A Programmers Life
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Java is ok. It's JavaScript which I really dislike. Despite the name the two are totally different animals. I have picked up a few langages along the way, but I try to keep my eggs in the same basket for a single project. The big question always is which basket to choose. Java or C# are among your best bets when you intend to run your code on different platforms. Right now I'm about to refactor a nice big load of code, but I'm caught between all chairs. I have nice data objects that have some built in logic, like validation. Now, that's a breach of the single responsibility principle[^] and I pay a certain price for that. I need to get those data objects throgh web services to a client. On the client side I must convert the dumb 'substitutes' back to the original types. That's not very complicated code, but it needs to be done for every object. Muche worse is that this approach also constitutes a breach of the multitier architecture[^]. Ok, it's not so hard to refactor the data objects, for example by moving the validation to a separate Validator object. But when I strip the data objects of all logic, the next guru comes around the corner and tells me that I now have a anemic domain model[^]. That's usually the point where I let the gurus be gurus and go ahead with what appears the least harmful choice. The comment about writing your own UI also was about this[^] little game client. There was no UI out of the box that could work together with a 3D engine, so I just made my own.
The language is JavaScript. that of Mordor, which I will not utter here
This is Javascript. If you put big wheels and a racing stripe on a golf cart, it's still a fucking golf cart.
"I don't know, extraterrestrial?" "You mean like from space?" "No, from Canada." If software development were a circus, wThanks CDP1802! It seems that the majority of programmers that have replied to my thread have said that C# is the way to go for many reasons other than just a UI. I have written a couple of projects in C# and I did enjoy the learning curve, but it also seems to be a powerful language. I will dive into C# and see where it leads, it may turn out to be my new language of choice. But I will cross that bridge with my safety harness on with my lifeline attached to my background of so many hours of dangling on a thin branch. I'm trying so hard to leave the old days and join the new world of .NET, Cloud(Azure) and many other new technologies. Thanks again and a wish you luck with your refactoring, sounds like a big job ahead. -Randy
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CDP1802 wrote:
Java or C# are among your best bets when you intend to run your code on different platforms
C# runs everywhere on all your Windows devices. Well alright, with .NET Core it runs on other devices as well, but I don't think it's as widely supported as Java just yet. However... For true multi-platform support you need to travel to Mordor. JavaScript is the only language that will run in your browser (all the others just transpile to JavaScript), it runs on your desktop, on your server, on Linux, Windows, iOS, embedded, in your IoT devices, your dog, your cat, your grandma and the armies of Mordor. Or maybe C++, C, Assembly or 1's and 0's :D 01001001 01101110 00100000 01101101 01111001 00100000 01100100 01100001 01111001 00100000 01110111 01100101 00100000 01100100 01101001 01100100 01101110 00100111 01110100 00100000 01101000 01100001 01110110 01100101 00100000 00110001 00100111 01110011 00101100 00100000 01101111 01101110 01101100 01111001 00100000 00110000 00100111 01110011 00100000 00111010 01000100 (from the top of my head ;p)
Best, Sander arrgh.js - Bringing LINQ to JavaScript SQL Server for C# Developers Succinctly Object-Oriented Programming in C# Succinctly
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it takes more ink to print a zero than a 1, so by weight [the pages of] zeros exceed the ones. ... have fun trying to get to sleep tonight! :suss: :laugh: :suss: :laugh: :suss: :laugh:
Sin tack the any key okay
Damn you!
I wanna be a eunuchs developer! Pass me a bread knife!
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Quote:
ones and zeros
Why both? The Romans built an empire that lasted for centuries, using a numerical system that did not have a zero. You should try to get away without a zero as well. Use only ones! ;P
Get me coffee and no one gets hurt!
That's just silly! The programs wouldn't work!
I wanna be a eunuchs developer! Pass me a bread knife!
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I always knew there was something special about you, something that tugged on my heartstrings, and made me want to give you drugs ! cheers, Bill
«When I consider my brief span of life, swallowed up in an eternity before and after, the little space I fill, and even can see, engulfed in the infinite immensity of spaces of which I am ignorant, and which know me not, I am frightened, and am astonished at being here rather than there; for there is no reason why here rather than there, now rather than then.» Blaise Pascal
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As an OCD sufferer, everything for me has to be black or white/yes or no, so I prefer to write out my programs in full in binary in a text editor. The only "extra" functionality I need in the text editor is the ability to sort, because when I'm finished writing a program, I insist on sorting all those messy ones and zeros numerically -- and I get annoyed if this doesn't result in the same number of pages of zeros as are used for the ones, so I make up the difference by adding instances of the character that came up short. The programs work perfectly well, so I don't see any need to invest in any new-fangled UIs, frameworks, etc.
