Steve Jobs Stanford speech
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dandy72 wrote:
Marketing genius, for sure, but on a technical basis, all props go to Woz, at least when Apple got started. He himself at least admitted to that.
That's the problem with devs... they incorrectly assume the only measurable way to be intelligent or contribute to something is via tech. Saying Jobs was a genius in no way takes away from Woz also being extremely gifted and talented. You're comparing apples to oranges. And while I do recognize there would be no Apple without Woz, I can promise you there would be no Apple without Jobs. He provided motivation and vision and direction. All of which Woz lacked. And that's ok... it's called teamwork. But, let's stop trying to undermine Job's contributions. This conversation gets repeated over and over and over on CP because the typical dev can't see past their own bias and blinders.
Jeremy Falcon
Jeremy Falcon wrote:
That's the problem with devs... they incorrectly assume the only measurable way to be intelligent or contribute to something is via tech.
Seems that some managers make the same assumption. I was just reading a blog about this earlier today: [The Worst Programmer I Know](https://dannorth.net/2023/09/02/the-worst-programmer/) Steve Jobs was a micromanager, luckily he was good at it. :)
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Jeremy Falcon wrote:
That's the problem with devs... they incorrectly assume the only measurable way to be intelligent or contribute to something is via tech.
Seems that some managers make the same assumption. I was just reading a blog about this earlier today: [The Worst Programmer I Know](https://dannorth.net/2023/09/02/the-worst-programmer/) Steve Jobs was a micromanager, luckily he was good at it. :)
Totally agree some managers do. There are blind and foolish people all over. My main beef with all of this isn’t that jobs was flawed. He was. Very much so. I probably wouldn’t want to work from him. Dunno. Never met him in person. My beef is that on CP people never say anything positive. There’s always something hateful by someone… dude can’t even die of cancer without immature people here being hateful.
Jeremy Falcon
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Jeremy Falcon wrote:
That's the problem with devs... they incorrectly assume the only measurable way to be intelligent or contribute to something is via tech.
Seems that some managers make the same assumption. I was just reading a blog about this earlier today: [The Worst Programmer I Know](https://dannorth.net/2023/09/02/the-worst-programmer/) Steve Jobs was a micromanager, luckily he was good at it. :)
Oh btw… wasn’t referring to your post. This thread was already derailed.
Jeremy Falcon
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I came across this: Steve Jobs' 2005 Stanford Commencement Address - YouTube[^] While I cannot say that I appreciated the (public) man, I found that truly well written.
I agree with you, it's a good speech. For me, one of the best speeches is John's: You Have One Life, Don't Waste It – John Piper - YouTube[^]
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Y'know, I'm fine with the personal attacks, but I'll just point one thing out: If you think I'm being "inhumane" because of words on a screen, words being exchanged in a conversation, online, you're really trivializing what happened to people who were actually subjected to inhumane treatment. You don't have to "waste your time" or "endure" anything because of me. It's easy enough to stop a thread. I just wanted to make this one last point, as I had already said I was ready to put an end to this rather pointless conversation. I'm curious to find out whether you are.
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Jeremy Falcon wrote:
You've already said enough and distracted from a man giving a speech after he found out he has a terminal condition. You may wanna look inward bro.
This is Steve Jobs we're talking about, not the messiah. There's not much that can be said about him nowadays that will change my opinion of him. [Edit] Oh, and his pancreatic cancer was very much treatable when he was diagnosed. It only became terminal after he [wasted months thinking he could cure himself using herbs](https://www.bing.com/search?q=did+steve+jobs+wait+too+long+to+get+cancer+treatment).
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Totally agree some managers do. There are blind and foolish people all over. My main beef with all of this isn’t that jobs was flawed. He was. Very much so. I probably wouldn’t want to work from him. Dunno. Never met him in person. My beef is that on CP people never say anything positive. There’s always something hateful by someone… dude can’t even die of cancer without immature people here being hateful.
Jeremy Falcon
I read these posts to learn something. Unfortunately, flaming others in posts is easier than sharing useful information and ideas. Thanks for not permitting a bad post to silence your replies. Steve Jobs accomplished something that nobody else can ever do. He created Apple. Others can create something like Apple, but not Apple.
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dandy72 wrote:
I'm curious to find out whether you are.
And of course he replied. You are not the only one he responds to in this manner.
IKR? I told him I was ready to put an end to this thread twice. He kept responding. Somehow *I*'m the one wasting his time but he's the one who kept the thread going. He secretly enjoyed the conversation, no doubt about it. [Edit] And re-read the whole thread. He wasted no time to get onto the personal attack, apparently because of my blasphemy against St-Jobs... It's a cult, when you care so much about someone you don't know, never met, and whose life you haven't affected in any way, shape or form.
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dandy72 wrote:
Oh, and his pancreatic cancer was very much treatable when he was diagnosed.
Yep. So intelligent but not very wise.
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IKR? I told him I was ready to put an end to this thread twice. He kept responding. Somehow *I*'m the one wasting his time but he's the one who kept the thread going. He secretly enjoyed the conversation, no doubt about it. [Edit] And re-read the whole thread. He wasted no time to get onto the personal attack, apparently because of my blasphemy against St-Jobs... It's a cult, when you care so much about someone you don't know, never met, and whose life you haven't affected in any way, shape or form.
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Ok, then you go do what he did. See how easy it is.
Jeremy Falcon
Accomplishing something challenging doesn't make you a genius. Nor does accomplishing something that would be beyond oneself. As I wrote, the word is so overworked and misused it is becoming meaningless.
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Accomplishing something challenging doesn't make you a genius. Nor does accomplishing something that would be beyond oneself. As I wrote, the word is so overworked and misused it is becoming meaningless.
It’s time you left me alone. I don’t need your hate in my life.
Jeremy Falcon
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It’s time you left me alone. I don’t need your hate in my life.
Jeremy Falcon
Now you're being silly. I just said the word "genius" is overworked, and by any sane definition of the word Jobs wasn't a genius. Mozart was, Newton was, Hawkins was. But that's my opinion, yours is clearly different, but to regard an opinion that differs from yours as "hate" is just immature.
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Now you're being silly. I just said the word "genius" is overworked, and by any sane definition of the word Jobs wasn't a genius. Mozart was, Newton was, Hawkins was. But that's my opinion, yours is clearly different, but to regard an opinion that differs from yours as "hate" is just immature.
You can think what you want. Your opinion means nothing. You don't understand the derailment. You are acting hateful.
Jeremy Falcon
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You can think what you want. Your opinion means nothing. You don't understand the derailment. You are acting hateful.
Jeremy Falcon
Judging by your responses I don't think you are an actual human being. If you are, you have a lot to learn about life.
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Judging by your responses I don't think you are an actual human being. If you are, you have a lot to learn about life.
Dude this is a month old. I don't care at all what you think. You're not self-aware. Go away. You don't belong around people.
Jeremy Falcon