I Think I've Been Insulted...
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I was asked by a friend to help her with her taxes recently. She hasn't filed in 4 years. I took on the chore - a minor one - because I want to help her get back on track financially, and I've done taxes professionally and on the side for 30+ years. This will only make sense to Americans, but bear with me. She bought a house in 2003, so I had hoped to save her some money by claiming the closing costs, plus the interest on the loan as itemized deductions. No go - the seller paid the closing costs, and her total payments including interest were less than the standard deduction. In 2004 her total interest payments - mortgage interest is deductible from income in the US - were less than the standard deduction once again, and she made too much for an Earned Income Credit. One W-2, no outside work. No medical deductions. No education or job expense. No moving expense, no dependents, no medical savings account, no IRA or Keough plan deductions. Nothing but the one job and the house. I've got nothing to work with here... The insulting thing was that, when I handed the package of fully completed tax returns for 4 years, she said, " There's no way I can owe that much tax. I'm going to have to pay someone to do it right." I'm hurt. Have I reason to be? "If it's Snowbird season, why can't we shoot them?" - Overheard in a bar in Bullhead City
Roger Wright wrote: Have I reason to be? Absolutly! My wife pulls something similar often. Goes like this...She askes my opinion on something, I give it, she doesn't believe me, she asks someone else who tells them the same thing I told her so then she believes them. Not me. Example: She and her mother wanted to have cream colored appliances for the kitchen. I told her it wouldn't look good with the cherry cabinets and we should get black. After doging me for having no taste she asked the builder. The builder said we should go with black. She immediately changed her mind. But I still have no taste!! ed ~"Watch your thoughts; they become your words. Watch your words they become your actions. Watch your actions; they become your habits. Watch your habits; they become your character. Watch your character; it becomes your destiny." - -Uknown.
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I was asked by a friend to help her with her taxes recently. She hasn't filed in 4 years. I took on the chore - a minor one - because I want to help her get back on track financially, and I've done taxes professionally and on the side for 30+ years. This will only make sense to Americans, but bear with me. She bought a house in 2003, so I had hoped to save her some money by claiming the closing costs, plus the interest on the loan as itemized deductions. No go - the seller paid the closing costs, and her total payments including interest were less than the standard deduction. In 2004 her total interest payments - mortgage interest is deductible from income in the US - were less than the standard deduction once again, and she made too much for an Earned Income Credit. One W-2, no outside work. No medical deductions. No education or job expense. No moving expense, no dependents, no medical savings account, no IRA or Keough plan deductions. Nothing but the one job and the house. I've got nothing to work with here... The insulting thing was that, when I handed the package of fully completed tax returns for 4 years, she said, " There's no way I can owe that much tax. I'm going to have to pay someone to do it right." I'm hurt. Have I reason to be? "If it's Snowbird season, why can't we shoot them?" - Overheard in a bar in Bullhead City
So she had no idea what to do, or how much she had to pay, but she knows the amount you gave her was too much? You should lend her some of your books and ask her to work it out herself. I would be hurt by that. If I had put a large amount of effort into working it out and checking it (which we all know you would have done) only to have it thrown back into my face. Whether a fee was charged or not. If she didn't agree with it, she should have said thank you and had it done professionally without telling you. some people have no sense of subtlety. On a side ntoe, I need to prepare my accounts for 2003-2004 if you have some spare time... :rolleyes:
Ðavid Wulff The Royal Woofle Museum
Audioscrobbler :: flikrDie Freiheit spielt auf allen Geigen
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Roger Wright wrote: Have I reason to be? Absolutly! My wife pulls something similar often. Goes like this...She askes my opinion on something, I give it, she doesn't believe me, she asks someone else who tells them the same thing I told her so then she believes them. Not me. Example: She and her mother wanted to have cream colored appliances for the kitchen. I told her it wouldn't look good with the cherry cabinets and we should get black. After doging me for having no taste she asked the builder. The builder said we should go with black. She immediately changed her mind. But I still have no taste!! ed ~"Watch your thoughts; they become your words. Watch your words they become your actions. Watch your actions; they become your habits. Watch your habits; they become your character. Watch your character; it becomes your destiny." - -Uknown.
