Calling all Brits
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You don't like your big brother, do you? ;) -- An eye for an eye will only make the world blind.
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You don't like your big brother, do you? ;) -- An eye for an eye will only make the world blind.
Jörgen Sigvardsson wrote: You don't like your big brother, do you? Well, this scheme has been thought up by people with the technological skill of a tenth-rate VB programmer and an authoritarian streak wider than the Atlantic....
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Jörgen Sigvardsson wrote: You don't like your big brother, do you? Well, this scheme has been thought up by people with the technological skill of a tenth-rate VB programmer and an authoritarian streak wider than the Atlantic....
We've had this scheme for as long as I can remember. When you are born you are given a number, much like a social security number. It's the birth date plus four digits (YYYYMMDD-XXXX). I can't say that I have suffered from this, but on the same note I can't say that I have benefited from it either. -- An eye for an eye will only make the world blind.
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We've had this scheme for as long as I can remember. When you are born you are given a number, much like a social security number. It's the birth date plus four digits (YYYYMMDD-XXXX). I can't say that I have suffered from this, but on the same note I can't say that I have benefited from it either. -- An eye for an eye will only make the world blind.
Jörgen Sigvardsson wrote: We've had this scheme for as long as I can remember. When you are born you are given a number, much like a social security number. It's the birth date plus four digits (YYYYMMDD-XXXX). The scheme here is significantly more sinister - the whole thing is backed by a National Identity Register - which also includes things like: Biometrics (Face, iris and fingerprints) - even though these have a failure rate that makes them unsuited to mass populations. Requirement to notify the State when you move house (currently only people registered on the Violent and Sex Offenders list have to do that) - with hefty fines for non-compliance. In fact, there's a big old list of stuff here[^].
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Jörgen Sigvardsson wrote: We've had this scheme for as long as I can remember. When you are born you are given a number, much like a social security number. It's the birth date plus four digits (YYYYMMDD-XXXX). The scheme here is significantly more sinister - the whole thing is backed by a National Identity Register - which also includes things like: Biometrics (Face, iris and fingerprints) - even though these have a failure rate that makes them unsuited to mass populations. Requirement to notify the State when you move house (currently only people registered on the Violent and Sex Offenders list have to do that) - with hefty fines for non-compliance. In fact, there's a big old list of stuff here[^].
Yikes!! What the hell is going on over there!? -- An eye for an eye will only make the world blind.
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Yikes!! What the hell is going on over there!? -- An eye for an eye will only make the world blind.
Jörgen Sigvardsson wrote: Yikes!! What the hell is going on over there!? Control freakery by a technophiliac UK Government - some of the current proposals include vehicle tracking with GPS/Galileo to replace fuel taxes, then there's the ID Cards with National Identity Register, and I think there's some child register being talked about too, computerisation and mass networking of the health service, "electronic government", electronic tagging/tracking of certain classes of criminals and people who the government think are terrorists but have no evidence at all. There's probably some other stuff too, but the ID Cards and National Identity Register is the most pressing thing to stop, followed by the vehicle tracking stuff.
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Jörgen Sigvardsson wrote: Yikes!! What the hell is going on over there!? Control freakery by a technophiliac UK Government - some of the current proposals include vehicle tracking with GPS/Galileo to replace fuel taxes, then there's the ID Cards with National Identity Register, and I think there's some child register being talked about too, computerisation and mass networking of the health service, "electronic government", electronic tagging/tracking of certain classes of criminals and people who the government think are terrorists but have no evidence at all. There's probably some other stuff too, but the ID Cards and National Identity Register is the most pressing thing to stop, followed by the vehicle tracking stuff.
I wish you good luck! -- An eye for an eye will only make the world blind.
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Jörgen Sigvardsson wrote: We've had this scheme for as long as I can remember. When you are born you are given a number, much like a social security number. It's the birth date plus four digits (YYYYMMDD-XXXX). The scheme here is significantly more sinister - the whole thing is backed by a National Identity Register - which also includes things like: Biometrics (Face, iris and fingerprints) - even though these have a failure rate that makes them unsuited to mass populations. Requirement to notify the State when you move house (currently only people registered on the Violent and Sex Offenders list have to do that) - with hefty fines for non-compliance. In fact, there's a big old list of stuff here[^].
Ian Darling wrote: Requirement to notify the State when you move house Don't people always have to register and notify some kind of authority when they move? I have to, and I'm practically your neighbour.
