MS can't catch a break when it comes to search
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There's yet another article on Slashdot claiming [Bing's market share has barely budged despite ChatGPT being added to it](https://tech.slashdot.org/story/24/01/18/1340247/microsofts-bing-market-share-barely-budged-with-chatgpt-add-on?utm\_source=rss1.0mainlinkanon&utm\_medium=feed), and initially being a big hit, yada-yada. And yet barely 2 days prior, another article read, "[Google Search Really Has Gotten Worse, Researchers Find](https://tech.slashdot.org/story/24/01/16/2137200/google-search-really-has-gotten-worse-researchers-find?utm\_source=rss1.0mainlinkanon&utm\_medium=feed)". I've been seeing those sorts of articles time and again over the last few months. I can't say whether that's true. I try to do as little as possible with Google nowadays. I've actually been doing my searches through Bing for a few years now, using Edge (since it moved to the Chromium engine), and frankly, it's a rare occurrence where I can't find what I'm looking for within the first few results of a query. Generally if I can't find anything on Bing, Google really doesn't fare quantifiably "better". And MS already has all the information it wants from me, if not through my search queries and browser telemetry, then through telemetry sent by the OS itself. If Google's search results truly are getting worse (not my claim), I'm not sure why they should still be in my life. Frankly if my data's gonna get collected anyway, I'd rather have one company have it then two. Especially when one of them is purely an advertising company (whereas the other is merely trying to move in that direction, despite failing repeatedly - and the company's very survival doesn't rely on its ad department). Nobody it seems ever misses a chance to ridicule Edge or Bing. Laugh all you want, I'm actually rather happy with how it's working out for me. Obviously, YMMV. So what say you? Are Google's results getting as unusable as some claim? If so, why stick with it?
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There's yet another article on Slashdot claiming [Bing's market share has barely budged despite ChatGPT being added to it](https://tech.slashdot.org/story/24/01/18/1340247/microsofts-bing-market-share-barely-budged-with-chatgpt-add-on?utm\_source=rss1.0mainlinkanon&utm\_medium=feed), and initially being a big hit, yada-yada. And yet barely 2 days prior, another article read, "[Google Search Really Has Gotten Worse, Researchers Find](https://tech.slashdot.org/story/24/01/16/2137200/google-search-really-has-gotten-worse-researchers-find?utm\_source=rss1.0mainlinkanon&utm\_medium=feed)". I've been seeing those sorts of articles time and again over the last few months. I can't say whether that's true. I try to do as little as possible with Google nowadays. I've actually been doing my searches through Bing for a few years now, using Edge (since it moved to the Chromium engine), and frankly, it's a rare occurrence where I can't find what I'm looking for within the first few results of a query. Generally if I can't find anything on Bing, Google really doesn't fare quantifiably "better". And MS already has all the information it wants from me, if not through my search queries and browser telemetry, then through telemetry sent by the OS itself. If Google's search results truly are getting worse (not my claim), I'm not sure why they should still be in my life. Frankly if my data's gonna get collected anyway, I'd rather have one company have it then two. Especially when one of them is purely an advertising company (whereas the other is merely trying to move in that direction, despite failing repeatedly - and the company's very survival doesn't rely on its ad department). Nobody it seems ever misses a chance to ridicule Edge or Bing. Laugh all you want, I'm actually rather happy with how it's working out for me. Obviously, YMMV. So what say you? Are Google's results getting as unusable as some claim? If so, why stick with it?
Hmm, the Quote button doesn't seem to be working. Aanywaayy... Are Google's results getting as unusable as some claim? I have no idea; I've never used it.
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Hmm, the Quote button doesn't seem to be working. Aanywaayy... Are Google's results getting as unusable as some claim? I have no idea; I've never used it.
> Hmm, the Quote button doesn't seem to be working. I've noticed that...the button is there, clicking on it doesn't do anything except for removing the highlight. So, I've been manually copying and pasting, and then adding a ">" before the pasted line. The hamsters must be acting up.
