Elon Musk forced to step down
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So he's still CEO, just not chairman of the board. For a few years. So nothing will really change. And frankly I hope it doesn't. He's full nutbag crazy but he's pushing the industry above and beyond what they would have done by themselves. When the iPhone came out the feature phone was dead. Every major camera maker scrambled to make something that cool. When the Tesla came out suddenly the entire EV industry became cool and the horrid tiny Evs aimed at incredibly niche market of what appeared to be those who didn't actually like cars was replaced by a market of car enthusiasts who expected a car with a big "Ludicrous mode" button that could beat any car on the road. That's what Elon brings and I hope he keeps pushing.
cheers Chris Maunder
Chris Maunder wrote:
So nothing will really change.
I would like to think that he has at least learned the lesson.
M.D.V. ;) If something has a solution... Why do we have to worry about?. If it has no solution... For what reason do we have to worry about? Help me to understand what I'm saying, and I'll explain it better to you Rating helpful answers is nice, but saying thanks can be even nicer.
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So he's still CEO, just not chairman of the board. For a few years. So nothing will really change. And frankly I hope it doesn't. He's full nutbag crazy but he's pushing the industry above and beyond what they would have done by themselves. When the iPhone came out the feature phone was dead. Every major camera maker scrambled to make something that cool. When the Tesla came out suddenly the entire EV industry became cool and the horrid tiny Evs aimed at incredibly niche market of what appeared to be those who didn't actually like cars was replaced by a market of car enthusiasts who expected a car with a big "Ludicrous mode" button that could beat any car on the road. That's what Elon brings and I hope he keeps pushing.
cheers Chris Maunder
It's still a niche market. And will remain so for the foreseeable future. Reason being, they're still fucking expensive for anyone except rich people. Lithium batteries are a mature industrial product and the price for them isn't dropping anymore, except on some fanpages, so the cost of a full range battery pack will remain prohibitive for the majority of people. For reference, there used to be a pricetag for an exchange battery pack for the S85 on Teslas homepage of $46,000. It's since long gone, together with the $35,000 model E (you can find it on the wayback machine if you bother). Hybrid cars though, is a completely different question.
Wrong is evil and must be defeated. - Jeff Ello
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Seems to have got off very lightly for a pretty serious lapse of reason. Corporate regulators in other jurisdictions may have taken a much dimmer view.
Peter Wasser "The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts." - Bertrand Russell
Exactly - in a previous company I worked for that went public we were told a story of someone who was jailed simply for chatting with a friend over a beer about his company's future plans which led to the share price rising and his friend making money on the information. The head of finance told us that we should not mention anything about future plans of the company to anyone outside of the company as we too could risk going to jail. It does demonstrate that money buys influence, as I wonder what would have happened to one of his engineers if they had tweeted the same information.
“That which can be asserted without evidence, can be dismissed without evidence.”
― Christopher Hitchens
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So he's still CEO, just not chairman of the board. For a few years. So nothing will really change. And frankly I hope it doesn't. He's full nutbag crazy but he's pushing the industry above and beyond what they would have done by themselves. When the iPhone came out the feature phone was dead. Every major camera maker scrambled to make something that cool. When the Tesla came out suddenly the entire EV industry became cool and the horrid tiny Evs aimed at incredibly niche market of what appeared to be those who didn't actually like cars was replaced by a market of car enthusiasts who expected a car with a big "Ludicrous mode" button that could beat any car on the road. That's what Elon brings and I hope he keeps pushing.
cheers Chris Maunder
Chris Maunder wrote:
That's what Elon brings and I hope he keeps pushing.
What Elon brings is twitter-meltdowns and broken production-promises. I hope he keeps doing what he does best; prove he's an idiot :)
Bastard Programmer from Hell :suss: If you can't read my code, try converting it here[^] "If you just follow the bacon Eddy, wherever it leads you, then you won't have to think about politics." -- Some Bell.
