Young Indians should work 70 hours a week, says billionaire tech founder
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[Infosys’ billionaire founder says Indians need to work 70 hours a week to succeed | CNN Business](https://edition.cnn.com/india-infosys-founder-work-hours-success-intl-hnk/index.html)
Caveat Emptor. "Progress doesn't come from early risers – progress is made by lazy men looking for easier ways to do things." Lazarus Long
I agree. If you not gifted in one way or the other, you need to put in hours to make it. To riches, that is. If you can be happy with less, then it is better to be happy.
Bastard Programmer from Hell :suss: "If you just follow the bacon Eddy, wherever it leads you, then you won't have to think about politics." -- Some Bell.
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I can be dedicated and driven in 40 hours, thank you very much. You're not "nation building" by working for a demanding asshole like that. You're wealth building, and not for yourself.
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Respectfully agree to disagree.
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Need to add one more thing. There is a vision at the national level to have the next generation Microsofts, Googles, Amazons, etc. to be run out of India. We are the most populous nation in the world, with a large young population, and certainly have the brains to achieve that. We need to raise ourselves from being an outsourcing shop to product-definition place, for yet-to-be-uncovered products. And this definitely needs dedication in a good percentage of our youngsters. This is what he's implying. Even if this takes the next 20 years, we should start NOW.
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[Infosys’ billionaire founder says Indians need to work 70 hours a week to succeed | CNN Business](https://edition.cnn.com/india-infosys-founder-work-hours-success-intl-hnk/index.html)
Caveat Emptor. "Progress doesn't come from early risers – progress is made by lazy men looking for easier ways to do things." Lazarus Long
aaahhhh yes; modern slavery. I would argue that after 35/40 hours, or even less, you stop being productive. So you have a bunch of employees showing up for work and having low productivity and be at the office just for show.
CI/CD = Continuous Impediment/Continuous Despair
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Amarnath S wrote:
More often than not, I've seen youngsters with a lackadaisical attitude, as though "I've got a job; so I can relax", and in some cases, "I have nothing more to learn" kind of attitude.
Seen that in the United States too. :laugh: :laugh:
Jeremy Falcon
Jeremy Falcon wrote:
Seen that in the United States too. :laugh: :laugh:
And in a couple of countries in Europe too. Heck in Spain we even call the the "ni-ni" (the neither-nor) generation: Neither job nor lust to work.
M.D.V. ;) If something has a solution... Why do we have to worry about?. If it has no solution... For what reason do we have to worry about? Help me to understand what I'm saying, and I'll explain it better to you Rating helpful answers is nice, but saying thanks can be even nicer.
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Need to add one more thing. There is a vision at the national level to have the next generation Microsofts, Googles, Amazons, etc. to be run out of India. We are the most populous nation in the world, with a large young population, and certainly have the brains to achieve that. We need to raise ourselves from being an outsourcing shop to product-definition place, for yet-to-be-uncovered products. And this definitely needs dedication in a good percentage of our youngsters. This is what he's implying. Even if this takes the next 20 years, we should start NOW.
Amarnath S wrote:
We need to raise ourselves from being an outsourcing shop to product-definition place, for yet-to-be-uncovered products. And this definitely needs dedication in a good percentage of our youngsters.
To do that you don't really need the youngs to work 70 hours, you need a change of mindset and work philosophy. The time I worked there (local production of european brands), I was :omg: :wtf: :omg: :wtf: a couple of times a day (during a couple of years). People that you didn't have to guide them every step and even several times in the same step were reaaaaaalllyyy difficult to find.
M.D.V. ;) If something has a solution... Why do we have to worry about?. If it has no solution... For what reason do we have to worry about? Help me to understand what I'm saying, and I'll explain it better to you Rating helpful answers is nice, but saying thanks can be even nicer.
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Jeremy Falcon wrote:
Seen that in the United States too. :laugh: :laugh:
And in a couple of countries in Europe too. Heck in Spain we even call the the "ni-ni" (the neither-nor) generation: Neither job nor lust to work.
