repair or replace?
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I was planning on replacing the unit last summer, but prices and availability made me hang on. I fear it's the MB, not the RAM, so replacing the unit is probably my best choice.
BryanFazekas wrote:
I was planning on replacing the unit last summer, but prices and availability made me hang on.
Same here :D
GCS d--(d-) s-/++ a C++++ U+++ P- L+@ E-- W++ N+ o+ K- w+++ O? M-- V? PS+ PE- Y+ PGP t+ 5? X R+++ tv-- b+(+++) DI+++ D++ G e++ h--- r+++ y+++* Weapons extension: ma- k++ F+2 X
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TBH, given it's a desktop not a laptop, and you're clearly happy inside the case, I'd have thought it a no-brainer - check the RAM before even posting here. Open it up, swap the RAM cards and if it works, fine; probably one of the cards worked it's way out. If it's still at 4Gb you know its the RAM. If there's no readable memory it's the RAM and the motherboard! Nothing lost other than under 2 minutes.
I had (notice past tense) a pc that was quite few years old. Upgraded to ssd, more memory but it was rather slow and would get these hangs where ssd would go 100% for a minute. I was reluctant to spend the money for a possible faster pc. My son has a rather new gaming pc. It is very fast. So I took my boot drive put it in his and booted. The difference was more than night and day! So I spent 800 or so for new parts (used pcpartpicker; he had an older graphics card (radeon r290?) so saved on that). It has been the best thing I did.
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If you are going to replace I can recommend importing an AMD Ryzen 4750G from South Korea. This CPU includes a good built in GPU, as GPUs are hard to come by right now. I found some at this eBay store https://www.ebay.com/str/beyondtheworld
I'm researching to determine if buying a CPU with a built-in GPU will work. I play Skyrim and it requires a good GPU.
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Personally I buy most of my PC components from Amazon. Their prices are pretty much what you find everywhere else and if you have Prime they are often a little cheaper when you factor in p&p. Their great advantage is that if any component goes wrong you generally have a no-questions-asked guarantee and quick turnaround. Yesterday I mistakenly tried to return a laptop battery under 12 months guarantee a year too late (Damn you COVID, I've lost a year!) - their agent said he would try it anyway and it went through! The OP hasn't said what his MB, CPU are and if his OS HDD is mechanical or SSD. I recently upgraded the Memsahib's i3 to an i7 2700K with a processor found on ebay for 70€ and the difference is quite notable.
So old that I did my first coding in octal via switches on a DEC PDP 8
My current CPU is an AMD FX-4130 ... yeah, it's that old, but it handles all my needs well. I'm planning to stick with AMD, as I've had great success with them since the late 90's. I was considering the 5600X, but am also considering a 5700G, as the price difference is $30 and the onboard graphics may solve the GPU problem. The difficulty is that I need graphics sufficient to support Skyrim and The Witcher, and built-in GPU may not do it. My current GPU card works, and I can continue to use it until supplies open up. I have 3 SSDs in the box: OS, files, and hot-backup. When I want a quick backup of things, I copy to the 3rd SSD and may later move to offline storage. I have a stack of WD Black HD that I use with an external caddy for more permanent backups, along with an WE external HD and a couple of portable HD. I'm also a dinosaur who still burns DVDs ... which are ransomware proof once finalized. Overall, I'm balancing cost with stability -- I'm looking to spend the least I can while ensuring that I have a system that will work for at least 5 years. A cutting edge CPU is too expensive, while old tech is superseded too quickly. Research, research, research ...
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Yeah, I'm concerned that I'm throwing money away on RAM, even if the problem is not the MB. As I said in other replies, I've been planning. This may force the issue, which is not necessarily a bad thing as long as I do it before it dies completely. I considered installing W11 on a new one, but am going to stick with W10 for now. I don't need additional, unnecessary hassles! :laugh:
I have old Laptop RAM floating around... You might look around for used. Someone probably has some shelved (welcome to 2022)! FWIW, Once a machine hits 2yrs, I try to buy an off-lease cold spare. My previous cold spare is sitting on the shelf. I am close to getting one. I've been taken down HARD before. I fresh install is about 80hrs of my time. [Supporting Software from 25+ years ago]. Moved to VMs, so it might be down to 40hrs. Eventually, I guess my Dev machine(s) will be in the Cloud, and I will just remote into them. Why do I picture an X-Windows Like World?
