Follow on vegetarians. - This is about "Pleasure hunting" [modified]
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On the aspect of hunting. If it isn't for pest control or food, but purely for sport then I don't agree with it. On the aspect of breeding animals for food then that is fine. We are omnivores, we are supposed to eat meat AND vegetables. If you are really concerned and don't want to cause any suffering at all then become a frutarian. Anything else is just hypocracy.
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My post was referring to hunting for pleasure indeed. I wasn't very explicit about my intent. I wanted to mention that the previous vegetarian post reminded me of this article I read, and the editorial about pleasure hunting, that touched me. Spent too much time translating it and didn't pay attention to wrapping it right :)
Cheers, Mircea "Pay people peanuts and you get monkeys" - David Ogilvy
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We could kill off all the farm animals and replace them with a mono-curtual crops of Soya; that would be an enviromental disaster. Cows eat grass and we eat cows; so we'll eating reproccessed grass. Consider Grass to be a base class with is inherited by cows. We inherit from cows so we actually eat grass. If you want to rant go to the soapbox.
Grady Booch: I told Google to their face...what you need is some serious adult supervision. (2007 Turing lecture) http://www.frankkerrigan.com/[^]
I'm not a vegetarian. My post intended to cover pleasure hunting. I can see that I wasn't very clear about it. If you check out the photos you'll notice that.
Cheers, Mircea "Pay people peanuts and you get monkeys" - David Ogilvy
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[EDIT] This is not intended to be a pro for becoming a vegetarian. Though it is a belief of the editor of this photo magazine article, don't miss the main focus of the photoshoot: PLEASURE HUNTING. I realise I wasn't very clear about this from the beginning. [/EDIT] The previous post with Alicia's message for becoming a vegetarian didn't get to me. But it remembered me about an editorial I read in a local photography magazine written by Harris Walman in an introduction to Jeff Mitchell's editorial "Stalking Season Starts In Scotland" that really touched me. I've translated it into english. It goes like this
**With eyes closed** **Hunting, an old habit thousands of years old, a noble sport practiced exclusively by the elites. Loads of crap attended by brutes, in my opinion. How on earth can you wake up one morning thinking that you’re going to end one life and also be happy about it? How is it any less important the life of that beautiful deer in the forest than your 2 cents worthless life? Hot is it any less important the life of the chicken that awaits his end without ever seeing anything else than a neon tube?** Chickens raised in farms are kept permanently in neon light to interfere with their ovulation, for the purpose of increasing egg production. In some locations they’re so filled with growth hormones that they end up breaking their legs because of their own weight. In the end they’re tied to a hook and sent on a rolling band that cuts off their heads. In order for calves to produce light meat they’re kept in the dark in a space as tight as possible. Their meat will become then anemic, but very tasty and soft. And in order for them not to get sick in these conditions, and to grow faster they’re treated with growth hormones and vaccines that are scientifically proven to cause disease to the ones that consume it. Millions of animals are killed every day for consume. That cow with gentle eyes, the calves that were running moments ago on the fields enjoying the sun and grass, the horses the Romanians sacrifice on a few euro for the Italian consumers, big consumers of this type of meat. If all this crap is performed by the butchers - simple people turned into brutes that must earn a buck for the kids at home – hunting is entirely a different matter. We won’t meet helpless people there. Poor people can’t afford a rifle of a few thousand euros or a trophy. No, hunting is for the elites. For the individual bored of its own life that doesn’t fMircea Grelus wrote:
the calves that were running moments ago on the fields enjoying the sun and grass
I thought they were in pens in the dark being fed steriods? Anyway, hmm, venison. Havent had any for a while. I particularly like the filet, goes very well with a red wine sauce. Mind you its been a while since I hunted. Used to use a .308 on deer and a .22 on rabbits. A 12 guage for pigeons, the remington automatic was my choice with adjustable choke. Anyway. We were born to eat meat. Its natural, but anyone who hasnt got the balls to kill an animal for food shouldnt eat meat.