M.D.V. ;) If something has a solution... Why do we have to worry about?. If it has no solution... For what reason do we have to worry about? Help me to understand what I'm saying, and I'll explain it better to you Rating helpful answers is nice, but saying thanks can be even nicer.
Nelek wrote:
in Spain we even call the the "ni-ni" (the neither-nor) generation: Neither job nor lust to work.
I thought ni-ni is for "neither studying, nor employed" (ni estudian, ni trabajan). Not sure it's something of their choosing.
Mircea
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Nelek wrote:
in Spain we even call the the "ni-ni" (the neither-nor) generation: Neither job nor lust to work.
I thought ni-ni is for "neither studying, nor employed" (ni estudian, ni trabajan). Not sure it's something of their choosing.
Mircea
It started like that, but both are used (although yours is more extended). The point is they stay at home playing e-games or go out to hook with friends and get high. Big % have neither motivation nor ambition to do something productive with their lives. They even joke saying "live from your parents until you can live from your kids" like an :elephant: parasite.
Mircea Neacsu wrote:
Not sure it's something of their choosing.
That's what it makes me get angry, that I know some guys that really want to work, but can't find anything for the long term. On the other hand, in my old town those are the very small minority.
M.D.V. ;) If something has a solution... Why do we have to worry about?. If it has no solution... For what reason do we have to worry about? Help me to understand what I'm saying, and I'll explain it better to you Rating helpful answers is nice, but saying thanks can be even nicer.
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It started like that, but both are used (although yours is more extended). The point is they stay at home playing e-games or go out to hook with friends and get high. Big % have neither motivation nor ambition to do something productive with their lives. They even joke saying "live from your parents until you can live from your kids" like an :elephant: parasite.
Mircea Neacsu wrote:
Not sure it's something of their choosing.
That's what it makes me get angry, that I know some guys that really want to work, but can't find anything for the long term. On the other hand, in my old town those are the very small minority.
M.D.V. ;) If something has a solution... Why do we have to worry about?. If it has no solution... For what reason do we have to worry about? Help me to understand what I'm saying, and I'll explain it better to you Rating helpful answers is nice, but saying thanks can be even nicer.
Nelek wrote:
live from your parents until you can live from your kids
A cute, unrelated (or only vaguely related) story about Jose Antonio Torroja who happened to be the son of a very famous civil engineer, Eduardo Torroja, and the father of Ana Torroja of Mecano fame. Apparently, Jose Antonio said that he went from being the son of his father to the father of his daughter. Of course, he was talking only about fame, as professionally he was a well-respected university professor. I guess there are different ways of skipping a generation :D
Mircea
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Nelek wrote:
live from your parents until you can live from your kids
A cute, unrelated (or only vaguely related) story about Jose Antonio Torroja who happened to be the son of a very famous civil engineer, Eduardo Torroja, and the father of Ana Torroja of Mecano fame. Apparently, Jose Antonio said that he went from being the son of his father to the father of his daughter. Of course, he was talking only about fame, as professionally he was a well-respected university professor. I guess there are different ways of skipping a generation :D
Mircea
In the town where my mother was born (last two pics[^]) I still am the grandson of my grandpa (he founded the local music band), no matter how far did I get.
M.D.V. ;) If something has a solution... Why do we have to worry about?. If it has no solution... For what reason do we have to worry about? Help me to understand what I'm saying, and I'll explain it better to you Rating helpful answers is nice, but saying thanks can be even nicer.
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aaahhhh yes; modern slavery. I would argue that after 35/40 hours, or even less, you stop being productive. So you have a bunch of employees showing up for work and having low productivity and be at the office just for show.
CI/CD = Continuous Impediment/Continuous Despair
Maximilien wrote:
I would argue that after 35/40 hours, or even less, you stop being productive.
That's also a huge part of it. That figure wasn't chosen at random. At this stage in my life, I feel like I have nothing else to prove to anyone. That's not to say won't do some crunch time if I really, really, REALLY have to, but I'm not gonna make a habit of it, that's for sure. After some amount of time, working extra hours becomes counterproductive. You end up reworking the mistakes you made when you were just too damned tired to think straight.
