What is inside windows
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aka "Refactoring" :-D I hope that you have money because it’s necessary to be practical. And I hope that at least once a year you put some money in front of you and say "you are mine" just to make clear who owns who. - Victor Hugo
Now, if you write it correctly the first time, do you have to refactor it afterwards? :-D
Flight to Redmond - £200 Bulldozer Rental - £100 Destroying the MS campus single handedly for not doing an Academic upgrade, PRICELESS! -Jonny Newman
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Yeah, it's a mess. In Longhorn, they're planning to reduce the # of APIs from 75,000 :omg: to about 9000, while at the same time adding functionality.
"Blessed are the peacemakers, for they shall be called sons of God." - Jesus
"You must be the change you wish to see in the world." - Mahatma GandhiBut the number of Interfaces will probably go from 10,000 to 10,000,000. Todd Smith
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Now, if you write it correctly the first time, do you have to refactor it afterwards? :-D
Flight to Redmond - £200 Bulldozer Rental - £100 Destroying the MS campus single handedly for not doing an Academic upgrade, PRICELESS! -Jonny Newman
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I have yet to see any software that doesn't suffer from entropy. Tim Smith I'm going to patent thought. I have yet to see any prior art.
Here's one:
main(){}nyeah nyeah nyeah evilpen dot net :: embrace the lie -
I have yet to see any software that doesn't suffer from entropy. Tim Smith I'm going to patent thought. I have yet to see any prior art.
I know...I was just joking. The Windows API is such a big target...I just couldn't resist. :)
youd ebtter bnot be taki8ng agvantage o f my mental abilites!1 -David Wulff one night over MSN while totally plastered
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Here's one:
main(){}nyeah nyeah nyeah evilpen dot net :: embrace the lie -
I know...I was just joking. The Windows API is such a big target...I just couldn't resist. :)
youd ebtter bnot be taki8ng agvantage o f my mental abilites!1 -David Wulff one night over MSN while totally plastered
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Now, if you write it correctly the first time, do you have to refactor it afterwards? :-D
Flight to Redmond - £200 Bulldozer Rental - £100 Destroying the MS campus single handedly for not doing an Academic upgrade, PRICELESS! -Jonny Newman
Actually, yes... simply because things change over time. I think refactoring can be a good thing, it can keep code from becoming an ugly mess of spaghetti and hacks (that sounds like a recipe in my Better Homes and Gardens cookbook... :-D ) "When a man sits with a pretty girl for an hour, it seems like a minute. But let him sit on a hot stove for a minute and it's longer than any hour. That's relativity." - Albert Einstein
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Windows API has many functions, old and new, which works and not or whish haves different names but still doing the same thing. Looking at Windows API I imagine what windows code looks like :wtf:. XP has god look but what is inside ? P.S. my japanese english looks like windows API too, but i hope you’ll understand it.:)
I think it's because they put too much emphasis on backwards compatibility. I mean, man, most of the OS files are still in 8.3 format! :wtf: I'd say, make some sort of emulator for legacy stuff, and move on. (This should be easier than ever now, since AFAIK Microsoft recently bought out VirtualPC, which can run operating systems in their own virtual machines.) Windows could be so much more than what it is if they'd let go of the past. "When a man sits with a pretty girl for an hour, it seems like a minute. But let him sit on a hot stove for a minute and it's longer than any hour. That's relativity." - Albert Einstein
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Actually, yes... simply because things change over time. I think refactoring can be a good thing, it can keep code from becoming an ugly mess of spaghetti and hacks (that sounds like a recipe in my Better Homes and Gardens cookbook... :-D ) "When a man sits with a pretty girl for an hour, it seems like a minute. But let him sit on a hot stove for a minute and it's longer than any hour. That's relativity." - Albert Einstein
I totally agree. At one point or another you'll have to either refactor or dump. The point is to make it easy to refactor to begin with, and refactor as soon as you see a problem (where possible), so that you won't have a real headache later.
"Blessed are the peacemakers, for they shall be called sons of God." - Jesus
"You must be the change you wish to see in the world." - Mahatma Gandhi -
I totally agree. At one point or another you'll have to either refactor or dump. The point is to make it easy to refactor to begin with, and refactor as soon as you see a problem (where possible), so that you won't have a real headache later.