Ed K wrote: My wife pulls something similar often. Goes like this...She askes my opinion on something, I give it, she doesn't believe me, she asks someone else who tells them the same thing I told her so then she believes them. Not me. Your wife too? I thought my wife is the only one. :laugh:
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I was asked by a friend to help her with her taxes recently. She hasn't filed in 4 years. I took on the chore - a minor one - because I want to help her get back on track financially, and I've done taxes professionally and on the side for 30+ years. This will only make sense to Americans, but bear with me. She bought a house in 2003, so I had hoped to save her some money by claiming the closing costs, plus the interest on the loan as itemized deductions. No go - the seller paid the closing costs, and her total payments including interest were less than the standard deduction. In 2004 her total interest payments - mortgage interest is deductible from income in the US - were less than the standard deduction once again, and she made too much for an Earned Income Credit. One W-2, no outside work. No medical deductions. No education or job expense. No moving expense, no dependents, no medical savings account, no IRA or Keough plan deductions. Nothing but the one job and the house. I've got nothing to work with here... The insulting thing was that, when I handed the package of fully completed tax returns for 4 years, she said, " There's no way I can owe that much tax. I'm going to have to pay someone to do it right." I'm hurt. Have I reason to be? "If it's Snowbird season, why can't we shoot them?" - Overheard in a bar in Bullhead City
Roger Wright wrote: She bought a house in 2003 How was she able to get a house financed without showing a couple years of tax records? I just bought a measly mobile home and had to do proof of income statements, tax records, the whole nine yards! Roger Wright wrote: Have I reason to be? Absolutely. That's pretty disrespectful. Marc MyXaml Advanced Unit Testing YAPO
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A IRS Licensed Tax Preparer is not allowed to disclose his/her clients confidential information without the clients explicit approval. She has not been named, but sufficient information has been provided for interested parties (for example her enemies) to deduce her identity. We already know she is a friend of Rogers. She may in turn have a circle of friends who know Roger is helping her with her taxes. Some of those friends may be reading these message boards. To these folks this message will jump straight out at them. Now they are privy to some information they have no business knowing. The internet is a permanent record. They can pull up these messages even 2-3 years from now and voila ! Easiest way to catch Osama - I would have Gillete announce a "Worst Beard Contest 2005" in North West Pakistan and arrest the top-three winners. One of them has got to be Osama. Simple yet cunning !
Vivek Rajan wrote: She has not been named, but sufficient information has been provided for interested parties (for example her enemies) to deduce her identity. Nonsense. I have many friends and acquaintances, and the FBI would be seriously strained to identify them all. I haven't even mentioned which state she lives in, and I have regular contacts with friends from many of them. Quite a few of them ask me for tax help, as well. "If it's Snowbird season, why can't we shoot them?" - Overheard in a bar in Bullhead City
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boy, she must have either bought a very inexpensive home, got a really low interest rate or a really long loan period. I refinanced three years ago (5.25% @ 15 years) and the loan interest is still 60% of the monthly payment...I was told some time ago that the principle portion of a monthly payment doesn't get to more than 50% until at least half of the loan life has past. Steve
Steve Mayfield wrote: I was told some time ago that the principle portion of a monthly payment doesn't get to more than 50% until at least half of the loan life has past. That's correct - you can do the math and prove it to yourself. Adding even $100/month to your payment will significantly reduce your total cost over the life of the loan because for the first 5 years or so your payments are almost entirely interest. "If it's Snowbird season, why can't we shoot them?" - Overheard in a bar in Bullhead City
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Roger Wright wrote: I'm hurt. Have I reason to be? Typical response is Yes. But think about this, said by Christopher Duncan a month or so back: "Life isn't fair, and the world is full of unscrupulous characters. There are things worth fighting for, killing for and dying for, but it's a really small list. Chalk it up to experience, let it go, and move on to the next positive experience in your life." :rose: Vikram.
http://www.geocities.com/vpunathambekar "It's like hitting water with your fist. There's all sorts of motion and noise at impact, and no impression left whatsoever shortly thereafter." — gantww.