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There's yet another article on Slashdot claiming [Bing's market share has barely budged despite ChatGPT being added to it](https://tech.slashdot.org/story/24/01/18/1340247/microsofts-bing-market-share-barely-budged-with-chatgpt-add-on?utm\_source=rss1.0mainlinkanon&utm\_medium=feed), and initially being a big hit, yada-yada. And yet barely 2 days prior, another article read, "[Google Search Really Has Gotten Worse, Researchers Find](https://tech.slashdot.org/story/24/01/16/2137200/google-search-really-has-gotten-worse-researchers-find?utm\_source=rss1.0mainlinkanon&utm\_medium=feed)". I've been seeing those sorts of articles time and again over the last few months. I can't say whether that's true. I try to do as little as possible with Google nowadays. I've actually been doing my searches through Bing for a few years now, using Edge (since it moved to the Chromium engine), and frankly, it's a rare occurrence where I can't find what I'm looking for within the first few results of a query. Generally if I can't find anything on Bing, Google really doesn't fare quantifiably "better". And MS already has all the information it wants from me, if not through my search queries and browser telemetry, then through telemetry sent by the OS itself. If Google's search results truly are getting worse (not my claim), I'm not sure why they should still be in my life. Frankly if my data's gonna get collected anyway, I'd rather have one company have it then two. Especially when one of them is purely an advertising company (whereas the other is merely trying to move in that direction, despite failing repeatedly - and the company's very survival doesn't rely on its ad department). Nobody it seems ever misses a chance to ridicule Edge or Bing. Laugh all you want, I'm actually rather happy with how it's working out for me. Obviously, YMMV. So what say you? Are Google's results getting as unusable as some claim? If so, why stick with it?
I'm a creature of habit. I've been using Google search so long, I forget Bing is there. I'm a Firefox guy for my browser. I find what I'm looking for so I'm not worried. Maybe if you're searching eccentric stuff it matters. But for boring stuff like "Where to buy a 16" husky chainsaw" Google does just fine for me.
Hogan
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Hmm, the Quote button doesn't seem to be working. Aanywaayy... Are Google's results getting as unusable as some claim? I have no idea; I've never used it.
> Are Google's results getting as unusable as some claim? Yes. Very much yes when you are looking for specific information, or trying to recall an article you read a while ago. Their verbatim search used to be the bees knees, or however the saying goes. Even it sucks now. And has for about at least a year.
Our Forgotten Astronomy | Object Oriented Programming with C++ | Wordle solver
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I'm a creature of habit. I've been using Google search so long, I forget Bing is there. I'm a Firefox guy for my browser. I find what I'm looking for so I'm not worried. Maybe if you're searching eccentric stuff it matters. But for boring stuff like "Where to buy a 16" husky chainsaw" Google does just fine for me.
Hogan
I use Vivaldi as my main browser, and Firefox for some other stuff (its Facebook container is its main selling point to me). Yesterday I checked the memory footprint between them. Vivaldi - 106 tabs, 5.5 GB. Firefox: 10 tabs, 4 GB. This is in line with every time I've checked memory usage in the past. For some reason FF just sucks it up a lot more. Maybe the extension are heavy, although I only have three.
