Principles
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Is there any kind of company you wouldn't work for ? Would you develop software for a tobacco company, a slaughterhouse, a nuclear plant, Microsoft, landmine makers etc Is there any job that you'd have to say no to because they were involved in something you didn't believe in? Michael :-)
Michael P Butler wrote: Would you develop software for a tobacco company, a slaughterhouse, a nuclear plant, Microsoft, landmine makers etc 1. A tobacco company. Yes with a few little bugs. :rolleyes: 2. A slaughterhouse. Why not? I'm not a vegetarian. 3. A nuclear plant. Yeah. Nuc plants are pretty safe these days. 4. Microsoft. Yes!!! I'm not an open-source fanatic. 5. Landmine makers. Hmmm. Hardly. I vote pro drink :beer:
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Is there any kind of company you wouldn't work for ? Would you develop software for a tobacco company, a slaughterhouse, a nuclear plant, Microsoft, landmine makers etc Is there any job that you'd have to say no to because they were involved in something you didn't believe in? Michael :-)
Interesting question. Actually, I'm working for a nuke plant right now. I justify it because the project I'm working on is a safety inspection system - I figure that's good karma. And as it turns out, I have a feeling the next contract my employer will want me to work on is for the military. It's an immersive video system for tanks and troop carriers. I have a serious problem with this, in that I don't want to ever contribute to any war effort. It'll will be interesting to see if I'm going to have to choose between my morals and my job... :confused: J
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Huh? Why woudldn't you work for land-mine workers? That's what he asked? Or were you answering him in reverse? Nish Sonork ID 100.9786 voidmain www.busterboy.org If you don't find me on CP, I'll be at Bob's HungOut
Nish [BusterBoy] wrote: Why woudldn't you work for land-mine workers? He said "Land mine makers", My opinion is that land-mines have reached a new level of cruelty these days. Especialy the mass types that can be bombed onto countrysides. It is one thing to shoot a soldier, it is another to masacrre his family, but to slowly maim and destroy civilians over many years really disgusts me. Regardz Colin J Davies
Sonork ID 100.9197:Colin
If you can't dazzle them with your brilliance, baffle 'em with your bullsh*t P J Arends 0 = ( ( x^2 - (x-1)^2 ) + (x-1)^2) * ( (x-1)^2 + ( x^2 - (x-1)^2 ) ) - x^4 x != 0 0 = sqrt( x^2 - (x-1)^2 ) - 5
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Nish [BusterBoy] wrote: Why woudldn't you work for land-mine workers? He said "Land mine makers", My opinion is that land-mines have reached a new level of cruelty these days. Especialy the mass types that can be bombed onto countrysides. It is one thing to shoot a soldier, it is another to masacrre his family, but to slowly maim and destroy civilians over many years really disgusts me. Regardz Colin J Davies
Sonork ID 100.9197:Colin
If you can't dazzle them with your brilliance, baffle 'em with your bullsh*t P J Arends 0 = ( ( x^2 - (x-1)^2 ) + (x-1)^2) * ( (x-1)^2 + ( x^2 - (x-1)^2 ) ) - x^4 x != 0 0 = sqrt( x^2 - (x-1)^2 ) - 5
Colin Davies wrote: He said "Land mine makers", Oops! Sorry. It's 2:16 AM and I am kinda sleepy. I think I better go to sleep now. Good night Colin. Nish Sonork ID 100.9786 voidmain www.busterboy.org If you don't find me on CP, I'll be at Bob's HungOut
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Is there any kind of company you wouldn't work for ? Would you develop software for a tobacco company, a slaughterhouse, a nuclear plant, Microsoft, landmine makers etc Is there any job that you'd have to say no to because they were involved in something you didn't believe in? Michael :-)
I will work for anybody that is legal and can afford me. I have no scruples at all:) Tobacco Company: They are a perfectly legit business providing a legit product. Keep your sensibilities to yourself. Slaughterhouse: I like meat. I am not a vegan. I don't even think I like people that don't like meat. Where's the beef? Nuclear Plant: I think we need about three times as many plants as we have now. I live very close ( 25 miles or so )to one ( Glen Rose ) so I am not speaking hearsay. The best and safest form of energy production that we have at the present. Microsoft: Don't bite that hand that feeds you. I was actually offered a job there several years ago but did not want to relocate. Plus in my State there are no State income taxes and even though there was a increase in salary it would have been eaten up in taxes and a higher cost of living so I stayed here. Good descision. Now I work for myself and that would never have happened if I had relocated. Landmine maker; Damn right. Landmines are not the demons the are described to be. At least not the kind the US uses. There are countless soldiers that owe their lives to landmines. I belive in anything that lets us whack the bad guys without giving the bad guys a chance to whack us. If you pick up a starving dog and make him prosperous, he will not bite you. This is the principal difference between a dog and a man. - Pudd'nhead Wilson's Calendar