Christopher is one of our wiser members - I appreciate his input whenever he cares to give it. Hurt, anger, and other negative emotions are hard for me to retain - I seem to have a defect in that way. I was really just doing a reality check here, wondering if I'm still normal since it's so hard for me to feel really upset with anyone about such a trivial matter. So many people get very upset about things that I hardly notice, I sometimes wonder whether I'm defective in some way, as I rarely get disturbed by small things. I can't remember the last time I felt angry, and it sometimes bothers me. Once in a while I wish I could get really worked up about something and hit somebody, as so many people often do, but somehow I never feel the urge to do so.:sigh: "If it's Snowbird season, why can't we shoot them?" - Overheard in a bar in Bullhead City
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Roger Wright wrote: I'm hurt. Have I reason to be? Yes. So I would sit back and watch her spend good money on someone who will tel her the same. If he however manages to reduce her tax, you should forgive her. If not I would make a point of it to confront her at least twice a year for the next 2-3 years :) (best with a joke, been doing something similar with a friend for over 10 years now, it has become a running gag.) Rutger
:laugh::laugh: Nice thought, but I'm completely incapable of holding a grudge for more than 10 minutes. "If it's Snowbird season, why can't we shoot them?" - Overheard in a bar in Bullhead City
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It sounds like she was looking for an excuse to deny something she didn't want to acknowledge. The tigress is here :-D
I think you're absolutely right, Elaine. I, too, think I pay far too much in taxes and would love to deny the numbers. But they don't lie - if you have a simple income and no deductible expenses, you're screwed in this country. That's most of us, a minor consolation knowing that we're in good company. Taxes in the US take half of everything we earn in the US, and it's distressing, but it is somewhat better than in many other places in the world. You can shut up and pay it, or get out to the voting booths and do something about it, however small. Denying it doesn't help, or keep the bloodsuckers away from your doorstep. "If it's Snowbird season, why can't we shoot them?" - Overheard in a bar in Bullhead City
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Roger Wright wrote: Have I reason to be? Absolutly! My wife pulls something similar often. Goes like this...She askes my opinion on something, I give it, she doesn't believe me, she asks someone else who tells them the same thing I told her so then she believes them. Not me. Example: She and her mother wanted to have cream colored appliances for the kitchen. I told her it wouldn't look good with the cherry cabinets and we should get black. After doging me for having no taste she asked the builder. The builder said we should go with black. She immediately changed her mind. But I still have no taste!! ed ~"Watch your thoughts; they become your words. Watch your words they become your actions. Watch your actions; they become your habits. Watch your habits; they become your character. Watch your character; it becomes your destiny." - -Uknown.
Wow! Is that ever familiar! Curiously, most of my friends are female, and I get this behavior a lot. I doubt that it's limited to the female of the species, though, as most men I know are also afflicted with this kind of defective logic. I lack the practical experience to prove it, however. "If a man speaks in the woods, and there is no woman around to hear him, is he still wrong?" ;) "If it's Snowbird season, why can't we shoot them?" - Overheard in a bar in Bullhead City
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So she had no idea what to do, or how much she had to pay, but she knows the amount you gave her was too much? You should lend her some of your books and ask her to work it out herself. I would be hurt by that. If I had put a large amount of effort into working it out and checking it (which we all know you would have done) only to have it thrown back into my face. Whether a fee was charged or not. If she didn't agree with it, she should have said thank you and had it done professionally without telling you. some people have no sense of subtlety. On a side ntoe, I need to prepare my accounts for 2003-2004 if you have some spare time... :rolleyes:
Ðavid Wulff The Royal Woofle Museum
Audioscrobbler :: flikrDie Freiheit spielt auf allen Geigen
David Wulff wrote: On a side ntoe, I need to prepare my accounts for 2003-2004 if you have some spare time... I'd be happy to do that for you, David, if I had any knowledge of tax laws in your country. From what I read here in these forums, though, they're quite as complicated as those in the US, and entirely different. You'd be a fool to let me try.:) "If it's Snowbird season, why can't we shoot them?" - Overheard in a bar in Bullhead City
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Roger Wright wrote: She bought a house in 2003 How was she able to get a house financed without showing a couple years of tax records? I just bought a measly mobile home and had to do proof of income statements, tax records, the whole nine yards! Roger Wright wrote: Have I reason to be? Absolutely. That's pretty disrespectful. Marc MyXaml Advanced Unit Testing YAPO
I was wondering the same thing. I'm considering buying in the same area, now that I have a real income, and definitely want to use the same mortgage company. Maybe they won't notice my terrible credit.:rolleyes: "If it's Snowbird season, why can't we shoot them?" - Overheard in a bar in Bullhead City
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A IRS Licensed Tax Preparer is not allowed to disclose his/her clients confidential information without the clients explicit approval. She has not been named, but sufficient information has been provided for interested parties (for example her enemies) to deduce her identity. We already know she is a friend of Rogers. She may in turn have a circle of friends who know Roger is helping her with her taxes. Some of those friends may be reading these message boards. To these folks this message will jump straight out at them. Now they are privy to some information they have no business knowing. The internet is a permanent record. They can pull up these messages even 2-3 years from now and voila ! Easiest way to catch Osama - I would have Gillete announce a "Worst Beard Contest 2005" in North West Pakistan and arrest the top-three winners. One of them has got to be Osama. Simple yet cunning !
Vivek Rajan wrote: They can pull up these messages even 2-3 years from now and voila ! so? I understand your point, but what can possibly be gained by knowing someone hasn't paid taxes in 4 years and just bought a house? She obviously isn't trying to get away with anything since she is trying to pay what she owes, so what about this info can be used by "her enemies"? BW
I want pancakes! God, do you people understand every language except English?
