Did I overreact?
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I just got a call from a telemarketer that I believe was exploiting the handicapped and just yelled at some poor person over the phone. Here is the conversation, paraphrased:
TM: Good afternoon is James Johnson available? JTJ: Speaking TM: I'm with (some company; TDDH? TDH? T-something). We are not a charity; but we employ the handicap to create products that we then sell to you as a business owner. We have stationary and pens with your business name and address already written on them. Would you be interested in find out how much this will cost? JTJ: [said in an almost hysterical loud voice] I'm sorry but you're exploiting the handicapped TM: No we're not JTJ: [same voice] If you're not exploiting them, then why did you even tell me they were handicapped. You should be able to take the products they make and sell them on the open market without resorting to such tactics. [slightly louder, voice quivering from non-use at this point] Goodbye.
Now of course my anxiety is kicking in and I'm starting to feel bad at this point; what if the person making the call was handicapped? Is it even exploitation of the handicapped? Maybe those would be the best pens I would have ever used? :sigh: James -- modified at 13:05 Wednesday 28th September, 2005
James T. Johnson wrote: Did I overreact? Probably...but then life goes on. No sense beating yourself up about it. If there was a way to contact the person, I would suggest that you apologize. But other than that, you are right to ask questions (with civility) and expect answers. Gary Kirkham Forever Forgiven and Alive in the Spirit He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain what he cannot lose. - Jim Elliot Me blog, You read
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I just got a call from a telemarketer that I believe was exploiting the handicapped and just yelled at some poor person over the phone. Here is the conversation, paraphrased:
TM: Good afternoon is James Johnson available? JTJ: Speaking TM: I'm with (some company; TDDH? TDH? T-something). We are not a charity; but we employ the handicap to create products that we then sell to you as a business owner. We have stationary and pens with your business name and address already written on them. Would you be interested in find out how much this will cost? JTJ: [said in an almost hysterical loud voice] I'm sorry but you're exploiting the handicapped TM: No we're not JTJ: [same voice] If you're not exploiting them, then why did you even tell me they were handicapped. You should be able to take the products they make and sell them on the open market without resorting to such tactics. [slightly louder, voice quivering from non-use at this point] Goodbye.
Now of course my anxiety is kicking in and I'm starting to feel bad at this point; what if the person making the call was handicapped? Is it even exploitation of the handicapped? Maybe those would be the best pens I would have ever used? :sigh: James -- modified at 13:05 Wednesday 28th September, 2005
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I just got a call from a telemarketer that I believe was exploiting the handicapped and just yelled at some poor person over the phone. Here is the conversation, paraphrased:
TM: Good afternoon is James Johnson available? JTJ: Speaking TM: I'm with (some company; TDDH? TDH? T-something). We are not a charity; but we employ the handicap to create products that we then sell to you as a business owner. We have stationary and pens with your business name and address already written on them. Would you be interested in find out how much this will cost? JTJ: [said in an almost hysterical loud voice] I'm sorry but you're exploiting the handicapped TM: No we're not JTJ: [same voice] If you're not exploiting them, then why did you even tell me they were handicapped. You should be able to take the products they make and sell them on the open market without resorting to such tactics. [slightly louder, voice quivering from non-use at this point] Goodbye.
Now of course my anxiety is kicking in and I'm starting to feel bad at this point; what if the person making the call was handicapped? Is it even exploitation of the handicapped? Maybe those would be the best pens I would have ever used? :sigh: James -- modified at 13:05 Wednesday 28th September, 2005
Probably - it's a telemarketing call, so you can pretty much guarantee the guy's life sucks enough without your help. That said, the pitch was terrible, so i'm sure he's used to it by now. :sigh: wow, i hated telemarketing. depressing, soul-sucking job.
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I just got a call from a telemarketer that I believe was exploiting the handicapped and just yelled at some poor person over the phone. Here is the conversation, paraphrased:
TM: Good afternoon is James Johnson available? JTJ: Speaking TM: I'm with (some company; TDDH? TDH? T-something). We are not a charity; but we employ the handicap to create products that we then sell to you as a business owner. We have stationary and pens with your business name and address already written on them. Would you be interested in find out how much this will cost? JTJ: [said in an almost hysterical loud voice] I'm sorry but you're exploiting the handicapped TM: No we're not JTJ: [same voice] If you're not exploiting them, then why did you even tell me they were handicapped. You should be able to take the products they make and sell them on the open market without resorting to such tactics. [slightly louder, voice quivering from non-use at this point] Goodbye.