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[Infosys’ billionaire founder says Indians need to work 70 hours a week to succeed | CNN Business](https://edition.cnn.com/india-infosys-founder-work-hours-success-intl-hnk/index.html)
Caveat Emptor. "Progress doesn't come from early risers – progress is made by lazy men looking for easier ways to do things." Lazarus Long
Because they work for him?
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[Infosys’ billionaire founder says Indians need to work 70 hours a week to succeed | CNN Business](https://edition.cnn.com/india-infosys-founder-work-hours-success-intl-hnk/index.html)
Caveat Emptor. "Progress doesn't come from early risers – progress is made by lazy men looking for easier ways to do things." Lazarus Long
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[Infosys’ billionaire founder says Indians need to work 70 hours a week to succeed | CNN Business](https://edition.cnn.com/india-infosys-founder-work-hours-success-intl-hnk/index.html)
Caveat Emptor. "Progress doesn't come from early risers – progress is made by lazy men looking for easier ways to do things." Lazarus Long
I donot agree, the 70 hour work week is the way of slavery and low self esteem. If so little is left of an employees time, where is the scope for self education, introspection, family life, illness and recovery. I know for a fact that his company Infosys is consistently one of the lowest paying organizations in the country. Even startups pay better. I know people who take a job there only for the tag and leave it in about a year. The offers that come to them after the stint are the ones that actually correspond to market reality. Then and only then, the pay actually corresponds to what an average engineering student earns as first choice. However, again, he has a point in that students who graduate from our lower and middle education tiers have abysmal skills. Skills that we would not even see in a 8th standard passout from a good Institute. The professional, communication, and attitude skills are so bad that they need to train for an additional 2 years to catch up. And this is pure adult learning. These employees are the ones who need 70 hr weeks to just catch up to the whole wide world. I've interviewed so many and found them to be so lacking in basic skills like connecting to a database and getting some data out of it. Designing an employee database and querying for some salary data. Nothing magic, just run of the mill humdrum CRUD stuff. And again, I bet he wouldn't have worked that long except for his first decade. Maybe not even that long. Pure BS and virtue signalling.
Paras Parmar
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I donot agree, the 70 hour work week is the way of slavery and low self esteem. If so little is left of an employees time, where is the scope for self education, introspection, family life, illness and recovery. I know for a fact that his company Infosys is consistently one of the lowest paying organizations in the country. Even startups pay better. I know people who take a job there only for the tag and leave it in about a year. The offers that come to them after the stint are the ones that actually correspond to market reality. Then and only then, the pay actually corresponds to what an average engineering student earns as first choice. However, again, he has a point in that students who graduate from our lower and middle education tiers have abysmal skills. Skills that we would not even see in a 8th standard passout from a good Institute. The professional, communication, and attitude skills are so bad that they need to train for an additional 2 years to catch up. And this is pure adult learning. These employees are the ones who need 70 hr weeks to just catch up to the whole wide world. I've interviewed so many and found them to be so lacking in basic skills like connecting to a database and getting some data out of it. Designing an employee database and querying for some salary data. Nothing magic, just run of the mill humdrum CRUD stuff. And again, I bet he wouldn't have worked that long except for his first decade. Maybe not even that long. Pure BS and virtue signalling.
Paras Parmar
Paras Parmar wrote:
I've interviewed so many and found them to be so lacking in basic skills like connecting to a database and getting some data out of it. Designing an employee database and querying for some salary data. Nothing magic, just run of the mill humdrum CRUD stuff.
I would fail in that too, because I have used three or four times in my life, and that was during studies to pass the exam. But I am pretty sure that if I go to any industry production line in the world, I will be able to win some decimals if not several seconds in the process what at the end of the year is a huge performance boost. Or improve your quality vision systems, or... or... or... The right question is not if the candidate fail to answer a concrete question / topic or not, the right question is, is he willing to learn and to improve his skills? That's why when confronted with something I didn't know I have always answered: NOW, I can't do that. But if I get a chance and a couple of weeks, I will learn it.
