Toe The Line?
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Yes, it is proof that the Taliban is either lying or incredibly stupid. As has been said already, often proof cannot be revealed without revealing the source. Do you think the US will tar & feather Bin Laden, or torture him ? You think he wouldn't get a trial ? You must be joking, the US would be feeling the eyes of the world on them if they had him in jail. You should not flame anyone who expresses a contrary opinion to yours! If you read my original post you will see that you actually agree with me without realising that! You think I flamed you ? You must be joking, you ain't seen nothin' if you want to start a flame war. Christian As I learn the innermost secrets of the around me, they reward me in many ways to keep quiet. Men with pierced ears are better prepared for marriage. They've experienced pain and bought Jewellery.
You think I flamed you ? You must be joking, you ain't seen nothin' if you want to start a flame war. Take your pick: 1, "Linux is better that Windowze" 2, "Women are better than men" 3, "Mine is bigger than yours" ;P
:bob: -=:bob:=-
David Wulff dwulff@battleaxesoftware.com
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Invade a way? Kill how many more people? And then feed the rest? How very practical! Kill someone's brother and sister etc and then feed him? U know what, he will take your food and turn around and bomb u tomorrow! That is a sure way to create more terrorists. Pakistan has closed it's borders to a flood of refugees. I am advocating that the US go through that border ( which constitutes invasion, they would be uninvited on an other countries soil ), and set up an armed force to protect the people there and themselves, and then feed the people who are starving on the border. Thus they would win the friendship of people who have suffered under the Taliban, and maybe even satisfy the US bashers on this forum. I doubt they could achieve the latter though. Why do u advocate this? Remember, life is precious - Afghan or American! Yeah, that's exactly the point I was trying to make. Christian As I learn the innermost secrets of the around me, they reward me in many ways to keep quiet. Men with pierced ears are better prepared for marriage. They've experienced pain and bought Jewellery.
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What on earth for? The UN are doing that. Why risk American soldiers in this way? Is that what the mobilisation was for? Will that help the current situation and find out who did it? :confused:
Because the Taliban is calling it's people to holy war. If the US does this, they will save lives on both sides, and they will have little trouble in wandering into the country to get ahold of the Taliban leaders and/or Bin Laden. Christian As I learn the innermost secrets of the around me, they reward me in many ways to keep quiet. Men with pierced ears are better prepared for marriage. They've experienced pain and bought Jewellery.
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So u think telling the Taliban 'Trust me, hand him over, I know he is guilty but I cannot tell u why. He will get a fair trail etc' is good enough? Remember this man fought for Afghanistan against the Russians and is some kind of hero. I have heard of quite a few miscarriages of justice! The legal system is not infallible.
Yeah, right. I see it now. The US should have, for example, asked the Mafia to hand over Al Capone and revealed all the sources they had IN the Mafia, knowing they would be treated fairly. I know it's a bit different, but it's a lot the same. Christian As I learn the innermost secrets of the around me, they reward me in many ways to keep quiet. Men with pierced ears are better prepared for marriage. They've experienced pain and bought Jewellery.
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Yeah, right. I see it now. The US should have, for example, asked the Mafia to hand over Al Capone and revealed all the sources they had IN the Mafia, knowing they would be treated fairly. I know it's a bit different, but it's a lot the same. Christian As I learn the innermost secrets of the around me, they reward me in many ways to keep quiet. Men with pierced ears are better prepared for marriage. They've experienced pain and bought Jewellery.
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Because the Taliban is calling it's people to holy war. If the US does this, they will save lives on both sides, and they will have little trouble in wandering into the country to get ahold of the Taliban leaders and/or Bin Laden. Christian As I learn the innermost secrets of the around me, they reward me in many ways to keep quiet. Men with pierced ears are better prepared for marriage. They've experienced pain and bought Jewellery.
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Give me ONE instance when a country has handed over a SUSPECT without any proof being submitted! Please hurry - can't wait!
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Give me ONE instance when a country has handed over a SUSPECT without any proof being submitted! Please hurry - can't wait!
What do you do when a country performs an act of war and refuses to take responsibility ? Christian As I learn the innermost secrets of the around me, they reward me in many ways to keep quiet. Men with pierced ears are better prepared for marriage. They've experienced pain and bought Jewellery.
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I think the UN is capable, I have not heard that those refugees are being killed by the Taliban. I think u should give up now! :-)
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I think the UN is capable, I have not heard that those refugees are being killed by the Taliban. I think u should give up now! :-)
I have not heard that those refugees are being killed by the Taliban. I think u should give up now! I'm quoting the refugees claims, which I have seen made on TV. Who knows, maybe the media covered some guy in mud, starved him a few months and mocked up the story. Maybe the guy was lying in the hope of some food. Either way, they claim it and I am quoting them. Christian As I learn the innermost secrets of the around me, they reward me in many ways to keep quiet. Men with pierced ears are better prepared for marriage. They've experienced pain and bought Jewellery.