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Ian Darling wrote: Requirement to notify the State when you move house Don't people always have to register and notify some kind of authority when they move? I have to, and I'm practically your neighbour.
Michael Hendrickx wrote: Don't people always have to register and notify some kind of authority when they move? I have to, and I'm practically your neighbour. The only authority I had to contact last time I moved was the local council for the area I moved to, and that was just for the electoral roll and to register for the locally administered housing tax. And I certainly wouldn't get fined thousands of pounds if I didn't get it done within a month. When I was a student I was exempt from the local house taxes too, so I don't think I even had that much to do (IIRC). I also registered with the local doctors surgery, but only when I needed medical treatment for an injury. As far as I'm concerned, most bits of government (and in particular, central government) don't need to know where I live, as I almost never have to deal with them. Why have the extra bureaucracy when it isn't needed?
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Jörgen Sigvardsson wrote: You don't like your big brother, do you? Well, this scheme has been thought up by people with the technological skill of a tenth-rate VB programmer and an authoritarian streak wider than the Atlantic....
I think that your comment is insulting to tenth-rate VB programmers. ;P
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Michael Hendrickx wrote: Don't people always have to register and notify some kind of authority when they move? I have to, and I'm practically your neighbour. The only authority I had to contact last time I moved was the local council for the area I moved to, and that was just for the electoral roll and to register for the locally administered housing tax. And I certainly wouldn't get fined thousands of pounds if I didn't get it done within a month. When I was a student I was exempt from the local house taxes too, so I don't think I even had that much to do (IIRC). I also registered with the local doctors surgery, but only when I needed medical treatment for an injury. As far as I'm concerned, most bits of government (and in particular, central government) don't need to know where I live, as I almost never have to deal with them. Why have the extra bureaucracy when it isn't needed?
Ian Darling wrote: As far as I'm concerned, most bits of government (and in particular, central government) don't need to know where I live, as I almost never have to deal with them. Why have the extra bureaucracy when it isn't needed? True, I wholeheartly agree, yet if all local council / authorities / medical entities / .. - would all stick together, having one big database (oracle 9i - unbreakable :)) they would have had a profile on you already. Furthermore, look at it from the governments point of view, you wanna live in the UK, take advantage of its features (medical treatment, education, safety, roads, ...) but yet remain anonymous? It's like you wanna post in codeproject.com, but dont wanna sign up. I mean; put all data about you together, including education, medical data, family, hobbies, emails your receive (mailing lists, what sites you surf to, ...), phone records, .. There's awfully little space for freedom. Now UK government just want it all a little bit organized. So, Big Brother has you. Not uncle sam, but Uncle Tony in your case :) Yeah, I don't like big brother too.. but there's very little you can do about it.
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Ian Darling wrote: As far as I'm concerned, most bits of government (and in particular, central government) don't need to know where I live, as I almost never have to deal with them. Why have the extra bureaucracy when it isn't needed? True, I wholeheartly agree, yet if all local council / authorities / medical entities / .. - would all stick together, having one big database (oracle 9i - unbreakable :)) they would have had a profile on you already. Furthermore, look at it from the governments point of view, you wanna live in the UK, take advantage of its features (medical treatment, education, safety, roads, ...) but yet remain anonymous? It's like you wanna post in codeproject.com, but dont wanna sign up. I mean; put all data about you together, including education, medical data, family, hobbies, emails your receive (mailing lists, what sites you surf to, ...), phone records, .. There's awfully little space for freedom. Now UK government just want it all a little bit organized. So, Big Brother has you. Not uncle sam, but Uncle Tony in your case :) Yeah, I don't like big brother too.. but there's very little you can do about it.