I wanna be a eunuchs developer! Pass me a bread knife!
I'll be.... a text editor? I always thought that real programmers used "copy con"
"Abstract art? A product of the untalented, sold by the unprincipled to the utterly bewildered." Al Capp
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If only I was joking. JavaScript really is the one language that runs EVERYWHERE (or the one language to rule them all, sticking to the LOTR analogy). One of the worst languages ever created so of course it had to be the universal programming language X| I wouldn't start with JavaScript as a first language though (even though it's really easy to get started with). C# is a solid choice, beautiful and elegant language. It has many features JavaScript lacks. Just download and install Visual Studio Community Edition and you're pretty much ready to go :)
Best, Sander arrgh.js - Bringing LINQ to JavaScript SQL Server for C# Developers Succinctly Object-Oriented Programming in C# Succinctly
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I'll be.... a text editor? I always thought that real programmers used "copy con"
"Abstract art? A product of the untalented, sold by the unprincipled to the utterly bewildered." Al Capp
EDLINandSORTare all the development environment I need. And a coffee machine, of course. No environment is complete without a coffee machine.I wanna be a eunuchs developer! Pass me a bread knife!
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This is a general question to all and I really am not asking for help per say, but really just understanding why you have chosen a specific set of tools used for creating the majority of the projects created and what led you to the path you're on. For instance, I would like to know what programming language you prefer for creating GUI main pages, if you use cross platform or maybe any language depending on your project? You will be targeting a Windows environment Ver.7 and beyond. Let's assume that it's for a local program, not web-based and the targeted user will be using it as a database collection program. I just want opinions, advice and the knowledge from experienced programmers. What is your language of choice and why? Thank you for taking your time to share. :-) I am not trying to waste your time or annoy anyone, but my curiosity has been scratching the inside of my skull for some time now. Again, thank you and wish you all a Happy Easter!
C++ is my language of choice, simply because it's the only language that can get me true satisfaction. Besides, I like Qt more than anything .net has to offer.
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This is a general question to all and I really am not asking for help per say, but really just understanding why you have chosen a specific set of tools used for creating the majority of the projects created and what led you to the path you're on. For instance, I would like to know what programming language you prefer for creating GUI main pages, if you use cross platform or maybe any language depending on your project? You will be targeting a Windows environment Ver.7 and beyond. Let's assume that it's for a local program, not web-based and the targeted user will be using it as a database collection program. I just want opinions, advice and the knowledge from experienced programmers. What is your language of choice and why? Thank you for taking your time to share. :-) I am not trying to waste your time or annoy anyone, but my curiosity has been scratching the inside of my skull for some time now. Again, thank you and wish you all a Happy Easter!
C# with DevExpress XAF. With one source code in C# with XAF, you produce : - WinForms - Web (touch enabled) - multi-platform Mobile app with native look and feel. Your source code is mainly the description of your objects and their relations, where you add declarative validation and other goodies via attributes. Your application creates (or updates) the database automatically (including indexes, foreign keys, necessary n-n relation tables, etc.) and produces a beautiful default UI that you can fully customize, either in Visual Studio or at run-time. The learning curve is sharp, but well worth it. Everything is done by following best design patterns. See my answer to another similar question here, that includes links to tutorials and demos: Generic Multi Purpose .NET Layered Framework[^]
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This is a general question to all and I really am not asking for help per say, but really just understanding why you have chosen a specific set of tools used for creating the majority of the projects created and what led you to the path you're on. For instance, I would like to know what programming language you prefer for creating GUI main pages, if you use cross platform or maybe any language depending on your project? You will be targeting a Windows environment Ver.7 and beyond. Let's assume that it's for a local program, not web-based and the targeted user will be using it as a database collection program. I just want opinions, advice and the knowledge from experienced programmers. What is your language of choice and why? Thank you for taking your time to share. :-) I am not trying to waste your time or annoy anyone, but my curiosity has been scratching the inside of my skull for some time now. Again, thank you and wish you all a Happy Easter!