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Interesting question. Actually, I'm working for a nuke plant right now. I justify it because the project I'm working on is a safety inspection system - I figure that's good karma. And as it turns out, I have a feeling the next contract my employer will want me to work on is for the military. It's an immersive video system for tanks and troop carriers. I have a serious problem with this, in that I don't want to ever contribute to any war effort. It'll will be interesting to see if I'm going to have to choose between my morals and my job... :confused: J
Purely out of interest, don't your taxes already contribute to your country's war effort? ________________ David Wulff http://www.davidwulff.co.uk "I loathe people who keep dogs. They are cowards who haven't got the guts to bite people themselves" - August Strindberg
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Purely out of interest, don't your taxes already contribute to your country's war effort? ________________ David Wulff http://www.davidwulff.co.uk "I loathe people who keep dogs. They are cowards who haven't got the guts to bite people themselves" - August Strindberg
David Wulff wrote: Purely out of interest, don't your taxes already contribute to your country's war effort? Hahaha, a good one. But he is not in a position to decide what his tax money will be spent for. I vote pro drink :beer:
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Purely out of interest, don't your taxes already contribute to your country's war effort? ________________ David Wulff http://www.davidwulff.co.uk "I loathe people who keep dogs. They are cowards who haven't got the guts to bite people themselves" - August Strindberg
Hard to say. I live in Canada, and so my taxes go mostly to subsidizing donut stores and propping up the dollar. As far as amounts go, I figure military contributions are not quite as high as to the little-known task force in charge of harvesting our own blood from captive black flies... J
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Purely out of interest, don't your taxes already contribute to your country's war effort? ________________ David Wulff http://www.davidwulff.co.uk "I loathe people who keep dogs. They are cowards who haven't got the guts to bite people themselves" - August Strindberg
And hey, if I had a choice, I'd definitely dole out my taxes to the places that need it. Like education, health care and environmental protection. J
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Is there any kind of company you wouldn't work for ? Would you develop software for a tobacco company, a slaughterhouse, a nuclear plant, Microsoft, landmine makers etc Is there any job that you'd have to say no to because they were involved in something you didn't believe in? Michael :-)
I like the way you just slipped Microsoft inbetween a nucleay plant and landmine makers! Trying to tell us something, Michael? Onliy kidding... Tobacco company - sure. It's up to each individual if they decide to smoke. Saying no to this one on "moral grounds" would be like saying no to a car plant because cars can inflict damage to other people when used inconsiderately. Slaughterhouse - again, i'd have no problem with this. Meat is a necessary part of our lives, and the animals have to be killed at some point. In some ways I wish we didn't have to mass kill the animals 'cause it's not very nice to think about, but then again it happens in nature and in many worse ways. I could never partake in the actual process though - purely because I doubt I could stomache it. Nuclear plant - yes, why not? The methods in which nuclear powerstations generate electricity is the safest and cleanest we have ever designed. They don't build powerstations that can produce catastrophic events without adequate protiection, and if I could work on something as exciting as that, I would jump at the chance. Microsoft - it depends on what i'd be doing. If I was going to be a cubicle worked then no I would not, but if it was a position that was challenging and fun at the same time then again I would jump at the chance. Of course though, it would have to be with Microsoft UK... ;) Landmine makers - maybe. If the company was working to produce safer landmines (I mean like having mass remote detonation and radio tracking, etc, not ones that squirt foam), then I might. So, who wouldn't I work for? Well, there are two scenarios that spring to mind:- The military - I would not, ever, serve in the military unless conscripted, and then it would only be as either a non-combat, non-medic. I wouldn't class myself as being a CO (no, not commanding officer, but a conciensious objecter), but quite simply I doubt I could pull the trigger on another person for mainly non-moral reasons. Call me old fashioned, but I believe in the sanctity of life ("all life"). The "well they knew what they were getting into" argument is rubbish, as many people do not server their country's through choice. Manual labour - never, ever, ever. I understand that someone must do all the physically hard-work jobs in life, but it's not going to be me. I cannot work in or at something I do not enjoy. Some people don't have the ability to choose in life, and I feel for them, but at this risk of sounding prejudiced: some people are better s
