Lotus Gotes and it's evil inventors
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(warning - RANT mode ON) When you're deep into a cursing session at Lotus Blotes, and it seems that Hell it self can't be far away, do you ever find yourself wishing you could tear the larynx out of the development team that fostered this aborted dung hill of a program on the general masses? Well it appears we can now track 'em down![^] I love this part of the article: " "The fundamental nature of work is changing," said Ozzie. Rhodin noted that "we are at a tipping point where technologies can go in many different directions. Twenty years ago we didn't know what Notes would become." " Duh, what kind of a dumbass do you think we all are Ozzie? The "fundamental nature of work"? Gack someone slap these idiots up the side of the head - next we'll be talking about a new paradigm to transform the Knowledege Worker! Then there's these classic quotes: " Dyson asked the panel members, "What do we need to do next?" Here is what they said: Greif: "See the differences between now and 20 years ago: relationships between research and real applications, the explosion of online communications, and the interesting intellectual issues." Ozzie: "Embrace the idea that the business environment is moving toward a confederation of businesses instead of vertical integration -- a mesh environment. Understand that there isn't one answer for all environments and that it is healthy to try different approaches." Rhodin: "Figure out how to unlock the creativity of users without breaking the IT department." Conrad: "Accommodate the next multitasking generation." Dituro: "Deal with the institutional inclination for more control, not less. Recognize the business need to communicate." " "Accommodate the next multitasking generation" - yeah I love that, cause soon there will be multiple ways to do do 5 things at once! "Figure out how to unlock the creativity of users without breaking the IT department." - Have these people ever worked in a real job? No worker cares about "creativity" (for the most part). For craps sake they want to get their email and move on with their life!!! :mad: Hey Esther, if you're listening, here's what you can do next: - Hang all the Notes lead developers - Fix the resulting mess to roughly act like a nor
So I guess you didn't get the car? ;P
My name is Inigo Montoya, you killed my process, prepare to die. Slightly modified quote from Princess Bride. Code-frog System Architects, Inc.
-- modified at 12:01 Friday 9th September, 2005
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(warning - RANT mode ON) When you're deep into a cursing session at Lotus Blotes, and it seems that Hell it self can't be far away, do you ever find yourself wishing you could tear the larynx out of the development team that fostered this aborted dung hill of a program on the general masses? Well it appears we can now track 'em down![^] I love this part of the article: " "The fundamental nature of work is changing," said Ozzie. Rhodin noted that "we are at a tipping point where technologies can go in many different directions. Twenty years ago we didn't know what Notes would become." " Duh, what kind of a dumbass do you think we all are Ozzie? The "fundamental nature of work"? Gack someone slap these idiots up the side of the head - next we'll be talking about a new paradigm to transform the Knowledege Worker! Then there's these classic quotes: " Dyson asked the panel members, "What do we need to do next?" Here is what they said: Greif: "See the differences between now and 20 years ago: relationships between research and real applications, the explosion of online communications, and the interesting intellectual issues." Ozzie: "Embrace the idea that the business environment is moving toward a confederation of businesses instead of vertical integration -- a mesh environment. Understand that there isn't one answer for all environments and that it is healthy to try different approaches." Rhodin: "Figure out how to unlock the creativity of users without breaking the IT department." Conrad: "Accommodate the next multitasking generation." Dituro: "Deal with the institutional inclination for more control, not less. Recognize the business need to communicate." " "Accommodate the next multitasking generation" - yeah I love that, cause soon there will be multiple ways to do do 5 things at once! "Figure out how to unlock the creativity of users without breaking the IT department." - Have these people ever worked in a real job? No worker cares about "creativity" (for the most part). For craps sake they want to get their email and move on with their life!!! :mad: Hey Esther, if you're listening, here's what you can do next: - Hang all the Notes lead developers - Fix the resulting mess to roughly act like a nor
It's hard to have done any serious development using Lotus Notes as a platform, and not vote Jim's message a 5. Ugh. I did quite a bit of Notes development in the mid-late 90's. There was actually some good stuff there for workflow applications - messaging services, digital signature support, a document-centric database -- really, for workflow apps, there were a good set of services there. Especially at that time, when there wasn't as much happening to enable workflow applications as there is today. An end user, clicking a menu item from their email, filling out a form which routes itself automatically where it needs to go, getting proper digital signatures and approvals along the way - Notes had the right kinds of services to support this type of app and not many others did. But boy do they blow it with the user interface and developer experience X| I wonder if Lotus has ever understood that no matter what good services they build into the platform, no one will want to build apps for it if the development tool is unnecessarily frustrating. And Notes/Designer is certainly that - unnecessarily frustrating - in far too many areas. Can Notes ever evolve into that fantastic workflow platform, which is actually a joy to develop in? I'm not holding my breath - they have had 20 years to work it all out, after all.
