A surprising confession
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I'm sorry. I'm sure many will call me insensitive. I'm sure many will call me closed minded. But I just don't buy it. Sure, I buy you have the condition you claim to have. It makes sense. What I don't buy is this "pain and suffering". What this boils down to is, you don't like the way you look. Guess what? Few people do! My inner "self image" shows me as a someone looking like brad pitt, but that's not what I look like. Should I be in pain and suffering because my body doesn't match my self image? No, I deal with it and I get on with life. This is just a side-effect of the whole Generation X-Y-Z-(wonder what comes next?) self-pity trip. I've noticed this a lot with people my age and younger. We've been raised by our parents and hippy-wannabe teachers and guidance counselors to over-inflate our self-worth to the universe. We've been raised to think we're special, unique little snowflakes that make the world a better place. And when the world is *NOT* a better place, we place the blame on ourselves. We feel guilty and this leads to self-pity. Pretty soon it becomes a habit, and we enjoy the feeling and consider ourselves martyrs of a sort. This is what fuels many so-called "goths" and "punks" (goths are depressed punks with (slightly) better fashion sense) and many other so-called social outcasts. Ok, so i've wandered way off topic here. I'm not trying to oppress you, or hate you, or call you names. What I am saying, is that life sucks in general and the only way you're going to survive is to deal with it. Getting an operation won't change anything. Your problems are much deeper than just what you look like, or you would be able to deal with it much better. Just think about it. Think about what I said objectively for 5 minutes... if you still think i'm a narrow minded bigot, fine. I can deal with that. Just consider what I've said, and think about it. -- Where are we going? And why am I in this handbasket?
I'm sorry. I'm sure many will call me insensitive. I'm sure many will call me closed minded. But I just don't buy it. Not at all Erik. We all have to form our own opinions of the situations we encounter, and I find it perfectly understandable that you would feel that way. Sure, I buy you have the condition you claim to have. It makes sense. What I don't buy is this "pain and suffering". It's about much more than image. Your perceived gender affects the way you feel, dress, and how people interact with you (and expect you to act). This cannot be easily changed without doing something drastic. What this boils down to is, you don't like the way you look. Guess what? Few people do! My inner "self image" shows me as a someone looking like brad pitt, but that's not what I look like. Should I be in pain and suffering because my body doesn't match my self image? No, I deal with it and I get on with life. The fact that I'm here talking about it must tell you that I am dealing with this. I'm talking to close friends and seeking counselling as a first step. I've tried to "bury" this before and it doesn't work. Trust me on that. This is just a side-effect of the whole Generation X-Y-Z-(wonder what comes next?) self-pity trip. I've noticed this a lot with people my age and younger. We've been raised by our parents and hippy-wannabe teachers and guidance counselors to over-inflate our self-worth to the universe. I certainly wasn't, I can assure you of that. I've had zero self worth for most of my life, mainly because I thought there was something abnormal about me. It was only when I discovered that there are lots of others who share my condition that I was able to change that. So why shouldn't I talk about it? Ok, so i've wandered way off topic here. I'm not trying to oppress you, or hate you, or call you names. What I am saying, is that life sucks in general and the only way you're going to survive is to deal with it. Getting an operation won't change anything. Your problems are much deeper than just what you look like, or you would be able to deal with it much better. It's more than an op. It's a complete change in lifestyle and your perceived role in society which can take up to 5 years to complete. The medical procedures (which begin with hormone treatment and facial hair removal and utlimately lead to facial and sexual reassignment surgery) are only a means to that end. During this process you are constantly monitored by psychiatrists to ensure that yo
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> Are you talking about not "fitting in"? Or is it something deeper? BWA HA HA HA HA!!! Oh pleeze stop! Yer killin me! LOLOL To hell with those thin-skinned pillow-biters. - Me, 10/03/2001
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Goodness, the stuff you guys and gals talk about when I'm asleep..... Anna ( no, I'm not going to guess ), I must admit it sounds a contradiction to me that you are attracted to women *and* want to be one. I'd like to have a womans body too: I often tell my wife if I did, I would never leave the house. However, if you say you've had counselling, then one would presume this ( rather unusual ) condition is quite real. I guess my point is that if you go ahead with your operation, you have to face the fact that your situtation is unusual enough that it's likely to define the rest of your life. However, if this is who you are, then I suspect you won't be happy unless you pursue it. My personal lifes philosophy is summed up in two words: get stuffed. This is my heartfelt message to anyone who does not accept me for who I am. I suggest you adopt it, you'll probably need it. And as has been said already, no matter what you do with your life, your real friends are the ones who will stick by you, and the rest don't matter. Is it just me, or do we all know each other so well now that we seem comfortable discussing all manner of private things with each other. Someone else said it and I agree - this place has become a large part of my social life too. Christian As I learn the innermost secrets of the around me, they reward me in many ways to keep quiet. Men with pierced ears are better prepared for marriage. They've experienced pain and bought Jewellery.
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David, you really are a New Age Sensitive Guy, Aren't you ? Regardz Colin J Davies
Maybe, but I also know how hard it is to do something like this (though I personally have never thought about changing sex [other than "damn the girls always have it better, that would be cool"]), or become gay. People react in very strange ways, and it's always hard to know how to approach them.
:cool: -=:suss:=-
David Wulff dwulff@battleaxesoftware.com Founder of The BLA
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Hey, I've never done anything with Bruce that couldn't be shared with children. To hell with those thin-skinned pillow-biters. - Me, 10/03/2001
:eek: I'm afraid, very afraid.
