cub scouts
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ok. i'm a cub scout den leader lookin for a good plan of attack to teach boys why computer programming is cool. So far I'm gonna show em my old dos graphics apps (tree drawing app, moire graphics, etc) and my midi sequencer. Now i know that these things can't hold a candle to nintendo 64's banjo kazooie and similar type stuff. My plan is to show em a little of what i did as a kid, what i do now, and what it takes to be a computer programmer: - like to spend time alone thinking - know typing - good at math/logic - good at reading (so you can make it thru those god awful computer books) - good at learning new ideas Anybody else got some ideers bout what to chat about? After that, we prepare for our skit - the MEDICRIN http://www.elshaz.com/76/info/skit.doc[^] In advance, tenks mon... ...Steve
Something which might be helpful would be to get out a pen-turtle and LOGO (or the more modern equivalent, Lego Mindstorms), or something else with a physical/mechanical component to it. A physical aspect is much more "graspable", and easier to demonstrate too - you don't have to have all the cubs crowded around one screen. And computer programming should be described to the kids in terms of the satisfaction of getting computers to do exactly what you tell them, rather than just driving something else (examples as described in books: the "creative joy" in Fred Brooks' Mythical Man Month, or Robert Pirsig's riding a motorcycle with parts you've machined yourself in Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintainence). There's also a great deal of folklore and stories to be told, such as the history of the first computer "bug", and so on. A well chosen story would go a long way to keep things interesting.
Ian Darling "One of the few systems...which has had “no deaths” in the reliability requirements." - Michael Platt
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IMHO, a good programmer (besides what you've already said): 1. Hates doing the same thing again and again. 2. Has lots of curiosity. 3. Wants to disassemble his PS2 (N64 sucks) to "see how it works". 4. Contrary to what most people believe, a good programmer may suck at math, but must be good at abstract ideas. 5. Wants to buy half of what's shown on thinkgeek.com, cause he can't afford the other half. Perl combines all the worst aspects of C and Lisp: a billion different sublanguages in one monolithic executable. It combines the power of C with the readability of PostScript. -- Jamie Zawinski
Daniel Turini wrote: 1. Hates doing the same thing again and again Then you won't be programming as a profession then. Same ole same ole all the time. With those rare but refreshing forays into the unknown :) Daniel Turini wrote: 3. Wants to disassemble his PS2 (N64 sucks) to "see how it works Sounds like a hardware problem to me . Leave that to the EE guys. Daniel Turini wrote: 4. Contrary to what most people believe, a good programmer may suck at math, but must be good at abstract ideas Which he will never understand without the math. Recursion rears its ugly head again. Daniel Turini wrote: 5. Wants to buy half of what's shown on thinkgeek.com, cause he can't afford the other half. This you soon outgrow. Richard "The man that hath not music in himself and is not moved with concord of sweet sounds is fit for treasons, stratagems and spoils; Let no man trust him." Shakespeare
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Ack!!! What a terrible thing to teach cub scouts! They're supposed to learn how to tie knots, read a topo map, light a safe fire, build a monkey bridge across a ravine, handle an axe and knife, skin a bear with their teeth - manly stuff, not wimpy techno-dweeb things. There's time enough for that when acne strikes and they're left out of all the cool groups in high school. Shame on you!!!!:mad: Heard in Bullhead City - "You haven't lost your girl -
you've just lost your turn..." [sigh] So true...I always thought that cubs were about preparing kids for the modern day and how to look after themselves (you know, Be Prepared and all that). So one evening spent on programming isn't really that terrible an idea - especially if you tie some of the more general notions in with more traditional cub activities. You could consider it a high-tech way of teaching about doing things in the right order, how to solve problems, and so forth. Anyway, isn't learning how to use pointers in C much like learning the arrow signals marked on tracks using branches and stones? Both are an art only understood by a few (or those with the right books to hand :-)) But I'm in agreement that the general point of cubs is to learn stuff like building a bridge out of bits of monkey, and tying knots with their teeth, and skinning their fellow cubs with nothing but a map and compass :-D
Ian Darling "One of the few systems...which has had “no deaths” in the reliability requirements." - Michael Platt
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IMHO, a good programmer (besides what you've already said): 1. Hates doing the same thing again and again. 2. Has lots of curiosity. 3. Wants to disassemble his PS2 (N64 sucks) to "see how it works". 4. Contrary to what most people believe, a good programmer may suck at math, but must be good at abstract ideas. 5. Wants to buy half of what's shown on thinkgeek.com, cause he can't afford the other half. Perl combines all the worst aspects of C and Lisp: a billion different sublanguages in one monolithic executable. It combines the power of C with the readability of PostScript. -- Jamie Zawinski