Our Forgotten Astronomy | Object Oriented Programming with C++ | Wordle solver
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There's yet another article on Slashdot claiming [Bing's market share has barely budged despite ChatGPT being added to it](https://tech.slashdot.org/story/24/01/18/1340247/microsofts-bing-market-share-barely-budged-with-chatgpt-add-on?utm\_source=rss1.0mainlinkanon&utm\_medium=feed), and initially being a big hit, yada-yada. And yet barely 2 days prior, another article read, "[Google Search Really Has Gotten Worse, Researchers Find](https://tech.slashdot.org/story/24/01/16/2137200/google-search-really-has-gotten-worse-researchers-find?utm\_source=rss1.0mainlinkanon&utm\_medium=feed)". I've been seeing those sorts of articles time and again over the last few months. I can't say whether that's true. I try to do as little as possible with Google nowadays. I've actually been doing my searches through Bing for a few years now, using Edge (since it moved to the Chromium engine), and frankly, it's a rare occurrence where I can't find what I'm looking for within the first few results of a query. Generally if I can't find anything on Bing, Google really doesn't fare quantifiably "better". And MS already has all the information it wants from me, if not through my search queries and browser telemetry, then through telemetry sent by the OS itself. If Google's search results truly are getting worse (not my claim), I'm not sure why they should still be in my life. Frankly if my data's gonna get collected anyway, I'd rather have one company have it then two. Especially when one of them is purely an advertising company (whereas the other is merely trying to move in that direction, despite failing repeatedly - and the company's very survival doesn't rely on its ad department). Nobody it seems ever misses a chance to ridicule Edge or Bing. Laugh all you want, I'm actually rather happy with how it's working out for me. Obviously, YMMV. So what say you? Are Google's results getting as unusable as some claim? If so, why stick with it?
(All) AI "search" is patronizing. If it only makes a few hits, it keeps regurgitating them until it has a few pages of "content". Quantity over quality ... cause it can't tell the difference.
"Before entering on an understanding, I have meditated for a long time, and have foreseen what might happen. It is not genius which reveals to me suddenly, secretly, what I have to say or to do in a circumstance unexpected by other people; it is reflection, it is meditation." - Napoleon I
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There's yet another article on Slashdot claiming [Bing's market share has barely budged despite ChatGPT being added to it](https://tech.slashdot.org/story/24/01/18/1340247/microsofts-bing-market-share-barely-budged-with-chatgpt-add-on?utm\_source=rss1.0mainlinkanon&utm\_medium=feed), and initially being a big hit, yada-yada. And yet barely 2 days prior, another article read, "[Google Search Really Has Gotten Worse, Researchers Find](https://tech.slashdot.org/story/24/01/16/2137200/google-search-really-has-gotten-worse-researchers-find?utm\_source=rss1.0mainlinkanon&utm\_medium=feed)". I've been seeing those sorts of articles time and again over the last few months. I can't say whether that's true. I try to do as little as possible with Google nowadays. I've actually been doing my searches through Bing for a few years now, using Edge (since it moved to the Chromium engine), and frankly, it's a rare occurrence where I can't find what I'm looking for within the first few results of a query. Generally if I can't find anything on Bing, Google really doesn't fare quantifiably "better". And MS already has all the information it wants from me, if not through my search queries and browser telemetry, then through telemetry sent by the OS itself. If Google's search results truly are getting worse (not my claim), I'm not sure why they should still be in my life. Frankly if my data's gonna get collected anyway, I'd rather have one company have it then two. Especially when one of them is purely an advertising company (whereas the other is merely trying to move in that direction, despite failing repeatedly - and the company's very survival doesn't rely on its ad department). Nobody it seems ever misses a chance to ridicule Edge or Bing. Laugh all you want, I'm actually rather happy with how it's working out for me. Obviously, YMMV. So what say you? Are Google's results getting as unusable as some claim? If so, why stick with it?
Rarely use Google. Brave browser, duckduckgo search engine, and some duck.com email. Contrarian/curmudgeon here. :-D
>64 There is never enough time to do it right, but there is enough time to do it over.
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Hmm, the Quote button doesn't seem to be working. Aanywaayy... Are Google's results getting as unusable as some claim? I have no idea; I've never used it.
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I use Vivaldi as my main browser, and Firefox for some other stuff (its Facebook container is its main selling point to me). Yesterday I checked the memory footprint between them. Vivaldi - 106 tabs, 5.5 GB. Firefox: 10 tabs, 4 GB. This is in line with every time I've checked memory usage in the past. For some reason FF just sucks it up a lot more. Maybe the extension are heavy, although I only have three.
Our Forgotten Astronomy | Object Oriented Programming with C++ | Wordle solver
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Interesting. I'm 6 tabs deep in FF with only 1.5Gb of memory used. Opened up Facebook and it brought me to 2Gb. So not too big of a deal to me. Maybe I just do boring stuff with my machine.
