Modern Halloween - Whats the point?
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reading all the comments from people who don't live in the US it's amazing how different your views are from reality here. Halloween mischief is very rare. What Halloween has been here since my childhood was where children get dressed up and go trick or treating (being a kid doing this when I was young was something we looked forward to every year). It's also a chance to get dressed up and have a party. All these calls of commercialism and mischief are rediculous. People don't get presents for Halloween. Maybe the candy makers make some money, but beyond that it has little commercial value. If you were never 6 years old with a bad dracula costume dancing around with excitement as you get ready to go trick or treating, then it's hard for you to trully understand the fun of it.
Allen Anderson wrote: reading all the comments from people who don't live in the US it's amazing how different your views are from reality here. Halloween isn't just a US thing, it happens almost everywhere now. Just because the kids in your locality don't cause problems (vanadlism, intimidation, causing distress to the elderly, etc) doesn't mean it doesn't happen elsewhere. Here, it is a big problem every year - I live in an area full of old people who are preyed on by young teenagers to get money and sweets. My next door neighbours are in their late nineties, and today their family is staying with them to answer the door to trick-and-treat'ers. Allen Anderson wrote: Maybe the candy makers make some money, but beyond that it has little commercial value. Walk into just about *any* shop over here (even those that have nothing to do with kids) and you will have to walk past displays of Halloween costumes, fake blood spray, glow in the dark teeth, etc. There is enormous commercial value in, and demand for, these items. Shops are now selling more non-candy Halloween products than they do fireworks for Guy Fawkes Night[^].
David Wulff The Royal Woofle Museum
Everybody is entitled to my opinion
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Toasty0 wrote: Yeah, so following your logic all children should be deprived because you feel inconvenience? I'm not sure what I'm depriving them of. If you want to celebrate Halloween within your own family and friends, then more power to you. Just don't come knocking on my door asking for handouts. My two nieces visited this morning, dressed in their costumes. I very happily supplied them with treats after they'd done their trick of blowing a toy horn through my letter box. All good fun to them and I don't mind playing along, because they are family. Michael CP Blog [^]
Michael P Butler wrote: My two nieces visited this morning, dressed in their costumes. I very happily supplied them with treats after they'd done their trick of blowing a toy horn through my letter box. All good fun to them and I don't mind playing along, because they are family. Hmmmm, looks to me like a matter of degrees. I guess I am still an old timer (read:traditionalist) and see my neighborhood as an extension of my family. Maybe I'm not cosmopolitain enough to be insular and view my community as them instead of us. Best, Jerry
I Do Whatever My Rice Krispies Tell Me To. Toasty0.com
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reading all the comments from people who don't live in the US it's amazing how different your views are from reality here. Halloween mischief is very rare. What Halloween has been here since my childhood was where children get dressed up and go trick or treating (being a kid doing this when I was young was something we looked forward to every year). It's also a chance to get dressed up and have a party. All these calls of commercialism and mischief are rediculous. People don't get presents for Halloween. Maybe the candy makers make some money, but beyond that it has little commercial value. If you were never 6 years old with a bad dracula costume dancing around with excitement as you get ready to go trick or treating, then it's hard for you to trully understand the fun of it.
Allen Anderson wrote: All these calls of commercialism and mischief are rediculous Every major supermarket I've visited for the last few weeks has had an aisle full of Halloween goods, from plastic masks to full costumes. From specially branded sweets to plastic pumpkin decorations. In the UK, the commercialization is in full swing. I'm surprised to hear, that it is different in the US. As for the "mischief" - maybe that is a cultural thing. It probably does vary from area to area, my street isn't exactly a high-class or even middle class area. Michael CP Blog [^]
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Allen Anderson wrote: All these calls of commercialism and mischief are rediculous Every major supermarket I've visited for the last few weeks has had an aisle full of Halloween goods, from plastic masks to full costumes. From specially branded sweets to plastic pumpkin decorations. In the UK, the commercialization is in full swing. I'm surprised to hear, that it is different in the US. As for the "mischief" - maybe that is a cultural thing. It probably does vary from area to area, my street isn't exactly a high-class or even middle class area. Michael CP Blog [^]
Those same markets are full food too. Have you decieded to stop eating due to the commercialism of it? Best, Jerry
I Do Whatever My Rice Krispies Tell Me To. Toasty0.com
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Those same markets are full food too. Have you decieded to stop eating due to the commercialism of it? Best, Jerry
I Do Whatever My Rice Krispies Tell Me To. Toasty0.com
Toasty0 wrote: Those same markets are full food too. Have you decieded to stop eating due to the commercialism of it? Actually I have sort of. I'm trying to support more local produce and avoid buying mass-manufactured items. More of a health thing than anything else, trying to avoid the large amount of salt and sugar that is added to most food we buy. I'm afraid I'm turning into a bit of a socialist in my old age. I've grown very cynical about big corporations, especially when it comes to explotation of peoples traditions. Michael CP Blog [^]
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Last year I was almost threatened with a knife by a fourteen year old and his friends for not giving any candy (I had none to give). I say almost, because for once my just-try-it-prick attitude played in my favour. The police did nothing, even though I was not the only person who reported them and other people had known who they were (names and addresses). If I was faced with your situation I would have shut the door in his face when he first opened his mouth. At least the local maffia are polite when they collect their intimidation money. Maybe it is the minority ruining it for the majority, but then that is always the case.
