More fun with MSDN searching...
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My most recent search on MSDN online led to this gem:
Server Error in '/Downloads' Application.
There is not enough space on the disk.
Description: An unhandled exception occurred during the execution of the current web request. Please review the stack trace for more information about the error and where it originated in the code.Exception Details: System.IO.IOException: There is not enough space on the disk.
Source Error:
Line 691: try
Line 692: {
Line 693: downloads.cpmsftwbsx01.DownloadService dlQuery = new downloads.cpmsftwbsx01.DownloadService();
Line 694: dlQuery.Url = sDownloadCenterUrl;
Line 695: results = dlQuery.GetSummaries("","","","","","",strMsdnKeyWordHack,"",DcLanguageId,"","","","50","",Sparams.ToString());Source File: d:\http\downloads\code\msdn_dc.cs Line: 693
Stack Trace:
[IOException: There is not enough space on the disk.
]
System.IO.__Error.WinIOError(Int32 errorCode, String str) +723
System.IO.FileStream..ctor(String path, FileMode mode, FileAccess access, FileShare share, Int32 bufferSize, Boolean useAsync, String msgPath, Boolean bFromProxy) +888
System.IO.FileStream..ctor(String path, FileMode mode, FileAccess access, FileShare share) +45
System.CodeDom.Compiler.CodeCompiler.FromSourceBatch(CompilerParameters options, String[] sources) +278
System.CodeDom.Compiler.CodeCompiler.FromSource(CompilerParameters options, String source) +90
System.CodeDom.Compiler.CodeCompiler.System.CodeDom.Compiler.ICodeCompiler.CompileAssemblyFromSource(CompilerParameters options, String source) +37
System.Xml.Serialization.Compiler.Compile() +398
System.Xml.Serialization.TempAssembly..ctor(XmlMapping[] xmlMappings) +1259
System.Xml.Serialization.XmlSerializer.FromMappings(XmlMapping[] mappings) +60
System.Web.Services.Protocols.SoapClientType..ctor(Type type) +968
System.Web.Services.Protocols.SoapHttpClientProtocol..ctor() +151
downloads.cpmsftwbsx01.DownloadService..ctor()
ASP.default_aspx.LoadTop50() in d:\http\downloads\code\msdn_dc.cs:693
ASP.default_aspx.DoInitSetup() in d:\http\downloads\code\msdn_dc.cs:56
ASP.default_aspx.Page_Load(Object sender, EventArgs ePageRefresh) in d:\http\downloads\code\msdn_dc.cs:25
System.Web.UI.Control.OnLoad(EventArgs e) +67
System.Web.UI.Control.LoadRecursive() +35
System.Web.UI.Page.ProcessRequestMain() +731
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My most recent search on MSDN online led to this gem:
Server Error in '/Downloads' Application.
There is not enough space on the disk.
Description: An unhandled exception occurred during the execution of the current web request. Please review the stack trace for more information about the error and where it originated in the code.Exception Details: System.IO.IOException: There is not enough space on the disk.
Source Error:
Line 691: try
Line 692: {
Line 693: downloads.cpmsftwbsx01.DownloadService dlQuery = new downloads.cpmsftwbsx01.DownloadService();
Line 694: dlQuery.Url = sDownloadCenterUrl;
Line 695: results = dlQuery.GetSummaries("","","","","","",strMsdnKeyWordHack,"",DcLanguageId,"","","","50","",Sparams.ToString());Source File: d:\http\downloads\code\msdn_dc.cs Line: 693
Stack Trace:
[IOException: There is not enough space on the disk.