"Blessed are the peacemakers, for they shall be called sons of God." - Jesus
"You must be the change you wish to see in the world." - Mahatma GandhiDarn straight! It is much easier to refactor code that already works pretty well, than it is to refactor a big glob of goo. "When a man sits with a pretty girl for an hour, it seems like a minute. But let him sit on a hot stove for a minute and it's longer than any hour. That's relativity." - Albert Einstein
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I think it's because they put too much emphasis on backwards compatibility. I mean, man, most of the OS files are still in 8.3 format! :wtf: I'd say, make some sort of emulator for legacy stuff, and move on. (This should be easier than ever now, since AFAIK Microsoft recently bought out VirtualPC, which can run operating systems in their own virtual machines.) Windows could be so much more than what it is if they'd let go of the past. "When a man sits with a pretty girl for an hour, it seems like a minute. But let him sit on a hot stove for a minute and it's longer than any hour. That's relativity." - Albert Einstein
Yeah, I tend to agree. But I think they're heading this way with Longhorn (look at NexGen for example). They'll have the WinPE pre-boot executing environment, and a totally new kernel, API, rendering system, file system, etc.
"Blessed are the peacemakers, for they shall be called sons of God." - Jesus
"You must be the change you wish to see in the world." - Mahatma Gandhi -
Yeah, I tend to agree. But I think they're heading this way with Longhorn (look at NexGen for example). They'll have the WinPE pre-boot executing environment, and a totally new kernel, API, rendering system, file system, etc.
"Blessed are the peacemakers, for they shall be called sons of God." - Jesus
"You must be the change you wish to see in the world." - Mahatma Gandhi:knock-on-wood: From what I konw about Longhorn, there are still large parts of it (especially drivers) completely up in the air, so it could change at any moment. "When a man sits with a pretty girl for an hour, it seems like a minute. But let him sit on a hot stove for a minute and it's longer than any hour. That's relativity." - Albert Einstein
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Now, if you write it correctly the first time, do you have to refactor it afterwards? :-D
Flight to Redmond - £200 Bulldozer Rental - £100 Destroying the MS campus single handedly for not doing an Academic upgrade, PRICELESS! -Jonny Newman
This would mean that MS envisioned Windows XP running on a 3Ghz hyperthreading P4 with 1GB RAM when all we had was Win3.1 running on a 386 with 4MB RAM. Damn, my video card has 12.8 times more memory than my first hard disk. I hope that you have money because it’s necessary to be practical. And I hope that at least once a year you put some money in front of you and say "you are mine" just to make clear who owns who. - Victor Hugo
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Wait till the change orders start coming in. Tim Smith I'm going to patent thought. I have yet to see any prior art.
lol :laugh: evilpen dot net :: embrace the lie
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I think it's because they put too much emphasis on backwards compatibility. I mean, man, most of the OS files are still in 8.3 format! :wtf: I'd say, make some sort of emulator for legacy stuff, and move on. (This should be easier than ever now, since AFAIK Microsoft recently bought out VirtualPC, which can run operating systems in their own virtual machines.) Windows could be so much more than what it is if they'd let go of the past. "When a man sits with a pretty girl for an hour, it seems like a minute. But let him sit on a hot stove for a minute and it's longer than any hour. That's relativity." - Albert Einstein
Navin wrote: I think it's because they put too much emphasis on backwards compatibility Not for every Microsoft product. See Microsoft Visual Studio. I am not even talking about the project file formats. Rather the COFF file format that has been changed. Poor decisions. Navin wrote: I mean, man, most of the OS files are still in 8.3 format! Or the full path of a file limited to 512 bytes on a NTFS system. Now tell me MS guys are visionaires.
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Navin wrote: I think it's because they put too much emphasis on backwards compatibility Not for every Microsoft product. See Microsoft Visual Studio. I am not even talking about the project file formats. Rather the COFF file format that has been changed. Poor decisions. Navin wrote: I mean, man, most of the OS files are still in 8.3 format! Or the full path of a file limited to 512 bytes on a NTFS system. Now tell me MS guys are visionaires.
Poor design decisions early on make for major problems later. There are many things in Windows that are poorly designed. I hope that they do better in Longhorn. As far as the MS guys not being visionaries, they're all individual people, and some are visionaries, and some aren't.
"Blessed are the peacemakers, for they shall be called sons of God." - Jesus
"You must be the change you wish to see in the world." - Mahatma Gandhi -
Poor design decisions early on make for major problems later. There are many things in Windows that are poorly designed. I hope that they do better in Longhorn. As far as the MS guys not being visionaries, they're all individual people, and some are visionaries, and some aren't.
