or working continuously under the gun. That does not go well with my personality in the least. The other 'real' developer is quite good and wouldn't bat an eye at seeking employment elsewhere. About half the company's operations are running on the stuff we built. We'll both go on making the best stuff we can while we can. But - thrown out to you lot - comments?
"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." - Albert Einstein
"If you are searching for perfection in others, then you seek disappointment. If you are seek perfection in yourself, then you will find failure." - Balboos HaGadol Mar 2010
Any chance of quitting before the deadline? I did something similar last year to get out of a place where staying was not a good idea anymore. We secretly all looked for new jobs, helped each other as good as possible and all got out, except one. Alone the faces of the bosses you get to see when most of the team quit within a few days are definitely priceless. If it's so easy, then do it yourself, d*ckheads.
The language is JavaScript. that of Mordor, which I will not utter here
This is Javascript. If you put big wheels and a racing stripe on a golf cart, it's still a fucking golf cart.
"I don't know, extraterrestrial?" "You mean like from space?" "No, from Canada." If software development were a circus, we would all be the clowns. -
You essentially have two choices: 0) Tell them where they can put their "hard deadline" (and don't omit the depth or force of insertion requirements) 1) Work until they fire you and leave without so much as a whimper. Don't forget to thank them for the opportunity to get screwed on your way out the door.
".45 ACP - because shooting twice is just silly" - JSOP, 2010
-----
You can never have too much ammo - unless you're swimming, or on fire. - JSOP, 2010
-----
When you pry the gun from my cold dead hands, be careful - the barrel will be very hot. - JSOP, 2013I can do most of (1). More likely than not, they'll discover the extent of the infrastructure I built, and commented though it is, if anything breaks their up to their ankles in sh*t: standing on their heads. However, they gave me a position to begin with, so I have this caveat to your solution: they put food on my table for years. I'm many things (check the soapbox) - but an ingrate is not one of them. The thought of . . . well it crossed my mind but I'll just pack my things and go.
"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." - Albert Einstein
"If you are searching for perfection in others, then you seek disappointment. If you are seek perfection in yourself, then you will find failure." - Balboos HaGadol Mar 2010
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If they all found other jobs (and quit on the same day) their employer would have an direct problem. Would serve them right! Employees hold the power, unfortunately it's a lot harder to make a bunch of employees work together than it is for management to work against all of them :sigh:
Best, Sander arrgh.js - Bringing LINQ to JavaScript SQL Server for C# Developers Succinctly Object-Oriented Programming in C# Succinctly
Good idea. Viva la revolution!
The language is JavaScript. that of Mordor, which I will not utter here
This is Javascript. If you put big wheels and a racing stripe on a golf cart, it's still a fucking golf cart.
"I don't know, extraterrestrial?" "You mean like from space?" "No, from Canada." If software development were a circus, we would all be the clowns. -
You essentially have two choices: 0) Tell them where they can put their "hard deadline" (and don't omit the depth or force of insertion requirements) 1) Work until they fire you and leave without so much as a whimper. Don't forget to thank them for the opportunity to get screwed on your way out the door.
".45 ACP - because shooting twice is just silly" - JSOP, 2010
-----
You can never have too much ammo - unless you're swimming, or on fire. - JSOP, 2010
-----
When you pry the gun from my cold dead hands, be careful - the barrel will be very hot. - JSOP, 2013Both. Kindof 'work', secretly find your ticket out of there and then give them a hard deadline.
The language is JavaScript. that of Mordor, which I will not utter here
This is Javascript. If you put big wheels and a racing stripe on a golf cart, it's still a fucking golf cart.
"I don't know, extraterrestrial?" "You mean like from space?" "No, from Canada." If software development were a circus, we would all be the clowns. -
W∴ Balboos wrote:
we do make this deadline. Now we've set a precdedent that the seriously understaffed development group can be intimidated into results
If you can do that you deserve to be sacked. Sorry, it is your DUTY to the company to produce a quality product as fast as possible.
Another post of yours that deserves a rude comment.
Munchies_Matt wrote:
If you can do that you deserve to be sacked.