]
System.IO.__Error.WinIOError(Int32 errorCode, String str) +723
System.IO.FileStream..ctor(String path, FileMode mode, FileAccess access, FileShare share, Int32 bufferSize, Boolean useAsync, String msgPath, Boolean bFromProxy) +888
System.IO.FileStream..ctor(String path, FileMode mode, FileAccess access, FileShare share) +45
System.CodeDom.Compiler.CodeCompiler.FromSourceBatch(CompilerParameters options, String[] sources) +278
System.CodeDom.Compiler.CodeCompiler.FromSource(CompilerParameters options, String source) +90
System.CodeDom.Compiler.CodeCompiler.System.CodeDom.Compiler.ICodeCompiler.CompileAssemblyFromSource(CompilerParameters options, String source) +37
System.Xml.Serialization.Compiler.Compile() +398
System.Xml.Serialization.TempAssembly..ctor(XmlMapping[] xmlMappings) +1259
System.Xml.Serialization.XmlSerializer.FromMappings(XmlMapping[] mappings) +60
System.Web.Services.Protocols.SoapClientType..ctor(Type type) +968
System.Web.Services.Protocols.SoapHttpClientProtocol..ctor() +151
downloads.cpmsftwbsx01.DownloadService..ctor()
ASP.default_aspx.LoadTop50() in d:\http\downloads\code\msdn_dc.cs:693
ASP.default_aspx.DoInitSetup() in d:\http\downloads\code\msdn_dc.cs:56
ASP.default_aspx.Page_Load(Object sender, EventArgs ePageRefresh) in d:\http\downloads\code\msdn_dc.cs:25
System.Web.UI.Control.OnLoad(EventArgs e) +67
System.Web.UI.Control.LoadRecursive() +35
System.Web.UI.Page.ProcessRequestMain() +731
Jim Crafton wrote: strMsdnKeyWordHack Have to love those cool var names :)
Paul Watson wrote: "At the end of the day it is what you produce that counts, not how many doctorates you have on the wall." George Carlin wrote: "Don't sweat the petty things, and don't pet the sweaty things." Jörgen Sigvardsson wrote: If the physicists find a universal theory describing the laws of universe, I'm sure the asshole constant will be an integral part of that theory.
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My most recent search on MSDN online led to this gem:
Server Error in '/Downloads' Application.
There is not enough space on the disk.
Description: An unhandled exception occurred during the execution of the current web request. Please review the stack trace for more information about the error and where it originated in the code.Exception Details: System.IO.IOException: There is not enough space on the disk.
Source Error:
Line 691: try
Line 692: {
Line 693: downloads.cpmsftwbsx01.DownloadService dlQuery = new downloads.cpmsftwbsx01.DownloadService();
Line 694: dlQuery.Url = sDownloadCenterUrl;
Line 695: results = dlQuery.GetSummaries("","","","","","",strMsdnKeyWordHack,"",DcLanguageId,"","","","50","",Sparams.ToString());Source File: d:\http\downloads\code\msdn_dc.cs Line: 693
Stack Trace:
[IOException: There is not enough space on the disk.
]
System.IO.__Error.WinIOError(Int32 errorCode, String str) +723
System.IO.FileStream..ctor(String path, FileMode mode, FileAccess access, FileShare share, Int32 bufferSize, Boolean useAsync, String msgPath, Boolean bFromProxy) +888
System.IO.FileStream..ctor(String path, FileMode mode, FileAccess access, FileShare share) +45
System.CodeDom.Compiler.CodeCompiler.FromSourceBatch(CompilerParameters options, String[] sources) +278
System.CodeDom.Compiler.CodeCompiler.FromSource(CompilerParameters options, String source) +90
System.CodeDom.Compiler.CodeCompiler.System.CodeDom.Compiler.ICodeCompiler.CompileAssemblyFromSource(CompilerParameters options, String source) +37
System.Xml.Serialization.Compiler.Compile() +398
System.Xml.Serialization.TempAssembly..ctor(XmlMapping[] xmlMappings) +1259
System.Xml.Serialization.XmlSerializer.FromMappings(XmlMapping[] mappings) +60
System.Web.Services.Protocols.SoapClientType..ctor(Type type) +968
System.Web.Services.Protocols.SoapHttpClientProtocol..ctor() +151
downloads.cpmsftwbsx01.DownloadService..ctor()
ASP.default_aspx.LoadTop50() in d:\http\downloads\code\msdn_dc.cs:693
ASP.default_aspx.DoInitSetup() in d:\http\downloads\code\msdn_dc.cs:56
ASP.default_aspx.Page_Load(Object sender, EventArgs ePageRefresh) in d:\http\downloads\code\msdn_dc.cs:25
System.Web.UI.Control.OnLoad(EventArgs e) +67
System.Web.UI.Control.LoadRecursive() +35
System.Web.UI.Page.ProcessRequestMain() +731
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Hmmm...more importantly why is Microsoft running their ASP.NET applications in debug mode with the stack trace going out to the public despite their warnings against doing that in their documentation?