Now of course my anxiety is kicking in and I'm starting to feel bad at this point; what if the person making the call was handicapped? Is it even exploitation of the handicapped? Maybe those would be the best pens I would have ever used? :sigh: James -- modified at 13:05 Wednesday 28th September, 2005
Yes, my son. As penitence say 10 Hail Maries and buy 10,000 pencil sharpeners from them. Through the ministry of the Church may God give you pardon and peace, and I absolve you from your sins in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit. Feel better after your confession? ;) On a serious note; Maybe there are more unscrupolous sorts in the States who do exploit the severly handicapped but when they phone me here in South Africa I have taken it well. I don't always buy from them though. regards, Paul Watson South Africa Colib and WebTwoZero. K(arl) wrote: oh, and BTW, CHRISTIAN ISN'T A PARADOX, HE IS A TASMANIAN!
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I just got a call from a telemarketer that I believe was exploiting the handicapped and just yelled at some poor person over the phone. Here is the conversation, paraphrased:
TM: Good afternoon is James Johnson available? JTJ: Speaking TM: I'm with (some company; TDDH? TDH? T-something). We are not a charity; but we employ the handicap to create products that we then sell to you as a business owner. We have stationary and pens with your business name and address already written on them. Would you be interested in find out how much this will cost? JTJ: [said in an almost hysterical loud voice] I'm sorry but you're exploiting the handicapped TM: No we're not JTJ: [same voice] If you're not exploiting them, then why did you even tell me they were handicapped. You should be able to take the products they make and sell them on the open market without resorting to such tactics. [slightly louder, voice quivering from non-use at this point] Goodbye.
Now of course my anxiety is kicking in and I'm starting to feel bad at this point; what if the person making the call was handicapped? Is it even exploitation of the handicapped? Maybe those would be the best pens I would have ever used? :sigh: James -- modified at 13:05 Wednesday 28th September, 2005
No, they're not exploiting handicaped. They're giving handicaped a means to support themselves, and that is a good thing! Surely, they don't get paid as much as a non-handicaped person. But it's far better than being on wellfare, don't you agree? More power to them IMO! The reason why they mentioned they are handicaped is perhaps that they're trying to evoke feelings of pity, or whatever in you. -- Keep talking! You're the fool, I'm the preacher.
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I just got a call from a telemarketer that I believe was exploiting the handicapped and just yelled at some poor person over the phone. Here is the conversation, paraphrased:
TM: Good afternoon is James Johnson available? JTJ: Speaking TM: I'm with (some company; TDDH? TDH? T-something). We are not a charity; but we employ the handicap to create products that we then sell to you as a business owner. We have stationary and pens with your business name and address already written on them. Would you be interested in find out how much this will cost? JTJ: [said in an almost hysterical loud voice] I'm sorry but you're exploiting the handicapped TM: No we're not JTJ: [same voice] If you're not exploiting them, then why did you even tell me they were handicapped. You should be able to take the products they make and sell them on the open market without resorting to such tactics. [slightly louder, voice quivering from non-use at this point] Goodbye.
Now of course my anxiety is kicking in and I'm starting to feel bad at this point; what if the person making the call was handicapped? Is it even exploitation of the handicapped? Maybe those would be the best pens I would have ever used? :sigh: James -- modified at 13:05 Wednesday 28th September, 2005
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James T. Johnson wrote: Did I overreact? Probably...but then life goes on. No sense beating yourself up about it. If there was a way to contact the person, I would suggest that you apologize. But other than that, you are right to ask questions (with civility) and expect answers. Gary Kirkham Forever Forgiven and Alive in the Spirit He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain what he cannot lose. - Jim Elliot Me blog, You read
Gary Kirkham wrote: But other than that, you are right to ask questions (with civility) and expect answers. Well I definately wasn't civil about it...I lost it after they said they weren't a charity and that they employed the handicapped. As John stated they have to hire the handicapped if they can do the job; so it might have been a subconsious connection to that. I doubt I'll have to deal with them any time soon though :-O James
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Could be that they're just letting you know as some sort of legal requirement? Maybe they have to tell you they were made by handicapped people by some sort of useless law? Otherwise it's just like the guy in Office Space who pretends to be a crack addict to sell magazines...:sigh: ------------------------------------- Do not do what has already been done.