Hogan
I don't know. It has been an issue every time I've looked at Firefox, seemingly into the distant past.
Our Forgotten Astronomy | Object Oriented Programming with C++ | Wordle solver
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I'm a creature of habit. I've been using Google search so long, I forget Bing is there. I'm a Firefox guy for my browser. I find what I'm looking for so I'm not worried. Maybe if you're searching eccentric stuff it matters. But for boring stuff like "Where to buy a 16" husky chainsaw" Google does just fine for me.
Hogan
> Maybe if you're searching eccentric stuff it matters. But for boring stuff like "Where to buy a 16" husky chainsaw" Google does just fine for me Most of my searches is for formal API documentation (where IntelliSense isn't enough and I need more details). The rest is rather generic. But it's been established I'm not the typical "consumer" whose only use for search engines is to buy crap. Had a long thread about this a few months back.
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> Maybe if you're searching eccentric stuff it matters. But for boring stuff like "Where to buy a 16" husky chainsaw" Google does just fine for me Most of my searches is for formal API documentation (where IntelliSense isn't enough and I need more details). The rest is rather generic. But it's been established I'm not the typical "consumer" whose only use for search engines is to buy crap. Had a long thread about this a few months back.
I think Bing is and was always the better choice to search the MS docs.
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I'm a creature of habit. I've been using Google search so long, I forget Bing is there. I'm a Firefox guy for my browser. I find what I'm looking for so I'm not worried. Maybe if you're searching eccentric stuff it matters. But for boring stuff like "Where to buy a 16" husky chainsaw" Google does just fine for me.
Hogan
Your use case 'Where to buy a 16" husky chainsaw' maps 1:1 to Google's use case of showing the most possible targeted ads. I think the decline of Google search is related to the searched things you don't want to buy.
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I use Vivaldi as my main browser, and Firefox for some other stuff (its Facebook container is its main selling point to me). Yesterday I checked the memory footprint between them. Vivaldi - 106 tabs, 5.5 GB. Firefox: 10 tabs, 4 GB. This is in line with every time I've checked memory usage in the past. For some reason FF just sucks it up a lot more. Maybe the extension are heavy, although I only have three.
Our Forgotten Astronomy | Object Oriented Programming with C++ | Wordle solver
Many Chromium-based browser does that - it is called suspended page. When I go back to it, it loads again. It is a bit annoying, except when you play music from one of those pages - till it gets suspended. I use a 32 bit W7 box, there is no HTML 5 browser running all pages living other than the good old trusty IE 11. It is funny when you have a MS product to showcase as a memory-conscious application.
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There's yet another article on Slashdot claiming [Bing's market share has barely budged despite ChatGPT being added to it](https://tech.slashdot.org/story/24/01/18/1340247/microsofts-bing-market-share-barely-budged-with-chatgpt-add-on?utm\_source=rss1.0mainlinkanon&utm\_medium=feed), and initially being a big hit, yada-yada. And yet barely 2 days prior, another article read, "[Google Search Really Has Gotten Worse, Researchers Find](https://tech.slashdot.org/story/24/01/16/2137200/google-search-really-has-gotten-worse-researchers-find?utm\_source=rss1.0mainlinkanon&utm\_medium=feed)". I've been seeing those sorts of articles time and again over the last few months. I can't say whether that's true. I try to do as little as possible with Google nowadays. I've actually been doing my searches through Bing for a few years now, using Edge (since it moved to the Chromium engine), and frankly, it's a rare occurrence where I can't find what I'm looking for within the first few results of a query. Generally if I can't find anything on Bing, Google really doesn't fare quantifiably "better". And MS already has all the information it wants from me, if not through my search queries and browser telemetry, then through telemetry sent by the OS itself. If Google's search results truly are getting worse (not my claim), I'm not sure why they should still be in my life. Frankly if my data's gonna get collected anyway, I'd rather have one company have it then two. Especially when one of them is purely an advertising company (whereas the other is merely trying to move in that direction, despite failing repeatedly - and the company's very survival doesn't rely on its ad department). Nobody it seems ever misses a chance to ridicule Edge or Bing. Laugh all you want, I'm actually rather happy with how it's working out for me. Obviously, YMMV. So what say you? Are Google's results getting as unusable as some claim? If so, why stick with it?
