racism at work?
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Rodrigo, Do you perchance have a slight middle-eastern look? I know quite a few people from Spain that fit the middle eastern/arabic "profile". Certainly after several centuries of Moorish domination there's bound to be some of that in the Spanish gene pool =) I doubt you're being stopped because you look hispanic per se, otherwise police in Texas, Arizona and California would be having a field day stopping every Mexican they saw under the pretext of national security. There are a lot of Mexicans in Boston - is every single one of them treated this way that you know of? Now, I'm not saying there's no discrimination against hispanics in the US, far from it. I see it every day here in Arizona. But I'm also a bit detached from that because even though I was born in Mexico I just don't look (or sound) the part. My brother (who lives in Barcelona, BTW) was telling me the other day how he saw a lot of this going on in Germany as well. But he looks even more German than me so he doesn't have that problem -- his main concern is his deficient control of the language :) On the other hand, it is my very personal opinion that most Hispanics in the US and abroad *deserve* to be discriminated against, but that's another story. And no, I don't think anyone should be treated that way. But to be brutally honest, I prefer my "authorities" a bit less PC and a lot more careful. In a way, we're slightly lucky that we're in a war with Islamic terrorists and not with the Norwegian Lutheran Jihad or something. That would make it a lot more difficult. Why don't you just take it up with them? The worst you can do is just sit and simmer in your anger. Confront the problem, don't bemoan the fact that you have it in the first place. Just my $0.02. These topics are always a bit tricky. Buena suerte! ___________ Klaus [www.vbbox.com]
Hey, I just send a carfully worded memo to the HR director and to the Compliance Officer, ccing everybody on the Diversity traning department (I didn't even know we had a compliance officer and a diversity training department). Now its time to duck, and let the bombs fall. I think i'll be telecommuting for the next few days. Who knows where all of this is going to end up. Luckily, I just found out that the security company's contract is ending 1/1, maybe this would give us a better hand (foot I should say) at kicking their ass.
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Hey, I just send a carfully worded memo to the HR director and to the Compliance Officer, ccing everybody on the Diversity traning department (I didn't even know we had a compliance officer and a diversity training department). Now its time to duck, and let the bombs fall. I think i'll be telecommuting for the next few days. Who knows where all of this is going to end up. Luckily, I just found out that the security company's contract is ending 1/1, maybe this would give us a better hand (foot I should say) at kicking their ass.
rcVu wrote: Now its time to duck, and let the bombs fall. I think i'll be telecommuting for the next few days. Who knows where all of this is going to end up. Don't worry too much about it, Rodrigo, just stand your ground. You can't be constantly mistreated. And besides, by sending this memo out, you will be diminishing the security company's chances of renewing their contract. Good luck! Keep us posted.... Melissa
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Hey, I just send a carfully worded memo to the HR director and to the Compliance Officer, ccing everybody on the Diversity traning department (I didn't even know we had a compliance officer and a diversity training department). Now its time to duck, and let the bombs fall. I think i'll be telecommuting for the next few days. Who knows where all of this is going to end up. Luckily, I just found out that the security company's contract is ending 1/1, maybe this would give us a better hand (foot I should say) at kicking their ass.