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I always thought that cubs were about preparing kids for the modern day and how to look after themselves (you know, Be Prepared and all that). So one evening spent on programming isn't really that terrible an idea - especially if you tie some of the more general notions in with more traditional cub activities. You could consider it a high-tech way of teaching about doing things in the right order, how to solve problems, and so forth. Anyway, isn't learning how to use pointers in C much like learning the arrow signals marked on tracks using branches and stones? Both are an art only understood by a few (or those with the right books to hand :-)) But I'm in agreement that the general point of cubs is to learn stuff like building a bridge out of bits of monkey, and tying knots with their teeth, and skinning their fellow cubs with nothing but a map and compass :-D
Ian Darling "One of the few systems...which has had “no deaths” in the reliability requirements." - Michael Platt
Ian Darling wrote: But I'm in agreement that the general point of cubs is to learn stuff like building a bridge out of bits of monkey, and tying knots with their teeth, and skinning their fellow cubs with nothing but a map and compass :laugh::laugh: Clown. :-D
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ok. i'm a cub scout den leader lookin for a good plan of attack to teach boys why computer programming is cool. So far I'm gonna show em my old dos graphics apps (tree drawing app, moire graphics, etc) and my midi sequencer. Now i know that these things can't hold a candle to nintendo 64's banjo kazooie and similar type stuff. My plan is to show em a little of what i did as a kid, what i do now, and what it takes to be a computer programmer: - like to spend time alone thinking - know typing - good at math/logic - good at reading (so you can make it thru those god awful computer books) - good at learning new ideas Anybody else got some ideers bout what to chat about? After that, we prepare for our skit - the MEDICRIN http://www.elshaz.com/76/info/skit.doc[^] In advance, tenks mon... ...Steve
There is also a cub scout academic belt loop and pin that can be earned. A single den meeting could earn the boys a belt loop and open the discussion about programming. If any of the boys actually started programming they would probably qualify for the pin. http://www.usscouts.org/advance/cubscout/academics/computers.html Darrell Long
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ok. i'm a cub scout den leader lookin for a good plan of attack to teach boys why computer programming is cool. So far I'm gonna show em my old dos graphics apps (tree drawing app, moire graphics, etc) and my midi sequencer. Now i know that these things can't hold a candle to nintendo 64's banjo kazooie and similar type stuff. My plan is to show em a little of what i did as a kid, what i do now, and what it takes to be a computer programmer: - like to spend time alone thinking - know typing - good at math/logic - good at reading (so you can make it thru those god awful computer books) - good at learning new ideas Anybody else got some ideers bout what to chat about? After that, we prepare for our skit - the MEDICRIN http://www.elshaz.com/76/info/skit.doc[^] In advance, tenks mon... ...Steve
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Ack!!! What a terrible thing to teach cub scouts! They're supposed to learn how to tie knots, read a topo map, light a safe fire, build a monkey bridge across a ravine, handle an axe and knife, skin a bear with their teeth - manly stuff, not wimpy techno-dweeb things. There's time enough for that when acne strikes and they're left out of all the cool groups in high school. Shame on you!!!!:mad: Heard in Bullhead City - "You haven't lost your girl -
you've just lost your turn..." [sigh] So true...A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, design a building, write a sonnet, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, solve equations, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects. -- Robert Heinlein I could certainly make a bow and arrow, milk a goat, prepare a microscope slide and copy BASIC programs around that age.. it's only the one day :) Ryan
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Something which might be helpful would be to get out a pen-turtle and LOGO (or the more modern equivalent, Lego Mindstorms), or something else with a physical/mechanical component to it. A physical aspect is much more "graspable", and easier to demonstrate too - you don't have to have all the cubs crowded around one screen. And computer programming should be described to the kids in terms of the satisfaction of getting computers to do exactly what you tell them, rather than just driving something else (examples as described in books: the "creative joy" in Fred Brooks' Mythical Man Month, or Robert Pirsig's riding a motorcycle with parts you've machined yourself in Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintainence). There's also a great deal of folklore and stories to be told, such as the history of the first computer "bug", and so on. A well chosen story would go a long way to keep things interesting.