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Hey... at least they don't run MSDN on PHP! :rolleyes:
"Der Geist des Kriegers ist erwacht / Ich hab die Macht" StS
sighist | Agile Programming | doxygen -
My most recent search on MSDN online led to this gem:
Server Error in '/Downloads' Application.
There is not enough space on the disk.
Description: An unhandled exception occurred during the execution of the current web request. Please review the stack trace for more information about the error and where it originated in the code.Exception Details: System.IO.IOException: There is not enough space on the disk.
Source Error:
Line 691: try
Line 692: {
Line 693: downloads.cpmsftwbsx01.DownloadService dlQuery = new downloads.cpmsftwbsx01.DownloadService();
Line 694: dlQuery.Url = sDownloadCenterUrl;
Line 695: results = dlQuery.GetSummaries("","","","","","",strMsdnKeyWordHack,"",DcLanguageId,"","","","50","",Sparams.ToString());Source File: d:\http\downloads\code\msdn_dc.cs Line: 693
Stack Trace:
[IOException: There is not enough space on the disk.
]
System.IO.__Error.WinIOError(Int32 errorCode, String str) +723
System.IO.FileStream..ctor(String path, FileMode mode, FileAccess access, FileShare share, Int32 bufferSize, Boolean useAsync, String msgPath, Boolean bFromProxy) +888
System.IO.FileStream..ctor(String path, FileMode mode, FileAccess access, FileShare share) +45
System.CodeDom.Compiler.CodeCompiler.FromSourceBatch(CompilerParameters options, String[] sources) +278
System.CodeDom.Compiler.CodeCompiler.FromSource(CompilerParameters options, String source) +90
System.CodeDom.Compiler.CodeCompiler.System.CodeDom.Compiler.ICodeCompiler.CompileAssemblyFromSource(CompilerParameters options, String source) +37
System.Xml.Serialization.Compiler.Compile() +398
System.Xml.Serialization.TempAssembly..ctor(XmlMapping[] xmlMappings) +1259
System.Xml.Serialization.XmlSerializer.FromMappings(XmlMapping[] mappings) +60
System.Web.Services.Protocols.SoapClientType..ctor(Type type) +968
System.Web.Services.Protocols.SoapHttpClientProtocol..ctor() +151
downloads.cpmsftwbsx01.DownloadService..ctor()
ASP.default_aspx.LoadTop50() in d:\http\downloads\code\msdn_dc.cs:693
ASP.default_aspx.DoInitSetup() in d:\http\downloads\code\msdn_dc.cs:56
ASP.default_aspx.Page_Load(Object sender, EventArgs ePageRefresh) in d:\http\downloads\code\msdn_dc.cs:25
System.Web.UI.Control.OnLoad(EventArgs e) +67
System.Web.UI.Control.LoadRecursive() +35
System.Web.UI.Page.ProcessRequestMain() +731
Jim Crafton wrote: Huh, now that's helpful! You'd think that the web folks at MS would try and do a better job.... Jeez...I get really sick and tired of hearing this crap. :mad: Have you ever written a big program that didn't exactly work correctly? Have you ever had an error in your code? Besides, check out the error... Have you ever done work with .NET? Do you know what a System.IO.IOException is? Especially with the "There is not enough space on the disk" message? It means they freaking ran out of disk space on the server you were on. It's not a bug in their code...it's a hardware flaw...they didn't plan on having run out of disk space. Do you ever take that into account in your code? :|
youd ebtter bnot be taki8ng agvantage o f my mental abilites!1 -David Wulff one night over MSN while totally plastered
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Jim Crafton wrote: Huh, now that's helpful! You'd think that the web folks at MS would try and do a better job.... Jeez...I get really sick and tired of hearing this crap. :mad: Have you ever written a big program that didn't exactly work correctly? Have you ever had an error in your code? Besides, check out the error... Have you ever done work with .NET? Do you know what a System.IO.IOException is? Especially with the "There is not enough space on the disk" message? It means they freaking ran out of disk space on the server you were on. It's not a bug in their code...it's a hardware flaw...they didn't plan on having run out of disk space. Do you ever take that into account in your code? :|
youd ebtter bnot be taki8ng agvantage o f my mental abilites!1 -David Wulff one night over MSN while totally plastered
David Stone wrote: Jeez...I get really sick and tired of hearing this crap. Have you ever written a big program that didn't exactly work correctly? Have you ever had an error in your code? I think the real issue is that the exception trace is visible for all and sundry to see. They should have the configuration setup on a production box to direct all errors to a 'friendly' error page, and log the trace to the event log. Also, the fact you can see the sourcecode indicates it's running in debug mode - Which affects performance (as well as being questionable from a security viewpoint) At least they're not exposing server names or sprocs in the code... :rolleyes: John[^]