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Hi, I'm not usually in the presence of this but lately at work the security people have been getting really bad. I’m spanic, and I work in Boston Ma, we have badges to get in and out of the building and we are also supposed to walk around with them. The problem is that whenever I walk around without mine they always stop me and ask me to show them mine, which is fine I don't mind and is their job. However, what is pissing me off, is that even when I walk around with other people (white people) they only stop me! What the f**k is this? The other problem, and the one that specially pisses me off is that to some times I bring to work other people with me (share the car), and when we go into the building one opens the door for all to enter (you know). But they only stop me and ask me for my badge (not always but enough times to notice), even when there are more people (white people) than only me going in without one. I’m really pissed off today, since I didn't have my badge to get in the building, and they only stopped me for one (after the guy I drove to work open the door for me). Since I didn't have one and I had to sign in, they said that "all maintenance people (cleaners) should always have their badge". I didn't know that the fact that I’m spanic automatically makes me "maintenance". I work 70+ hours every week, I write client server apps and save the company a lot of money with my work. I don't think I or anyone should ever be treated that way, any ideas as to how to address my situation? Rodrigo
Here's a suggestion that hasn't been mentioned. I assume that there are only a small number of security guards that work in the areas you walk through. Next time you get stopped, strike up a short and friendly conversation with the guy. (Maybe about how he likes his job?) It would seem to me that once the guards have made even a very small emotional connection with you, they would be able to remember your face and know who you are -- making it less likely that they'll stop you. You might even end up with a good friend out of the deal. :) (Of course, this approach would also bring to light the guys who truly are racist...) John
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Here's a suggestion that hasn't been mentioned. I assume that there are only a small number of security guards that work in the areas you walk through. Next time you get stopped, strike up a short and friendly conversation with the guy. (Maybe about how he likes his job?) It would seem to me that once the guards have made even a very small emotional connection with you, they would be able to remember your face and know who you are -- making it less likely that they'll stop you. You might even end up with a good friend out of the deal. :) (Of course, this approach would also bring to light the guys who truly are racist...) John
I've actually tried that aproach, and it doesn't work. They either have the worst memmory of anyone I know, or they are that way because they want to be that way. Only one of them is pretty cool, he still asks for a badge Id. But he asks everybody for it, not only me. And he is quick at the computer when I need a temp one.
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To get in you have to tell them your name, show ID, tell them your phone extension and your department. Then they take that information and look it up on the computer to see if is true, this usually takes seconds for regular people (I designed the directory, so I know), but these morons take 5 minutes (they use their 2 fingers to use the keyboard..) Finally you have to fill more paper work to get a temporary badge (and plastic badge for the doors and a sticker on your shirt that reads temp)which is good for one day, and you also have to fill more paper work before you leave. And is not like I work in a very restricted business (or secretive), I mean I work in an insurence company!. Rodrigo.
>> I designed the directory, so I know That's absurd. classic D.Adams material. :suss: ( <-- Danger-o-matic) However, the "temporary badge" process sounds almost perfect for zivilen ungehorsam (civil disobedience is the best translation I can come up with); but , it'll cost you quite some energy (and they might start to *really* hate you...) Peter
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Hi, I'm not usually in the presence of this but lately at work the security people have been getting really bad. I’m spanic, and I work in Boston Ma, we have badges to get in and out of the building and we are also supposed to walk around with them. The problem is that whenever I walk around without mine they always stop me and ask me to show them mine, which is fine I don't mind and is their job. However, what is pissing me off, is that even when I walk around with other people (white people) they only stop me! What the f**k is this? The other problem, and the one that specially pisses me off is that to some times I bring to work other people with me (share the car), and when we go into the building one opens the door for all to enter (you know). But they only stop me and ask me for my badge (not always but enough times to notice), even when there are more people (white people) than only me going in without one. I’m really pissed off today, since I didn't have my badge to get in the building, and they only stopped me for one (after the guy I drove to work open the door for me). Since I didn't have one and I had to sign in, they said that "all maintenance people (cleaners) should always have their badge". I didn't know that the fact that I’m spanic automatically makes me "maintenance". I work 70+ hours every week, I write client server apps and save the company a lot of money with my work. I don't think I or anyone should ever be treated that way, any ideas as to how to address my situation? Rodrigo
This is bullshit. You should complain both to your boss and the security manager. And the white people who are walking past you and letting this go without comment, assuming they are, should be speaking up too.