RPG/400 is the best! :-D :-D :-D :-D :-D
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This is a general question to all and I really am not asking for help per say, but really just understanding why you have chosen a specific set of tools used for creating the majority of the projects created and what led you to the path you're on. For instance, I would like to know what programming language you prefer for creating GUI main pages, if you use cross platform or maybe any language depending on your project? You will be targeting a Windows environment Ver.7 and beyond. Let's assume that it's for a local program, not web-based and the targeted user will be using it as a database collection program. I just want opinions, advice and the knowledge from experienced programmers. What is your language of choice and why? Thank you for taking your time to share. :-) I am not trying to waste your time or annoy anyone, but my curiosity has been scratching the inside of my skull for some time now. Again, thank you and wish you all a Happy Easter!
Hi! My choice would be Embarcadero Delphi. I know it costs a lot more than C#, so if price is an issue go with that. My preferred combo would be: * Delphi * DevExpress * VCL Skins For the client and * RemObjects For the server. If you only need simple DB access, then ditch RemObjects. My reasons for this choice are: - Polish: DevExpress gives your app an incredibly clean look. As an alternative, VCL skins allow you to skin your apps natively in a number of ways - Cross Platform: most code can be shared between Windows and Mac. Mac requires the use of FireMonkey for the GUI, but if you are smart that is not very painful - App tethering: your apps can communicate very simply across a network or using BlueTooth - Android/iOS package: the Pro version allows you to buy an optional pack to do mobile apps. App tethering works with this as well, so you could use your phone and update your app automatically - No runtimes: you deploy a single exe that works across the board, even if .NET isn't installed - Wealth of high quality 3rd party components - Modern language: generics, anonymous functions, etc. Yeah, it's still catching up a bit, but it all works. - DB engines that you can embed: a number of companies make RDBMS systems that you can embed in your program. An example of this would be NexusDB, whose DCU only version is completely free. Keep in mind that NexusDB is also capable of having a whole DB in memory and - if you buy the C/S version - you can even have it in memory on a remote server. The flexibility, raw power and freedom is just a sight to behold. A free starter version exists but I don't think it lets you do databases. Worth playing with though.
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I've been in the industry for over 30 years now and have a variety of tool as needed. I started with FORTran and FMS on a VAX/VMS platform and from there, migrated to some Windows development. However, most of my Windows development, then and now, has been back end processing: services, data extract/manipulation processing, etc. So, I started using the tools made available and in common use in the areas I was in. That tended to be VB6, then VB.NET. I know, flameproof suit on, but, if it works for what I need... So.. to that extent, use what you are comfortable with that will do the job.
Visual Basic was one of the best things that happened to IT. The language was (and still is) easy to learn, easy to read, implemented drag-n-drop GUI building well, and simplified event-driven programming. Back in the 90's it was a game changer, a radical departure from every technology then on the market. I was a C programmer (among other things) and moved into C++ and Java ... got out quickly. OTOH, VB made business programming quick and efficient -- and VB built a market share that I don't believe any other language has equaled. Is there crap VB code out in the wild? Yup. There's also crap C++, Java, C#, etc. The problem is rarely the language, it's the person who doesn't know how to program with maintainability as part of the design process. I roll my eyes when I read rants against VB ... the language has been unsupported for over 15 years yet a recent survey listed it as a the 11th most popular language according to one site. [I recall other sites rank VB between 11 and 18.] Take all language rankings with a 5# bag of salt, as they all focus on specific criteria. Top 100 Most Popular Programming Languages Of 2016[^] Dropping support for VB6 was possibly the most bone-headed move Microsoft made, one that stands out in a sea of bone-headed moves. It cost them a lot of faithful users of their products. Do I recommend learning VB6 now? Only for programming VBA. Knowing VB/VBA is useful in useful in writing Excel functions which beat the crap out of chaining worksheet functions together. My MS Word Normal.dotm contains macros I wrote in the 90's, still useful today. [Visual Basic is alive and well behind the scenes in Microsoft Office, as well as other products.] These days I'm doing C# winforms and MVC with Oracle and SQL Server. Why? That is what the employer needs. I learn the languages that have market share, which ensures I have a steady paycheck. I like my job and love programming, but the languages and technologies are simply a means to an end. In themselves they rank low in importance.