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My current CPU is an AMD FX-4130 ... yeah, it's that old, but it handles all my needs well. I'm planning to stick with AMD, as I've had great success with them since the late 90's. I was considering the 5600X, but am also considering a 5700G, as the price difference is $30 and the onboard graphics may solve the GPU problem. The difficulty is that I need graphics sufficient to support Skyrim and The Witcher, and built-in GPU may not do it. My current GPU card works, and I can continue to use it until supplies open up. I have 3 SSDs in the box: OS, files, and hot-backup. When I want a quick backup of things, I copy to the 3rd SSD and may later move to offline storage. I have a stack of WD Black HD that I use with an external caddy for more permanent backups, along with an WE external HD and a couple of portable HD. I'm also a dinosaur who still burns DVDs ... which are ransomware proof once finalized. Overall, I'm balancing cost with stability -- I'm looking to spend the least I can while ensuring that I have a system that will work for at least 5 years. A cutting edge CPU is too expensive, while old tech is superseded too quickly. Research, research, research ...
BryanFazekas wrote:
My current CPU is an AMD FX-4130 ... yeah, it's that old, but it handles all my needs well
Horses for courses! That cpu has a cpumark of 2712 and you are looking at cpus that are 7 to 8 times faster. You could maybe save quite a bit by aiming lower for the cpu with a later upgrade in mind. You would still feel a significant performance boost aided by DDR4 ram etc. Have a look at this "bang for buck" chart [^]and see if you can find a sweet spot. Then look at MBs and find one that should be future proof for cpu upgrade. Good luck with your project!
So old that I did my first coding in octal via switches on a DEC PDP 8
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I've dealt with Newegg for years and been very satisfied. Computer Parts, PC Components, Laptops, Gaming Systems, Automotive Parts, and more - Newegg.com[^]
The less you need, the more you have. Even a blind squirrel gets a nut...occasionally. JaxCoder.com
Newegg has a policy of replace, not refund. I once ordered a computer kit from them, in which I had to install the CPU chip myself. The motherboard was bad, it was a design problem that could not be fixed simply by replacing it with another of the same. I forget what the problem was, but had something to do with incompatibility with the CPU. Since they would not refund, I spent several hours with their tech support, who even sent me a new CPU chip to try out. I eventually gave up, tossed the whole thing as a loss, and bought a new burned in computer elsewhere. Therefore, I no longer buy from Newegg except for commodity parts that are a good deal.
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My 8 yo desktop is currently running on half RAM -- one of the 4 GB sticks is not registering. I will crack the case, clean the contacts, and re-seat it to see if that fixes it. If that fixes the problem, I'll continue limping along with it. The PC runs fine, although it's obviously long in the tooth. I have looked into replacing it, but prices and availability have kept the old tiger running. If it doesn't fix it? I can get a pair of 4 GB DDR3 (yes, this PC is that old!) for $46 USD. Any suggestions on where to look for components? I build my own and haven't been pleased with what I've seen at the common vendors. Thanks!
I like to use https://pcpartpicker.com/[^] They will show who has the lowest price. I have ordered from most of the recommended sources like Amazon, Walmart, New Egg, etc. I really like the compatibility feature. Helped me avoid a few mistakes. Also, it's a bad few years to build a new PC. I did it though and don't regret it. The better machine was worth a few extra hundred bucks. Don't look back!
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My 8 yo desktop is currently running on half RAM -- one of the 4 GB sticks is not registering. I will crack the case, clean the contacts, and re-seat it to see if that fixes it. If that fixes the problem, I'll continue limping along with it. The PC runs fine, although it's obviously long in the tooth. I have looked into replacing it, but prices and availability have kept the old tiger running. If it doesn't fix it? I can get a pair of 4 GB DDR3 (yes, this PC is that old!) for $46 USD. Any suggestions on where to look for components? I build my own and haven't been pleased with what I've seen at the common vendors. Thanks!
If you have a Microcenter close by, that's my go-to place for components. I like just going in and wandering around. Shelves on shelves of components. Sometimes I get new ideas for things I didn't even know existed. You said your GPU is only 3 years old. You didn't say what it was but you're probably not going to get anything better for cheap, these days. If you use the on-board GPU on the CPU, you'll be sharing some of your memory with the GPU, so you'll probably need more memory. You ought to consider whether you want a CPU that's compatible with Windows 11. If you're going to keep this machine for a while, you may be wanting to upgrade.
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My 8 yo desktop is currently running on half RAM -- one of the 4 GB sticks is not registering. I will crack the case, clean the contacts, and re-seat it to see if that fixes it. If that fixes the problem, I'll continue limping along with it. The PC runs fine, although it's obviously long in the tooth. I have looked into replacing it, but prices and availability have kept the old tiger running. If it doesn't fix it? I can get a pair of 4 GB DDR3 (yes, this PC is that old!) for $46 USD. Any suggestions on where to look for components? I build my own and haven't been pleased with what I've seen at the common vendors. Thanks!