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Hi, I'm not usually in the presence of this but lately at work the security people have been getting really bad. I’m spanic, and I work in Boston Ma, we have badges to get in and out of the building and we are also supposed to walk around with them. The problem is that whenever I walk around without mine they always stop me and ask me to show them mine, which is fine I don't mind and is their job. However, what is pissing me off, is that even when I walk around with other people (white people) they only stop me! What the f**k is this? The other problem, and the one that specially pisses me off is that to some times I bring to work other people with me (share the car), and when we go into the building one opens the door for all to enter (you know). But they only stop me and ask me for my badge (not always but enough times to notice), even when there are more people (white people) than only me going in without one. I’m really pissed off today, since I didn't have my badge to get in the building, and they only stopped me for one (after the guy I drove to work open the door for me). Since I didn't have one and I had to sign in, they said that "all maintenance people (cleaners) should always have their badge". I didn't know that the fact that I’m spanic automatically makes me "maintenance". I work 70+ hours every week, I write client server apps and save the company a lot of money with my work. I don't think I or anyone should ever be treated that way, any ideas as to how to address my situation? Rodrigo
I sympathize with your plight, Rodrigo, but frankly, I'm glad there are people out there who have decided to err on the side of public safety rather than on the side of political correctness. Given that these guards are probably not the most mentally agile people on earth, and bound to make mistakes under the best conditions, what do you think their priority should be? "But, daddy, that was back in the hippie ages..." My twelve year old son - winning the argument. "Stan, you are an intelligent guy who responds in meaningful ways" Paul Watson 16/10/01
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Very good advice Melissa, I suggest you to do the same. This should help! I am sure most of the CPians would agree to file a petition with you to get this solve. Good luck! - God bless the World
You make up the petitionand sign it and I'll take the second sig ! CPians together UNITE ! Regardz Colin J Davies
Sonork ID 100.9197:Colin
I live in Bob's HungOut now
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Here's a suggestion that hasn't been mentioned. I assume that there are only a small number of security guards that work in the areas you walk through. Next time you get stopped, strike up a short and friendly conversation with the guy. (Maybe about how he likes his job?) It would seem to me that once the guards have made even a very small emotional connection with you, they would be able to remember your face and know who you are -- making it less likely that they'll stop you. You might even end up with a good friend out of the deal. :) (Of course, this approach would also bring to light the guys who truly are racist...) John
John Fisher wrote: I assume that there are only a small number of security guards that work in the areas you walk through. Next time you get stopped, strike up a short and friendly conversation with the guy. (Maybe about how he likes his job?) It would seem to me that once the guards have made even a very small emotional connection with you, they would be able to remember your face and know who you are -- making it less likely that they'll stop you. You might even end up with a good friend out of the deal. (Of course, this approach would also bring to light the guys who truly are racist...) That's actually what I would do, and if it didn't work then I would threaten legal action. Also be nice to baggage handlers in airports etc, If you don't your bags might never arrive, and that really sux even when you have insurance coverage etc.. Regardz Colin J Davies
Sonork ID 100.9197:Colin
I live in Bob's HungOut now
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I sympathize with your plight, Rodrigo, but frankly, I'm glad there are people out there who have decided to err on the side of public safety rather than on the side of political correctness. Given that these guards are probably not the most mentally agile people on earth, and bound to make mistakes under the best conditions, what do you think their priority should be? "But, daddy, that was back in the hippie ages..." My twelve year old son - winning the argument. "Stan, you are an intelligent guy who responds in meaningful ways" Paul Watson 16/10/01
Stan Shannon wrote: I sympathize with your plight, Rodrigo, but frankly, I'm glad there are people out there who have decided to err on the side of public safety rather than on the side of political correctness. Given that these guards are probably not the most mentally agile people on earth, and bound to make mistakes under the best conditions, what do you think their priority should be? True, but why only him? Unfair--it should apply to EVERYONE then. Not selective. Melissa
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I sympathize with your plight, Rodrigo, but frankly, I'm glad there are people out there who have decided to err on the side of public safety rather than on the side of political correctness. Given that these guards are probably not the most mentally agile people on earth, and bound to make mistakes under the best conditions, what do you think their priority should be? "But, daddy, that was back in the hippie ages..." My twelve year old son - winning the argument. "Stan, you are an intelligent guy who responds in meaningful ways" Paul Watson 16/10/01
Im all for badge ids to get into the building. But this should be aplied to all not half/half all. But assuming they have asked all to show and Id to get into the building, then I don't se a reason to walk around with it inside the building. Only to get in. And if there is a good reason to have badges inside the building, then it should be asked to all not half/half. Remember there are afew crazy f**ks that are terrorists and happen to look middle eastern. But there are a lot more crazy f**ks that are not terrorists and do kill a lot of people (can anyone say nazy, or kkk) and the do not look middle eastern. I mean we hear every so often about these midle age guys who walk into work and kills a dozen or so people. Or the "they didn't hugg me when I was little, and I don't have any friends" kids that go into school and start shooting at everyone. They do not look middle eastern, or spanic for that matter.