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Jim Crafton wrote: Huh, now that's helpful! You'd think that the web folks at MS would try and do a better job.... Jeez...I get really sick and tired of hearing this crap. :mad: Have you ever written a big program that didn't exactly work correctly? Have you ever had an error in your code? Besides, check out the error... Have you ever done work with .NET? Do you know what a System.IO.IOException is? Especially with the "There is not enough space on the disk" message? It means they freaking ran out of disk space on the server you were on. It's not a bug in their code...it's a hardware flaw...they didn't plan on having run out of disk space. Do you ever take that into account in your code? :|
youd ebtter bnot be taki8ng agvantage o f my mental abilites!1 -David Wulff one night over MSN while totally plastered
David Stone wrote: Have you ever written a big program that didn't exactly work correctly? No. David Stone wrote: Have you ever had an error in your code? Not that I ever heard about. Of course, I've never worked in a commercial environment where releasing a product when Marketing promised it is more important than releasing one that works. The DoD is picky about that...
"Nobody is Ugly at 2AM"
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Jim Crafton wrote: Huh, now that's helpful! You'd think that the web folks at MS would try and do a better job.... Jeez...I get really sick and tired of hearing this crap. :mad: Have you ever written a big program that didn't exactly work correctly? Have you ever had an error in your code? Besides, check out the error... Have you ever done work with .NET? Do you know what a System.IO.IOException is? Especially with the "There is not enough space on the disk" message? It means they freaking ran out of disk space on the server you were on. It's not a bug in their code...it's a hardware flaw...they didn't plan on having run out of disk space. Do you ever take that into account in your code? :|
youd ebtter bnot be taki8ng agvantage o f my mental abilites!1 -David Wulff one night over MSN while totally plastered
David Stone wrote: Have you ever written a big program that didn't exactly work correctly? Nope. David Stone wrote: Have you ever done work with .NET? Do you know what a System.IO.IOException is? Yep. Yep. David Stone wrote: Do you ever take that into account in your code? If its an issue, then I would ;P
To those who didn't make it, we will remember you. To those who did :bob: is back. - Megan Forbes in Black Friday
Another Post by NnamdiOnyeyiri -
Jim Crafton wrote: Huh, now that's helpful! You'd think that the web folks at MS would try and do a better job.... Jeez...I get really sick and tired of hearing this crap. :mad: Have you ever written a big program that didn't exactly work correctly? Have you ever had an error in your code? Besides, check out the error... Have you ever done work with .NET? Do you know what a System.IO.IOException is? Especially with the "There is not enough space on the disk" message? It means they freaking ran out of disk space on the server you were on. It's not a bug in their code...it's a hardware flaw...they didn't plan on having run out of disk space. Do you ever take that into account in your code? :|
youd ebtter bnot be taki8ng agvantage o f my mental abilites!1 -David Wulff one night over MSN while totally plastered
Yes I have written several large programs all of which were well beyound 200K LOC. Yeah I am aware of .NET. That doesn't excuse the sloppy testing/coding. They should have caught the exception, and routed the user to an HTML error page, not a stupid stack dump, which not only exposes some of the code, but also exposes the directory tree that the stuff is running on. It's called testing. People who get paid for the code they write generally do at least some level of it. I'm NOT saying that I write perfect, flawless, bugfree, code. But I am saying that given the overwhelmingly vast and well funded resources that MS has at it's disposal that this kind of thing is pretty inexcusable. ¡El diablo está en mis pantalones! ¡Mire, mire! Real Mentats use only 100% pure, unfooled around with Sapho Juice(tm)!
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David Stone wrote: Have you ever written a big program that didn't exactly work correctly? No. David Stone wrote: Have you ever had an error in your code? Not that I ever heard about. Of course, I've never worked in a commercial environment where releasing a product when Marketing promised it is more important than releasing one that works. The DoD is picky about that...