That happen to my Dell T3600 Workstation after about 7 years. I have 32 gigs of Ram and 16 disappeared. It turned out to be the board and not the RAM. I was bummed. But RAM is pretty tough, never really had a RAM stick go bad on me. Mostly just incompatible RAM not working right because I bought it from Frys. But that was last century. Found a replacement board on EBay for $50. Now all 32 Gigs work. But I had to software license everything again, and that finally got me in trouble with the BSA about a month later. I'm still using this rig, been 10 years now I think. Took me a few of months to settle with the BSA. My new Rig that I ordered from Dell Nov 15, 2021 shows up today. Bought a new Dell 5820 with a 10 core Xeon and RX A400 card. NVMe boot drive. Just bought a 2nd Flex Chassis for M.2 and another SSD SATA drive for long storage, plus new Microsoft/Adobe software license keys. It's the most I ever paid for a computer. Also bought a new EOS R6 Camera and RF 24-70 lens for my product photos and new 4K videos to advertise with. The case for replace is to beat inflation, hindered by supply chain shortages. Add on boosted productivity and extra power to pursue more complex stuff like AI, or mess with crypto currencies. The case for repair, well not much of a case, except for perhaps saving money, but maybe open a can of works with software licensing if you have to replace the board. Having old slow ports like old USB. Up to you really. For me it's the year to up my game with modern hardware to match or exceed my skill level. So far all the new stuff I have purchased over the last 2 years has paid off huge for me with big ROI! If you see the potential go for it and buy new stuff.
If it ain't broke don't fix it Discover my world at jkirkerx.com
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If you have a Microcenter close by, that's my go-to place for components. I like just going in and wandering around. Shelves on shelves of components. Sometimes I get new ideas for things I didn't even know existed. You said your GPU is only 3 years old. You didn't say what it was but you're probably not going to get anything better for cheap, these days. If you use the on-board GPU on the CPU, you'll be sharing some of your memory with the GPU, so you'll probably need more memory. You ought to consider whether you want a CPU that's compatible with Windows 11. If you're going to keep this machine for a while, you may be wanting to upgrade.
I had not heard of Microcenter, but none is any where near me. My old GPU is a GeForce NTX 1080 ti, which was $350 USD four years ago (it's older than I thought), and now retails for $500. It's working well enough for me now, so I'm sticking with it. At some point I'll replace it, when the price is right, or when this one craps out. The CPU I ordered (Ryzen 5600X) is supported by Win11. I'll upgrade at some point, but am in no hurry to do so. Officially Win10 support ends in a bit over 3.5 years, but we'll see how that goes. MS pushed hard to get everyone off 7 and 8, and onto 10. Raising the HW bar for 11 has me wondering if MS will keep that schedule, or if they'll knuckle under to corporate IT dept that are not meeting that schedule. That said, it's not a good idea for anyone in the Windows world to buy a CPU that is not supported by Win11.
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That happen to my Dell T3600 Workstation after about 7 years. I have 32 gigs of Ram and 16 disappeared. It turned out to be the board and not the RAM. I was bummed. But RAM is pretty tough, never really had a RAM stick go bad on me. Mostly just incompatible RAM not working right because I bought it from Frys. But that was last century. Found a replacement board on EBay for $50. Now all 32 Gigs work. But I had to software license everything again, and that finally got me in trouble with the BSA about a month later. I'm still using this rig, been 10 years now I think. Took me a few of months to settle with the BSA. My new Rig that I ordered from Dell Nov 15, 2021 shows up today. Bought a new Dell 5820 with a 10 core Xeon and RX A400 card. NVMe boot drive. Just bought a 2nd Flex Chassis for M.2 and another SSD SATA drive for long storage, plus new Microsoft/Adobe software license keys. It's the most I ever paid for a computer. Also bought a new EOS R6 Camera and RF 24-70 lens for my product photos and new 4K videos to advertise with. The case for replace is to beat inflation, hindered by supply chain shortages. Add on boosted productivity and extra power to pursue more complex stuff like AI, or mess with crypto currencies. The case for repair, well not much of a case, except for perhaps saving money, but maybe open a can of works with software licensing if you have to replace the board. Having old slow ports like old USB. Up to you really. For me it's the year to up my game with modern hardware to match or exceed my skill level. So far all the new stuff I have purchased over the last 2 years has paid off huge for me with big ROI! If you see the potential go for it and buy new stuff.