Truth is the subjection of reality to an individuals perception
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I'm not a vegetarian. My post intended to cover pleasure hunting. I can see that I wasn't very clear about it. If you check out the photos you'll notice that.
Cheers, Mircea "Pay people peanuts and you get monkeys" - David Ogilvy
What's wrong with hunting it's Free Range food and organic how more natural can you get.
Grady Booch: I told Google to their face...what you need is some serious adult supervision. (2007 Turing lecture) http://www.frankkerrigan.com/[^]
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[EDIT] This is not intended to be a pro for becoming a vegetarian. Though it is a belief of the editor of this photo magazine article, don't miss the main focus of the photoshoot: PLEASURE HUNTING. I realise I wasn't very clear about this from the beginning. [/EDIT] The previous post with Alicia's message for becoming a vegetarian didn't get to me. But it remembered me about an editorial I read in a local photography magazine written by Harris Walman in an introduction to Jeff Mitchell's editorial "Stalking Season Starts In Scotland" that really touched me. I've translated it into english. It goes like this
**With eyes closed** **Hunting, an old habit thousands of years old, a noble sport practiced exclusively by the elites. Loads of crap attended by brutes, in my opinion. How on earth can you wake up one morning thinking that you’re going to end one life and also be happy about it? How is it any less important the life of that beautiful deer in the forest than your 2 cents worthless life? Hot is it any less important the life of the chicken that awaits his end without ever seeing anything else than a neon tube?** Chickens raised in farms are kept permanently in neon light to interfere with their ovulation, for the purpose of increasing egg production. In some locations they’re so filled with growth hormones that they end up breaking their legs because of their own weight. In the end they’re tied to a hook and sent on a rolling band that cuts off their heads. In order for calves to produce light meat they’re kept in the dark in a space as tight as possible. Their meat will become then anemic, but very tasty and soft. And in order for them not to get sick in these conditions, and to grow faster they’re treated with growth hormones and vaccines that are scientifically proven to cause disease to the ones that consume it. Millions of animals are killed every day for consume. That cow with gentle eyes, the calves that were running moments ago on the fields enjoying the sun and grass, the horses the Romanians sacrifice on a few euro for the Italian consumers, big consumers of this type of meat. If all this crap is performed by the butchers - simple people turned into brutes that must earn a buck for the kids at home – hunting is entirely a different matter. We won’t meet helpless people there. Poor people can’t afford a rifle of a few thousand euros or a trophy. No, hunting is for the elites. For the individual bored of its own life that doesn’t fI actually spent 3 years as a vegetarian in the 80s, which was an educational experience in a number of ways. My motivations were physical rather than philosophical. I'd read articles promoting the belief that not eating meat reduced "type A" tendencies, so I thought I'd give it a spin to see what difference my diet would have on my reactions. In other words, it was an exercise in behavioral modification rather than an aversion to killing Bambi. Aside from the fact that I noticed none of the aforementioned results, I also learned that there are a wide variety of "vegetarians" including what they'll eat (for instance, I would eat eggs, but not the chicken) and their motivations for their dietary lifestyle. Some were thinking about healthy eating, some objected to the exploitation of animals, some were horrified at the thought of harming another creature, etc. Having been there and back (steak and potatoes for dinner last night), and having a few more years of living behind me, I now see many of these motivations in a different light. Years ago, I let a coworker go on for 10 minutes as he criticized my poor moral fabric for eating meat before I complimented him on his nice leather shoes. Of course, each person is an individual with their own take on things, but to generalize a bit, I find those who become vegetarians out of a belief that we shouldn't harm animals to be the most difficult to fathom, especially when they chastise me for my own way of life. More accurately, I find the people in this group to be very noble spirits with a somewhat limited perspective. I've been criticized for "playing God" by eating meat, i.e. choosing who has the right to live and who should die. This, typically, from someone who just ate a bunch of dead plants for dinner. Ah, but that's different, right? Everyone knows that plants aren't as important as animals. Funny, regardless of religious conviction, I rather thought that all life came from the same place and was therefore equally important. Seems to me that declaring one form of life as less important than the next falls into the "playing God" category quite nicely. But what about hunting, as in a random act of violence not driven by the need for resources? Surely that must be evil. Well, I'm sure it is, at least from the target's perspective. However, I wonder how many of the people who protest this activity have nicely manicured lawns, i.e. fields of grass that they savagely attack with a sharp blade on a regular basis for no other reason than their visual pleasure?
