Be careful how you turn off your PC
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dandy72 wrote:
the physical power button
Yes.
A Reset button, I'd understand. Maybe. But the power button (that requires to be held down for 4 seconds when the system's already running), which powers everything down, and then you have to press it again to power it back on...then yeah, that pretty much sounds like a cold boot to me. If you're not getting prompted for the BIOS password after that sequence...then I agree, it's useless.
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Cp-Coder wrote:
if I turn off the PC by hitting the power button instead
If a desktop then it means power outage would do the same.
Cp-Coder wrote:
My main PC may get stolen with the external drives during a burglary, for example.
I am not rigorous in this but I do see a lot of PC cases with lock ports. Attach a cable lock to it and a heavy desk. Then less risk unless it is a targeted theft.
jschell wrote:
I am not rigorous in this but I do see a lot of PC cases with lock ports. Attach a cable lock to it and a heavy desk. Then less risk unless it is a targeted theft.
Lift the closest corner, pull the cable from under the leg. I don't consider myself to be particularly strong, but I don't think I've ever seen a desk I couldn't lift a corner at least the thickness of those metal security cables off the ground. Or they'll just take your own wire cutters from the garage and cut the cable.
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A Reset button, I'd understand. Maybe. But the power button (that requires to be held down for 4 seconds when the system's already running), which powers everything down, and then you have to press it again to power it back on...then yeah, that pretty much sounds like a cold boot to me. If you're not getting prompted for the BIOS password after that sequence...then I agree, it's useless.
dandy72 wrote:
yeah, that pretty much sounds like a cold boot to me.
It is not completely powered down. I have had to turn off the main switch power supply (on a full sized desktop PC) to make the PC clear all its caches, soft switches and selectors. For a period, our tasks at work repeatedly brought the PC into a state requiring a PS OFF reset; it always worked, and there was no other way of getting out of it. For a laptop with no classical PS, you might have to unplug the power cable - but power will usually be supplied by the battery. So you may have to unplug the power cord and remove the battery, at the same time. Maybe you even may have to leave them out for a while: Some electronics have a large capacitor that will supply essential circuits with power while you replace the battery pack with another one. If the battery can't be removed, you'll have to leave the PC running until the battery is completely drained.
Religious freedom is the freedom to say that two plus two make five.
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Check the power management settings - your power button is probably set to "sleep" or "hibernate" but there is a "Shut down" option which should restart the OS on power up and require access control to the drives:
Control Panel > Hardware and Sound > Power Options > Chose what the power buttons do"I have no idea what I did, but I'm taking full credit for it." - ThisOldTony "Common sense is so rare these days, it should be classified as a super power" - Random T-shirt AntiTwitter: @DalekDave is now a follower!
Ironically, the shutdown option does not fully shut down the machine, it hibernates things for a faster start up, while the reboot option does quiesce the files for a fresh start up. Check this link for more information if you do not think I'm right. Actually, don't believe me - check it for yourself. How to disable Windows 10 fast startup (and why you'd want to) | Windows Central[^] The search string to Google for is "Disable fast startup" Just switching your machine off at the power probably doesn't make Windows any less reliable. The filesystem should pretty much cope - though odd applications will require their files to be saved or the program to be exited to avoid the loss of data.
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Sound advice, but I use Windows Security Ransomware Protection on all folders where data are stored. My Macrium system images are protected by Macrium's Image Garden against any and all unauthorized alterations. Then I also maintain an old style 8TB Western Digital spinning disk drive for off-line storage of all important data. This drive is kept powered down an disconnected 99% of the time. On top of all that: I make at least every week a DVD backup of all new critical data. The DVDs are closed and locked after creation to prevent any further changes. I have a high pile of such old DVDs in my off-line collection. As regards my system drive: If the worst happens I can always clean my systems drive and do a clean install of Windows on the drive. I have done many clean installs and it typically takes me 3 or so hours to be fully up and running. I always keep a few flash drives with the bootable tiny Windows PE operating system that has embedded the Diskpart utility that can forcibly clean any disk and prepare it for a clean install. I don't have much faith in backups on the cloud and mostly avoid that. Some of my critical backups are stored off site in a relative's residence. If you want to know more about Windows PE, see: Windows PE (WinPE) | Microsoft Learn[^]
Ok, I have had my coffee, so you can all come out now!