If it ain't broke don't fix it Discover my world at jkirkerx.com
Given that my CPU, MB, and RAM are 8 yo, once I thought it through, repair was nothing within my personal risk tolerance. While a MB failure would cost me no data, the desktop would be down until I got a replacement in, which could take weeks. Since I know I have a HW failure, it makes the most sense to replace it. I considered an M2 drive, but the prices are high enough at this point that I went with a standard SSD. I replace the HD every 2 years or so -- we'll see what the market looks like in 2 years. Current cost was reduced by keeping the case and the GPU. It's most likely I'll replace the case first, as it's the cheapest component. The new MB I ordered supports USB 3.2, so I'll need a case with a connector on the front. Which reminds me -- I need to check which fan sizes my current case needs. Despite periodic cleaning, the case fans are looking rough and have gotten louder. If I'm tearing everything apart, it makes sense to replace the fans.
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Given that my CPU, MB, and RAM are 8 yo, once I thought it through, repair was nothing within my personal risk tolerance. While a MB failure would cost me no data, the desktop would be down until I got a replacement in, which could take weeks. Since I know I have a HW failure, it makes the most sense to replace it. I considered an M2 drive, but the prices are high enough at this point that I went with a standard SSD. I replace the HD every 2 years or so -- we'll see what the market looks like in 2 years. Current cost was reduced by keeping the case and the GPU. It's most likely I'll replace the case first, as it's the cheapest component. The new MB I ordered supports USB 3.2, so I'll need a case with a connector on the front. Which reminds me -- I need to check which fan sizes my current case needs. Despite periodic cleaning, the case fans are looking rough and have gotten louder. If I'm tearing everything apart, it makes sense to replace the fans.
That sounds like a good plan. I think you made the right move.
If it ain't broke don't fix it Discover my world at jkirkerx.com
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My 8 yo desktop is currently running on half RAM -- one of the 4 GB sticks is not registering. I will crack the case, clean the contacts, and re-seat it to see if that fixes it. If that fixes the problem, I'll continue limping along with it. The PC runs fine, although it's obviously long in the tooth. I have looked into replacing it, but prices and availability have kept the old tiger running. If it doesn't fix it? I can get a pair of 4 GB DDR3 (yes, this PC is that old!) for $46 USD. Any suggestions on where to look for components? I build my own and haven't been pleased with what I've seen at the common vendors. Thanks!
Yes RAM reseating often works. You haven't mention the first most important thing and that is what do you use it for and neither the second thing what are the specifications - make, model, motherboard, CPU, RAM speed, etc. oh and what operating system? Replacing the hard drive with an SSD always speeds up the older computers.
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I had not heard of Microcenter, but none is any where near me. My old GPU is a GeForce NTX 1080 ti, which was $350 USD four years ago (it's older than I thought), and now retails for $500. It's working well enough for me now, so I'm sticking with it. At some point I'll replace it, when the price is right, or when this one craps out. The CPU I ordered (Ryzen 5600X) is supported by Win11. I'll upgrade at some point, but am in no hurry to do so. Officially Win10 support ends in a bit over 3.5 years, but we'll see how that goes. MS pushed hard to get everyone off 7 and 8, and onto 10. Raising the HW bar for 11 has me wondering if MS will keep that schedule, or if they'll knuckle under to corporate IT dept that are not meeting that schedule. That said, it's not a good idea for anyone in the Windows world to buy a CPU that is not supported by Win11.
If that GPU works for your games now, it will work with the new rig. Sounds like you’ve got plenty of experience building your own computers. Make sure the new mobo has a slot that will accept your GPU, but I expect you’ve already thought of that. One more note, if you get a mobo that has an M.2 slot that supports PCIe x4, it would be good to get a compatible M.2 SSD. You can get a 500Gb Samsung 970 EVO drive for a ridiculously low $70 on Amazon. That drive, in a compatible slot, is unbelievably fast. Like 6x faster than a SATA drive. I’ve put nothing but M.2 PCIe drives in all my builds for the past few years. You’ll need a Windows license too. I’ve been buying Win10 Pro OEM licenses (actually, all I buy is the activation code) from various people on eBay for around $30-$40. So far, I haven’t gotten burned on one.