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(warning - RANT mode ON) When you're deep into a cursing session at Lotus Blotes, and it seems that Hell it self can't be far away, do you ever find yourself wishing you could tear the larynx out of the development team that fostered this aborted dung hill of a program on the general masses? Well it appears we can now track 'em down![^] I love this part of the article: " "The fundamental nature of work is changing," said Ozzie. Rhodin noted that "we are at a tipping point where technologies can go in many different directions. Twenty years ago we didn't know what Notes would become." " Duh, what kind of a dumbass do you think we all are Ozzie? The "fundamental nature of work"? Gack someone slap these idiots up the side of the head - next we'll be talking about a new paradigm to transform the Knowledege Worker! Then there's these classic quotes: " Dyson asked the panel members, "What do we need to do next?" Here is what they said: Greif: "See the differences between now and 20 years ago: relationships between research and real applications, the explosion of online communications, and the interesting intellectual issues." Ozzie: "Embrace the idea that the business environment is moving toward a confederation of businesses instead of vertical integration -- a mesh environment. Understand that there isn't one answer for all environments and that it is healthy to try different approaches." Rhodin: "Figure out how to unlock the creativity of users without breaking the IT department." Conrad: "Accommodate the next multitasking generation." Dituro: "Deal with the institutional inclination for more control, not less. Recognize the business need to communicate." " "Accommodate the next multitasking generation" - yeah I love that, cause soon there will be multiple ways to do do 5 things at once! "Figure out how to unlock the creativity of users without breaking the IT department." - Have these people ever worked in a real job? No worker cares about "creativity" (for the most part). For craps sake they want to get their email and move on with their life!!! :mad: Hey Esther, if you're listening, here's what you can do next: - Hang all the Notes lead developers - Fix the resulting mess to roughly act like a nor
I hate, hate, HATE it. X| :mad: I'm forced to use it at work, and frankly, I'm tempted to switch companies because of it. X| Cheers, Vikram.
http://www.geocities.com/vpunathambekar
Google talk: binarybandit
After all is said and done, much is said and little is done.
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So I guess you didn't get the car? ;P
My name is Inigo Montoya, you killed my process, prepare to die. Slightly modified quote from Princess Bride. Code-frog System Architects, Inc.
-- modified at 12:01 Friday 9th September, 2005
Hmm, well that's an interesting story. After a lengthy, emotional discussion* we comprised on this car[^]. At 1" high, it doesn't seem to have quite the "oomph" that the other did, and the horsepower is a little lacking. ALthough I suppose it is safer. *the duration of which was about 1 second. ¡El diablo está en mis pantalones! ¡Mire, mire! Real Mentats use only 100% pure, unfooled around with Sapho Juice(tm)! SELECT * FROM User WHERE Clue > 0 0 rows returned Save an Orange - Use the VCF!
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I hate, hate, HATE it. X| :mad: I'm forced to use it at work, and frankly, I'm tempted to switch companies because of it. X| Cheers, Vikram.
http://www.geocities.com/vpunathambekar
Google talk: binarybandit
After all is said and done, much is said and little is done.
I know *exactly* how you feel. I'd almost be tempted to ask at an interview if the company uses Notes, and if it does consider this as a strike against wanting to work there. ¡El diablo está en mis pantalones! ¡Mire, mire! Real Mentats use only 100% pure, unfooled around with Sapho Juice(tm)! SELECT * FROM User WHERE Clue > 0 0 rows returned Save an Orange - Use the VCF!
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Hmm, well that's an interesting story. After a lengthy, emotional discussion* we comprised on this car[^]. At 1" high, it doesn't seem to have quite the "oomph" that the other did, and the horsepower is a little lacking. ALthough I suppose it is safer. *the duration of which was about 1 second. ¡El diablo está en mis pantalones! ¡Mire, mire! Real Mentats use only 100% pure, unfooled around with Sapho Juice(tm)! SELECT * FROM User WHERE Clue > 0 0 rows returned Save an Orange - Use the VCF!
Hey that's a nice ride! Man I think I'd be bashing Lotus too. But then one really doesn't need an excuse to do that... That *other* car you posted... Yeah, that's right the one made of Kevlar. Dang!!! Pretty cool. Orange and yellow are 2 of my favorite car colors to. If you ever get it let me know. I'll pay my own expenses just to get a rid in that thing. That is *after* I triple my life insurance coverage.:cool:
My name is Inigo Montoya, you killed my process, prepare to die. Slightly modified quote from Princess Bride. Code-frog System Architects, Inc.
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Hey that's a nice ride! Man I think I'd be bashing Lotus too. But then one really doesn't need an excuse to do that... That *other* car you posted... Yeah, that's right the one made of Kevlar. Dang!!! Pretty cool. Orange and yellow are 2 of my favorite car colors to. If you ever get it let me know. I'll pay my own expenses just to get a rid in that thing. That is *after* I triple my life insurance coverage.:cool:
My name is Inigo Montoya, you killed my process, prepare to die. Slightly modified quote from Princess Bride. Code-frog System Architects, Inc.