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And hey, if I had a choice, I'd definitely dole out my taxes to the places that need it. Like education, health care and environmental protection. J
That posses and interesting question for the future of federal taxes: should you be allowed to specify which fields you want the money to go to (assuming this is not already possible)? I suppose that would cause more problems than it'd solve though. ________________ David Wulff http://www.davidwulff.co.uk "I loathe people who keep dogs. They are cowards who haven't got the guts to bite people themselves" - August Strindberg
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I will work for anybody that is legal and can afford me. I have no scruples at all:) Tobacco Company: They are a perfectly legit business providing a legit product. Keep your sensibilities to yourself. Slaughterhouse: I like meat. I am not a vegan. I don't even think I like people that don't like meat. Where's the beef? Nuclear Plant: I think we need about three times as many plants as we have now. I live very close ( 25 miles or so )to one ( Glen Rose ) so I am not speaking hearsay. The best and safest form of energy production that we have at the present. Microsoft: Don't bite that hand that feeds you. I was actually offered a job there several years ago but did not want to relocate. Plus in my State there are no State income taxes and even though there was a increase in salary it would have been eaten up in taxes and a higher cost of living so I stayed here. Good descision. Now I work for myself and that would never have happened if I had relocated. Landmine maker; Damn right. Landmines are not the demons the are described to be. At least not the kind the US uses. There are countless soldiers that owe their lives to landmines. I belive in anything that lets us whack the bad guys without giving the bad guys a chance to whack us. If you pick up a starving dog and make him prosperous, he will not bite you. This is the principal difference between a dog and a man. - Pudd'nhead Wilson's Calendar
This is a lot like what I would have said, except the Microsoft part. I've never even applied there but I probably would have turned them down for the same reasons as you. Thanks for putting it so well, Alvaro
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I like the way you just slipped Microsoft inbetween a nucleay plant and landmine makers! Trying to tell us something, Michael? Onliy kidding... Tobacco company - sure. It's up to each individual if they decide to smoke. Saying no to this one on "moral grounds" would be like saying no to a car plant because cars can inflict damage to other people when used inconsiderately. Slaughterhouse - again, i'd have no problem with this. Meat is a necessary part of our lives, and the animals have to be killed at some point. In some ways I wish we didn't have to mass kill the animals 'cause it's not very nice to think about, but then again it happens in nature and in many worse ways. I could never partake in the actual process though - purely because I doubt I could stomache it. Nuclear plant - yes, why not? The methods in which nuclear powerstations generate electricity is the safest and cleanest we have ever designed. They don't build powerstations that can produce catastrophic events without adequate protiection, and if I could work on something as exciting as that, I would jump at the chance. Microsoft - it depends on what i'd be doing. If I was going to be a cubicle worked then no I would not, but if it was a position that was challenging and fun at the same time then again I would jump at the chance. Of course though, it would have to be with Microsoft UK... ;) Landmine makers - maybe. If the company was working to produce safer landmines (I mean like having mass remote detonation and radio tracking, etc, not ones that squirt foam), then I might. So, who wouldn't I work for? Well, there are two scenarios that spring to mind:- The military - I would not, ever, serve in the military unless conscripted, and then it would only be as either a non-combat, non-medic. I wouldn't class myself as being a CO (no, not commanding officer, but a conciensious objecter), but quite simply I doubt I could pull the trigger on another person for mainly non-moral reasons. Call me old fashioned, but I believe in the sanctity of life ("all life"). The "well they knew what they were getting into" argument is rubbish, as many people do not server their country's through choice. Manual labour - never, ever, ever. I understand that someone must do all the physically hard-work jobs in life, but it's not going to be me. I cannot work in or at something I do not enjoy. Some people don't have the ability to choose in life, and I feel for them, but at this risk of sounding prejudiced: some people are better s