Me and this other developer operate as a gestalt - we rebuilt half the companies software infrastructure in just a few years - almost every item extensible without limitations and fiercely reliable. But - we can only hope you find yourself in a position where you're asked to do a job that requires half a dozen developers and you do it with one colleague (or in your case, you'd like work alone as who'd want to be stuck there). A quality product - as fast as possible - WELL - which one is it to be? If you want speed, hire an adequate headcount of qualified staff. Your comment so much reminds me of Marie Antoinette's solution of what the poor should eat if they have no bread. I understand the people's response.
"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." - Albert Einstein
"If you are searching for perfection in others, then you seek disappointment. If you are seek perfection in yourself, then you will find failure." - Balboos HaGadol Mar 2010
-
In an earlier post The Lounge[^] I noted that a useful member of IT staff was abruptly terminated and, as of yesterday, they grim reaper harvested another. Meanwhile, some thoughts: IT, per say, was put on notice by the New Kids on the Block that are reorganizing the company, that if a certain program isn't completed by a (demanded) hard date than we're all history. Personally, I think they were simply setting up a pretext, but let's assume not. OK - so these guys come around (and they're IT-clueless, unlike the predecessor), demand a hard deadline and make threats. Two scenario's open up. 1 - we don't make their deadline - and we're replaced by "smarter younger programmers" 2 - we do make this deadline. Now we've set a precdedent that the seriously understaffed development group can be intimidated into results. So - now I can look forward to a slightly early retirement or working continuously under the gun. That does not go well with my personality in the least. The other 'real' developer is quite good and wouldn't bat an eye at seeking employment elsewhere. About half the company's operations are running on the stuff we built. We'll both go on making the best stuff we can while we can. But - thrown out to you lot - comments?
"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." - Albert Einstein
"If you are searching for perfection in others, then you seek disappointment. If you are seek perfection in yourself, then you will find failure." - Balboos HaGadol Mar 2010
-
Another post of yours that deserves a rude comment.
Munchies_Matt wrote:
If you can do that you deserve to be sacked.
Me and this other developer operate as a gestalt - we rebuilt half the companies software infrastructure in just a few years - almost every item extensible without limitations and fiercely reliable. But - we can only hope you find yourself in a position where you're asked to do a job that requires half a dozen developers and you do it with one colleague (or in your case, you'd like work alone as who'd want to be stuck there). A quality product - as fast as possible - WELL - which one is it to be? If you want speed, hire an adequate headcount of qualified staff. Your comment so much reminds me of Marie Antoinette's solution of what the poor should eat if they have no bread. I understand the people's response.
"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." - Albert Einstein
"If you are searching for perfection in others, then you seek disappointment. If you are seek perfection in yourself, then you will find failure." - Balboos HaGadol Mar 2010
W∴ Balboos wrote:
Another post of yours that deserves a rude comment.
Why? I think you may be taking it too personal. His point is, if I may, that if you don't do your best work you should be fired. That's it. Wouldn't you agree that if you don't do your best work you could/should be fired?
W∴ Balboos wrote:
A quality product - as fast as possible - WELL - which one is it to be?
They are not mutually exclusive. As fast as possible could mean 2 weeks or could mean 6 years. Again, all's he's saying, I believe, is to do a good job everyday. Period.
There are two kinds of people in the world: those who can extrapolate from incomplete data. There are only 10 types of people in the world, those who understand binary and those who don't.
-
Alas, I'm rather old by developers' standards - old enough to be two. One of my pet lines is to get a job as a programmer you need to be 25 years old and have 30 years experience. Maybe some local contract work? Fortunately - I put in the preparation and am essentially immune from any real damage. Time to get back into some serious photography? (!) The thing is, I love coding - but, then again, I learned to do it and did it years before someone would pay me.
"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." - Albert Einstein
"If you are searching for perfection in others, then you seek disappointment. If you are seek perfection in yourself, then you will find failure." - Balboos HaGadol Mar 2010
-
Munchies_Matt wrote:
it is your DUTY to the company to produce a quality product as fast as possible.
Yes, but within reason.
There are two kinds of people in the world: those who can extrapolate from incomplete data. There are only 10 types of people in the world, those who understand binary and those who don't.
He is paid to do a job, do it.