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So he's still CEO, just not chairman of the board. For a few years. So nothing will really change. And frankly I hope it doesn't. He's full nutbag crazy but he's pushing the industry above and beyond what they would have done by themselves. When the iPhone came out the feature phone was dead. Every major camera maker scrambled to make something that cool. When the Tesla came out suddenly the entire EV industry became cool and the horrid tiny Evs aimed at incredibly niche market of what appeared to be those who didn't actually like cars was replaced by a market of car enthusiasts who expected a car with a big "Ludicrous mode" button that could beat any car on the road. That's what Elon brings and I hope he keeps pushing.
cheers Chris Maunder
Big cars, big roads, big parking lots. Sure he is a visionary. An interesting point of view from a dedicated cyclist. Big fibs also seem to be the way of the future, everyone is into it.
Peter Wasser "The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts." - Bertrand Russell
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Elon Musk forced to step down as chairman of Tesla, remains CEO - The Verge[^]:
Musk will have to step down as the chairman of Tesla within 45 days, and will not be able to take that role with the company again for three years. He will be able to remain Tesla’s CEO during that time.
We are all equal, but some are more equal than others.
M.D.V. ;) If something has a solution... Why do we have to worry about?. If it has no solution... For what reason do we have to worry about? Help me to understand what I'm saying, and I'll explain it better to you Rating helpful answers is nice, but saying thanks can be even nicer.
It was the evil AI that's out to get him.
"Never attribute to malice that which can be explained by stupidity." - Hanlon's Razor
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Big cars, big roads, big parking lots. Sure he is a visionary. An interesting point of view from a dedicated cyclist. Big fibs also seem to be the way of the future, everyone is into it.
Peter Wasser "The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts." - Bertrand Russell
You realise that Elon isn't actually about the cars?
cheers Chris Maunder
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It's still a niche market. And will remain so for the foreseeable future. Reason being, they're still fucking expensive for anyone except rich people. Lithium batteries are a mature industrial product and the price for them isn't dropping anymore, except on some fanpages, so the cost of a full range battery pack will remain prohibitive for the majority of people. For reference, there used to be a pricetag for an exchange battery pack for the S85 on Teslas homepage of $46,000. It's since long gone, together with the $35,000 model E (you can find it on the wayback machine if you bother). Hybrid cars though, is a completely different question.
Wrong is evil and must be defeated. - Jeff Ello
Lithium batteries are just a stepping stone, and an unsustainable one at that. There's better, safer, denser options coming.
cheers Chris Maunder
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Lithium batteries are just a stepping stone, and an unsustainable one at that. There's better, safer, denser options coming.
cheers Chris Maunder
Are there really? There are a lot in news, but then it goes quiet. There really aren't any better oxidizer-reducing agent pairs known that are practically usable in a car. At least not now. Well, there is the Sodium-Sulphur battery with roughly twice the energy content compared with Lithium-ion. It has the drawback of being extraordinarily corrosive, and it has a working temperature of 300C which is a teensy bit high. But I believe it could actually be quite useful in buses. The most expensive part is the casing, the rest of the components are dirt cheap. In short, to be practically useful, they need to work at room temperature, charge-discharge quite a bit more than 50 times and preferably not be explosive or overly poisonous. AND actually cheaper than Lithium-ion as well as having higher capacity. That's a tough combo to beat.
Wrong is evil and must be defeated. - Jeff Ello
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You realise that Elon isn't actually about the cars?
cheers Chris Maunder
I was responding to you lauding his creation of big powerful electric cars. He is both a visionary and a fascinating character. It seems the li battery in South Australia is set to be a success and if the economics allowed it I'd be keen to have a Powerwall. I hope he holds it together.
Peter Wasser "The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts." - Bertrand Russell
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I was responding to you lauding his creation of big powerful electric cars. He is both a visionary and a fascinating character. It seems the li battery in South Australia is set to be a success and if the economics allowed it I'd be keen to have a Powerwall. I hope he holds it together.