M.D.V. ;) If something has a solution... Why do we have to worry about?. If it has no solution... For what reason do we have to worry about? Help me to understand what I'm saying, and I'll explain it better to you Rating helpful answers is nice, but saying thanks can be even nicer.
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[Infosys’ billionaire founder says Indians need to work 70 hours a week to succeed | CNN Business](https://edition.cnn.com/india-infosys-founder-work-hours-success-intl-hnk/index.html)
Caveat Emptor. "Progress doesn't come from early risers – progress is made by lazy men looking for easier ways to do things." Lazarus Long
(Working long != working hard) && (working long != working productively) No need to say more. Edit: Added the second term due to the answer below.
M.D.V. ;) If something has a solution... Why do we have to worry about?. If it has no solution... For what reason do we have to worry about? Help me to understand what I'm saying, and I'll explain it better to you Rating helpful answers is nice, but saying thanks can be even nicer.
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[Infosys’ billionaire founder says Indians need to work 70 hours a week to succeed | CNN Business](https://edition.cnn.com/india-infosys-founder-work-hours-success-intl-hnk/index.html)
Caveat Emptor. "Progress doesn't come from early risers – progress is made by lazy men looking for easier ways to do things." Lazarus Long
Does that include commuting? I consider it (part of) "work"; unproductive work .... which makes most people's days pretty long.
"Before entering on an understanding, I have meditated for a long time, and have foreseen what might happen. It is not genius which reveals to me suddenly, secretly, what I have to say or to do in a circumstance unexpected by other people; it is reflection, it is meditation." - Napoleon I
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Does that include commuting? I consider it (part of) "work"; unproductive work .... which makes most people's days pretty long.
"Before entering on an understanding, I have meditated for a long time, and have foreseen what might happen. It is not genius which reveals to me suddenly, secretly, what I have to say or to do in a circumstance unexpected by other people; it is reflection, it is meditation." - Napoleon I
Gerry Schmitz wrote:
Does that include commuting? I consider it (part of) "work"; unproductive work ....
When I have been abroad I have always started the timer leaving the hotel and stopped it when coming back to the reception. But I did specify what was conmuting and what was "factory" time in my reports. Both got billed (and payed).
M.D.V. ;) If something has a solution... Why do we have to worry about?. If it has no solution... For what reason do we have to worry about? Help me to understand what I'm saying, and I'll explain it better to you Rating helpful answers is nice, but saying thanks can be even nicer.
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Amarnath S wrote:
Youngsters need to work hard to build the nation, since India is still termed as a "developing country".
So is the idea then that you'll eventually reach a point where an employer says "ok, we're developed enough now, you can ease off a bit and no longer have to work yourselves to death"? I'm in Canada. As far as I've been told, this is a developed country. If employers could get us to put in more hours, if it weren't for those pesky labor laws, most absolutely would put us through the ringer without hesitation. So don't think you'll be done when you're no longer "developing". I work to live. I don't live to work.
You might be wrong. I'm an employer and I'd rather have well rested and happy employees than overworked employees. I even prefer for them to have a four day work week and put in no more than the necessary eight hours a day, unless it's absolutely necessary. Work from home for at least half the time and flexible work hours is not a problem. More hours == more work is pretty outdated, and countries like Japan, where people generally make long hours, show the contrary. Of course, some of these things are not applicable for factory workers and other professions. Anyway, even for those professions, if I had a boss like that I'd be out as soon as I got a chance.
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(Working long != working hard) && (working long != working productively) No need to say more. Edit: Added the second term due to the answer below.
M.D.V. ;) If something has a solution... Why do we have to worry about?. If it has no solution... For what reason do we have to worry about? Help me to understand what I'm saying, and I'll explain it better to you Rating helpful answers is nice, but saying thanks can be even nicer.
Nelek wrote:
Woirking long != working hard.
Concisely stated! I will add "Nor working productively". Many moons ago the team I was on had a young guy who worked 70 hours a week, while everyone else worked 45-50. Management repeatedly praised him for his effort. The sad fact was that he couldn't get his work done in the same time as everyone else, and had to work ridiculous hours to keep up.