Actually some people prefer physical work. I mean, there's no better feeling than creating something, for us it's software - for others a table, a building etc. I do feel sorry for those who work at these jobs because they have to and don't want to. I know some guy that's been talking about opening some sort of a fast food stand for all his life. His saving money for that and we all support him, because he knows what he wants to do and goes for it! I remember when I designed a website for some company, I got a huge office with air conditioning and a cool chair and stuff, pretty good for a temporary job. Anyway, one day they needed to fix some old server to extract some data. They asked me to help them and I happily agreed, all that day I roamed the company with a screwdriver and a smile streching from one ear to another, looking for parts, taking computers apart, installing things and all that stuff. In the end of that day I was very tired and my hands were all dirty, but that was my best day in that job! Anyway, you get what I'm trying to say. Isaac Sasson, Small time programmer - complainer at large. Sonork ID 100.13704
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Actually some people prefer physical work. I mean, there's no better feeling than creating something, for us it's software - for others a table, a building etc. I do feel sorry for those who work at these jobs because they have to and don't want to. I know some guy that's been talking about opening some sort of a fast food stand for all his life. His saving money for that and we all support him, because he knows what he wants to do and goes for it! I remember when I designed a website for some company, I got a huge office with air conditioning and a cool chair and stuff, pretty good for a temporary job. Anyway, one day they needed to fix some old server to extract some data. They asked me to help them and I happily agreed, all that day I roamed the company with a screwdriver and a smile streching from one ear to another, looking for parts, taking computers apart, installing things and all that stuff. In the end of that day I was very tired and my hands were all dirty, but that was my best day in that job! Anyway, you get what I'm trying to say. Isaac Sasson, Small time programmer - complainer at large. Sonork ID 100.13704
I agree with what you have said, but that is not the kind of hard manual labour I was thinking of. I was referring more to sweat shops. Even I enjoy building things! ________________ David Wulff http://www.davidwulff.co.uk "I loathe people who keep dogs. They are cowards who haven't got the guts to bite people themselves" - August Strindberg
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Is there any kind of company you wouldn't work for ? Would you develop software for a tobacco company, a slaughterhouse, a nuclear plant, Microsoft, landmine makers etc Is there any job that you'd have to say no to because they were involved in something you didn't believe in? Michael :-)
I turned down a 6-figure job in San Diego because the company was a) it was a company that did all of it's business over the internet, b) used the internet for something I don't agree with by allowing users to backup their hard drives onto remote storage devices across the internet, and c) offered me a 6-figure salary. "...the staggering layers of obscenity in your statement make it a work of art on so many levels." - Jason Jystad, 10/26/2001
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That posses and interesting question for the future of federal taxes: should you be allowed to specify which fields you want the money to go to (assuming this is not already possible)? I suppose that would cause more problems than it'd solve though. ________________ David Wulff http://www.davidwulff.co.uk "I loathe people who keep dogs. They are cowards who haven't got the guts to bite people themselves" - August Strindberg
David Wulff wrote: should you be allowed to specify which fields you want the money to go to (assuming this is not already possible)? If this were possible, I'd put my money in sewerage treatment, because no-one else would, and imagine the smell without it.... I don't see a scheme where we get to channel our funds as remotely viable. Everyone would choose health or education, and no-one would choose wages for MP's or benefits for single mothers or the long term unemployed. Hey - wait a minute..... Christian I have come to clean zee pooollll. - Michael Martin Dec 30, 2001 Picture the daffodil. And while you do that, I'll be over here going through your stuff.