David Wulff The Royal Woofle Museum
Everybody is entitled to my opinion
David Wulff wrote: I would have shut the door in his face when he first opened his mouth. I'm pretty certain I will in the future. I think I remember you posting your story last year. I can't help but wonder who's raising these little brats. BW The Biggest Loser
"Farm Donkey makes us laugh.
Farm Donkey hauls some ass."
-The Stoves -
Toasty0 wrote: Those same markets are full food too. Have you decieded to stop eating due to the commercialism of it? Actually I have sort of. I'm trying to support more local produce and avoid buying mass-manufactured items. More of a health thing than anything else, trying to avoid the large amount of salt and sugar that is added to most food we buy. I'm afraid I'm turning into a bit of a socialist in my old age. I've grown very cynical about big corporations, especially when it comes to explotation of peoples traditions. Michael CP Blog [^]
In other words, even though you don't feed these evil money hungry corporations, you don't like the fact that other people do. Free will is a good thing only as long as people use it in a way you see fit. Great job there. :rolleyes: Tim Smith I'm going to patent thought. I have yet to see any prior art.
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Halloween, is it just another commercial exercise, something to keep the shops ticking over till the Christmas season? Is it just an excuse for the anti-social behaviour element, to make peoples lives a misery without having to worry about the police taking it seriously? Trick or treat by ten year olds is annoying enough, but 16 year olds with bags full of eggs is hardly in the spirit of things. So vote now, 5 for Halloween should be consigned to the history books. Vote 1 if I'm being the Halloween equivalent of Scrooge. Michael CP Blog [^]
It has never been a part of my childhood but I think when done in the right spirit it must be good fun for the kids. It is a pity others spoil it for everyone. The commercialisation is something you can simply ignore, much like at Christmas, Valentines or Easter. regards, Paul Watson South Africa Michael Dunn wrote: "except the sod who voted this a 1, NO SOUP FOR YOU" Crikey! ain't life grand?
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Allen Anderson wrote: reading all the comments from people who don't live in the US it's amazing how different your views are from reality here. Halloween isn't just a US thing, it happens almost everywhere now. Just because the kids in your locality don't cause problems (vanadlism, intimidation, causing distress to the elderly, etc) doesn't mean it doesn't happen elsewhere. Here, it is a big problem every year - I live in an area full of old people who are preyed on by young teenagers to get money and sweets. My next door neighbours are in their late nineties, and today their family is staying with them to answer the door to trick-and-treat'ers. Allen Anderson wrote: Maybe the candy makers make some money, but beyond that it has little commercial value. Walk into just about *any* shop over here (even those that have nothing to do with kids) and you will have to walk past displays of Halloween costumes, fake blood spray, glow in the dark teeth, etc. There is enormous commercial value in, and demand for, these items. Shops are now selling more non-candy Halloween products than they do fireworks for Guy Fawkes Night[^].
David Wulff The Royal Woofle Museum
Everybody is entitled to my opinion
David Wulff wrote: Halloween isn't just a US thing, it happens almost everywhere now. Just because the kids in your locality don't cause problems (vanadlism, intimidation, causing distress to the elderly, etc) doesn't mean it doesn't happen elsewhere. Here, it is a big problem every year - I live in an area full of old people who are preyed on by young teenagers to get money and sweets. My next door neighbours are in their late nineties, and today their family is staying with them to answer the door to trick-and-treat'ers. Here in the US, if people don't want to participate, they turn off their porch light. If they didn't want to participate then I can't imagine why anyone would force them. There are certain religions that don't believe in Halloween here and nobody bothers them.
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In other words, even though you don't feed these evil money hungry corporations, you don't like the fact that other people do. Free will is a good thing only as long as people use it in a way you see fit. Great job there. :rolleyes: Tim Smith I'm going to patent thought. I have yet to see any prior art.