Yeah the *other* car is cool! code-frog wrote: That is *after* I triple my life insurance coverage. Well I went and read through most of their website last night (after my workout I was just too damn brain dead to get any good programming done) and if the site is too be beleived, it supposedly pretty damn safe: Safety features adn testing.[^] If what they are claiming is true, then it's no worse (safety wise) to drive this car (at normal speeds) than a Toyota, Ford, or even a Corvette. ¡El diablo está en mis pantalones! ¡Mire, mire! Real Mentats use only 100% pure, unfooled around with Sapho Juice(tm)! SELECT * FROM User WHERE Clue > 0 0 rows returned Save an Orange - Use the VCF!
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Yeah the *other* car is cool! code-frog wrote: That is *after* I triple my life insurance coverage. Well I went and read through most of their website last night (after my workout I was just too damn brain dead to get any good programming done) and if the site is too be beleived, it supposedly pretty damn safe: Safety features adn testing.[^] If what they are claiming is true, then it's no worse (safety wise) to drive this car (at normal speeds) than a Toyota, Ford, or even a Corvette. ¡El diablo está en mis pantalones! ¡Mire, mire! Real Mentats use only 100% pure, unfooled around with Sapho Juice(tm)! SELECT * FROM User WHERE Clue > 0 0 rows returned Save an Orange - Use the VCF!
NO! YOU DON'T GET IT DO YOU~!~!~!;P I'm talking about the nearly 300 mile per hour ride in the car. At that speed it's not going to be safe. But safety won't be in the front of our minds as we race along at half the speed of sound now will it? Yeah, I knew you'd see it my way.:cool: P.S. - Guess I took this OT so I thought I should let the rest of the little green pointy head people know...
My name is Inigo Montoya, you killed my process, prepare to die. Slightly modified quote from Princess Bride. Code-frog System Architects, Inc.
-- modified at 12:39 Friday 9th September, 2005
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It's hard to have done any serious development using Lotus Notes as a platform, and not vote Jim's message a 5. Ugh. I did quite a bit of Notes development in the mid-late 90's. There was actually some good stuff there for workflow applications - messaging services, digital signature support, a document-centric database -- really, for workflow apps, there were a good set of services there. Especially at that time, when there wasn't as much happening to enable workflow applications as there is today. An end user, clicking a menu item from their email, filling out a form which routes itself automatically where it needs to go, getting proper digital signatures and approvals along the way - Notes had the right kinds of services to support this type of app and not many others did. But boy do they blow it with the user interface and developer experience X| I wonder if Lotus has ever understood that no matter what good services they build into the platform, no one will want to build apps for it if the development tool is unnecessarily frustrating. And Notes/Designer is certainly that - unnecessarily frustrating - in far too many areas. Can Notes ever evolve into that fantastic workflow platform, which is actually a joy to develop in? I'm not holding my breath - they have had 20 years to work it all out, after all.
You know I've read a number of articles that claim that Domino, the server side of Notes, is supposed to be superb. It *supposedly* is easy to admin, performs well, has a ton of great, advanced features, etc. But none of us ever really see any of this - we just see the client that's and utter abomination. Mike Ellison wrote: Can Notes ever evolve into that fantastic workflow platform, which is actually a joy to develop in? I'm not holding my breath - they have had 20 years to work it all out, after all. Why should they? Hell they alreaqdy have customer lock-in for all the big companies that use it. You can bet your bottom dollar that companies that have all sorts of notes databases in use are NOT going to ditch that. No other vendor, that I'm aware of*, has anything like it, and even if they did nobody can read the damn NSF db format. *not that this means a whole lot, I'm hardly an expert in this area. ¡El diablo está en mis pantalones! ¡Mire, mire! Real Mentats use only 100% pure, unfooled around with Sapho Juice(tm)! SELECT * FROM User WHERE Clue > 0 0 rows returned Save an Orange - Use the VCF!
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NO! YOU DON'T GET IT DO YOU~!~!~!;P I'm talking about the nearly 300 mile per hour ride in the car. At that speed it's not going to be safe. But safety won't be in the front of our minds as we race along at half the speed of sound now will it? Yeah, I knew you'd see it my way.:cool: P.S. - Guess I took this OT so I thought I should let the rest of the little green pointy head people know...
My name is Inigo Montoya, you killed my process, prepare to die. Slightly modified quote from Princess Bride. Code-frog System Architects, Inc.