Michael Hendrickx wrote: Furthermore, look at it from the governments point of view, you wanna live in the UK, take advantage of its features (medical treatment, education, safety, roads, ...) but yet remain anonymous? It's like you wanna post in codeproject.com, but dont wanna sign up. The thing is, that when dealing with education, health, and even codeproject, I'm the one choosing to be anonymous or not. But if I'm minding my own business, I want to remain anonymous. Under the National Identity Register, anonymity becomes a lot harder to attain, because the biometrics stored (unreliable as they are) can then be matched up to you (or a subset of people that probably includes you), even if you haven't wanted to be identified. Say I'm protesting a government policy (on anything you like). Being able to remain anonymous at your own choice is actually essential in this scenario, because it protects me from a government who might try to silence me if they knew who I was - basically the right to anonymity is one of the things that protects and supports democracy, and the people who live in democracies. (People in the UK may wish to remind themselves over the events regarding Dr Kelly at this point. If you're forced out of anonymity after criticising the government, the pressure on you ends up such that you might take your own life!) That was one of the things the American's definitely got right in their Constitution - the freedom to be anonymous and move about anonymously. Michael Hendrickx wrote: I mean; put all data about you together, including education, medical data, family, hobbies, emails your receive (mailing lists, what sites you surf to, ...), phone records, .. There's awfully little space for freedom. Now UK government just want it all a little bit organized. There's also a security failing when dealing with these sorts of unified databases - one mass database for everything is a much more attractive proposition for criminals and nosy bastards, in the same way a nice juicy steak is more appealing than cheap burgers. In the UK we have a law called the Data Protection Act, and one of the principles of that act is that any data stored on a person must be proportionate, that is to say relevant to the task at hand and nothing else. So mailing lists may have your address and some information relating to the list, but they can't justify having your medical records, tax records, private communications, and so forth.
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I think that your comment is insulting to tenth-rate VB programmers. ;P
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Colin Angus Mackay wrote: I think that your comment is insulting to tenth-rate VB programmers. And what's really scary is that is so true :sigh:
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I pledged, but I'm curious about this other one: "I will cut up my identity card and sent the bits to the Home Secretary but only if 50 other suspicious persons will too."[^] I'd still have to pay the £150 odd it would eventually rise to to get the card first, wouldn't I? There are two things I won't do, 1) cut up money and 2) cut up anything with the monarch's head on it, the card will probably carry both? (Neither is because I owe any real duty of care, but purely because I don't think they are very clever or repsectful things to do...) How about applying for a card in Osama Bin Laden's name, and details, and if it gets granted going to the tabloids? That ought to have the system scrapped overnight. I'm going to open a pool - "How many years until we are mandated to carry RFID tags in our bodies?" Entry is £5. The prize money + any interest will be split up amongst all the people who guess the correct year.
Ðavid Wulff Audioscrobbler :: flickr Die Freiheit spielt auf allen Geigen (QT)
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I pledged, but I'm curious about this other one: "I will cut up my identity card and sent the bits to the Home Secretary but only if 50 other suspicious persons will too."[^] I'd still have to pay the £150 odd it would eventually rise to to get the card first, wouldn't I? There are two things I won't do, 1) cut up money and 2) cut up anything with the monarch's head on it, the card will probably carry both? (Neither is because I owe any real duty of care, but purely because I don't think they are very clever or repsectful things to do...) How about applying for a card in Osama Bin Laden's name, and details, and if it gets granted going to the tabloids? That ought to have the system scrapped overnight. I'm going to open a pool - "How many years until we are mandated to carry RFID tags in our bodies?" Entry is £5. The prize money + any interest will be split up amongst all the people who guess the correct year.
Ðavid Wulff Audioscrobbler :: flickr Die Freiheit spielt auf allen Geigen (QT)
The whole thing is totally ridiculous. If they want the money then they can get it from me but if they give me a card then so what. I'll just lose it either intentionally or unintentionally. I can't even keep hold of things I want to keep. The only way they'll force me to carry it is by stapling it to my forehead. Another example of the petty fascism that is engulfing our country. Best just to ignore it like all the rest of their stupid rules.
MOO!
"I am not a morose person, but I would rather not be here. I don't have any reverence for life, only for the entities themselves. I would rather see a blank space where I am. This will sound like fruitcake stuff again but at least I wouldn't be harming anything." --Ingrid Newkirk, national director, People for the Ethical Treatment of Animals (PeTA), as quoted in Chip Brown, "She's a Portrait of Zealotry in Plastic Shoes," Washington Post, November 13, 1983, p. B10.
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Ian Darling wrote: As far as I'm concerned, most bits of government (and in particular, central government) don't need to know where I live, as I almost never have to deal with them. Why have the extra bureaucracy when it isn't needed? True, I wholeheartly agree, yet if all local council / authorities / medical entities / .. - would all stick together, having one big database (oracle 9i - unbreakable :)) they would have had a profile on you already. Furthermore, look at it from the governments point of view, you wanna live in the UK, take advantage of its features (medical treatment, education, safety, roads, ...) but yet remain anonymous? It's like you wanna post in codeproject.com, but dont wanna sign up. I mean; put all data about you together, including education, medical data, family, hobbies, emails your receive (mailing lists, what sites you surf to, ...), phone records, .. There's awfully little space for freedom. Now UK government just want it all a little bit organized. So, Big Brother has you. Not uncle sam, but Uncle Tony in your case :) Yeah, I don't like big brother too.. but there's very little you can do about it.