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I actually spent 3 years as a vegetarian in the 80s, which was an educational experience in a number of ways. My motivations were physical rather than philosophical. I'd read articles promoting the belief that not eating meat reduced "type A" tendencies, so I thought I'd give it a spin to see what difference my diet would have on my reactions. In other words, it was an exercise in behavioral modification rather than an aversion to killing Bambi. Aside from the fact that I noticed none of the aforementioned results, I also learned that there are a wide variety of "vegetarians" including what they'll eat (for instance, I would eat eggs, but not the chicken) and their motivations for their dietary lifestyle. Some were thinking about healthy eating, some objected to the exploitation of animals, some were horrified at the thought of harming another creature, etc. Having been there and back (steak and potatoes for dinner last night), and having a few more years of living behind me, I now see many of these motivations in a different light. Years ago, I let a coworker go on for 10 minutes as he criticized my poor moral fabric for eating meat before I complimented him on his nice leather shoes. Of course, each person is an individual with their own take on things, but to generalize a bit, I find those who become vegetarians out of a belief that we shouldn't harm animals to be the most difficult to fathom, especially when they chastise me for my own way of life. More accurately, I find the people in this group to be very noble spirits with a somewhat limited perspective. I've been criticized for "playing God" by eating meat, i.e. choosing who has the right to live and who should die. This, typically, from someone who just ate a bunch of dead plants for dinner. Ah, but that's different, right? Everyone knows that plants aren't as important as animals. Funny, regardless of religious conviction, I rather thought that all life came from the same place and was therefore equally important. Seems to me that declaring one form of life as less important than the next falls into the "playing God" category quite nicely. But what about hunting, as in a random act of violence not driven by the need for resources? Surely that must be evil. Well, I'm sure it is, at least from the target's perspective. However, I wonder how many of the people who protest this activity have nicely manicured lawns, i.e. fields of grass that they savagely attack with a sharp blade on a regular basis for no other reason than their visual pleasure?
You make an interesting point.
Cheers, Mircea "Pay people peanuts and you get monkeys" - David Ogilvy
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I actually spent 3 years as a vegetarian in the 80s, which was an educational experience in a number of ways. My motivations were physical rather than philosophical. I'd read articles promoting the belief that not eating meat reduced "type A" tendencies, so I thought I'd give it a spin to see what difference my diet would have on my reactions. In other words, it was an exercise in behavioral modification rather than an aversion to killing Bambi. Aside from the fact that I noticed none of the aforementioned results, I also learned that there are a wide variety of "vegetarians" including what they'll eat (for instance, I would eat eggs, but not the chicken) and their motivations for their dietary lifestyle. Some were thinking about healthy eating, some objected to the exploitation of animals, some were horrified at the thought of harming another creature, etc. Having been there and back (steak and potatoes for dinner last night), and having a few more years of living behind me, I now see many of these motivations in a different light. Years ago, I let a coworker go on for 10 minutes as he criticized my poor moral fabric for eating meat before I complimented him on his nice leather shoes. Of course, each person is an individual with their own take on things, but to generalize a bit, I find those who become vegetarians out of a belief that we shouldn't harm animals to be the most difficult to fathom, especially when they chastise me for my own way of life. More accurately, I find the people in this group to be very noble spirits with a somewhat limited perspective. I've been criticized for "playing God" by eating meat, i.e. choosing who has the right to live and who should die. This, typically, from someone who just ate a bunch of dead plants for dinner. Ah, but that's different, right? Everyone knows that plants aren't as important as animals. Funny, regardless of religious conviction, I rather thought that all life came from the same place and was therefore equally important. Seems to me that declaring one form of life as less important than the next falls into the "playing God" category quite nicely. But what about hunting, as in a random act of violence not driven by the need for resources? Surely that must be evil. Well, I'm sure it is, at least from the target's perspective. However, I wonder how many of the people who protest this activity have nicely manicured lawns, i.e. fields of grass that they savagely attack with a sharp blade on a regular basis for no other reason than their visual pleasure?