"Nobody is Ugly at 2AM"
Were you the tester of your own coding? :confused: (I believe that when the application becomes big enough, it's quiet impossible for the coder to do the testings correctly)
Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired, signifies in the final sense a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and are not clothed - Dwight D. Eisenhower
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Jim Crafton wrote: Huh, now that's helpful! You'd think that the web folks at MS would try and do a better job.... Jeez...I get really sick and tired of hearing this crap. :mad: Have you ever written a big program that didn't exactly work correctly? Have you ever had an error in your code? Besides, check out the error... Have you ever done work with .NET? Do you know what a System.IO.IOException is? Especially with the "There is not enough space on the disk" message? It means they freaking ran out of disk space on the server you were on. It's not a bug in their code...it's a hardware flaw...they didn't plan on having run out of disk space. Do you ever take that into account in your code? :|
youd ebtter bnot be taki8ng agvantage o f my mental abilites!1 -David Wulff one night over MSN while totally plastered
David Stone wrote: Jeez...I get really sick and tired of hearing this crap. Have you ever written a big program that didn't exactly work correctly? Have you ever had an error in your code? Besides, check out the error... Um...do a lot of asp.net development? :) Yes I get errors, but no I would never have a production app set to debug mode and I certainly wouldn't show the contents of the stack trace to the general public. Microsoft and in particular MSDN are judged by a higher standard and should follow their own best practice documents at the very least.
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Jim Crafton wrote: Huh, now that's helpful! You'd think that the web folks at MS would try and do a better job.... Jeez...I get really sick and tired of hearing this crap. :mad: Have you ever written a big program that didn't exactly work correctly? Have you ever had an error in your code? Besides, check out the error... Have you ever done work with .NET? Do you know what a System.IO.IOException is? Especially with the "There is not enough space on the disk" message? It means they freaking ran out of disk space on the server you were on. It's not a bug in their code...it's a hardware flaw...they didn't plan on having run out of disk space. Do you ever take that into account in your code? :|
youd ebtter bnot be taki8ng agvantage o f my mental abilites!1 -David Wulff one night over MSN while totally plastered
> they didn't plan on having run out of disk space. Do you ever take > that into account in your code? :wtf: Of course, don't you? Or do you blindly write to a file and let your code puke all over the user when it does run out of disk space? Handling errors gracefully isn't just a good idea, it's a way of life.
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> they didn't plan on having run out of disk space. Do you ever take > that into account in your code? :wtf: Of course, don't you? Or do you blindly write to a file and let your code puke all over the user when it does run out of disk space? Handling errors gracefully isn't just a good idea, it's a way of life.
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David Stone wrote: Jeez...I get really sick and tired of hearing this crap. Have you ever written a big program that didn't exactly work correctly? Have you ever had an error in your code? I think the real issue is that the exception trace is visible for all and sundry to see. They should have the configuration setup on a production box to direct all errors to a 'friendly' error page, and log the trace to the event log. Also, the fact you can see the sourcecode indicates it's running in debug mode - Which affects performance (as well as being questionable from a security viewpoint) At least they're not exposing server names or sprocs in the code... :rolleyes: John[^]
John Honan wrote: I think the real issue is that the exception trace is visible for all and sundry to see. They should have the configuration setup on a production box to direct all errors to a 'friendly' error page, and log the trace to the event log. Point taken...and while that's relatively easy to do in ASP.NET, it may be that they forgot to put the Release mode App on that server rather than the Debug. Hey, it happens.[^]
Hawaian shirts and shorts work too in Summer. People assume you're either a complete nut (in which case not a worthy target) or so damn good you don't need to worry about camouflage... -Anna-Jayne Metcalfe on Paintballing
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David Stone wrote: Have you ever written a big program that didn't exactly work correctly? Nope. David Stone wrote: Have you ever done work with .NET? Do you know what a System.IO.IOException is? Yep. Yep. David Stone wrote: Do you ever take that into account in your code? If its an issue, then I would ;P
To those who didn't make it, we will remember you. To those who did :bob: is back. - Megan Forbes in Black Friday
Another Post by NnamdiOnyeyiriNnamdi Onyeyiri wrote: If its an issue, then I would What if it's not your code doing the writing? What if there's another app that just keeps consuming disk space? Like this.[^]
Hawaian shirts and shorts work too in Summer. People assume you're either a complete nut (in which case not a worthy target) or so damn good you don't need to worry about camouflage... -Anna-Jayne Metcalfe on Paintballing
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Were you the tester of your own coding? :confused: (I believe that when the application becomes big enough, it's quiet impossible for the coder to do the testings correctly)
Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired, signifies in the final sense a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and are not clothed - Dwight D. Eisenhower
KaЯl wrote: impossible for the coder to do the testings correctly) True. In defense work there is always a QA team to do the testing, and a specification that details exactly how the program must behave. A good, detailed spec really makes a programmer's job much simpler, and far too much code is written without one. Unlike commercial apps, improperly written code there can result in lots of unintentionally dead people. I'm happy to report that the DoD takes that responsibility very seriously, even if they do pay too much for toilet seats.:-D
"Nobody is Ugly at 2AM"
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> they didn't plan on having run out of disk space. Do you ever take > that into account in your code? :wtf: Of course, don't you? Or do you blindly write to a file and let your code puke all over the user when it does run out of disk space? Handling errors gracefully isn't just a good idea, it's a way of life.