Ian Darling "One of the few systems...which has had “no deaths” in the reliability requirements." - Michael Platt
Great ideas!!! I wish i had some cool hardware like you mention, but the den meeting's tonight ;) Making the computer do what you want and bug I'll keep those in mind. Thanks so much! ...Steve
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Ack!!! What a terrible thing to teach cub scouts! They're supposed to learn how to tie knots, read a topo map, light a safe fire, build a monkey bridge across a ravine, handle an axe and knife, skin a bear with their teeth - manly stuff, not wimpy techno-dweeb things. There's time enough for that when acne strikes and they're left out of all the cool groups in high school. Shame on you!!!!:mad: Heard in Bullhead City - "You haven't lost your girl -
you've just lost your turn..." [sigh] So true...Hey, I agree with ya. But when you've been a den leader, THEN you're free to criticize :) That stuff is the guts of scouting, but hey, it's a winter evening! Most of those things require summer :) We've done the knots, not all the boys have pocket knives yet. (But i'm lookin forward to that!) Great point tho! ...Steve
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A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, design a building, write a sonnet, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, solve equations, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects. -- Robert Heinlein I could certainly make a bow and arrow, milk a goat, prepare a microscope slide and copy BASIC programs around that age.. it's only the one day :) Ryan
Ryan Roberts wrote: Robert Heinlein Aka, Lazarus Long, my mentor...;) Heard in Bullhead City - "You haven't lost your girl -
you've just lost your turn..." [sigh] So true... -
IMHO, a good programmer (besides what you've already said): 1. Hates doing the same thing again and again. 2. Has lots of curiosity. 3. Wants to disassemble his PS2 (N64 sucks) to "see how it works". 4. Contrary to what most people believe, a good programmer may suck at math, but must be good at abstract ideas. 5. Wants to buy half of what's shown on thinkgeek.com, cause he can't afford the other half. Perl combines all the worst aspects of C and Lisp: a billion different sublanguages in one monolithic executable. It combines the power of C with the readability of PostScript. -- Jamie Zawinski
4. Contrary to what most people believe, a good programmer may suck at math, but must be good at abstract ideas. Actually, Mathematics is just "abstract ideas". You can suck at arithmetic and still be good at Math. -Andy Brummer
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There is also a cub scout academic belt loop and pin that can be earned. A single den meeting could earn the boys a belt loop and open the discussion about programming. If any of the boys actually started programming they would probably qualify for the pin. http://www.usscouts.org/advance/cubscout/academics/computers.html Darrell Long
For the lazy, like my self - who can't be bothered to copy and paste the URL - here's the clickety: http://www.usscouts.org/advance/cubscout/academics/computers.html[^]
EuroCPian Spring 2004 Get Together[^] "You can have everything in life you want if you will just help enough other people get what they want." --Zig Ziglar "Get in touch with your Inner Capitalist - I wish you much success!" -- Christopher Duncan, Lounge 9-Feb-2004
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A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, design a building, write a sonnet, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, solve equations, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects. -- Robert Heinlein I could certainly make a bow and arrow, milk a goat, prepare a microscope slide and copy BASIC programs around that age.. it's only the one day :) Ryan
So why did he spend so much time writing books? That's not on the list. :rolleyes: BW CP Member Homepages
"...take what you need and leave the rest..."
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ok. i'm a cub scout den leader lookin for a good plan of attack to teach boys why computer programming is cool. So far I'm gonna show em my old dos graphics apps (tree drawing app, moire graphics, etc) and my midi sequencer. Now i know that these things can't hold a candle to nintendo 64's banjo kazooie and similar type stuff. My plan is to show em a little of what i did as a kid, what i do now, and what it takes to be a computer programmer: - like to spend time alone thinking - know typing - good at math/logic - good at reading (so you can make it thru those god awful computer books) - good at learning new ideas Anybody else got some ideers bout what to chat about? After that, we prepare for our skit - the MEDICRIN http://www.elshaz.com/76/info/skit.doc[^] In advance, tenks mon... ...Steve
I think a broad overview of computing would help them picture just how much can be done through computing. To get a feel for what their thoughts on the matter are already, ask them what they think programming can be used for. Discuss the wide variety of fields and applications that involve computing. How it can a be useful skill without being your primary job. You don't have to become a cubicle dwelling geek just because you know how to program. BW CP Member Homepages
"...take what you need and leave the rest..."