1 the scale of numbers measuring share of search are so high that to nudge any change is a lot of effort, but I also find it annoying when say things like only 5% of a market, but that 5% is 100m plus of revenue, dwarfing whole companies so. things like it default on android and safari browser makes for a massive audience. and then person writing an article is already in a niche segment so their usage will be massively different to the billion plus using the internet daily. Yes bing search runs when using start menu now, but how many office works in total do not use start menu search to open an application. When in the echo of IT work, simple things like ctrl+c sound obvious, but there multiple dev I work with being under 30 that like oh neat trick 🥲 Is google search getting worse, maybe is the expectations of people and bad search words and the ache of the amount of website and data out there and balancing new vs old and many parameters skewing the results. question where the writer of any article is coming from, your experience and expectations Javascript is a great thing for dead weight legacy and what good to use now. TextContent or innertext, still requires some sifting of mozilla docs or stackoverflow hoping that top answer marks oh, its past 2017 stop using that old way, use this, but then that "new" post become outdated and looks just as good as the 2014 post saying to use the other way because has a million linked articles
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There's yet another article on Slashdot claiming [Bing's market share has barely budged despite ChatGPT being added to it](https://tech.slashdot.org/story/24/01/18/1340247/microsofts-bing-market-share-barely-budged-with-chatgpt-add-on?utm\_source=rss1.0mainlinkanon&utm\_medium=feed), and initially being a big hit, yada-yada. And yet barely 2 days prior, another article read, "[Google Search Really Has Gotten Worse, Researchers Find](https://tech.slashdot.org/story/24/01/16/2137200/google-search-really-has-gotten-worse-researchers-find?utm\_source=rss1.0mainlinkanon&utm\_medium=feed)". I've been seeing those sorts of articles time and again over the last few months. I can't say whether that's true. I try to do as little as possible with Google nowadays. I've actually been doing my searches through Bing for a few years now, using Edge (since it moved to the Chromium engine), and frankly, it's a rare occurrence where I can't find what I'm looking for within the first few results of a query. Generally if I can't find anything on Bing, Google really doesn't fare quantifiably "better". And MS already has all the information it wants from me, if not through my search queries and browser telemetry, then through telemetry sent by the OS itself. If Google's search results truly are getting worse (not my claim), I'm not sure why they should still be in my life. Frankly if my data's gonna get collected anyway, I'd rather have one company have it then two. Especially when one of them is purely an advertising company (whereas the other is merely trying to move in that direction, despite failing repeatedly - and the company's very survival doesn't rely on its ad department). Nobody it seems ever misses a chance to ridicule Edge or Bing. Laugh all you want, I'm actually rather happy with how it's working out for me. Obviously, YMMV. So what say you? Are Google's results getting as unusable as some claim? If so, why stick with it?
Absolutely agree. Years using Bing (and Edge) and both work very well. The interface if Bing is better for my taste and even if it shows ads, they are a less agressive tha Google's. By the way I am no fan of Google and I prefer not to use any of its apps, including Gmail.