I'm a vegetarian basically because all the affordable meat is raised in a way that isn't good for the environment, and I'm concerned about the mercury levels in fish. If it was all free-range grass fed beef and mercury free sushi grade tuna, I'd be chowing down on my bovine brother too. I've been a vegetarian for a couple of years now, and really there aren't that many changes I've had to make or effects on my body. I buy the best quality vegetables, eggs and cheese that I can afford, so it isn't any cheaper, but I think I do eat more variety and better tasting food as a vegetarian. I am limited on the cheap end of the spectrum. I can't just buy a pound of 99 cent hamburger and a pack of buns for 1.29 and call it a meal anymore, and there are few fast food options. Not that I really miss either of those. The biggest pain being a vegetarian is dealing with those same "don't harm animals" vegetarians, and the omnivores that have had to deal with their crap for too long. Man is an omnivore and it will happily kill and eat other critters and that's just part of nature. Not only that, so many top predators are no longer in the ecosystem that we have to take over for them and keep herbivore populations in check.
Christopher Duncan wrote:
However, I wonder how many of the people who protest this activity have nicely manicured lawns, i.e. fields of grass that they savagely attack with a sharp blade on a regular basis for no other reason than their visual pleasure?
Weeding is one of the most important parts of agriculture. We have to kill the plants without the tasty bits so the ones with them will survive.
This blanket smells like ham
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I'm a vegetarian basically because all the affordable meat is raised in a way that isn't good for the environment, and I'm concerned about the mercury levels in fish. If it was all free-range grass fed beef and mercury free sushi grade tuna, I'd be chowing down on my bovine brother too. I've been a vegetarian for a couple of years now, and really there aren't that many changes I've had to make or effects on my body. I buy the best quality vegetables, eggs and cheese that I can afford, so it isn't any cheaper, but I think I do eat more variety and better tasting food as a vegetarian. I am limited on the cheap end of the spectrum. I can't just buy a pound of 99 cent hamburger and a pack of buns for 1.29 and call it a meal anymore, and there are few fast food options. Not that I really miss either of those. The biggest pain being a vegetarian is dealing with those same "don't harm animals" vegetarians, and the omnivores that have had to deal with their crap for too long. Man is an omnivore and it will happily kill and eat other critters and that's just part of nature. Not only that, so many top predators are no longer in the ecosystem that we have to take over for them and keep herbivore populations in check.
Christopher Duncan wrote:
However, I wonder how many of the people who protest this activity have nicely manicured lawns, i.e. fields of grass that they savagely attack with a sharp blade on a regular basis for no other reason than their visual pleasure?
Weeding is one of the most important parts of agriculture. We have to kill the plants without the tasty bits so the ones with them will survive.
This blanket smells like ham
Andy Brummer wrote:
Weeding is one of the most important parts of agriculture. We have to kill the plants without the tasty bits so the ones with them will survive.
And I can proudly say that in the 70s I did my part, mostly by burning them. ;)
Christopher Duncan Author of The Career Programmer and Unite the Tribes www.PracticalUSA.com
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Andy Brummer wrote:
Weeding is one of the most important parts of agriculture. We have to kill the plants without the tasty bits so the ones with them will survive.
And I can proudly say that in the 70s I did my part, mostly by burning them. ;)
Christopher Duncan Author of The Career Programmer and Unite the Tribes www.PracticalUSA.com
Nice. :laugh:
This blanket smells like ham
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Thanks!!!!!!! I could really go a burger now.
Grady Booch: I told Google to their face...what you need is some serious adult supervision. (2007 Turing lecture) http://www.frankkerrigan.com/[^]