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Daniel Turini wrote: 1. Hates doing the same thing again and again Then you won't be programming as a profession then. Same ole same ole all the time. With those rare but refreshing forays into the unknown :) Daniel Turini wrote: 3. Wants to disassemble his PS2 (N64 sucks) to "see how it works Sounds like a hardware problem to me . Leave that to the EE guys. Daniel Turini wrote: 4. Contrary to what most people believe, a good programmer may suck at math, but must be good at abstract ideas Which he will never understand without the math. Recursion rears its ugly head again. Daniel Turini wrote: 5. Wants to buy half of what's shown on thinkgeek.com, cause he can't afford the other half. This you soon outgrow. Richard "The man that hath not music in himself and is not moved with concord of sweet sounds is fit for treasons, stratagems and spoils; Let no man trust him." Shakespeare
Richard Stringer wrote: Daniel Turini wrote: 5. Wants to buy half of what's shown on thinkgeek.com, cause he can't afford the other half. This you soon outgrow. Is that because you eventually are able to buy it all, or get married and have to pay all the bills? My code isn't buggy. Those are all fleatures.
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Richard Stringer wrote: Daniel Turini wrote: 5. Wants to buy half of what's shown on thinkgeek.com, cause he can't afford the other half. This you soon outgrow. Is that because you eventually are able to buy it all, or get married and have to pay all the bills? My code isn't buggy. Those are all fleatures.
Nope. Picture a kid in the candy store---- then picture an adult in a candy store. same principle. Richard "The man that hath not music in himself and is not moved with concord of sweet sounds is fit for treasons, stratagems and spoils; Let no man trust him." Shakespeare
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Daniel Turini wrote: 1. Hates doing the same thing again and again Then you won't be programming as a profession then. Same ole same ole all the time. With those rare but refreshing forays into the unknown :) Daniel Turini wrote: 3. Wants to disassemble his PS2 (N64 sucks) to "see how it works Sounds like a hardware problem to me . Leave that to the EE guys. Daniel Turini wrote: 4. Contrary to what most people believe, a good programmer may suck at math, but must be good at abstract ideas Which he will never understand without the math. Recursion rears its ugly head again. Daniel Turini wrote: 5. Wants to buy half of what's shown on thinkgeek.com, cause he can't afford the other half. This you soon outgrow. Richard "The man that hath not music in himself and is not moved with concord of sweet sounds is fit for treasons, stratagems and spoils; Let no man trust him." Shakespeare
Richard Stringer wrote: N64 sucks Hey I'm a programmer and I prefer Nintendo! :cool: Jeremy Falcon
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Richard Stringer wrote: N64 sucks Hey I'm a programmer and I prefer Nintendo! :cool: Jeremy Falcon
Jeremy Falcon wrote: Hey I'm a programmer and I prefer Nintendo! And if you fitted wheels to my XBox, you could turn it into a monster truck that destroys all consoles before it (particularly Nintendo ones) :-) (yes, I admit it - I was a Sega fanboy for the best part of a decade [I even own a Saturn :rolleyes:], and now I'm a big fan of the XBox)
Ian Darling "One of the few systems...which has had “no deaths” in the reliability requirements." - Michael Platt
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Jeremy Falcon wrote: Hey I'm a programmer and I prefer Nintendo! And if you fitted wheels to my XBox, you could turn it into a monster truck that destroys all consoles before it (particularly Nintendo ones) :-) (yes, I admit it - I was a Sega fanboy for the best part of a decade [I even own a Saturn :rolleyes:], and now I'm a big fan of the XBox)
Ian Darling "One of the few systems...which has had “no deaths” in the reliability requirements." - Michael Platt
Ian Darling wrote: And if you fitted wheels to my XBox, you could turn it into a monster truck that destroys all consoles before it (particularly Nintendo ones) Hardware-wise: not really. Besides it's like comparing apples to oranges. Game-wise: that's a matter of opinion. Lastly, having a debate of the "better" system is dumb. Jeremy Falcon