Yo quiero pancakes. Donnez moi pancakes. Click click, bloody click pancakes!
-- Stewie Griffin -
I think this is the correct response for you in this case. If this is a bit esoteric I am happy to elucidate later. Roger Wright wrote: I'm hurt. Have I reason to be? Yes. Michael Martin Australia "I controlled my laughter and simple said "No,I am very busy,so I can't write any code for you". The moment they heard this all the smiling face turned into a sad looking face and one of them farted. So i had to leave the place as soon as possible." - Mr.Prakash 24/04/2004
:laugh::laugh: Thanks, but I'll pass. I'm by nature a bit more diplomatic than that. Not to say that I haven't thought such things, mind you...;) "If it's Snowbird season, why can't we shoot them?" - Overheard in a bar in Bullhead City
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If it's any consolation, she inherently admitted her own inability to do her taxes "right" - in other words, she didn't insult your abilities any more than she insulted her own. And since she said "There's no way I can owe that much tax", I'm guessing she was probably rather distressed when she said it, which means she probably wasn't really thinking about your feelings and was probably looking for a way to calm herself about the amount of money she owes. ----------------------------------------------------- Empires Of Steel[^] It was very nice of our loving Designer to design an immune system to protect us from the deadly diseases He designed.
Brit wrote: was probably looking for a way to calm herself about the amount of money she owes. Quite likely true. Sadly, what she owes is a pittance, and I almost offerred to pay it for her, but at the wages most people here earn it must seem like an insurmountable debt. "If it's Snowbird season, why can't we shoot them?" - Overheard in a bar in Bullhead City
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I was asked by a friend to help her with her taxes recently. She hasn't filed in 4 years. I took on the chore - a minor one - because I want to help her get back on track financially, and I've done taxes professionally and on the side for 30+ years. This will only make sense to Americans, but bear with me. She bought a house in 2003, so I had hoped to save her some money by claiming the closing costs, plus the interest on the loan as itemized deductions. No go - the seller paid the closing costs, and her total payments including interest were less than the standard deduction. In 2004 her total interest payments - mortgage interest is deductible from income in the US - were less than the standard deduction once again, and she made too much for an Earned Income Credit. One W-2, no outside work. No medical deductions. No education or job expense. No moving expense, no dependents, no medical savings account, no IRA or Keough plan deductions. Nothing but the one job and the house. I've got nothing to work with here... The insulting thing was that, when I handed the package of fully completed tax returns for 4 years, she said, " There's no way I can owe that much tax. I'm going to have to pay someone to do it right." I'm hurt. Have I reason to be? "If it's Snowbird season, why can't we shoot them?" - Overheard in a bar in Bullhead City
I wouldn't take it too hard, Roger. She lacks tact, but I'd guess, if you are really friends, she didn't mean the way it came out. If she didn't trust you, she wouldn't have asked for your help to begin with. She is likely reacting to the news, and hoping you have missed something that could save her some money. She's just grasping at straws, more or less. BW
I want pancakes! God, do you people understand every language except English?
Yo quiero pancakes. Donnez moi pancakes. Click click, bloody click pancakes!
-- Stewie Griffin -
I was asked by a friend to help her with her taxes recently. She hasn't filed in 4 years. I took on the chore - a minor one - because I want to help her get back on track financially, and I've done taxes professionally and on the side for 30+ years. This will only make sense to Americans, but bear with me. She bought a house in 2003, so I had hoped to save her some money by claiming the closing costs, plus the interest on the loan as itemized deductions. No go - the seller paid the closing costs, and her total payments including interest were less than the standard deduction. In 2004 her total interest payments - mortgage interest is deductible from income in the US - were less than the standard deduction once again, and she made too much for an Earned Income Credit. One W-2, no outside work. No medical deductions. No education or job expense. No moving expense, no dependents, no medical savings account, no IRA or Keough plan deductions. Nothing but the one job and the house. I've got nothing to work with here... The insulting thing was that, when I handed the package of fully completed tax returns for 4 years, she said, " There's no way I can owe that much tax. I'm going to have to pay someone to do it right." I'm hurt. Have I reason to be? "If it's Snowbird season, why can't we shoot them?" - Overheard in a bar in Bullhead City
Roger Wright wrote: I'm hurt. Have I reason to be? Yes, but if you are the vengeful type (though you don't seem to be) she will get hers when she has to pay what she owes plus the "professional's fee". As for the taxes theres not much you can do with simple income, I'm sure it varies from state to state but you fill in a few boxes and viola you've got your results. Recently I have had my own personal taxes done professionally because my "income" is getting more complex etc and I just do it for peace of mind (and I know the guy) but after reviewing it there isn't anything he can do that I couldn't. Matt Newman
Even the very best tools in the hands of an idiot will produce something of little or no value. - Chris Meech on Idiots
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Steve Mayfield wrote: I was told some time ago that the principle portion of a monthly payment doesn't get to more than 50% until at least half of the loan life has past. That's correct - you can do the math and prove it to yourself. Adding even $100/month to your payment will significantly reduce your total cost over the life of the loan because for the first 5 years or so your payments are almost entirely interest. "If it's Snowbird season, why can't we shoot them?" - Overheard in a bar in Bullhead City
We all know the fantastic portion of interest paid on a long term homeloan, but it was really brought home to me recently as I have just bought a house. I was using an online mortgage calculator to estimate my repayments on a loan amount of ZAR690k, and mistakenly entered ZAR690.00. In the result field, the amount I took to be the repayment, over ZAR7k seemed way too high, but was actually the total amount to be paid over the term. That is, 10 times the loan amount, for only a small loan over 20 years. His hands felt the grasp of strong white hairs, and he knew he would not survive this fungus.