Nicholas Wigant Maybe they have to tell you they were made by handicapped people by some sort of useless law? Possible; I would assume they told me they weren't a charity for legal reasons. I don't think the IRS would be too kind to any business that had thousands of other businesses claiming their purchases as a charity donation. I think mentioning the handicapped was just trying a pity move to get me to buy, not from any sort of law...then again there are some pretty stupid laws out there so I guess it is possible. James
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Well...I could see it both ways. I mean, there are some businesses that seek to give employment opportunities to those unable to get them in the normal market. So it might be that they're actually assisting the handicapped rather than exploiting them. In that case, pointing out that they're handicapped would just be a selling tool that they're using, as well as an appeal to pity (one of those nice logical fallacies they teach you about in high school logic/debate classes). On the other hand, depending on whether or not they pay their workers the same as non-handicapped, they could be exploiting them. You might have overreacted just a tad...especially given that you don't know how much they pay their workers. Hehe...this reminded me of the dinner scene in Wedding Crashers: John (Owen Wilson): Like what. Well, there's the company that we have where we're taking the, uh, fur or the wool from sheep and we turn it into thread for homeless people to, uh, sew and they make it into cloth, which they in turn sell. And um...make shirts and pants for other homeless people to sell (Jeremy knocking plates and glasses around). It's a pretty good deal. Jeremy (Vince Vaughn): People helping people... Claire (Rachel McAdams): That's, that's very admirable. Sack (Bradley Cooper): What's this company called? Jeremy: Holy sh..! John: Shirts and Pants. Holy Shirts and Pants. It's a little corny and obvious, but what do you get on being subtle, right? Secretary (Christopher Walken): That's a hell of a good project. I'm going to mention something to the Commerce Secretary. :-D
Picture a huge catholic cathedral. In it there's many people, including a gregorian monk choir. You know, those who sing beautifully. Then they start singing, in latin, as they always do: "Ad hominem..." -Jörgen Sigvardsson
David Stone wrote: I mean, there are some businesses that seek to give employment opportunities to those unable to get them in the normal market. So it might be that they're actually assisting the handicapped rather than exploiting them. In that case, pointing out that they're handicapped would just be a selling tool that they're using, as well as an appeal to pity (one of those nice logical fallacies they teach you about in high school logic/debate classes). A pity sell IMO is exploitation. There are other things they could have done to get my attention and not my ire. I believe they could have gone non-profit if it was truly just to give the handicapped a job. That would have been better than saying 'we are not a charity'. James
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James T. Johnson wrote: but we employ the handicap They are providing jobs for the handicap ... not sure how that would be considered exploitation. Perhaps if they weren't "employed", in the since that they are making money, have insurance and whatnot ... James T. Johnson wrote: we then sell to you as a business owner Not sure what the heck this statement really means ... but that's me ... :~
:..::. Douglas H. Troy ::..
Fold with us|Development Blogging|viksoe.dk's siteDouglas Troy wrote: They are providing jobs for the handicap ... not sure how that would be considered exploitation. The exploitation would be in that it is a selling point. John mentioned that they can't not (ugh) hire the handicapped; so there is a good chance of there being handicapped employees at any sizable business. If the businesses existance was to hire them I think there is a better way to do it. Douglas Troy wrote: Not sure what the heck this statement really means ... but that's me ... I blame my not going to bed until 7am on that awful piece of wording :-O There wasn't any reason to use that statement because it was just normal business, they make a product; they sell it to me. I'm pretty sure the TM did mention 'business owner' when they talked to me though. I'm kinda fed up over the whole 'business' thing because it stems from a partnership my dad and I started about 7 years ago but never did anything with after the first few months. James
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James T. Johnson wrote: We have stationary and pens with your business name and address already written on them. If this is true, they were trying to make you feel obliged to buy something that a handicapped person made, without any order being placed. I'd say this is a hard sell, and unfair. I would have said no on principle. How do you know they even use handicapped labour ? Even if the guy was handicapped, he deserved what you said, because of the hard sell technique he's using. Christian Graus - Microsoft MVP - C++
Christian Graus wrote: If this is true, they were trying to make you feel obliged to buy something that a handicapped person made, without any order being placed. I'd say this is a hard sell, and unfair. I would have said no on principle. I think that is what set me off. Between the 'we are not a charity' and employing the handicap I had an idea -- possibly incorrect -- that the IRS was forcing them to say they weren't a charity. I've given stern 'no' answers or just plain hung up on telemarketers before...but yelling at them is really out of character for me. I can only vaguely remember one other time that I yelled at someone other than my sister or parents, but I have no idea what it was about now....probably one of the jerks in high school. Heh, if I keep posting at this rate I just might get 50 posts in for 2005 ;P James
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I just got a call from a telemarketer that I believe was exploiting the handicapped and just yelled at some poor person over the phone. Here is the conversation, paraphrased:
TM: Good afternoon is James Johnson available? JTJ: Speaking TM: I'm with (some company; TDDH? TDH? T-something). We are not a charity; but we employ the handicap to create products that we then sell to you as a business owner. We have stationary and pens with your business name and address already written on them. Would you be interested in find out how much this will cost? JTJ: [said in an almost hysterical loud voice] I'm sorry but you're exploiting the handicapped TM: No we're not JTJ: [same voice] If you're not exploiting them, then why did you even tell me they were handicapped. You should be able to take the products they make and sell them on the open market without resorting to such tactics. [slightly louder, voice quivering from non-use at this point] Goodbye.