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As for pouring a bucket of sun over the whole country I disagree. We need concrete proof and there is none! Retaliation is not the answer. In civilised society, if someone murders someone we take them to court to get justice and try them. As long as we have evidence! SO FAR THERE IS NONE! Don't forget a bucket of sun would affect the whole world and us. The effects would be catastrophic! Only a group of sick individuals are responsible for this (whoever they are) and they need to be brought to justice. Also what right does the govt have in using its superpower status to bully other countries into helping them? Give undeniable proof. Bin Laden has already said it wasn't him and so far we know him not to be a liar as he admitted his involvement in the Embassy bombing. And isn't it weird that big leads were left - arabic pilot training manuals and a Koran were found. Let's be honest if Bin Laden and his associates carried out these atrocities with such professionalism and extreme care in planning and precision. Do you really think they would leave any evidence like that? I think not and it's probably a false trail! We need to widen the search. Find out who did this and why? It is wrong for the govt to go bullying other countries and except them to toe/tow :-D the line without any substantial proof! Rich
There is plenty of evidence. You seem to confuse the words "proof" and "evidence". We only need probable cause to request his extradition. The whole purpose of a trial is to determine if the evidence is proof guilt. If you had to show proof of guilt before extradition, you would have to hold a trial in absentia, which is not something we want to do. It's true that the evidence is largely circumstantial. We have no signed confessions implicating Al Queda or OBL, but that's the purpose of a trial. Hell, if OJ Simpson can be acquitted, and there was mounds of evidence, OBL has a pretty good chance of getting a fair trial as well. Even if we can never directly link him to giving an order to do this, there is still plenty of other things which he is guilty of, such as aiding and funding the groups we know to be responsible. He built the machine which did the deed. Whether or not he ordered it, he is responsible for the actions of it. He's going to stand trial for more than the WTC attack. He'll stand trial for the USS Cole, the Embasy bombings, and several other attacks as well. Those we KNOW and have leveled much evidence against him. Based on only that evidence, the taliban should give him up. And BTW, the Talban admitted to lying today. OBL *IS* In Afghanistan, and under their protection. We can't trust them. -- Where are we going? And why am I in this handbasket?
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I use Call Alert because I cannot seem to fix my old login as email address has changed (cue chris) If you remember you password you can fix the email yourself. If your email changed and you don't know you password then we send Christian around to have a word with you about changing email adresses *before* you lose access to your old box ;) Send me an email and I'll fix it. I'll need some proof of ID for the old box. cheers, Chris Maunder (CodeProject)
Chris, If this is the Bart I think it is I'd be happy to vouch for him. David
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I would urge everyone to read the comments by Rickard OBerg(he is one of the makers of JBoss J2EE stack, in my opinion only rivaled by Orion and Weblogic) at: JavaLobby It was written several days after the attack and since then alot more things that just dont add up, came about.
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"OK...who funded and created Bin Laden? America Why? To fight the Russians and then he turned on America too" How illogical can you be? We give bin Ladin the financial support he needed to help defend an Islamic country - so he kills 6000+ Americans? Excuse me! Geez, how mad would he be if we had stood back and just let the USSR take Afganistan? Do you honestly beleive that this is about "inequalities in the world"? LOL. The Islamic world is not mad at us because of what we do or don't do. The U.S. is the leading supplier of aide to Afganistan for gods sake. Your argument makes no sense. What more could we possibly do for them? Join the world wide socialist utiopia? The irony is that they fear and hate us because of the values which our very existence and our success establish in the minds of people around the world. We represent the thing they most fear - proof that people, male and female, can coexist as individuals free from religious tyranny, as individuals pursueing their own private goals and ambitions in life without being dependent on a caretaker political/religious infrastructure. They hate us for the hopes and dreams that we plant in the minds of the people that their politcal establishment wants to control, especially their women. It is *they* who want to keep people unequal and downtrodden, not us. Try to sell your Marxist propaganda to someone else. "I never met anyone I didn't like" Will Rogers.
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Chris, If this is the Bart I think it is I'd be happy to vouch for him. David
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"2 + 2 = 5", anybody who doesn't agree with me or says otherwise is just a small minded person who is unwilling to see the other side of an argument. .... Ummm, no. Sometimes people are just wrong. Sometimes they are just a troll. Many have posted intelligent commentaries on the current situation and have been well received. But when trolls come here TRYING to stir up trouble, people usually beat on them. As far as giving Taliban requesting proof, don't confuse due process and extradition with delay and obfuscation tactics. Tim Smith Descartes Systems Sciences, Inc.
Show me the proof, and I'll believe you
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These terrorists operate in the broad light of day throughout the entire middle-east. They openly recruit and train new members, they are openly funded by everybody in the middle east who has a check book OK...who funded and created Bin Laden? America Why? To fight the Russians and then he turned on America too. Hmmm... so who's responsible? You tell me! In our own society I believe we would be called vigilantes .i.e. taking the law into our own hands and seeking our own type of justice. As for your statements A through D. We need to ask ourselves why that is? Do you think these people do it for the heck of it? Could it possibly be about inequalities in the world today and developed nations holding down developing countries? Or is it about countries trying to impose their will on other countries? Please enlighten me! Rich
Rich, yes the US funded the Afgan guerilla's to fight the USSR during the Cold War. And our government made probably one of the worst mistakes in the world by completely backing out of the region and leaving them in poverty when the USSR collapsed and the 'war' was no longer needed. That doesn't change the fact that the US has enough evidence to call for Osama's arrest without actual proof that he did it. Now, I'm not in the Nuke'em all camp. I do however, believe that Osama deserves what he's going to get, and the Taliban that supports him deserves it as well. I don't have any simple answers to these complex issues, but I believe that the truth lies somewhere between 'Look on the grassy knoll' and 'Nuke'em all'. Anyone who claims to be in the light but hates his brother is still in the darkness. Whoever loves his brother lives in the light, and there is nothing in it to make him stumble -- 1 John 1:9-10
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That's exactly what I was thinking. Hmmm. <tappity-tappity-google-tappity> http://members.aol.com/MorelandC/HaveOriginsData.htm: Toe the line ------------ Meaning: Follow the group, don't disagree, do what others are doing. Origin: Many mistakenly think the phrase is "tow the line", thus obscuring the meaning. Mystery solved. cheers, Chris Maunder (CodeProject)