Daniel Desormeaux wrote: Of course, don't you? Or do you blindly write to a file and let your code puke all over the user when it does run out of disk space? Actually no, because I never write to files on the HDD... if I were the one doing the I/O then yeah, sure...but from what it looks like, they were using a method in the framework that temporarily does disk I/O to compile stuff. How on earth would you trap for that type of thing? I wouldn't. I wouldn't even have thought to catch IOExceptions.
Hawaian shirts and shorts work too in Summer. People assume you're either a complete nut (in which case not a worthy target) or so damn good you don't need to worry about camouflage... -Anna-Jayne Metcalfe on Paintballing
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Yes I have written several large programs all of which were well beyound 200K LOC. Yeah I am aware of .NET. That doesn't excuse the sloppy testing/coding. They should have caught the exception, and routed the user to an HTML error page, not a stupid stack dump, which not only exposes some of the code, but also exposes the directory tree that the stuff is running on. It's called testing. People who get paid for the code they write generally do at least some level of it. I'm NOT saying that I write perfect, flawless, bugfree, code. But I am saying that given the overwhelmingly vast and well funded resources that MS has at it's disposal that this kind of thing is pretty inexcusable. ¡El diablo está en mis pantalones! ¡Mire, mire! Real Mentats use only 100% pure, unfooled around with Sapho Juice(tm)!
Jim Crafton wrote: Yeah I am aware of .NET. That doesn't excuse the sloppy testing/coding. They should have caught the exception, and routed the user to an HTML error page, not a stupid stack dump, which not only exposes some of the code, but also exposes the directory tree that the stuff is running on. If you'll notice, the call is nested in a try block. I'm sure though, that they were trying to catch a particular set of exceptions cause by the CodeDOM compiler that they're calling rather than the disk IO that the compiler, in turn, uses. If you're writing code to use the CodeDOM compilers, are you gonna think about disk space errors? I haven't! Granted, they should have included a general exception handler that redirects to an error page. But it could be that they "forgot" to put the Release mode assembly on that particular server, no? It's happened before.[^] I'm just saying that yes, everybody makes mistakes, but it seems people come down harder on MSFT for not catching their own. Why? They're human too...and I doubt that anybody would have ever thought to catch an IOException when calling a CodeDOM method. Besides, how often do you just run out of disk space?
Hawaian shirts and shorts work too in Summer. People assume you're either a complete nut (in which case not a worthy target) or so damn good you don't need to worry about camouflage... -Anna-Jayne Metcalfe on Paintballing
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Daniel Desormeaux wrote: Of course, don't you? Or do you blindly write to a file and let your code puke all over the user when it does run out of disk space? Actually no, because I never write to files on the HDD... if I were the one doing the I/O then yeah, sure...but from what it looks like, they were using a method in the framework that temporarily does disk I/O to compile stuff. How on earth would you trap for that type of thing? I wouldn't. I wouldn't even have thought to catch IOExceptions.
Hawaian shirts and shorts work too in Summer. People assume you're either a complete nut (in which case not a worthy target) or so damn good you don't need to worry about camouflage... -Anna-Jayne Metcalfe on Paintballing
I wouldn't of thought about it either... ...but then, come to think about it, I'm new and almost totally self-taught. I have a built-in exception.