It's not that I 'wanna live in the UK' I am British. I happen to believe that I am the master here not them. They serve me not the other way round. It's an important distinction. It's fundemental to our civil liberties that we remain anonymous. My hobbies are my own to share if I will. Tony Blair is just a blip damn I should have made this an anonymous post!
MOO!
"I am not a morose person, but I would rather not be here. I don't have any reverence for life, only for the entities themselves. I would rather see a blank space where I am. This will sound like fruitcake stuff again but at least I wouldn't be harming anything." --Ingrid Newkirk, national director, People for the Ethical Treatment of Animals (PeTA), as quoted in Chip Brown, "She's a Portrait of Zealotry in Plastic Shoes," Washington Post, November 13, 1983, p. B10.
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I pledged, but I'm curious about this other one: "I will cut up my identity card and sent the bits to the Home Secretary but only if 50 other suspicious persons will too."[^] I'd still have to pay the £150 odd it would eventually rise to to get the card first, wouldn't I? There are two things I won't do, 1) cut up money and 2) cut up anything with the monarch's head on it, the card will probably carry both? (Neither is because I owe any real duty of care, but purely because I don't think they are very clever or repsectful things to do...) How about applying for a card in Osama Bin Laden's name, and details, and if it gets granted going to the tabloids? That ought to have the system scrapped overnight. I'm going to open a pool - "How many years until we are mandated to carry RFID tags in our bodies?" Entry is £5. The prize money + any interest will be split up amongst all the people who guess the correct year.
Ðavid Wulff Audioscrobbler :: flickr Die Freiheit spielt auf allen Geigen (QT)
David Wulff wrote: I'm going to open a pool - "How many years until we are mandated to carry RFID tags in our bodies?" Entry is £5. The prize money + any interest will be split up amongst all the people who guess the correct year. The year will be when Kevin Warwick (aka Captain Cyborg) convinces Tony Blair that it'd help in fighting terrorism :rolleyes: So I'd say it'll be announced in the next year or two, combined with the ID scheme (so you can't lose it), and rolled out around 2012 in time for the Olympics (if we win it), or 2013 if not.
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Michael Hendrickx wrote: Furthermore, look at it from the governments point of view, you wanna live in the UK, take advantage of its features (medical treatment, education, safety, roads, ...) but yet remain anonymous? It's like you wanna post in codeproject.com, but dont wanna sign up. The thing is, that when dealing with education, health, and even codeproject, I'm the one choosing to be anonymous or not. But if I'm minding my own business, I want to remain anonymous. Under the National Identity Register, anonymity becomes a lot harder to attain, because the biometrics stored (unreliable as they are) can then be matched up to you (or a subset of people that probably includes you), even if you haven't wanted to be identified. Say I'm protesting a government policy (on anything you like). Being able to remain anonymous at your own choice is actually essential in this scenario, because it protects me from a government who might try to silence me if they knew who I was - basically the right to anonymity is one of the things that protects and supports democracy, and the people who live in democracies. (People in the UK may wish to remind themselves over the events regarding Dr Kelly at this point. If you're forced out of anonymity after criticising the government, the pressure on you ends up such that you might take your own life!) That was one of the things the American's definitely got right in their Constitution - the freedom to be anonymous and move about anonymously. Michael Hendrickx wrote: I mean; put all data about you together, including education, medical data, family, hobbies, emails your receive (mailing lists, what sites you surf to, ...), phone records, .. There's awfully little space for freedom. Now UK government just want it all a little bit organized. There's also a security failing when dealing with these sorts of unified databases - one mass database for everything is a much more attractive proposition for criminals and nosy bastards, in the same way a nice juicy steak is more appealing than cheap burgers. In the UK we have a law called the Data Protection Act, and one of the principles of that act is that any data stored on a person must be proportionate, that is to say relevant to the task at hand and nothing else. So mailing lists may have your address and some information relating to the list, but they can't justify having your medical records, tax records, private communications, and so forth.
Ian Darling wrote: there's a metric f***load *flipping through the SI book* I just can't seem to find that unit.. :confused: :-D -- An eye for an eye will only make the world blind.
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Signed up. It cannot work and will meke about 2.5 million people criminals and legalise the criminals with fake cards. The tigress is here :-D
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It's just appeared in The Register. The tigress is here :-D