Iran Leader Calls for Israel's Destruction
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Christian Graus wrote:
Is the army that's concentrated in Iraq really enough to spread out on the offensive through two other countries ?
if the goal is to simply destroy Iran, we're more than capable. Cleek | Image Toolkits | Thumbnail maker
Chris Losinger wrote:
if the goal is to simply destroy Iran, we're more than capable.
Yeah, that's plainly the case. I certainly hope that is not the plan though. Can you imagine what would come next ? Christian Graus - Microsoft MVP - C++
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Wow! I'd love to see that too, but for the oposite reason of yours. It would be like trying to extinguish fire with gasoline. Americans would become radioactive in the middle-east for the next 20 years. You would have to say goodbye for cheap oil, goodbye to any influence in the region, ... Oh, well, it would be to good to be true. Even Bush can't be so crazy...:sigh: Dadinho é o caralho! Meu nome agora é Zé Pequeno, porra!
Leandro Firmino da Hora in the best movie[^] you'll ever see.So what made you dislike Americans so much? Absolute faith corrupts as absolutely as absolute power Eric Hoffer All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing. Edmund Burke
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Chris Losinger wrote:
if the goal is to simply destroy Iran, we're more than capable.
Yeah, that's plainly the case. I certainly hope that is not the plan though. Can you imagine what would come next ? Christian Graus - Microsoft MVP - C++
Christian Graus wrote:
Can you imagine what would come next ?
a string of crippled states right through the heart of the ME ? nothing bad could possibly come of that. Cleek | Image Toolkits | Thumbnail maker
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That would go over real well in the Islamic world! "Capitalism is the source of all true freedom."
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Stan Shannon wrote:
While I, for one, would love to see the draft reinstituted,
Because you're too old for it ? :P
Stan Shannon wrote:
Most of the insurgents we are fighting are coming from those two countries, or getting their supplies from them, so Iraq would have a respite from most of the violence.
Can you be sure of that ? Is the army that's concentrated in Iraq really enough to spread out on the offensive through two other countries ? Christian Graus - Microsoft MVP - C++
Christian Graus wrote:
Because you're too old for it ?
My son isn't. He'll be 18 in about 14 months.
Christian Graus wrote:
Can you be sure of that ? Is the army that's concentrated in Iraq really enough to spread out on the offensive through two other countries ?
As Chris said, I'm merely talking about defeating them militarily. Frankly, I would defeat them than leave them to rebuild as they best see fit without us there. While they were recovering, Iraq would have a chance to form a solid political infrastructure. Factions in both Syria and Iran would see an example of a free and democratic Islamic nation and would be motivated to follow suit. A scenairo such as that is about the only hope I see for long term success in the region. "Capitalism is the source of all true freedom."
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Christian Graus wrote:
Can you imagine what would come next ?
a string of crippled states right through the heart of the ME ? nothing bad could possibly come of that. Cleek | Image Toolkits | Thumbnail maker
Chris Losinger wrote:
a string of crippled states right through the heart of the ME ? nothing bad could possibly come of that.
I think that's near sighted thinking, but I could be wrong. You don't think that the response would be daily terrorist attacks on US soil ? Christian Graus - Microsoft MVP - C++
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Christian Graus wrote:
Because you're too old for it ?
My son isn't. He'll be 18 in about 14 months.
Christian Graus wrote:
Can you be sure of that ? Is the army that's concentrated in Iraq really enough to spread out on the offensive through two other countries ?
As Chris said, I'm merely talking about defeating them militarily. Frankly, I would defeat them than leave them to rebuild as they best see fit without us there. While they were recovering, Iraq would have a chance to form a solid political infrastructure. Factions in both Syria and Iran would see an example of a free and democratic Islamic nation and would be motivated to follow suit. A scenairo such as that is about the only hope I see for long term success in the region. "Capitalism is the source of all true freedom."
Stan Shannon wrote:
My son isn't. He'll be 18 in about 14 months.
Fair enough. You win, and I am shamed to silence.
Stan Shannon wrote:
Frankly, I would defeat them than leave them to rebuild as they best see fit without us there.
Really ? What do you think they would seek to build ? I'd guess bombs and people to strap them to.
Stan Shannon wrote:
Factions in both Syria and Iran would see an example of a free and democratic Islamic nation and would be motivated to follow suit.
I think this is a pipe dream. Christian Graus - Microsoft MVP - C++
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Chris Losinger wrote:
a string of crippled states right through the heart of the ME ? nothing bad could possibly come of that.
I think that's near sighted thinking, but I could be wrong. You don't think that the response would be daily terrorist attacks on US soil ? Christian Graus - Microsoft MVP - C++
(guess my sarcasm wasn't as dripping as i thought) :) Cleek | Image Toolkits | Thumbnail maker
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Christian Graus wrote:
Because you're too old for it ?
My son isn't. He'll be 18 in about 14 months.