"Blessed are the peacemakers, for they shall be called sons of God." - Jesus
"You must be the change you wish to see in the world." - Mahatma Gandhijdunlap wrote: Poor design decisions early on make for major problems later. There are many things in Windows that are poorly designed. I hope that they do better in Longhorn. As far as the MS guys not being visionaries, they're all individual people, and some are visionaries, and some aren't. Longhorn uses NTFS (WinFS is only an add-on to improve the search feature). Because of the many limitations of NTFS (I have cited the one about path length limitation, but you can read more elsewhere about the issues) ; because NTFS was designed in early 90s where demand for audio visuals were not exactly the same ; because 80-120GB hard drives are common these days, and probably we'll be playing with 1TB hard drives in 2008 ; because requirements are different since the use is different ; then yes, you are right, <sarcasm> MS guys are really visionaires and are proving they adapt quite well the changes in environments, just as when BillGates said in 1994 that he didn't give a shit about the internet.</sarcasm>. PS : unlike you said "some are visionaries some are not", there can't be such thing at Microsoft, this would imply that : - there is no design review (a design review would automatically filter out the isolated issues) - what are all the lead product managers, product managers, lead program managers, program managers, lead software design engineers, software design engineers paid for ? - there is no cross-team work. Obvious at this point. - there is no code review - what are all the lead product managers, product managers, lead program managers, program managers, lead software design engineers, software design engineers paid for ? - there is no QA - what are the QA paid for ? - what are the user groups for ? - what are the beta testers for ? - last but not least, what about customer satisfaction? As soon as people at Microsoft will start getting paid based on customer satisfaction, I can tell you the guys will behave differently. They just need a baffle.
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jdunlap wrote: Poor design decisions early on make for major problems later. There are many things in Windows that are poorly designed. I hope that they do better in Longhorn. As far as the MS guys not being visionaries, they're all individual people, and some are visionaries, and some aren't. Longhorn uses NTFS (WinFS is only an add-on to improve the search feature). Because of the many limitations of NTFS (I have cited the one about path length limitation, but you can read more elsewhere about the issues) ; because NTFS was designed in early 90s where demand for audio visuals were not exactly the same ; because 80-120GB hard drives are common these days, and probably we'll be playing with 1TB hard drives in 2008 ; because requirements are different since the use is different ; then yes, you are right, <sarcasm> MS guys are really visionaires and are proving they adapt quite well the changes in environments, just as when BillGates said in 1994 that he didn't give a shit about the internet.</sarcasm>. PS : unlike you said "some are visionaries some are not", there can't be such thing at Microsoft, this would imply that : - there is no design review (a design review would automatically filter out the isolated issues) - what are all the lead product managers, product managers, lead program managers, program managers, lead software design engineers, software design engineers paid for ? - there is no cross-team work. Obvious at this point. - there is no code review - what are all the lead product managers, product managers, lead program managers, program managers, lead software design engineers, software design engineers paid for ? - there is no QA - what are the QA paid for ? - what are the user groups for ? - what are the beta testers for ? - last but not least, what about customer satisfaction? As soon as people at Microsoft will start getting paid based on customer satisfaction, I can tell you the guys will behave differently. They just need a baffle.
Oh good grief. If there was 1% of merit in all of the things you claim, Bill Gates would be a gas station attendant, not the chief software architect at Microsoft and the richest f**king man in the world. As much as any of you MS-bashers would like to claim otherwise, Microsoft deals with the same market as everybody else. The fact that they have dealt with it better than anyone else tells me that, somewhere along the line, they're doing things right. I didn't say they were ethical, nice, or the most technically proficient.
Software Zen:
delete this; -
Oh good grief. If there was 1% of merit in all of the things you claim, Bill Gates would be a gas station attendant, not the chief software architect at Microsoft and the richest f**king man in the world. As much as any of you MS-bashers would like to claim otherwise, Microsoft deals with the same market as everybody else. The fact that they have dealt with it better than anyone else tells me that, somewhere along the line, they're doing things right. I didn't say they were ethical, nice, or the most technically proficient.
Software Zen:
delete this;So you don't know what is a "first mover" advantage, and you don't see the lore of free-markets. Definitely Poor.