Now of course my anxiety is kicking in and I'm starting to feel bad at this point; what if the person making the call was handicapped? Is it even exploitation of the handicapped? Maybe those would be the best pens I would have ever used? :sigh: James -- modified at 13:05 Wednesday 28th September, 2005
James T. Johnson wrote: Did I overreact? Unsure. I know of a guy who set up a similar business for handicapped people here. He himself is physically handicapped. I believe his primary motive with the business is to give employment, secondary is survival which means making a profit. When they first got going they worked a similar thing to what you experienced, with sales of furniture. I don't know if this exploitation, or self exploitation. But the employees are not slaves and are free to determine whether they turn up at work. Then again who can be bothered verifying what a tele-marketer has to say. Regardz Colin J Davies The most LinkedIn CPian (that I know of anyhow) :-)
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I just got a call from a telemarketer that I believe was exploiting the handicapped and just yelled at some poor person over the phone. Here is the conversation, paraphrased:
TM: Good afternoon is James Johnson available? JTJ: Speaking TM: I'm with (some company; TDDH? TDH? T-something). We are not a charity; but we employ the handicap to create products that we then sell to you as a business owner. We have stationary and pens with your business name and address already written on them. Would you be interested in find out how much this will cost? JTJ: [said in an almost hysterical loud voice] I'm sorry but you're exploiting the handicapped TM: No we're not JTJ: [same voice] If you're not exploiting them, then why did you even tell me they were handicapped. You should be able to take the products they make and sell them on the open market without resorting to such tactics. [slightly louder, voice quivering from non-use at this point] Goodbye.
Now of course my anxiety is kicking in and I'm starting to feel bad at this point; what if the person making the call was handicapped? Is it even exploitation of the handicapped? Maybe those would be the best pens I would have ever used? :sigh: James -- modified at 13:05 Wednesday 28th September, 2005
i think your use of "exploitation" is a little overblown/used in-correctly. but, yeah there was no need to tell you thye employee handicapped people... so what if they are, what's the point ??? just hang up the phone, no use snapping and watching your blood pressure rise.
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I just got a call from a telemarketer that I believe was exploiting the handicapped and just yelled at some poor person over the phone. Here is the conversation, paraphrased:
TM: Good afternoon is James Johnson available? JTJ: Speaking TM: I'm with (some company; TDDH? TDH? T-something). We are not a charity; but we employ the handicap to create products that we then sell to you as a business owner. We have stationary and pens with your business name and address already written on them. Would you be interested in find out how much this will cost? JTJ: [said in an almost hysterical loud voice] I'm sorry but you're exploiting the handicapped TM: No we're not JTJ: [same voice] If you're not exploiting them, then why did you even tell me they were handicapped. You should be able to take the products they make and sell them on the open market without resorting to such tactics. [slightly louder, voice quivering from non-use at this point] Goodbye.
Now of course my anxiety is kicking in and I'm starting to feel bad at this point; what if the person making the call was handicapped? Is it even exploitation of the handicapped? Maybe those would be the best pens I would have ever used? :sigh: James -- modified at 13:05 Wednesday 28th September, 2005
Well, it may or it may not be. We have a client called Windgap[^] which employs mainly disabled people (mostly for packaging and assembly from the few times I've been there). Although they do accept donations and financial assistance from the government, I don't think they are categorised as a charity (can anyone explain further on what defines a charity in Australia?). I can imagine one of their marketers calling me and saying the same thing. I suppose next time you should find out more about it before jumping into (perhaps false) conclusion. Ed
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Christian Graus wrote: If this is true, they were trying to make you feel obliged to buy something that a handicapped person made, without any order being placed. I'd say this is a hard sell, and unfair. I would have said no on principle. I think that is what set me off. Between the 'we are not a charity' and employing the handicap I had an idea -- possibly incorrect -- that the IRS was forcing them to say they weren't a charity. I've given stern 'no' answers or just plain hung up on telemarketers before...but yelling at them is really out of character for me. I can only vaguely remember one other time that I yelled at someone other than my sister or parents, but I have no idea what it was about now....probably one of the jerks in high school. Heh, if I keep posting at this rate I just might get 50 posts in for 2005 ;P James
James T. Johnson wrote: other than my sister or parents ROTFL !!! James T. Johnson wrote: probably one of the jerks in high school. You had those too ? :P Christian Graus - Microsoft MVP - C++