Christian Graus wrote:
Can you be sure of that ? Is the army that's concentrated in Iraq really enough to spread out on the offensive through two other countries ?
As Chris said, I'm merely talking about defeating them militarily. Frankly, I would defeat them than leave them to rebuild as they best see fit without us there. While they were recovering, Iraq would have a chance to form a solid political infrastructure. Factions in both Syria and Iran would see an example of a free and democratic Islamic nation and would be motivated to follow suit. A scenairo such as that is about the only hope I see for long term success in the region. "Capitalism is the source of all true freedom."
Stan Shannon wrote:
My son isn't. He'll be 18 in about 14 months.
cripes! I have a grandson who is finishing Marine bootcamp in a week. Mike "We ain't stuck on stupid." badass Lt. General Russel Honore **"Remember - live bunnies are a great source of nourishment"**silly-assed cartoon
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(guess my sarcasm wasn't as dripping as i thought) :) Cleek | Image Toolkits | Thumbnail maker
*grin* well, I was surprised to see that from you, I have to admit. Christian Graus - Microsoft MVP - C++
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Wow! I'd love to see that too, but for the oposite reason of yours. It would be like trying to extinguish fire with gasoline. Americans would become radioactive in the middle-east for the next 20 years. You would have to say goodbye for cheap oil, goodbye to any influence in the region, ... Oh, well, it would be to good to be true. Even Bush can't be so crazy...:sigh: Dadinho é o caralho! Meu nome agora é Zé Pequeno, porra!
Leandro Firmino da Hora in the best movie[^] you'll ever see.Diego Moita wrote:
Wow! I'd love to see that too, but for the oposite reason of yours.
Diego Moita wrote:
It would be like trying to extinguish fire with gasoline. Americans would become radioactive in the middle-east for the next 20 years. You would have to say goodbye for cheap oil, goodbye to any influence in the region, ...
Wow, I didm't realize you hated America so much. Let me ask you this, based on what you read (assuming you read the articles), do you think something should be done?
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Stan Shannon wrote:
My son isn't. He'll be 18 in about 14 months.
Fair enough. You win, and I am shamed to silence.
Stan Shannon wrote:
Frankly, I would defeat them than leave them to rebuild as they best see fit without us there.
Really ? What do you think they would seek to build ? I'd guess bombs and people to strap them to.
Stan Shannon wrote:
Factions in both Syria and Iran would see an example of a free and democratic Islamic nation and would be motivated to follow suit.
I think this is a pipe dream. Christian Graus - Microsoft MVP - C++
Christian Graus wrote:
I'd guess bombs and people to strap them to.
Well they are already doing that. What is the diffrence? THey already said they want to destroy Israel. What else do you need? A man is armed, he says he is going to shoot somebody. Do you not shoot him becasuse you fear his brother? Chances are his brother already hates you. I really do not understand this line of thinking.
Christian Graus wrote:
I think this is a pipe dream.
This pipe dream came true in Lebanon.
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Stan Shannon wrote:
My son isn't. He'll be 18 in about 14 months.
Fair enough. You win, and I am shamed to silence.
Stan Shannon wrote:
Frankly, I would defeat them than leave them to rebuild as they best see fit without us there.
Really ? What do you think they would seek to build ? I'd guess bombs and people to strap them to.
Stan Shannon wrote:
Factions in both Syria and Iran would see an example of a free and democratic Islamic nation and would be motivated to follow suit.
I think this is a pipe dream. Christian Graus - Microsoft MVP - C++
Christian Graus wrote:
Really ? What do you think they would seek to build ? I'd guess bombs and people to strap them to.
I'm sure they will. But who are they going to attack? There will be a thousand differernt factions fighting for control and all of them more interested in defeating each other than the west. Their terrorist efforts would be exhausted against one another.
Christian Graus wrote:
I think this is a pipe dream.
Well, what we are doing now is a pipe dream. And it is also a pipe dream to believe that any amount of touchy feely diplomacy in that region is ever going to do any good. But I believe that there are more people in the middle east who would fight to build more modern societies if the back of the Islamic fundamentalist instrastructure could be broken than there are terrorists. If these people were given a fighting chance, I think they would prevail. It would be a bloody mess, but frankly, I don't see any way to avoid a bloody mess. I just do not believe that there is a bloodless solution to any of this. "Capitalism is the source of all true freedom."
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Christian Graus wrote:
I'd guess bombs and people to strap them to.
Well they are already doing that. What is the diffrence? THey already said they want to destroy Israel. What else do you need? A man is armed, he says he is going to shoot somebody. Do you not shoot him becasuse you fear his brother? Chances are his brother already hates you. I really do not understand this line of thinking.
Christian Graus wrote:
I think this is a pipe dream.
This pipe dream came true in Lebanon.
kgaddy wrote:
Well they are already doing that. What is the diffrence?
