Self employed question about multiple contracts
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Quote:
change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, navigate a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly
I've done all of those except butchering the hog, writing the sonnet and dying gallantly (except in a game, does that count?). I am not, to the best of my knowledge, an insect.
- I would love to change the world, but they won’t give me the source code.
Well writing a sonnet shouldn't be too difficult to tick of the list... so that only leaves dying gallantly while butchering a hog. Personally I only ever eat meat where the butcher also died in the process. It makes me feel happy knowing there is a certain balance being preserved.
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Pick one. Trying to juggle two 4 hour days is less easy than it sounds. And you are more likely to end up with two dissatisfied customers.
Yeah, that is the one I am leaning toward. Plus, as the next reply says, 12 or more hours a day really drags on you.
A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, navigate a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects! - Lazarus Long
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Okay, after 'retiring',I started doing the odd 1099 contract on the side. It has done a fairly good job of giving me enough slush to take a few trips, buy some nice things (new house!), etc. However (always have one of those, right?) I am now in a position of taking on two contracts, both of which want 8 hours a day. Both are interesting and in areas I have not done much in (one in simulation/animation and the other is e-finance). Any thoughts or experiences about juggling two 8 hour/day contracts? Pick one Negotiate 4 hours per with longer delivery
A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, navigate a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects! - Lazarus Long
Agree with "Pick One." what happens when they both hit something bad and demand your immediate on-site presence to fix it? Even if that doesn't happen you'll find yourself easily burning 8 hours per day on both.
stoneyowl2 wrote:
Okay, after 'retiring'...
Clearly you already understand "retiring" is not 'stopping work.' but it is YOU: choosing if you want to work [incl. on any given day, week, month, ever] ... 1 'master' you compromise that somewhat, 2 'masters' you'll likely loose that completely. So I would go even further to say: Pick One and negotiate longer delivery ... pick the one that is most comfortable [for your 'retirement']. (of course you want to be paid but you also imply you're far from hurting for money, so why overextend yourself? you've earned your retirement, go and enjoy it with things that matter a lot more, remember retirement isn't forever either.)
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Okay, after 'retiring',I started doing the odd 1099 contract on the side. It has done a fairly good job of giving me enough slush to take a few trips, buy some nice things (new house!), etc. However (always have one of those, right?) I am now in a position of taking on two contracts, both of which want 8 hours a day. Both are interesting and in areas I have not done much in (one in simulation/animation and the other is e-finance). Any thoughts or experiences about juggling two 8 hour/day contracts? Pick one Negotiate 4 hours per with longer delivery
A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, navigate a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects! - Lazarus Long
stoneyowl2 wrote:
Any thoughts or experiences about juggling two 8 hour/day contracts?
Triple your rates, hire 2 full-time devs, and go into management. ;)
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Well writing a sonnet shouldn't be too difficult to tick of the list... so that only leaves dying gallantly while butchering a hog. Personally I only ever eat meat where the butcher also died in the process. It makes me feel happy knowing there is a certain balance being preserved.
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Okay, after 'retiring',I started doing the odd 1099 contract on the side. It has done a fairly good job of giving me enough slush to take a few trips, buy some nice things (new house!), etc. However (always have one of those, right?) I am now in a position of taking on two contracts, both of which want 8 hours a day. Both are interesting and in areas I have not done much in (one in simulation/animation and the other is e-finance). Any thoughts or experiences about juggling two 8 hour/day contracts? Pick one Negotiate 4 hours per with longer delivery
A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, navigate a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects! - Lazarus Long
Pick neither. But seriously, unless you're onsite, how are they doing to know? In short, I find it a pointless/unenforceable stipulation, so either ignore it or refuse.
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Pick one. Trying to juggle two 4 hour days is less easy than it sounds. And you are more likely to end up with two dissatisfied customers.
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Okay, after 'retiring',I started doing the odd 1099 contract on the side. It has done a fairly good job of giving me enough slush to take a few trips, buy some nice things (new house!), etc. However (always have one of those, right?) I am now in a position of taking on two contracts, both of which want 8 hours a day. Both are interesting and in areas I have not done much in (one in simulation/animation and the other is e-finance). Any thoughts or experiences about juggling two 8 hour/day contracts? Pick one Negotiate 4 hours per with longer delivery
A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, navigate a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects! - Lazarus Long
Be very careful. :) Over the past 20 years I have done something like what you are contemplating. In general, I have had one main customer and the occasional side gig. I have always picked up the side gig with good intentions, usually when things are slow at the main client. Every single elephanting time I commit to a side gig, the main customer goes bat $hit crazy with work they are willing to pay for. Every time... What you are contemplating is two main customers. And if you are any good, they are going to get excited and want more. And they are going to be greedy with your time. It sounds like you don't really have to work, so be upfront with them.