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There's yet another article on Slashdot claiming [Bing's market share has barely budged despite ChatGPT being added to it](https://tech.slashdot.org/story/24/01/18/1340247/microsofts-bing-market-share-barely-budged-with-chatgpt-add-on?utm\_source=rss1.0mainlinkanon&utm\_medium=feed), and initially being a big hit, yada-yada. And yet barely 2 days prior, another article read, "[Google Search Really Has Gotten Worse, Researchers Find](https://tech.slashdot.org/story/24/01/16/2137200/google-search-really-has-gotten-worse-researchers-find?utm\_source=rss1.0mainlinkanon&utm\_medium=feed)". I've been seeing those sorts of articles time and again over the last few months. I can't say whether that's true. I try to do as little as possible with Google nowadays. I've actually been doing my searches through Bing for a few years now, using Edge (since it moved to the Chromium engine), and frankly, it's a rare occurrence where I can't find what I'm looking for within the first few results of a query. Generally if I can't find anything on Bing, Google really doesn't fare quantifiably "better". And MS already has all the information it wants from me, if not through my search queries and browser telemetry, then through telemetry sent by the OS itself. If Google's search results truly are getting worse (not my claim), I'm not sure why they should still be in my life. Frankly if my data's gonna get collected anyway, I'd rather have one company have it then two. Especially when one of them is purely an advertising company (whereas the other is merely trying to move in that direction, despite failing repeatedly - and the company's very survival doesn't rely on its ad department). Nobody it seems ever misses a chance to ridicule Edge or Bing. Laugh all you want, I'm actually rather happy with how it's working out for me. Obviously, YMMV. So what say you? Are Google's results getting as unusable as some claim? If so, why stick with it?
I stopped using Google products a couple of years ago, excepting Gmail (can't find a client I like better for organization). Before I stopped using Google search, I was getting irritated with ads and it seemed like the results were always targeted. Today I use DuckDuckGo and Bing. Both work sufficiently well for my needs, although MS pushing their version of ML is beyond irritating, as I don't have a need for the hallucinations of a computer. Just search results. I thought about it, and I trust Microsoft more than I trust Google. On a trust scale of 1 to 1,000,000 I rank Google a 1 and Microsoft a 2, so trusting MS more than Google is not exactly a ringing endorsement. :laugh:
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There's yet another article on Slashdot claiming [Bing's market share has barely budged despite ChatGPT being added to it](https://tech.slashdot.org/story/24/01/18/1340247/microsofts-bing-market-share-barely-budged-with-chatgpt-add-on?utm\_source=rss1.0mainlinkanon&utm\_medium=feed), and initially being a big hit, yada-yada. And yet barely 2 days prior, another article read, "[Google Search Really Has Gotten Worse, Researchers Find](https://tech.slashdot.org/story/24/01/16/2137200/google-search-really-has-gotten-worse-researchers-find?utm\_source=rss1.0mainlinkanon&utm\_medium=feed)". I've been seeing those sorts of articles time and again over the last few months. I can't say whether that's true. I try to do as little as possible with Google nowadays. I've actually been doing my searches through Bing for a few years now, using Edge (since it moved to the Chromium engine), and frankly, it's a rare occurrence where I can't find what I'm looking for within the first few results of a query. Generally if I can't find anything on Bing, Google really doesn't fare quantifiably "better". And MS already has all the information it wants from me, if not through my search queries and browser telemetry, then through telemetry sent by the OS itself. If Google's search results truly are getting worse (not my claim), I'm not sure why they should still be in my life. Frankly if my data's gonna get collected anyway, I'd rather have one company have it then two. Especially when one of them is purely an advertising company (whereas the other is merely trying to move in that direction, despite failing repeatedly - and the company's very survival doesn't rely on its ad department). Nobody it seems ever misses a chance to ridicule Edge or Bing. Laugh all you want, I'm actually rather happy with how it's working out for me. Obviously, YMMV. So what say you? Are Google's results getting as unusable as some claim? If so, why stick with it?
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I prefer DuckDuckGo, but Bing used to be reasonable. The addition of the ChatGPT style answer system to Bing has made it completely unusable for me. I thought 75 baud text rendering died in 1981 when 300 baud became the norm.
I mostly use the traditional search box (and its behavior isn't changed for me), but only explicitly switch to ChatGPT if I want to ask it a question in plain English - when I know specific keywords are likely to be too generic to return relevant results. And generally if I provide enough context in my question, it'll often provide an answer I can actually use, at least as a starting point.