You might want to back off the coffee :) Seroiusly, that's a lot off effort you've gone to. Why? Is it the nature of the data?
Charlie Gilley “They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.” BF, 1759 Has never been more appropriate.
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I have a couple of external USB drives for backups of data, attached to my PC. The drives are Bitlocker encrypted, in case one gets lost or stolen. Everytime I start the PC I have to use my Bitlocker password to get access to the drives. However, I recently discovered that once I have access to a drive, if I turn off the PC by hitting the power button instead of doing a proper shutdown through the Start menu, any "open" drives remain open. Next time I start the machine, the drive is immediately accessible. No password needed! You have to go through the proper shutdown procedure to ensure your machine won't have immediate access to the drive on the next startup. I must admit I haven't checked if a different computer will also have access to the drive left open on my main PC. But the point is: My main PC may get stolen with the external drives during a burglary, for example.
Ok, I have had my coffee, so you can all come out now!
Beware the [Fast Startup](https://www.windowscentral.com/software-apps/windows-11/how-to-enable-or-disable-fast-startup-on-windows-11) as it stores the status of the OS drivers (incl. decryption keys) (but not the userland). It hit VeraCrypt, too. It may hit the task scheduler, too.
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Yes, I found the setting to change what the power buttons do. I changed that from "sleep" to "shut down". BUT: There is no way to save this change! X| At least not in the very latest version of Windows 11! When I exit the settings panel, Windows resets the setting to the default "sleep"! Stoopid Windows!
Ok, I have had my coffee, so you can all come out now!
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dandy72 wrote:
yeah, that pretty much sounds like a cold boot to me.
It is not completely powered down. I have had to turn off the main switch power supply (on a full sized desktop PC) to make the PC clear all its caches, soft switches and selectors. For a period, our tasks at work repeatedly brought the PC into a state requiring a PS OFF reset; it always worked, and there was no other way of getting out of it. For a laptop with no classical PS, you might have to unplug the power cable - but power will usually be supplied by the battery. So you may have to unplug the power cord and remove the battery, at the same time. Maybe you even may have to leave them out for a while: Some electronics have a large capacitor that will supply essential circuits with power while you replace the battery pack with another one. If the battery can't be removed, you'll have to leave the PC running until the battery is completely drained.
Religious freedom is the freedom to say that two plus two make five.
True, some modern power supplies can play all sorts of tricks so "powering down" no longer necessarily means what it used to. Nothing beats yanking out the power cord however (and taking out the battery if it's a laptop). And then waiting a bit since, as you say, some systems have large capacitors.
trønderen wrote:
If the battery can't be removed
...I won't be buying it.
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I have a couple of external USB drives for backups of data, attached to my PC. The drives are Bitlocker encrypted, in case one gets lost or stolen. Everytime I start the PC I have to use my Bitlocker password to get access to the drives. However, I recently discovered that once I have access to a drive, if I turn off the PC by hitting the power button instead of doing a proper shutdown through the Start menu, any "open" drives remain open. Next time I start the machine, the drive is immediately accessible. No password needed! You have to go through the proper shutdown procedure to ensure your machine won't have immediate access to the drive on the next startup. I must admit I haven't checked if a different computer will also have access to the drive left open on my main PC. But the point is: My main PC may get stolen with the external drives during a burglary, for example.
Ok, I have had my coffee, so you can all come out now!
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jschell wrote:
I am not rigorous in this but I do see a lot of PC cases with lock ports. Attach a cable lock to it and a heavy desk. Then less risk unless it is a targeted theft.
Lift the closest corner, pull the cable from under the leg. I don't consider myself to be particularly strong, but I don't think I've ever seen a desk I couldn't lift a corner at least the thickness of those metal security cables off the ground. Or they'll just take your own wire cutters from the garage and cut the cable.
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dandy72 wrote:
Lift the closest corner, pull the cable from under the leg.
My desk has support braces. One cannot 'lift' it to get the cable off.