Charlie Gilley <italic>Stuck in a dysfunctional matrix from which I must escape... "Where liberty dwells, there is my country." B. Franklin, 1783 “They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.” BF, 1759
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stoneyowl2 wrote:
Any thoughts or experiences about juggling two 8 hour/day contracts?
Triple your rates, hire 2 full-time devs, and go into management. ;)
Latest Articles:
Client-Side TypeScript without ASP.NET, Angular, etc.2 full-time devs from Asia. Profit!
[Signature space for sale]
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Okay, after 'retiring',I started doing the odd 1099 contract on the side. It has done a fairly good job of giving me enough slush to take a few trips, buy some nice things (new house!), etc. However (always have one of those, right?) I am now in a position of taking on two contracts, both of which want 8 hours a day. Both are interesting and in areas I have not done much in (one in simulation/animation and the other is e-finance). Any thoughts or experiences about juggling two 8 hour/day contracts? Pick one Negotiate 4 hours per with longer delivery
A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, navigate a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects! - Lazarus Long
I'm an FTE and have a side gig, working 5-10 hours/week for a small company doing testing, documentation, and writing. I have the side job mostly for fun as it's quite different from my day job. My primary job comes first -- the side gig understands that. However, when there are deadlines the side gig gets nervous and I work longer hours than I want. Nothing really bad so far, but it's something I think about. With 2 contracts? A corollary to Murphy's Law says things will get "interesting" at both at the same time, and it will suck for you. I'm with the majority that says "pick one".
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Okay, after 'retiring',I started doing the odd 1099 contract on the side. It has done a fairly good job of giving me enough slush to take a few trips, buy some nice things (new house!), etc. However (always have one of those, right?) I am now in a position of taking on two contracts, both of which want 8 hours a day. Both are interesting and in areas I have not done much in (one in simulation/animation and the other is e-finance). Any thoughts or experiences about juggling two 8 hour/day contracts? Pick one Negotiate 4 hours per with longer delivery
A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, navigate a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects! - Lazarus Long
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Okay, after 'retiring',I started doing the odd 1099 contract on the side. It has done a fairly good job of giving me enough slush to take a few trips, buy some nice things (new house!), etc. However (always have one of those, right?) I am now in a position of taking on two contracts, both of which want 8 hours a day. Both are interesting and in areas I have not done much in (one in simulation/animation and the other is e-finance). Any thoughts or experiences about juggling two 8 hour/day contracts? Pick one Negotiate 4 hours per with longer delivery
A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, navigate a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects! - Lazarus Long
I had this situation recently — between March and last Friday (10/18). Here are some things to consider from my experience. First, the money was very good. So good, it unexpectedly pushed me into a higher tax bracket. As you are 1099, you may have a little more control over how you recognize revenue, offset revenue with expenses, and take distributions. I was a W-2 for both of these gigs, so I had to adjust withholdings and found I may need to marry my partner a few months early so that he can shoulder some of the gains. Please don’t ignore your tax situation and plan for this extra income. Second, I had to let one of these projects “go” in the end. The work was excruciating and both projects were adversely affected by my inability to focus completely on one or the other. Both projects were in a nonstop state of crisis, which is why they both needed me in the first place — I am good at solving problems and mitigating crisis. But the personal toll on me was not small, and I have a sour attitude toward software projects now that I’m sure will take a few months to overcome. If you can truly contain the two projects to their 8-hour slots and are willing to put up with 16-hours a day to address them fairly, you are in a position I was not in. But I didn’t make a commitment to 16 hour days 5 days a week — I made a commitment to deliverables, and as those deliverable requirements and schedules kept shifting, it became very difficult to plan and keep things compartmentalized. I dumped one project that I could have saved if I hadn’t been working on two projects and picked the one that had the nicer people associated with it to focus on. I don’t think I’d allow myself to be put in this situation again, but I realize consultants juggle multiple clients’ projects all the time. They probably don’t get as involved as I do, or work more rigidly to a limited scope. If you don’t have the means to enforce scope (or bill according to changes in scope) you should probably pass on taking more work.
Joe T
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Take the more interesting of the two, negotiate 4 hrs per day and take some walks in the woods.
