Do developers really need a touch screen?
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:suss: I had a touchscreen for development back in the late '80s. :cool: :omg: What took y'all so long? :wtf:
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:thumbsup: /ravi
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MacSpudster wrote:
I had a touchscreen for development back in the late '80s.
Must be very expensive then.
TOMZ_KV
$400 for a 9" touchscreen for the then Mac Classic/Classic II. $815 in today's dollars ~ CPI Inflation Calculator[^]
The first person that replies to this comment gets $200. (Well, actually, anyone can get "$200" via copy/paste... :laugh: )
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$400 for a 9" touchscreen for the then Mac Classic/Classic II. $815 in today's dollars ~ CPI Inflation Calculator[^]
The first person that replies to this comment gets $200. (Well, actually, anyone can get "$200" via copy/paste... :laugh: )
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Most touch applications are developed using an emulator. The "touch" test is generally conducted on a real phone or pad. Are there any good reasons that developers need a touch screen dev box?
TOMZ_KV
Tomz_KV wrote:
Are there any good reasons that developers need a touch screen dev box?
Absolutely yes. I've been developing touch-screen apps since 2000, which obviously predates smartphones. I've used far too many phone apps that fail basic touch usability metrics: - Touch targets are too small - Targets are placed too closely together - Icons that indicate a target don't accurately delineate the target area - Text used as a touch target (finger obscures needed information, plus text is weak for positioning cues) - Target layout without regard to tasks I attribute a lot of this to the use of emulators and the mouse in place of testing on real devices with real fingers. I know a lot of app developers can't afford to buy several devices for testing purposes, but they could at least test on a representative of each class of device: small screen smartphone, large screen smartphone, small tablet (7"), large tablet (10"), laptop. For example: one of the apps I use on my phone every day requires that I rotate my index finger 90° in order to hit one target at the edge of the screen. A normal finger press does not work. A mouse is a high-precision pointing device. A finger is not.
Software Zen:
delete this; -
No. They require shutting down the system to clean the screen.
Jochen Arndt wrote:
They require shutting down the system to clean the screen.
Not so. My touch-screen apps include a "clean" operation. It opens a full-screen window that displays a 30 second countdown and ignores mouse clicks (our touch screen hardware simulates a mouse).
Software Zen:
delete this; -
Tomz_KV wrote:
Are there any good reasons that developers need a touch screen dev box?
Absolutely yes. I've been developing touch-screen apps since 2000, which obviously predates smartphones. I've used far too many phone apps that fail basic touch usability metrics: - Touch targets are too small - Targets are placed too closely together - Icons that indicate a target don't accurately delineate the target area - Text used as a touch target (finger obscures needed information, plus text is weak for positioning cues) - Target layout without regard to tasks I attribute a lot of this to the use of emulators and the mouse in place of testing on real devices with real fingers. I know a lot of app developers can't afford to buy several devices for testing purposes, but they could at least test on a representative of each class of device: small screen smartphone, large screen smartphone, small tablet (7"), large tablet (10"), laptop. For example: one of the apps I use on my phone every day requires that I rotate my index finger 90° in order to hit one target at the edge of the screen. A normal finger press does not work. A mouse is a high-precision pointing device. A finger is not.
Software Zen:
delete this; -
If you need to write software for the iPhone X, then yes, I'd recommend getting one. Most people reacting here in this thread are reacting before they read the entire question. ..if you don't need to write software for it, then the question would be simple; are you worth that iPhone X?
Bastard Programmer from Hell :suss: If you can't read my code, try converting it here[^]
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You're welcome.
Software Zen:
delete this; -
Most touch applications are developed using an emulator. The "touch" test is generally conducted on a real phone or pad. Are there any good reasons that developers need a touch screen dev box?
TOMZ_KV
I think it is not necessary :) Developers only need good laptop/pc. Touch screen is suitable for designer :laugh:
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Most touch applications are developed using an emulator. The "touch" test is generally conducted on a real phone or pad. Are there any good reasons that developers need a touch screen dev box?