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Here's a suggestion that hasn't been mentioned. I assume that there are only a small number of security guards that work in the areas you walk through. Next time you get stopped, strike up a short and friendly conversation with the guy. (Maybe about how he likes his job?) It would seem to me that once the guards have made even a very small emotional connection with you, they would be able to remember your face and know who you are -- making it less likely that they'll stop you. You might even end up with a good friend out of the deal. :) (Of course, this approach would also bring to light the guys who truly are racist...) John
You might even end up with a good friend out of the deal. You're a *real* "All You Need Is Love" kinda guy, aren't you John!! ----------------------------- "I leave no turn un-stoned." - John Simmons, Nov 6 2001 -----------------------------
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Hi, I'm not usually in the presence of this but lately at work the security people have been getting really bad. I’m spanic, and I work in Boston Ma, we have badges to get in and out of the building and we are also supposed to walk around with them. The problem is that whenever I walk around without mine they always stop me and ask me to show them mine, which is fine I don't mind and is their job. However, what is pissing me off, is that even when I walk around with other people (white people) they only stop me! What the f**k is this? The other problem, and the one that specially pisses me off is that to some times I bring to work other people with me (share the car), and when we go into the building one opens the door for all to enter (you know). But they only stop me and ask me for my badge (not always but enough times to notice), even when there are more people (white people) than only me going in without one. I’m really pissed off today, since I didn't have my badge to get in the building, and they only stopped me for one (after the guy I drove to work open the door for me). Since I didn't have one and I had to sign in, they said that "all maintenance people (cleaners) should always have their badge". I didn't know that the fact that I’m spanic automatically makes me "maintenance". I work 70+ hours every week, I write client server apps and save the company a lot of money with my work. I don't think I or anyone should ever be treated that way, any ideas as to how to address my situation? Rodrigo
I would speak to HR. Let them know how you feel. It's the responsibility of the security folks to keep the place secure. And it's the responsibility of the HR folks to help root out insensitivity and make people aware of employee diversity. I'm sorry you've had to put up with this unpleasantness. I must admit I've never experienced the same in the 20+ years I've lived in the US (I was born in India). But I know there are plenty of racist and clueless people both in the US and in India. /ravi "There is always one more bug..." ravib@ravib.com http://www.ravib.com
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Hi, I'm not usually in the presence of this but lately at work the security people have been getting really bad. I’m spanic, and I work in Boston Ma, we have badges to get in and out of the building and we are also supposed to walk around with them. The problem is that whenever I walk around without mine they always stop me and ask me to show them mine, which is fine I don't mind and is their job. However, what is pissing me off, is that even when I walk around with other people (white people) they only stop me! What the f**k is this? The other problem, and the one that specially pisses me off is that to some times I bring to work other people with me (share the car), and when we go into the building one opens the door for all to enter (you know). But they only stop me and ask me for my badge (not always but enough times to notice), even when there are more people (white people) than only me going in without one. I’m really pissed off today, since I didn't have my badge to get in the building, and they only stopped me for one (after the guy I drove to work open the door for me). Since I didn't have one and I had to sign in, they said that "all maintenance people (cleaners) should always have their badge". I didn't know that the fact that I’m spanic automatically makes me "maintenance". I work 70+ hours every week, I write client server apps and save the company a lot of money with my work. I don't think I or anyone should ever be treated that way, any ideas as to how to address my situation? Rodrigo