Over the past 25 years of consulting I've had many opportunities to do exactly this, take on multiple contracts at the same time. Unless you can dovetail the projects together you will end up working very long days and more than 5 days a week. One big thing that stands out as a red flag is you comment that you didn't have experience in either of the two fields. That means you may have a steep learning curve and spending a lot more time just getting up to speed on the new technology than you think. The things you don't know can really hurt you. Also on projects like that most people tend to underestimate the effort. My advise, pick the one that is the most attractive (scope or money) and then try to delay the second one for several months while you get the first one moving. Once the first project is well underway it's easier to pick up a second project. Obviously this assumes that you spend very little time at the clients location to do the task. Good luck, but two consulting jobs does not sound like "retirement".
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Quote:
change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, navigate a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly
I've done all of those except butchering the hog, writing the sonnet and dying gallantly (except in a game, does that count?). I am not, to the best of my knowledge, an insect.
- I would love to change the world, but they won’t give me the source code.
I believe this is a quote from a "Lazarus Long" book by Robert Heinlein. Is this correct?
I am a big SF fan too!
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Okay, after 'retiring',I started doing the odd 1099 contract on the side. It has done a fairly good job of giving me enough slush to take a few trips, buy some nice things (new house!), etc. However (always have one of those, right?) I am now in a position of taking on two contracts, both of which want 8 hours a day. Both are interesting and in areas I have not done much in (one in simulation/animation and the other is e-finance). Any thoughts or experiences about juggling two 8 hour/day contracts? Pick one Negotiate 4 hours per with longer delivery
A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, navigate a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects! - Lazarus Long
I've been in the same position a few times. Unless the parties want to "share" you may be stuck. I've managed to arrange "sharing" twice - both times worked out OK. You didn't mention how long these contracts run - three months, year, forever? That makes a difference. Try to negotiate part time with both. If not possible pick one and let the other go. You may find the one you let go comes back around if you finish the first quickly enough.
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Okay, after 'retiring',I started doing the odd 1099 contract on the side. It has done a fairly good job of giving me enough slush to take a few trips, buy some nice things (new house!), etc. However (always have one of those, right?) I am now in a position of taking on two contracts, both of which want 8 hours a day. Both are interesting and in areas I have not done much in (one in simulation/animation and the other is e-finance). Any thoughts or experiences about juggling two 8 hour/day contracts? Pick one Negotiate 4 hours per with longer delivery
A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, navigate a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects! - Lazarus Long
If the money is good, try to get them to agree to 3 - 10 hour days per week each. M-W at one and TH - Sat with the other. You might push it to 12 hour days. I'd check with your spouse/significant other first and get their approval. This doesn't sound like much of a "retirement" to me.
I'm going to work till I drop.
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Over the past 25 years of consulting I've had many opportunities to do exactly this, take on multiple contracts at the same time. Unless you can dovetail the projects together you will end up working very long days and more than 5 days a week. One big thing that stands out as a red flag is you comment that you didn't have experience in either of the two fields. That means you may have a steep learning curve and spending a lot more time just getting up to speed on the new technology than you think. The things you don't know can really hurt you. Also on projects like that most people tend to underestimate the effort. My advise, pick the one that is the most attractive (scope or money) and then try to delay the second one for several months while you get the first one moving. Once the first project is well underway it's easier to pick up a second project. Obviously this assumes that you spend very little time at the clients location to do the task. Good luck, but two consulting jobs does not sound like "retirement".
TWMitchell wrote:
pick the one that is the most attractive (scope or money) and then try to delay the second one for several months while you get the first one moving. Once the first project is well underway it's easier to pick up a second project.
I like this idea. Or, take both but just manage an overseas developer on one. Assuming you want to get your hands dirty on one of them. ;)
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If the money is good, try to get them to agree to 3 - 10 hour days per week each. M-W at one and TH - Sat with the other. You might push it to 12 hour days. I'd check with your spouse/significant other first and get their approval. This doesn't sound like much of a "retirement" to me.
I'm going to work till I drop.
Bad idea, even if you're not in "retirement". That way lies burnout, and dissatisfied customers. Building a reputation for good work take years, but it can be destroyed by one substandard project.
Freedom is the freedom to say that two plus two make four. If that is granted, all else follows. -- 6079 Smith W.
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Okay, after 'retiring',I started doing the odd 1099 contract on the side. It has done a fairly good job of giving me enough slush to take a few trips, buy some nice things (new house!), etc. However (always have one of those, right?) I am now in a position of taking on two contracts, both of which want 8 hours a day. Both are interesting and in areas I have not done much in (one in simulation/animation and the other is e-finance). Any thoughts or experiences about juggling two 8 hour/day contracts? Pick one Negotiate 4 hours per with longer delivery
A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, navigate a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects! - Lazarus Long
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I believe this is a quote from a "Lazarus Long" book by Robert Heinlein. Is this correct?
I am a big SF fan too!