Peter Wasser "The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts." - Bertrand Russell
his cars are great (except a bit cheap and rattly inside) but it's more his pushing the market to be better that I admire. In this world of design by committee we need people willing to take the risks he's taking. Don't get me wrong - he's full nutbag - but I admire his bravery and foolishness in equal amounts.
cheers Chris Maunder
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Are there really? There are a lot in news, but then it goes quiet. There really aren't any better oxidizer-reducing agent pairs known that are practically usable in a car. At least not now. Well, there is the Sodium-Sulphur battery with roughly twice the energy content compared with Lithium-ion. It has the drawback of being extraordinarily corrosive, and it has a working temperature of 300C which is a teensy bit high. But I believe it could actually be quite useful in buses. The most expensive part is the casing, the rest of the components are dirt cheap. In short, to be practically useful, they need to work at room temperature, charge-discharge quite a bit more than 50 times and preferably not be explosive or overly poisonous. AND actually cheaper than Lithium-ion as well as having higher capacity. That's a tough combo to beat.
Wrong is evil and must be defeated. - Jeff Ello
That's nothing that a pair of oven mitts and a bit of aluminium foil can't fix! (but yeah, I'm definitely hoping sodium ion work out. They can all the salt they want from Toronto's roads 6 months of the year)
cheers Chris Maunder
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That's nothing that a pair of oven mitts and a bit of aluminium foil can't fix! (but yeah, I'm definitely hoping sodium ion work out. They can all the salt they want from Toronto's roads 6 months of the year)
cheers Chris Maunder
The problem with all SodiumIon batteries so far is that they don't cycle more than fifty times. This seems to be a hard problem to overcome, apparently it's to do with the size of the sodiumion. They are larger and like to stay where they are. The other problem is that they have roughly half the capacity to the LiCoO2
Wrong is evil and must be defeated. - Jeff Ello
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Elon Musk forced to step down as chairman of Tesla, remains CEO - The Verge[^]:
Musk will have to step down as the chairman of Tesla within 45 days, and will not be able to take that role with the company again for three years. He will be able to remain Tesla’s CEO during that time.
We are all equal, but some are more equal than others.
M.D.V. ;) If something has a solution... Why do we have to worry about?. If it has no solution... For what reason do we have to worry about? Help me to understand what I'm saying, and I'll explain it better to you Rating helpful answers is nice, but saying thanks can be even nicer.
Good riddance to bad rubbish!
.dan.g. AbstractSpoon Software email: abstractspoon(dot)todolist(at)gmail(dot)com
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So he's still CEO, just not chairman of the board. For a few years. So nothing will really change. And frankly I hope it doesn't. He's full nutbag crazy but he's pushing the industry above and beyond what they would have done by themselves. When the iPhone came out the feature phone was dead. Every major camera maker scrambled to make something that cool. When the Tesla came out suddenly the entire EV industry became cool and the horrid tiny Evs aimed at incredibly niche market of what appeared to be those who didn't actually like cars was replaced by a market of car enthusiasts who expected a car with a big "Ludicrous mode" button that could beat any car on the road. That's what Elon brings and I hope he keeps pushing.
cheers Chris Maunder
Chris Maunder wrote:
And frankly I hope it doesn't. He's full nutbag crazy but he's pushing the industry above and beyond what they would have done by themselves.
Agreed. While I appreciate Gates, Buffet, Zuckerberg, etc... spending their spare billions fighting malaria and AIDS - I like to see the occasional super-rich entrepreneur push the envelope. Between Tesla, SpaceX and the Boring Company Musk is changing the future.
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I was responding to you lauding his creation of big powerful electric cars. He is both a visionary and a fascinating character. It seems the li battery in South Australia is set to be a success and if the economics allowed it I'd be keen to have a Powerwall. I hope he holds it together.