Tim Smith wrote: In other words, even though you don't feed these evil money hungry corporations, you don't like the fact that other people do. Free will is a good thing only as long as people use it in a way you see fit. The about sums it up. ;-) Of course, I don't really care how other people use their freedoms as long as they don't interfere with my freedoms and beliefs. Michael CP Blog [^]
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Halloween, is it just another commercial exercise, something to keep the shops ticking over till the Christmas season? Is it just an excuse for the anti-social behaviour element, to make peoples lives a misery without having to worry about the police taking it seriously? Trick or treat by ten year olds is annoying enough, but 16 year olds with bags full of eggs is hardly in the spirit of things. So vote now, 5 for Halloween should be consigned to the history books. Vote 1 if I'm being the Halloween equivalent of Scrooge. Michael CP Blog [^]
Halloween, is it just another commercial exercise, something to keep the shops ticking over till the Christmas season? Don't forget about the collusion the shops have with the dentists! As someone who is too old to trick or treat, I see it as an excuse to buy excessive amounts of candy and fill "the fix". I've already eaten half a bag of jolly rangers, nibs and tootsie rolls, and will be saving the Reese's peanut butter cups for as long as possible tonight, in the hopes that I won't even have to hand them out! Those things are just too tasty. There is another good thing that seems to be happening. I was at a party Friday night, and it seemed like every other woman was dressed ala sleazy nurse, policewoman or witch. You certainly forget all about the standard-ugly wizard of oz witch look after you've seen the avant-garde witch costume.
Pssst. You see that little light on your monitor? That's actually a spy camera, and I'm tracking your every move...
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When I grew up as a kid in Australia (40 or so years ago) Halloween was something we knew about simply because the Yanks made movies about it. We certainly didn't celebrate Halloween. Maybe 8 years ago (when I was still in Australia) we started seeing kids fronting up with 'Trick or Treat'. I, being a curmudgeon, always gave the little bastards short shrift. Now, living in the USA, I have to say that it certainly looks like Halloween is a commercial event. When you add to that the rubbish on talk radio about whether Halloween should even be observed on Sunday this year (uh huh, so Halloween has never before fallen on a Sunday????) I find myself very much inclined to say let's ditch it entirely. Oh, and one of the reasons advanced by the Scottsdale and Phoenix police forces for observing Halloween on Sunday was that they didn't have the resources to cope with it if it were observed on Saturday. Ummm, isn't it supposed to be a bunch of annoying kids soliciting lollies door to door? How is it possible, in a sane society, for a bunch of annoying kids to need police protection? Rob Manderson I'm working on a version for Visual Lisp++ My (occasional) blog http://blogs.wdevs.com/ultramaroon/[^]
Rob Manderson wrote: Now, living in the USA, You remain free to move elsewhere...
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David Wulff wrote: Halloween isn't just a US thing, it happens almost everywhere now. Just because the kids in your locality don't cause problems (vanadlism, intimidation, causing distress to the elderly, etc) doesn't mean it doesn't happen elsewhere. Here, it is a big problem every year - I live in an area full of old people who are preyed on by young teenagers to get money and sweets. My next door neighbours are in their late nineties, and today their family is staying with them to answer the door to trick-and-treat'ers. Here in the US, if people don't want to participate, they turn off their porch light. If they didn't want to participate then I can't imagine why anyone would force them. There are certain religions that don't believe in Halloween here and nobody bothers them.
Doesn't work here. :( Just saw the first police car of the night do it's rounds...
David Wulff The Royal Woofle Museum
Everybody is entitled to my opinion
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Halloween, is it just another commercial exercise, something to keep the shops ticking over till the Christmas season? Is it just an excuse for the anti-social behaviour element, to make peoples lives a misery without having to worry about the police taking it seriously? Trick or treat by ten year olds is annoying enough, but 16 year olds with bags full of eggs is hardly in the spirit of things. So vote now, 5 for Halloween should be consigned to the history books. Vote 1 if I'm being the Halloween equivalent of Scrooge. Michael CP Blog [^]
Scared of Halloween? For the same reason that no one likes to watch tragedies anymore - there is this dislike of Halloween. Everything must be fun and enjoyable uplifting, and above all well ordered. But the chaos is part of life, and tragedy comes to us all. I think Halloween reminds us of this. Happy Halloween.
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Last year I was almost threatened with a knife by a fourteen year old and his friends for not giving any candy (I had none to give). I say almost, because for once my just-try-it-prick attitude played in my favour. The police did nothing, even though I was not the only person who reported them and other people had known who they were (names and addresses). If I was faced with your situation I would have shut the door in his face when he first opened his mouth. At least the local maffia are polite when they collect their intimidation money. Maybe it is the minority ruining it for the majority, but then that is always the case.
David Wulff The Royal Woofle Museum
Everybody is entitled to my opinion
Its a pretty benign holiday here in the states. I've never encountered any kind of real vandalism or violence associated with it.