Man that REALLY blows. The next time a security guard treats you like that, show them your ID, and tell them that you understand how hard it must be living on $3 an hour, you had to do the same while you were getting your degree. OR say 'I don't carry it because I know you guys can't read anyhow'. OR flash a library card and then act surprised that he's smart enough to know the difference. OR say 'Being a highly paid programmer, I have one, but being Spanish I also deal in drugs and therefore own a gun. Why should I show you my ID when I have an Uzi under this jacket ?' OR how about 'I'm reporting you for harrassement, you racist swine' OR learn a martial art and kick their butts. Christian After all, there's nothing wrong with an elite as long as I'm allowed to be part of it!! - Mike Burston Oct 23, 2001
Sonork ID 100.10002:MeanManOz
I live in Bob's HungOut now
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here in Trivandrum the behaviour of star hotel doormen sucks. If a trivandrumite walks in wearing shabby clothes they wont let you in. But if some white tourist walks in wearin bermudas and no shirt with his semi-nude wife, they'll do a triple salute and let them in. its funny sometimes... after 54 years of independence in the hearts of some indians the westerner-dominance and fear/awe still exists so sad specially considering when its time we started treating oursleves as earth-citizens instead of as americans , aussies, indians, brits Nish Sonork ID 100.9786 voidmain www.busterboy.org If you don't find me on CP, I'll be at Bob's HungOut
Nish [BusterBoy] wrote: But if some white tourist walks in wearin bermudas and no shirt with his semi-nude wife, they'll do a triple salute and let them in. Did you miss the part where the wife is semi-nude ? Christian After all, there's nothing wrong with an elite as long as I'm allowed to be part of it!! - Mike Burston Oct 23, 2001
Sonork ID 100.10002:MeanManOz
I live in Bob's HungOut now
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Man that REALLY blows. The next time a security guard treats you like that, show them your ID, and tell them that you understand how hard it must be living on $3 an hour, you had to do the same while you were getting your degree. OR say 'I don't carry it because I know you guys can't read anyhow'. OR flash a library card and then act surprised that he's smart enough to know the difference. OR say 'Being a highly paid programmer, I have one, but being Spanish I also deal in drugs and therefore own a gun. Why should I show you my ID when I have an Uzi under this jacket ?' OR how about 'I'm reporting you for harrassement, you racist swine' OR learn a martial art and kick their butts. Christian After all, there's nothing wrong with an elite as long as I'm allowed to be part of it!! - Mike Burston Oct 23, 2001
Sonork ID 100.10002:MeanManOz
I live in Bob's HungOut now
Thanks all of you for your support. The HR people told me that they "will look into this", and the compliance officer said that "things like this should not ever happen. We are all the same, and we should all be treated the same". I was surprised that the compliance officer acted a lot quiker than HR did. I guess he doesn't have too much work to do. it looks like they are going to talk to the security company's representatives to see what can be done to not allow things like these to happen again. Rodrigo.
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You might even end up with a good friend out of the deal. You're a *real* "All You Need Is Love" kinda guy, aren't you John!! ----------------------------- "I leave no turn un-stoned." - John Simmons, Nov 6 2001 -----------------------------
Hmmm... I never thought about it that way. :) But I guess you could say so. (Although you would certainly be distorting the popular understanding of that phrase.) ;P John
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Nish [BusterBoy] wrote: But if some white tourist walks in wearin bermudas and no shirt with his semi-nude wife, they'll do a triple salute and let them in. Did you miss the part where the wife is semi-nude ? Christian After all, there's nothing wrong with an elite as long as I'm allowed to be part of it!! - Mike Burston Oct 23, 2001
Sonork ID 100.10002:MeanManOz
I live in Bob's HungOut now
LOL you've hit the nail on its head CG, you have :-) Nish Sonork ID 100.9786 voidmain www.busterboy.org If you don't find me on CP, I'll be at Bob's HungOut