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If that GPU works for your games now, it will work with the new rig. Sounds like you’ve got plenty of experience building your own computers. Make sure the new mobo has a slot that will accept your GPU, but I expect you’ve already thought of that. One more note, if you get a mobo that has an M.2 slot that supports PCIe x4, it would be good to get a compatible M.2 SSD. You can get a 500Gb Samsung 970 EVO drive for a ridiculously low $70 on Amazon. That drive, in a compatible slot, is unbelievably fast. Like 6x faster than a SATA drive. I’ve put nothing but M.2 PCIe drives in all my builds for the past few years. You’ll need a Windows license too. I’ve been buying Win10 Pro OEM licenses (actually, all I buy is the activation code) from various people on eBay for around $30-$40. So far, I haven’t gotten burned on one.
I've been building my own PCs for 25 years. That doesn't mean I'm an expert, as I don't do it all that often, and it gets harder over time as their are SOOO many new technologies and choices! So I research things and learn, and have the experience to figure things out. Plus threads like this help a lot. The new MOBO covers everything I need. I went through the specs of 2+ dozen boards before deciding. I've been looking at this, off-n-on, since last summer. Yow! The price on that M2 is great! However, I'm considering getting the 1 TB for $115 USD, as in the long term a larger drive is more useful. Gotta talk to the budget director (AKA wife) about this. Windows licensing is not an issue, as a have a multi-activation key through Windows Dev Essentials. Once a key is claimed, it's yours. I just checked the key for Win10 also works for Win11
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I've been building my own PCs for 25 years. That doesn't mean I'm an expert, as I don't do it all that often, and it gets harder over time as their are SOOO many new technologies and choices! So I research things and learn, and have the experience to figure things out. Plus threads like this help a lot. The new MOBO covers everything I need. I went through the specs of 2+ dozen boards before deciding. I've been looking at this, off-n-on, since last summer. Yow! The price on that M2 is great! However, I'm considering getting the 1 TB for $115 USD, as in the long term a larger drive is more useful. Gotta talk to the budget director (AKA wife) about this. Windows licensing is not an issue, as a have a multi-activation key through Windows Dev Essentials. Once a key is claimed, it's yours. I just checked the key for Win10 also works for Win11
Disk benchmarks on SATA-connected SSDs usually top out in the 550MB/s range. Magnetic spinners top out around 200MB/s (sequential read/write, they are terrible at random operations). M.2 PCIe SSDs top out around 3600MB/s. The difference in response for disk-intensive applications is very noticeable. If you still have spinners, it's likely they are the main bottleneck for overall performance, especially with the new MOBO, CPU and memory. I've been replacing spinning hard drives with SSDs in laptops for friends and family for several years. The difference in performance is noticeable, even if the replacement is just SATA. My "budget director" is still using a 10-year-old laptop that I swapped disks on and is happy with it (went from a 5400RPM spinner to a SATA SSD). Cost less that $70 to make it almost like a new laptop.
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Yes RAM reseating often works. You haven't mention the first most important thing and that is what do you use it for and neither the second thing what are the specifications - make, model, motherboard, CPU, RAM speed, etc. oh and what operating system? Replacing the hard drive with an SSD always speeds up the older computers.
This PC is my everything PC. Gaming, programming, and general use. Gaming & programming drive the hardware, especially gaming and video. My final choice is a an AMD Ryzen 5 5600X. I considered other models, looked at benchmarking and reviews, and finally at price. It seemed like the best bang for the buck, and one that I'll have no problem using 5 years from now. RAM is 3200 -- that's what the MB and CPU are rated for, so getting faster didn't make sense. MB is an Asus, but depending on ship date, I may have to make a different choice.
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This PC is my everything PC. Gaming, programming, and general use. Gaming & programming drive the hardware, especially gaming and video. My final choice is a an AMD Ryzen 5 5600X. I considered other models, looked at benchmarking and reviews, and finally at price. It seemed like the best bang for the buck, and one that I'll have no problem using 5 years from now. RAM is 3200 -- that's what the MB and CPU are rated for, so getting faster didn't make sense. MB is an Asus, but depending on ship date, I may have to make a different choice.
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Define "haven't been pleased." Please with what? You've picked about the worst time to build a new PC. Prices are high, and supply is short and even impossible to get. You can't find a video card anywhere on the planet. You're in line behind more than a million (not an exaggeration!) other people waiting for video cards.
Asking questions is a skill CodeProject Forum Guidelines Google: C# How to debug code Seriously, go read these articles.
Dave KreskowiakDo you know if this shortage of video cards (and their ridiculous prices) has to do with their intensive usage for crypto mining? Or is just the need for gaming - the raison d'être of 'computers' for more and more people? Because I - not being interested in either perversion - could happily live with what the motherboard itself has to offer in terms of video and sound. At least for a good while.