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That posses and interesting question for the future of federal taxes: should you be allowed to specify which fields you want the money to go to (assuming this is not already possible)? I suppose that would cause more problems than it'd solve though. ________________ David Wulff http://www.davidwulff.co.uk "I loathe people who keep dogs. They are cowards who haven't got the guts to bite people themselves" - August Strindberg
The governments are so low on monetary efficiency, that this will further reduce the money that reaches the targets. Just adding a level of officials, a department for finding out how much money should be spend where, and finally the government will find excuses why there should be exceptions to the rule and all activities will then be exceptions. The system of democracy in most countries do not present selective voting. And hence, the people select one guy with whom you agree more than the other guy at the time of the election. Casting the vote would probably be the least thought-out decision in the lives of many people. Thomas
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Is there any kind of company you wouldn't work for ? Would you develop software for a tobacco company, a slaughterhouse, a nuclear plant, Microsoft, landmine makers etc Is there any job that you'd have to say no to because they were involved in something you didn't believe in? Michael :-)
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Is there any kind of company you wouldn't work for ? Would you develop software for a tobacco company, a slaughterhouse, a nuclear plant, Microsoft, landmine makers etc Is there any job that you'd have to say no to because they were involved in something you didn't believe in? Michael :-)
I worked with a guy once who turned down a job offer from Microsoft back in about 1984 because his girlfriend wanted to move from Washington to Utah so she could ski more. Six months after they moved to Utah she left him for a guy on the U.S. ski team. Moral of the story: Screw principles, everybody else will, and take the job with Microsoft. "Thank you, thank you very much" Elvis.
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I like the way you just slipped Microsoft inbetween a nucleay plant and landmine makers! Trying to tell us something, Michael? Onliy kidding... Tobacco company - sure. It's up to each individual if they decide to smoke. Saying no to this one on "moral grounds" would be like saying no to a car plant because cars can inflict damage to other people when used inconsiderately. Slaughterhouse - again, i'd have no problem with this. Meat is a necessary part of our lives, and the animals have to be killed at some point. In some ways I wish we didn't have to mass kill the animals 'cause it's not very nice to think about, but then again it happens in nature and in many worse ways. I could never partake in the actual process though - purely because I doubt I could stomache it. Nuclear plant - yes, why not? The methods in which nuclear powerstations generate electricity is the safest and cleanest we have ever designed. They don't build powerstations that can produce catastrophic events without adequate protiection, and if I could work on something as exciting as that, I would jump at the chance. Microsoft - it depends on what i'd be doing. If I was going to be a cubicle worked then no I would not, but if it was a position that was challenging and fun at the same time then again I would jump at the chance. Of course though, it would have to be with Microsoft UK... ;) Landmine makers - maybe. If the company was working to produce safer landmines (I mean like having mass remote detonation and radio tracking, etc, not ones that squirt foam), then I might. So, who wouldn't I work for? Well, there are two scenarios that spring to mind:- The military - I would not, ever, serve in the military unless conscripted, and then it would only be as either a non-combat, non-medic. I wouldn't class myself as being a CO (no, not commanding officer, but a conciensious objecter), but quite simply I doubt I could pull the trigger on another person for mainly non-moral reasons. Call me old fashioned, but I believe in the sanctity of life ("all life"). The "well they knew what they were getting into" argument is rubbish, as many people do not server their country's through choice. Manual labour - never, ever, ever. I understand that someone must do all the physically hard-work jobs in life, but it's not going to be me. I cannot work in or at something I do not enjoy. Some people don't have the ability to choose in life, and I feel for them, but at this risk of sounding prejudiced: some people are better s
The military - I would not, ever, serve in the military unless conscripted, and then it would only be as either a non-combat, non-medic. I wouldn't class myself as being a CO (no, not commanding officer, but a conciensious objecter), but quite simply I doubt I could pull the trigger on another person for mainly non-moral reasons. Call me old fashioned, but I believe in the sanctity of life ("all life"). That foolish attitude would disappear the very first time someone shot at you. Surely you are not one of those types who go thru life turning the other cheek. Nor one of those who is willing to let some other mothers son die for the country while you wait on the sidelines to get the benifit of their sacrifice ? As to the "All Life" thingy what exactly do you eat? Manual labour - never, ever, ever. I understand that someone must do all the physically hard-work jobs in life, but it's not going to be me. I cannot work in or at something I do not enjoy. Some people don't have the ability to choose in life, and I feel for them, but at this risk of sounding prejudiced: some people are better suited to it than others. You simply have not been hungry enough or have led a priviliged life. One does what he has to do be it diggiing ditches or graves or raising food or programming computers. The idea of an elitist society has proven to not be real conductive to national progress. Perhaps you should give "Animal Farm" a deeper perusal than you have. Some are NOT more equal than others. Richard If you pick up a starving dog and make him prosperous, he will not bite you. This is the principal difference between a dog and a man. - Pudd'nhead Wilson's Calendar