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I was asked by a friend to help her with her taxes recently. She hasn't filed in 4 years. I took on the chore - a minor one - because I want to help her get back on track financially, and I've done taxes professionally and on the side for 30+ years. This will only make sense to Americans, but bear with me. She bought a house in 2003, so I had hoped to save her some money by claiming the closing costs, plus the interest on the loan as itemized deductions. No go - the seller paid the closing costs, and her total payments including interest were less than the standard deduction. In 2004 her total interest payments - mortgage interest is deductible from income in the US - were less than the standard deduction once again, and she made too much for an Earned Income Credit. One W-2, no outside work. No medical deductions. No education or job expense. No moving expense, no dependents, no medical savings account, no IRA or Keough plan deductions. Nothing but the one job and the house. I've got nothing to work with here... The insulting thing was that, when I handed the package of fully completed tax returns for 4 years, she said, " There's no way I can owe that much tax. I'm going to have to pay someone to do it right." I'm hurt. Have I reason to be? "If it's Snowbird season, why can't we shoot them?" - Overheard in a bar in Bullhead City
I really respect your good heart, Roger. You've just experienced that old human trait that folks respect your efforts and knowledge in perportion to the amount they paid for it. Jerry Most people are willing to pay more to be amused than to be educated--Robert C. Savage, Life Lessons Toasty0.com Ladder League (beta)
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I was asked by a friend to help her with her taxes recently. She hasn't filed in 4 years. I took on the chore - a minor one - because I want to help her get back on track financially, and I've done taxes professionally and on the side for 30+ years. This will only make sense to Americans, but bear with me. She bought a house in 2003, so I had hoped to save her some money by claiming the closing costs, plus the interest on the loan as itemized deductions. No go - the seller paid the closing costs, and her total payments including interest were less than the standard deduction. In 2004 her total interest payments - mortgage interest is deductible from income in the US - were less than the standard deduction once again, and she made too much for an Earned Income Credit. One W-2, no outside work. No medical deductions. No education or job expense. No moving expense, no dependents, no medical savings account, no IRA or Keough plan deductions. Nothing but the one job and the house. I've got nothing to work with here... The insulting thing was that, when I handed the package of fully completed tax returns for 4 years, she said, " There's no way I can owe that much tax. I'm going to have to pay someone to do it right." I'm hurt. Have I reason to be? "If it's Snowbird season, why can't we shoot them?" - Overheard in a bar in Bullhead City
Roger Wright wrote: I'm hurt. Have I reason to be? I agree, there is reason to be hurt. However, I think there is room to understand that she is in denial of the financial issues she has to deal with. She will pay her money to someone else, they will tell her the same and she will either get mad (still being in denial) and walk out looking for someone else, or finally accept the situation she is in. You can't help her with that, she has to come to terms with what she is facing. If she were not in denial, scared of what she has to deal with she might have stopped to ask for an explanation. "Would you be willing to help me understand why this is so high?" but she is not ready for that yet. Good luck, and I hope the friendship survives. Perhaps, as an appology she will return and ask if there is anything she can do, start doing (or start recording, like medical and charity payments) in order to prevent this from happening again. That might prepare her better for the future, proactive rather than reactive. _________________________ Asu no koto o ieba, tenjo de nezumi ga warau. Talk about things of tomorrow and the mice in the ceiling laugh. (Japanese Proverb)