TOMZ_KV
Only if they are human. Have you haver used a computer with a touch screen? Really used, not tried.
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Most touch applications are developed using an emulator. The "touch" test is generally conducted on a real phone or pad. Are there any good reasons that developers need a touch screen dev box?
TOMZ_KV
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Most touch applications are developed using an emulator. The "touch" test is generally conducted on a real phone or pad. Are there any good reasons that developers need a touch screen dev box?
TOMZ_KV
Nope most devs don't need them. Well Iv'e gotten by so far with not needing one, even when working on TS based projects. However... Most Devs DO NEED them, or at least the stake holders and project managers need devs to have them... Well at least if the amount of Stake Holders/Clients and Business folk that stab their fingers on my monitor when trying to "show me stuff" are anything to go by anyway :-)
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Most touch applications are developed using an emulator. The "touch" test is generally conducted on a real phone or pad. Are there any good reasons that developers need a touch screen dev box?
TOMZ_KV
Developers don't even "need" a computer. They can handwrite code on notepads and have a typist enter it for them. :rolleyes: Anyone who's developing touch capable software* needs access to a touch screen that they can debug against for day to day work. Whether that's a discrete phone/tablet for dev use, a laptop with a touch screen, or a touch enabled monitor is a secondary concern. Unless your management is braindamaged, it should be whatever allows each dev to work most efficiently. A cheap phone/tablet/touch upgrade for a laptop only costs a few hours of dev time, so just get whatever lets them work fastest. It'll pay for itself. * This includes anyone who's writing web applications or consumer focused desktop apps. You may think someone would need to be :elephant:ing insane to reach up and swipe their laptop screen instead of using a mouse/touchpad; but a significant fraction of your userbase *does* do just that. Or at least a significant fraction of people who would be part of your userbase (and helping to pay your salary) if the crap you wrote wasn't borderline unusable on their touch enabled system. :doh:
Did you ever see history portrayed as an old man with a wise brow and pulseless heart, weighing all things in the balance of reason? Is not rather the genius of history like an eternal, imploring maiden, full of fire, with a burning heart and flaming soul, humanly warm and humanly beautiful? --Zachris Topelius Training a telescope on one’s own belly button will only reveal lint. You like that? You go right on staring at it. I prefer looking at galaxies. -- Sarah Hoyt
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Tomz_KV wrote:
Are there any good reasons that developers need a touch screen dev box?
Absolutely yes. I've been developing touch-screen apps since 2000, which obviously predates smartphones. I've used far too many phone apps that fail basic touch usability metrics: - Touch targets are too small - Targets are placed too closely together - Icons that indicate a target don't accurately delineate the target area - Text used as a touch target (finger obscures needed information, plus text is weak for positioning cues) - Target layout without regard to tasks I attribute a lot of this to the use of emulators and the mouse in place of testing on real devices with real fingers. I know a lot of app developers can't afford to buy several devices for testing purposes, but they could at least test on a representative of each class of device: small screen smartphone, large screen smartphone, small tablet (7"), large tablet (10"), laptop. For example: one of the apps I use on my phone every day requires that I rotate my index finger 90° in order to hit one target at the edge of the screen. A normal finger press does not work. A mouse is a high-precision pointing device. A finger is not.
Software Zen:
delete this;Gary Wheeler wrote:
I attribute a lot of this to the use of emulators and the mouse in place of testing on real devices with real fingers. I know a lot of app developers can't afford to buy several devices for testing purposes, but they could at least test on a representative of each class of device: small screen smartphone, large screen smartphone, small tablet (7"), large tablet (10"), laptop.