The difference is that they would have nothing to lose.
kgaddy wrote:
THey already said they want to destroy Israel. What else do you need?
I'm not sure what you mean here. They made a threat, so we should nuke them ? US meddling in the Middle East, particularly in relation to Israel, is the reason the whole area is shot to hell to start with.
kgaddy wrote:
This pipe dream came true in Lebanon.
I didn't say it was impossible, but the idea that any country will follow the US model, when initially forced to, is what doesn't hold true for me. Christian Graus - Microsoft MVP - C++
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Christian Graus wrote:
Really ? What do you think they would seek to build ? I'd guess bombs and people to strap them to.
I'm sure they will. But who are they going to attack? There will be a thousand differernt factions fighting for control and all of them more interested in defeating each other than the west. Their terrorist efforts would be exhausted against one another.
Christian Graus wrote:
I think this is a pipe dream.
Well, what we are doing now is a pipe dream. And it is also a pipe dream to believe that any amount of touchy feely diplomacy in that region is ever going to do any good. But I believe that there are more people in the middle east who would fight to build more modern societies if the back of the Islamic fundamentalist instrastructure could be broken than there are terrorists. If these people were given a fighting chance, I think they would prevail. It would be a bloody mess, but frankly, I don't see any way to avoid a bloody mess. I just do not believe that there is a bloodless solution to any of this. "Capitalism is the source of all true freedom."
Stan Shannon wrote:
I just do not believe that there is a bloodless solution to any of this.
On that, I certainly agree. Christian Graus - Microsoft MVP - C++
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I don't think it would be too difficult for anyone who had a copy of Jane's military aircraft to figure out that F-15's would have to refule somewhere. "Capitalism is the source of all true freedom."
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Stan Shannon wrote:
My son isn't. He'll be 18 in about 14 months.
cripes! I have a grandson who is finishing Marine bootcamp in a week. Mike "We ain't stuck on stupid." badass Lt. General Russel Honore **"Remember - live bunnies are a great source of nourishment"**silly-assed cartoon
Hell, I still have an 11 year old at home... :sigh: "Capitalism is the source of all true freedom."
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http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20051026/ap_on_re_mi_ea/iran_israel Should Iran be allow to get the bomb? This is a huge red flag.
That sounds pretty mild to me. You may not realize this but almost all the Arab nations dislike Israel. That doesn't mean their going to start chucking nukes around because they can. Think about it - if one nation gets away with a nuclear strike, it would only encourage others - there would have to be masive retaliation. A more likely scenario is a nuclear device loaded onto a ship and detonated, with no clue as to who did it. Muslim Pakistan already has the bomb and could possibly accomplish this kind of strike, but they haven't.
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kgaddy wrote:
Well they are already doing that. What is the diffrence?
The difference is that they would have nothing to lose.
kgaddy wrote:
THey already said they want to destroy Israel. What else do you need?
I'm not sure what you mean here. They made a threat, so we should nuke them ? US meddling in the Middle East, particularly in relation to Israel, is the reason the whole area is shot to hell to start with.
kgaddy wrote:
This pipe dream came true in Lebanon.
I didn't say it was impossible, but the idea that any country will follow the US model, when initially forced to, is what doesn't hold true for me. Christian Graus - Microsoft MVP - C++
Christian Graus wrote:
S meddling in the Middle East, particularly in relation to Israel, is the reason the whole area is shot to hell to start with.
You need to read up on history. Isreal was attacked the day after it became a nation in 1948. This had nothing to do with the US. That area was already messed up. And yes, if a man is bulding a nuke and he says he is going to blow you and your family up, you better blow him up first. Of course you can choose not too, but you will be removed from the gene pool forever.
Christian Graus wrote:
I didn't say it was impossible, but the idea that any country will follow the US model, when initially forced to, is what doesn't hold true for me.
Forced too? Read stan's post again. He said he would leave it and hopfully they would see how well Iraq's system was going and follow it.
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Wow! I'd love to see that too, but for the oposite reason of yours. It would be like trying to extinguish fire with gasoline. Americans would become radioactive in the middle-east for the next 20 years. You would have to say goodbye for cheap oil, goodbye to any influence in the region, ... Oh, well, it would be to good to be true. Even Bush can't be so crazy...:sigh: Dadinho é o caralho! Meu nome agora é Zé Pequeno, porra!
Leandro Firmino da Hora in the best movie[^] you'll ever see.Diego Moita wrote:
Americans would become radioactive in the middle-east for the next 20 years. You would have to say goodbye for cheap oil, goodbye to any influence in the region, ...
Compared to what? Now? It is way past time for us to be concerning ourselves one way or another with how anyone in the middle east feels about anything. The only reason international Islamic terrorism exists is because of its secure bases of operation in the middle east. If those are eliminated, they are impotent to stage the kinds of attacks we have been seeing for the last several years. They will have no choice but to fight each other to restore stability to their own region. "Capitalism is the source of all true freedom."