-- modified at 12:39 Friday 9th September, 2005
Yeah that's true. But again, they claim, that the car is designed to be handled at these speeds and handle a crash, at least as safely as a formula one racer would. The F1 cars go that fast and people walk away from the crashs don't they? But I know what you mean, driving at that speed *is* nuts, especially on anything other than an oval track :) But it's *still* an uber cool car, safe or not! :) And damn sure as the Sun rises in the east, the second $500,000 I get is going towards getting one of these :) ¡El diablo está en mis pantalones! ¡Mire, mire! Real Mentats use only 100% pure, unfooled around with Sapho Juice(tm)! SELECT * FROM User WHERE Clue > 0 0 rows returned Save an Orange - Use the VCF!
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NO! YOU DON'T GET IT DO YOU~!~!~!;P I'm talking about the nearly 300 mile per hour ride in the car. At that speed it's not going to be safe. But safety won't be in the front of our minds as we race along at half the speed of sound now will it? Yeah, I knew you'd see it my way.:cool: P.S. - Guess I took this OT so I thought I should let the rest of the little green pointy head people know...
My name is Inigo Montoya, you killed my process, prepare to die. Slightly modified quote from Princess Bride. Code-frog System Architects, Inc.
-- modified at 12:39 Friday 9th September, 2005
Ummmm...... How many kilometers are there in 1 mile? 1 mile = 1.609 kilometers 370 km/hour X (1 / 1.609) = 229 miles / Hour Hardly what I would call 'half' the speed of sound. The speed of sound at 25 C and 60% humidity is 347.31 m/s = 777.1 miles per hour. So, it is more accurate to say the car goes 229 / 777 times the speed of sound. Well, it is traveling more like 0.2947 times the speed of sound, or roughly 1/3. I think you would be perfetly safe at those speeds ;) at least until the deer jumps out in front of your car, or the little old lady in her Hummer makes a left turn in front of you (don't lauch, this happened to me the other day!) :~
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Ummmm...... How many kilometers are there in 1 mile? 1 mile = 1.609 kilometers 370 km/hour X (1 / 1.609) = 229 miles / Hour Hardly what I would call 'half' the speed of sound. The speed of sound at 25 C and 60% humidity is 347.31 m/s = 777.1 miles per hour. So, it is more accurate to say the car goes 229 / 777 times the speed of sound. Well, it is traveling more like 0.2947 times the speed of sound, or roughly 1/3. I think you would be perfetly safe at those speeds ;) at least until the deer jumps out in front of your car, or the little old lady in her Hummer makes a left turn in front of you (don't lauch, this happened to me the other day!) :~
I was definitely doing some good old fashion exaggeration (it happens here from time to time). You are in a Kevlar car. So the deer would become jerky if you were going fast enough consider the deer "smoked". Now the old lady in the hummer... We'd have to address that with side mounted .50 cal smoking gats. (Since I'm exaggerating already, why not.) Also, we might actually be able to hit 385 MPH with nitrous or some other modifications. As long as Crafton did the driving and I was free to eject at the first sign of trouble I'm okay with all of it. (Since I'm exaggerating.)
My name is Inigo Montoya, you killed my process, prepare to die. Slightly modified quote from Princess Bride. Code-frog System Architects, Inc.
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(warning - RANT mode ON) When you're deep into a cursing session at Lotus Blotes, and it seems that Hell it self can't be far away, do you ever find yourself wishing you could tear the larynx out of the development team that fostered this aborted dung hill of a program on the general masses? Well it appears we can now track 'em down![^] I love this part of the article: " "The fundamental nature of work is changing," said Ozzie. Rhodin noted that "we are at a tipping point where technologies can go in many different directions. Twenty years ago we didn't know what Notes would become." " Duh, what kind of a dumbass do you think we all are Ozzie? The "fundamental nature of work"? Gack someone slap these idiots up the side of the head - next we'll be talking about a new paradigm to transform the Knowledege Worker! Then there's these classic quotes: " Dyson asked the panel members, "What do we need to do next?" Here is what they said: Greif: "See the differences between now and 20 years ago: relationships between research and real applications, the explosion of online communications, and the interesting intellectual issues." Ozzie: "Embrace the idea that the business environment is moving toward a confederation of businesses instead of vertical integration -- a mesh environment. Understand that there isn't one answer for all environments and that it is healthy to try different approaches." Rhodin: "Figure out how to unlock the creativity of users without breaking the IT department." Conrad: "Accommodate the next multitasking generation." Dituro: "Deal with the institutional inclination for more control, not less. Recognize the business need to communicate." " "Accommodate the next multitasking generation" - yeah I love that, cause soon there will be multiple ways to do do 5 things at once! "Figure out how to unlock the creativity of users without breaking the IT department." - Have these people ever worked in a real job? No worker cares about "creativity" (for the most part). For craps sake they want to get their email and move on with their life!!! :mad: Hey Esther, if you're listening, here's what you can do next: - Hang all the Notes lead developers - Fix the resulting mess to roughly act like a nor