I haven't done nywhere close to as much touch work as you have, but I fully agree. And lest any bean counters freak out, you don't need to buy one of each of the 5 classes of test device for every developer and tester; just enough that there's at least 1 per person working on it a time and at least 1 full set available to be shared around as needed so the testers can try all form factors and the devs can have access to a problematic form factor as needed to fix things.
Did you ever see history portrayed as an old man with a wise brow and pulseless heart, weighing all things in the balance of reason? Is not rather the genius of history like an eternal, imploring maiden, full of fire, with a burning heart and flaming soul, humanly warm and humanly beautiful? --Zachris Topelius Training a telescope on one’s own belly button will only reveal lint. You like that? You go right on staring at it. I prefer looking at galaxies. -- Sarah Hoyt
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Developers don't even "need" a computer. They can handwrite code on notepads and have a typist enter it for them. :rolleyes: Anyone who's developing touch capable software* needs access to a touch screen that they can debug against for day to day work. Whether that's a discrete phone/tablet for dev use, a laptop with a touch screen, or a touch enabled monitor is a secondary concern. Unless your management is braindamaged, it should be whatever allows each dev to work most efficiently. A cheap phone/tablet/touch upgrade for a laptop only costs a few hours of dev time, so just get whatever lets them work fastest. It'll pay for itself. * This includes anyone who's writing web applications or consumer focused desktop apps. You may think someone would need to be :elephant:ing insane to reach up and swipe their laptop screen instead of using a mouse/touchpad; but a significant fraction of your userbase *does* do just that. Or at least a significant fraction of people who would be part of your userbase (and helping to pay your salary) if the crap you wrote wasn't borderline unusable on their touch enabled system. :doh:
Did you ever see history portrayed as an old man with a wise brow and pulseless heart, weighing all things in the balance of reason? Is not rather the genius of history like an eternal, imploring maiden, full of fire, with a burning heart and flaming soul, humanly warm and humanly beautiful? --Zachris Topelius Training a telescope on one’s own belly button will only reveal lint. You like that? You go right on staring at it. I prefer looking at galaxies. -- Sarah Hoyt
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Most touch applications are developed using an emulator. The "touch" test is generally conducted on a real phone or pad. Are there any good reasons that developers need a touch screen dev box?
TOMZ_KV
Testing code preproduction, you really should execute it on any platform that it is expected to launched from. Emulators are good getting close, but if you're attempting to validate the code against the platform you need to be running from the platform. As far as developing with a touch screen, I've not tried that (probably because I have no laptop or desktop with a touch screen). But, I would really like to do some coding on my iPad Pro. I've not found the tools to do this however, so I don't.
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Most touch applications are developed using an emulator. The "touch" test is generally conducted on a real phone or pad. Are there any good reasons that developers need a touch screen dev box?
TOMZ_KV
To me it has very little to do with how they would test their application but rather how they work. Developers are expensive resources and if a touch screen will allow a given developer to work faster or even just make them happier then it is worth it. Now with that said I would say it depends on whether they are working with a desktop or a laptop. I am always surprised when a developer uses a desktop but I know it still happens. To me on a desktop it is irrelevant but on a laptop it is useful. That is my 2 cents!
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Most touch applications are developed using an emulator. The "touch" test is generally conducted on a real phone or pad. Are there any good reasons that developers need a touch screen dev box?
TOMZ_KV
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Most touch applications are developed using an emulator. The "touch" test is generally conducted on a real phone or pad. Are there any good reasons that developers need a touch screen dev box?
TOMZ_KV
I cannot say for developers in general, but I do use my touch screen (laptop screen) during development occasionally. When I develop using Xamarin.Forms, I make sure I develop for handsets (iPhone, Android) and tablets (iPad, Android, and Windows/UWP). Even with emulators, I like to test the "look and feel" of my screens. At least then I can catch and fix the more obvious issues before finally getting on to testing with actual devices. If you need a touch screen, use it. If you don't need a touch screen now, but may likely need it in the future, at least have it. If you don't need a touch screen now or ever, don't get one.