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Any chance of quitting before the deadline? I did something similar last year to get out of a place where staying was not a good idea anymore. We secretly all looked for new jobs, helped each other as good as possible and all got out, except one. Alone the faces of the bosses you get to see when most of the team quit within a few days are definitely priceless. If it's so easy, then do it yourself, d*ckheads.
The language is JavaScript. that of Mordor, which I will not utter here
This is Javascript. If you put big wheels and a racing stripe on a golf cart, it's still a fucking golf cart.
"I don't know, extraterrestrial?" "You mean like from space?" "No, from Canada." If software development were a circus, we would all be the clowns.Resignation would mean I don't get to collect unemployment compensation - not a fortune - something over $400/wk. Buys a lot of pizza and single-malt. If either of us two multi-project developer's is gone, the others' work would be impacted. His leaving would overload me with work; my leaving would end development of the infrastructure. If things do collapse and they need us back . . . it will be costly.
"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." - Albert Einstein
"If you are searching for perfection in others, then you seek disappointment. If you are seek perfection in yourself, then you will find failure." - Balboos HaGadol Mar 2010
-
In an earlier post The Lounge[^] I noted that a useful member of IT staff was abruptly terminated and, as of yesterday, they grim reaper harvested another. Meanwhile, some thoughts: IT, per say, was put on notice by the New Kids on the Block that are reorganizing the company, that if a certain program isn't completed by a (demanded) hard date than we're all history. Personally, I think they were simply setting up a pretext, but let's assume not. OK - so these guys come around (and they're IT-clueless, unlike the predecessor), demand a hard deadline and make threats. Two scenario's open up. 1 - we don't make their deadline - and we're replaced by "smarter younger programmers" 2 - we do make this deadline. Now we've set a precdedent that the seriously understaffed development group can be intimidated into results. So - now I can look forward to a slightly early retirement or working continuously under the gun. That does not go well with my personality in the least. The other 'real' developer is quite good and wouldn't bat an eye at seeking employment elsewhere. About half the company's operations are running on the stuff we built. We'll both go on making the best stuff we can while we can. But - thrown out to you lot - comments?
"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." - Albert Einstein
"If you are searching for perfection in others, then you seek disappointment. If you are seek perfection in yourself, then you will find failure." - Balboos HaGadol Mar 2010
There seem to be a lot of developers that feel everyone is their enemy. Also, several responses have already said to quit. I don't understand either of these mentalities. My philosophy is that I will do my best every day. If that is not good enough, then there are lots of other jobs. But I won't quit or runaway just because someone is putting undue pressure on me. I will communicate with them. Start by trying to communicate with them, or with your manager.
There are two kinds of people in the world: those who can extrapolate from incomplete data. There are only 10 types of people in the world, those who understand binary and those who don't.
-
He is paid to do a job, do it.
Munchies_Matt wrote:
He is paid to do a job, do it.
I agree. But if that job turns into "you must work 80 hour weeks" then I have no problem finding a more reasonable job. No good developer, at least in the US, should ever feel like they can't get another job.
There are two kinds of people in the world: those who can extrapolate from incomplete data. There are only 10 types of people in the world, those who understand binary and those who don't.
-
Another post of yours that deserves a rude comment.
Munchies_Matt wrote:
If you can do that you deserve to be sacked.
Me and this other developer operate as a gestalt - we rebuilt half the companies software infrastructure in just a few years - almost every item extensible without limitations and fiercely reliable. But - we can only hope you find yourself in a position where you're asked to do a job that requires half a dozen developers and you do it with one colleague (or in your case, you'd like work alone as who'd want to be stuck there). A quality product - as fast as possible - WELL - which one is it to be? If you want speed, hire an adequate headcount of qualified staff. Your comment so much reminds me of Marie Antoinette's solution of what the poor should eat if they have no bread. I understand the people's response.
"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." - Albert Einstein
"If you are searching for perfection in others, then you seek disappointment. If you are seek perfection in yourself, then you will find failure." - Balboos HaGadol Mar 2010
Hey, you are the one who said you could meet a shortened deadline, not me. I have worked with many inefficient software teams, and its quite staggering how much time they waste instead of just getting the product out.