:cool: -=:suss:=-
David Wulff dwulff@battleaxesoftware.com Founder of The BLA
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Although I've been visiting this site for a while, I'm posting this under my "inner" rather than my birth name, for reasons which should become obvious. :-O Some of you may be offended or shocked by what I have to say, and if so you have my sincerest apologies. That is not my intention. To quote Paul Watson a couple of days ago in the Programmers and Atheists thread: Actually, and this is an OLD joke: I am a Lesbian trapped in a mans body. :laugh: Seeing this prompted me to sound you all out on something which I have to face. I guess I'm testing the water to see what reaction I get when I finally tell people about it! You see, for some people (including myself) it's not just a joke, but a reality, and a very painful one at that. I should explain that physically I'm male, but my mind is most definately female (I've always known this but recently took several psychological tests which confirmed it). Since I'm attracted to women rather than men, that places me squarely inside the bounds of the joke! It's just as well that I can laugh at myself... ;P If you met me you would probably never know who I truly was unless I wanted you to (my mannerisms are not effeminate, although I do get very emotional). Over the years I've grown very adept at concealing my true self - mainly for fear of what would happen if people found out. The condition which causes this is called Gender Dysphoria. It affects both biological males and females at a rate (I'm told) of roughly one per 1000 of the population, and is thought to be caused by a birth defect in which the brain develops as one physical sex, and the body another (read up on fetal development; it's all there). The end result is an individual whose Gender (mental self image) is the opposite of their physical sex. As you can imagine, this is acutely painful, not to mention embarassing for those concerned (society isn't at all tolerant of those who cross the gender divide). It's taken me years to finally get to the point of admitting to others how I feel, and ask for help in dealing with it (I started talking about 6 weeks ago, and finally told my partner a fortnight ago. Right now I'm about to start counselling). Where I go from here, only time will tell. I have a choice of either living with the constant pain I feel right now for the rest of my life (psychiatric treatment doesn't have a history of success with this condition), or undertaking a long, difficult (and expensive) journey to attempt to make my body match
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Dude(Dudette?), why'd you have to come out on a site like this? It's hardly an appropriate place for it and I'm sure alot of people here don't really want to hear about it. Geeeeezzz, I'm outta here.... Josh josh@that-guy.net
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Maybe, but I also know how hard it is to do something like this (though I personally have never thought about changing sex [other than "damn the girls always have it better, that would be cool"]), or become gay. People react in very strange ways, and it's always hard to know how to approach them.
:cool: -=:suss:=-
David Wulff dwulff@battleaxesoftware.com Founder of The BLA
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I got my spelling from Chambers English Dictionary, and the two medical books in the house confirm it. Is Websters an American dictionary ? Everyone knows those things are wrong - they contain words like color. How can you trust the thoughts on language of anyone who thinks Z rhymes with tree ? Christian As I learn the innermost secrets of the around me, they reward me in many ways to keep quiet. Men with pierced ears are better prepared for marriage. They've experienced pain and bought Jewellery.
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I got my spelling from Chambers English Dictionary, and the two medical books in the house confirm it. Is Websters an American dictionary ? Everyone knows those things are wrong - they contain words like color. How can you trust the thoughts on language of anyone who thinks Z rhymes with tree ? Christian As I learn the innermost secrets of the around me, they reward me in many ways to keep quiet. Men with pierced ears are better prepared for marriage. They've experienced pain and bought Jewellery.
Let me guess, you pronounce 'Z' "zed"?
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> I got my spelling from Chambers English Dictionary, Well then, Chambers is a freak. To hell with those thin-skinned pillow-biters. - Me, 10/03/2001
So are my medical books ? Far be it from me to be pedantic over something so mundane, but the way I spelled it is how it is spelled in countries where the English language has not been raped. Christian As I learn the innermost secrets of the around me, they reward me in many ways to keep quiet. Men with pierced ears are better prepared for marriage. They've experienced pain and bought Jewellery.
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Let me guess, you pronounce 'Z' "zed"?
Now how in the hell ELSE would a normal person pronounce it ? Christian As I learn the innermost secrets of the around me, they reward me in many ways to keep quiet. Men with pierced ears are better prepared for marriage. They've experienced pain and bought Jewellery.
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There has to be one doesn't there? Whilst I expected to meet some hostility, I never expected it to be from you - and yes, we have talked in this forum before. Are you surprised to hear that? It just shows, you never can tell. :(( Don't expect others to conform to your narrow minded view of the world. I certainly won't, you have my word on that. ;P
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So are my medical books ? Far be it from me to be pedantic over something so mundane, but the way I spelled it is how it is spelled in countries where the English language has not been raped. Christian As I learn the innermost secrets of the around me, they reward me in many ways to keep quiet. Men with pierced ears are better prepared for marriage. They've experienced pain and bought Jewellery.
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Tell it like it is. Of course - that's my speciality... I have a five year old, I can't tell you how much I had to fight to overcome the 'zee' at the end of the alphabet song. I bought her a globe and showed her how far away the US is. She loves it now, she's always saying 'Daddy, tell me about the world' ( Tarzan lives here, Pocahontas lives here, John Smith comes from here, we live here... ) Christian As I learn the innermost secrets of the around me, they reward me in many ways to keep quiet. Men with pierced ears are better prepared for marriage. They've experienced pain and bought Jewellery.
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Josh I think sympathetic has a lot to do with it, or is it Roger Smith again? Any like yourself I don't wish to hear this crap. Norm Almond Chief Technical Architect FS Walker Hughes Limited