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Allen Anderson wrote: All these calls of commercialism and mischief are rediculous Every major supermarket I've visited for the last few weeks has had an aisle full of Halloween goods, from plastic masks to full costumes. From specially branded sweets to plastic pumpkin decorations. In the UK, the commercialization is in full swing. I'm surprised to hear, that it is different in the US. As for the "mischief" - maybe that is a cultural thing. It probably does vary from area to area, my street isn't exactly a high-class or even middle class area. Michael CP Blog [^]
commercialization - the great evil of our age :rolleyes:
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reading all the comments from people who don't live in the US it's amazing how different your views are from reality here. Halloween mischief is very rare. What Halloween has been here since my childhood was where children get dressed up and go trick or treating (being a kid doing this when I was young was something we looked forward to every year). It's also a chance to get dressed up and have a party. All these calls of commercialism and mischief are rediculous. People don't get presents for Halloween. Maybe the candy makers make some money, but beyond that it has little commercial value. If you were never 6 years old with a bad dracula costume dancing around with excitement as you get ready to go trick or treating, then it's hard for you to trully understand the fun of it.
Maybe mischief is rare over in the US, but here in Norway(atleast where I live) mischief is common. Not everyone knows about this custom(or wants to give away something). Especially Senior Citizens have no clue at all on whats this all about. So all of a sudden, kids dressed up as monsters show up at your door, demanding candy. There are mostly teens aged 12+ who do the trick or treating and when someone refuses or doesn't have any few of them walks away. Egged cars, windows, mailboxes, garden furniture etc. is all too common. So does the woman next door well in her eighties deserve to get her windows egged because she wouldn't give away, or even dind't have any candy to give away to these little bastards? All this has given me a negative opinion about Halloween as it is performed here in Norway. It's all right with new customs as long as they aren't so destructive and tiresome. St. Valentine's day for example.
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Michael P Butler wrote: Trick or treat by ten year olds is annoying enough Yes you are being a Scrooge. Why are they annoying? Were you not allowed to have fun when you were younger at this age? Michael P Butler wrote: 16 year olds with bags full of eggs is hardly in the spirit of things. Correct and as such the evening should not be equated to them. They are just vandals and should get a record to destroy their lives. Michael P Butler wrote: something to keep the shops ticking over till the Christmas season? Sorry, but I saw lights going up at a mall 3 weeks ago and my wifes place of employment has begun staying open to midnight. The commercial season is here, with or without Halloween. I do not mind getting old. It beats all the other options that can think of.
Michael A. Barnhart wrote: Yes you are being a Scrooge. Why are they annoying? Were you not allowed to have fun when you were younger at this age? Outside of the USA halloween is a non-event. Other than American movies I never heard of halloween as a kid. It is only in the past couple of years that people have started trick or treating. I sent everyone away yesterday telling them this isn't America we don't do halloween over here. Strangely enough it is almost exclusively asian and wog kids doing it. Michael Martin Australia "I controlled my laughter and simple said "No,I am very busy,so I can't write any code for you". The moment they heard this all the smiling face turned into a sad looking face and one of them farted. So i had to leave the place as soon as possible." - Mr.Prakash 24/04/2004
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Michael A. Barnhart wrote: Yes you are being a Scrooge. Why are they annoying? Were you not allowed to have fun when you were younger at this age? Outside of the USA halloween is a non-event. Other than American movies I never heard of halloween as a kid. It is only in the past couple of years that people have started trick or treating. I sent everyone away yesterday telling them this isn't America we don't do halloween over here. Strangely enough it is almost exclusively asian and wog kids doing it. Michael Martin Australia "I controlled my laughter and simple said "No,I am very busy,so I can't write any code for you". The moment they heard this all the smiling face turned into a sad looking face and one of them farted. So i had to leave the place as soon as possible." - Mr.Prakash 24/04/2004
I live in penrith, which I don't think is too far from where you are and... I THINK THEY ARE GETTING THE POINT!!! last year we had about 3 kids turn up on the door with very empty bags (obviously my house isn't the only one being stingy with the lollies), this year there was just one... always turned away with the "this isn't the USA" line. We can only hope this trend continues next year, as you say Halloween is an American thing, no excuse for any other country to be forced into doing it. Chris.
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Its a pretty benign holiday here in the states. I've never encountered any kind of real vandalism or violence associated with it.
When I was a kid it was all "Penny for the Guy" - We used to make an effigy of Guy Fawkes (he tried to blow up the parliament in Westminster because he didn't agree with who was elected - personally I don't agree with who's elected but I don't go around trying to blow up buildings in order to voice my displeasure... I digress) - or dress up and do a little routine (sing a song, tell a few jokes, and so on). Now, since it all got Americanised, they arrive at the door and say "Trick or Treat" and expect sweets or cash! And if you have a selection of sweets and say something like "take your pick" they take everything.