Peter Wasser "The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts." - Bertrand Russell
pwasser wrote:
. It seems the li battery in South Australia is set to be a success
It's off to a very promising start; but is making most of it's money from frequency response services not as long term storage. Frequency response is tweaking the amount of power put on the grid very rapidly to keep it equal to what's being demanded by users. When the two get out of sync the giant turbines that conventional power plants use speed up/slow down slightly like the giant fly wheels that they are and the frequency of the AC they produce shifts away from its nominal 50 or 60hz. This is very much the lowest hanging fruit for grid scale batteries because they can respond in a fraction of a second, while the fast ramping gas turbines that have traditionally been used need a few seconds to change speed and need to be kept idling to handle spikes (consuming some fuel well below their optimum fuel efficiency point and putting wear on their mechanical parts continuously). We're still a long way off from big batteries being competitive in regular large charge/discharge cycles except in places where power is stupidly expensive for some reason. (Eg small islands because everything is more expensive shipped on smaller boats.) *shrug* It's still very early days for grid scale storage though; we're not far from when wind/solar were only economical if you'd be looking at otherwise spending a small
largefortune to run wires to connect to the grid as an alternative. And if the 10%/year battery tech is providing is much less exciting than the 100% every 18 months that Moore's law gave we're not at the wall for exponential growth yet either.Did you ever see history portrayed as an old man with a wise brow and pulseless heart, weighing all things in the balance of reason? Is not rather the genius of history like an eternal, imploring maiden, full of fire, with a burning heart and flaming soul, humanly warm and humanly beautiful? --Zachris Topelius Training a telescope on one’s own belly button will only reveal lint. You like that? You go right on staring at it. I prefer looking at galaxies. -- Sarah Hoyt
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pwasser wrote:
. It seems the li battery in South Australia is set to be a success
It's off to a very promising start; but is making most of it's money from frequency response services not as long term storage. Frequency response is tweaking the amount of power put on the grid very rapidly to keep it equal to what's being demanded by users. When the two get out of sync the giant turbines that conventional power plants use speed up/slow down slightly like the giant fly wheels that they are and the frequency of the AC they produce shifts away from its nominal 50 or 60hz. This is very much the lowest hanging fruit for grid scale batteries because they can respond in a fraction of a second, while the fast ramping gas turbines that have traditionally been used need a few seconds to change speed and need to be kept idling to handle spikes (consuming some fuel well below their optimum fuel efficiency point and putting wear on their mechanical parts continuously). We're still a long way off from big batteries being competitive in regular large charge/discharge cycles except in places where power is stupidly expensive for some reason. (Eg small islands because everything is more expensive shipped on smaller boats.) *shrug* It's still very early days for grid scale storage though; we're not far from when wind/solar were only economical if you'd be looking at otherwise spending a small
largefortune to run wires to connect to the grid as an alternative. And if the 10%/year battery tech is providing is much less exciting than the 100% every 18 months that Moore's law gave we're not at the wall for exponential growth yet either.Did you ever see history portrayed as an old man with a wise brow and pulseless heart, weighing all things in the balance of reason? Is not rather the genius of history like an eternal, imploring maiden, full of fire, with a burning heart and flaming soul, humanly warm and humanly beautiful? --Zachris Topelius Training a telescope on one’s own belly button will only reveal lint. You like that? You go right on staring at it. I prefer looking at galaxies. -- Sarah Hoyt
You are correct in all you say however the incident that triggered the building of this battery was a complete loss of the grid not just frequency fluctuations. This was due to part being taken out by lightning and the rest overloading to the degree that the overload cutouts on interstate feeders tripped. It then took a long time to bring the grid back up. The battery has already (apparently) aided in preventing a recurrence of a similar event in a very cost effective way. It provides additional short term base load capacity that can be switched in very quickly.
Peter Wasser "The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts." - Bertrand Russell
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Elon Musk forced to step down as chairman of Tesla, remains CEO - The Verge[^]:
Musk will have to step down as the chairman of Tesla within 45 days, and will not be able to take that role with the company again for three years. He will be able to remain Tesla’s CEO during that time.
We are all equal, but some are more equal than others.
M.D.V. ;) If something has a solution... Why do we have to worry about?. If it has no solution... For what reason do we have to worry about? Help me to understand what I'm saying, and I'll explain it better to you Rating helpful answers is nice, but saying thanks can be even nicer.
The SEC is taking credit that he is the founder and mastermind of Tesla. Elon Musk has communicated yesterday that the SEC is the "Shortseller Enrichment Commission". I guess that this will have severe consequences. It is reckless to gamble with the future of Tesla. :mad:
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