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This is a general question to all and I really am not asking for help per say, but really just understanding why you have chosen a specific set of tools used for creating the majority of the projects created and what led you to the path you're on. For instance, I would like to know what programming language you prefer for creating GUI main pages, if you use cross platform or maybe any language depending on your project? You will be targeting a Windows environment Ver.7 and beyond. Let's assume that it's for a local program, not web-based and the targeted user will be using it as a database collection program. I just want opinions, advice and the knowledge from experienced programmers. What is your language of choice and why? Thank you for taking your time to share. :-) I am not trying to waste your time or annoy anyone, but my curiosity has been scratching the inside of my skull for some time now. Again, thank you and wish you all a Happy Easter!
I use RPG because it's a natural Business language with integrated record level database access. The variation I use is a Visual Studio Plug in language from ASNA.
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If only I was joking. JavaScript really is the one language that runs EVERYWHERE (or the one language to rule them all, sticking to the LOTR analogy). One of the worst languages ever created so of course it had to be the universal programming language X| I wouldn't start with JavaScript as a first language though (even though it's really easy to get started with). C# is a solid choice, beautiful and elegant language. It has many features JavaScript lacks. Just download and install Visual Studio Community Edition and you're pretty much ready to go :)
Best, Sander arrgh.js - Bringing LINQ to JavaScript SQL Server for C# Developers Succinctly Object-Oriented Programming in C# Succinctly
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Visual Basic was one of the best things that happened to IT. The language was (and still is) easy to learn, easy to read, implemented drag-n-drop GUI building well, and simplified event-driven programming. Back in the 90's it was a game changer, a radical departure from every technology then on the market. I was a C programmer (among other things) and moved into C++ and Java ... got out quickly. OTOH, VB made business programming quick and efficient -- and VB built a market share that I don't believe any other language has equaled. Is there crap VB code out in the wild? Yup. There's also crap C++, Java, C#, etc. The problem is rarely the language, it's the person who doesn't know how to program with maintainability as part of the design process. I roll my eyes when I read rants against VB ... the language has been unsupported for over 15 years yet a recent survey listed it as a the 11th most popular language according to one site. [I recall other sites rank VB between 11 and 18.] Take all language rankings with a 5# bag of salt, as they all focus on specific criteria. Top 100 Most Popular Programming Languages Of 2016[^] Dropping support for VB6 was possibly the most bone-headed move Microsoft made, one that stands out in a sea of bone-headed moves. It cost them a lot of faithful users of their products. Do I recommend learning VB6 now? Only for programming VBA. Knowing VB/VBA is useful in useful in writing Excel functions which beat the crap out of chaining worksheet functions together. My MS Word Normal.dotm contains macros I wrote in the 90's, still useful today. [Visual Basic is alive and well behind the scenes in Microsoft Office, as well as other products.] These days I'm doing C# winforms and MVC with Oracle and SQL Server. Why? That is what the employer needs. I learn the languages that have market share, which ensures I have a steady paycheck. I like my job and love programming, but the languages and technologies are simply a means to an end. In themselves they rank low in importance.
VB.net is the latest version. Ok it doesn't resemble VB6 very much but it can do almost everything that C# can. My only gripe with VB6 is that it didn't encourage properly structured or DRY programming. I have recently been working with some folk who learned their coding skills with VB6. They created some gargantuan functions with literally hundreds of lines of code. It took a great deal of pursasion to get them to start making functions that do only one thing and never repeat themselves.
We're philosophical about power outages here. A.C. come, A.C. go.
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This is a general question to all and I really am not asking for help per say, but really just understanding why you have chosen a specific set of tools used for creating the majority of the projects created and what led you to the path you're on. For instance, I would like to know what programming language you prefer for creating GUI main pages, if you use cross platform or maybe any language depending on your project? You will be targeting a Windows environment Ver.7 and beyond. Let's assume that it's for a local program, not web-based and the targeted user will be using it as a database collection program. I just want opinions, advice and the knowledge from experienced programmers. What is your language of choice and why? Thank you for taking your time to share. :-) I am not trying to waste your time or annoy anyone, but my curiosity has been scratching the inside of my skull for some time now. Again, thank you and wish you all a Happy Easter!
A computer programmer exemplifies Human thought, translating in effect each brain-step to a computer command. It is therefore ABSOLUTELY necessary that the programming languaged used is as close to Human thought as possible. This is exactly where Visual Basic scores High. But I do appreciate the need for other languages. Let us accept the fact that our whole logic is built around our natural language, that is the HUMAN language. Therefore, the programming language that is closer to the HUMAN language is more suitable for expressing algorithms while at the same time it reduces logical errors in programming. In other words, "IF... THEN... ELSE..." is far more clear and closer to the HUMAN language than if... {... }... Professor E. J. Yannakoudakis (eyan@aueb.gr)
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VB.net is the latest version. Ok it doesn't resemble VB6 very much but it can do almost everything that C# can. My only gripe with VB6 is that it didn't encourage properly structured or DRY programming. I have recently been working with some folk who learned their coding skills with VB6. They created some gargantuan functions with literally hundreds of lines of code. It took a great deal of pursasion to get them to start making functions that do only one thing and never repeat themselves.
We're philosophical about power outages here. A.C. come, A.C. go.
I dabbled briefly in VB.NET then switched to C#. Due to the lack of backwards compatibility and apparent indifference from Microsoft, VB.NET lost the traction provided by the VB6 crowd and C# seemed to be the better route. Hindsight has proven that correct (IMO). I have no problems with VB.NET; however, in my area it doesn't have market share so I went in a different direction. A don't know that any mainstream language truly "encourages" good structured programming. While I agree that some VB folks didn't understand that writing an entire 10,000 line program in one function is a bad idea ... I've run into equally bizarre things in the OO world. Twenty years ago I recall one of the OO evangelists writing about how OO fixed all the problems of procedural programming ... while I was trying to debug OO code whose original author seemed to have a truly nonsensical take on what OO is. Good programming skills need to be instilled early in the learning process; then they become second nature.
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This is a general question to all and I really am not asking for help per say, but really just understanding why you have chosen a specific set of tools used for creating the majority of the projects created and what led you to the path you're on. For instance, I would like to know what programming language you prefer for creating GUI main pages, if you use cross platform or maybe any language depending on your project? You will be targeting a Windows environment Ver.7 and beyond. Let's assume that it's for a local program, not web-based and the targeted user will be using it as a database collection program. I just want opinions, advice and the knowledge from experienced programmers. What is your language of choice and why? Thank you for taking your time to share. :-) I am not trying to waste your time or annoy anyone, but my curiosity has been scratching the inside of my skull for some time now. Again, thank you and wish you all a Happy Easter!
DrBones69 wrote:
why you have chosen a specific set of tools used for creating the majority of the projects created and what led you to the path you're on
While I answered this obliquely in a reply to a post in this thread, I haven't answered directly. My choice of languages and technologies is driven primarily by market share. Companies typically hire for specific technologies so to maintain a consistent paycheck I learn whatever is in demand. In the past 30 years I've seen numerous technologies rise to stardom and fade into obscurity, so I focus on what I project will have market share in the foreseeable future -- with the understanding that I'll learn new things as the current ones fade. The simple fact is that as much as I enjoy programming, my focus is having a paycheck. My experience is that having a paycheck beats the heck out of NOT having a paycheck. ;P But market share is not the only consideration -- what *I* want to do is important. We spend too much time at work to do something we absolutely hate for long (although I've done that when the economy was less than stellar). Most surveys I've read recently put C# at 6th or 7th in popularity. It seems to hold consistently in that place year after year, and C# has good market share in my area (lot of Microsoft-based shops). I like C# and database, so that's my choice. My advice to everyone is to watch the job boards, even when you have no interest in jumping ship. Stay abreast of where the paying jobs are, and take the trade rag articles on upcoming languages with a grain of salt. Until someone is willing to pay for a skill set, it is of limited value.
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This is a general question to all and I really am not asking for help per say, but really just understanding why you have chosen a specific set of tools used for creating the majority of the projects created and what led you to the path you're on. For instance, I would like to know what programming language you prefer for creating GUI main pages, if you use cross platform or maybe any language depending on your project? You will be targeting a Windows environment Ver.7 and beyond. Let's assume that it's for a local program, not web-based and the targeted user will be using it as a database collection program. I just want opinions, advice and the knowledge from experienced programmers. What is your language of choice and why? Thank you for taking your time to share. :-) I am not trying to waste your time or annoy anyone, but my curiosity has been scratching the inside of my skull for some time now. Again, thank you and wish you all a Happy Easter!
Now a day, I use these three exclusively: C#, JavaScript and SQL. With these two I can build just about any application web or desktop. I know, lots of developers don't like JS, but I like it, especially ES6. I try not to use third party tool/libraries especially those all-in-one framework tools that are bloated, like DevExpress, Telerik, extjs, etc. I do use third party (open source) libraries, but only those that are light weight and specific. I event shy using jquery.
