Fight Club
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To watch that movie because I abhor unnecessary violence especially in the form of combat for pride. {Lump me into where you were.} I haven't even seen all the Lord of the Rings films or all the Star Wars films or 30 other films I really wanted to see "Tears in the Sun" being one of them (what can I say I like Willis, he was brilliant in Over the Hedge). Since I'll never see this show. My wife won't even watch Gladiator which in my opinion carries some really deep meanings as well (it is also a film I had zero intention of ever watching) and is one of my all-time FAVORITE-FAVORITE-FAVORITE flicks! So what's the deeper meaning? Now that you guys are stepping out about it I'm thinking it has to do with the "trapped" feelings many of us have and the deeper desire to "bust out" every now and then. But that seems ignorant and shallow not having seen the flick or knowing anything about it... Someone loop me in. I'd lay 1000000000000000000000000000000:1 odds that I will ever get to see it. Movies and T.V. just don't really happen in our house.
code-frog wrote:
So what's the deeper meaning? Now that you guys are stepping out about it I'm thinking it has to do with the "trapped" feelings many of us have and the deeper desire to "bust out" every now and then. But that seems ignorant and shallow not having seen the flick or knowing anything about it...
Well one thing I got out of it is the progressive trend of men being emasculated in popular culture and society. There are really several things going on in this movie and one of the threads is that in the movie a *lot* of men are interested in joining the fight club / society for what appear to be reasons of reinstating their genetic and historic male role in society. Popular culture and advertising has been relentlessly disassembling the traditional role of the man in society, making fun of the very aspects that make men different from women, portraying men as childish barbarous ineffectual idiots. Entire sitcoms that ran many seasons on TV mined that vein for all it was worth. Look at most ad's with a woman and a man in them, the man is nearly always portrayed as being an idiot on some level or another with the woman always knowing best. Look at nearly any of those ads and imagine the exact same ad with the sexes reversed and you will quickly realize just how unacceptible those ads would be in modern society. In short it's blatant sexism that started as a backlash of the sexist treatment of women for decades (before that it was irrelevant because the great majority of women were *not* interested in assuming male roles in anything). It's no more right or accurate than it was the other way around in this day and age but for some reason it's more socially acceptable. Men seem in general content to have their traditional male characteristics laughed at and made fun of. Society seems to be trending towards a conscious attempt on the one hand to deny that there is any difference between the sexes all the while negatively percieving the male attitudes. There are no more rights of passage any more, no real outlet for men (especially in urban areas) to have an outlet for their male identity, few opportunities to be a true individual and go your own way. One thread of this movie taps into that, but it's not the only or even main thread of the movie.
When everyone is a hero no one is a hero.
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dighn wrote:
messages that I got were the emptiness of material things and the lack of purpose in the lives of so many.
i think most people buy material things because they lack purpose in life and thus have no way to judge whether or not something is important to them so they wait to be told what is important by masses.
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code-frog wrote:
So what's the deeper meaning? Now that you guys are stepping out about it I'm thinking it has to do with the "trapped" feelings many of us have and the deeper desire to "bust out" every now and then. But that seems ignorant and shallow not having seen the flick or knowing anything about it...
Well one thing I got out of it is the progressive trend of men being emasculated in popular culture and society. There are really several things going on in this movie and one of the threads is that in the movie a *lot* of men are interested in joining the fight club / society for what appear to be reasons of reinstating their genetic and historic male role in society. Popular culture and advertising has been relentlessly disassembling the traditional role of the man in society, making fun of the very aspects that make men different from women, portraying men as childish barbarous ineffectual idiots. Entire sitcoms that ran many seasons on TV mined that vein for all it was worth. Look at most ad's with a woman and a man in them, the man is nearly always portrayed as being an idiot on some level or another with the woman always knowing best. Look at nearly any of those ads and imagine the exact same ad with the sexes reversed and you will quickly realize just how unacceptible those ads would be in modern society. In short it's blatant sexism that started as a backlash of the sexist treatment of women for decades (before that it was irrelevant because the great majority of women were *not* interested in assuming male roles in anything). It's no more right or accurate than it was the other way around in this day and age but for some reason it's more socially acceptable. Men seem in general content to have their traditional male characteristics laughed at and made fun of. Society seems to be trending towards a conscious attempt on the one hand to deny that there is any difference between the sexes all the while negatively percieving the male attitudes. There are no more rights of passage any more, no real outlet for men (especially in urban areas) to have an outlet for their male identity, few opportunities to be a true individual and go your own way. One thread of this movie taps into that, but it's not the only or even main thread of the movie.
When everyone is a hero no one is a hero.
John C wrote:
Society seems to be trending towards a conscious attempt on the one hand to deny that there is any difference between the sexes
psssssh like what :-P but i hear what you're saying and someone is squatting on www.manimal.com
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code-frog wrote:
So what's the deeper meaning? Now that you guys are stepping out about it I'm thinking it has to do with the "trapped" feelings many of us have and the deeper desire to "bust out" every now and then. But that seems ignorant and shallow not having seen the flick or knowing anything about it...
Well one thing I got out of it is the progressive trend of men being emasculated in popular culture and society. There are really several things going on in this movie and one of the threads is that in the movie a *lot* of men are interested in joining the fight club / society for what appear to be reasons of reinstating their genetic and historic male role in society. Popular culture and advertising has been relentlessly disassembling the traditional role of the man in society, making fun of the very aspects that make men different from women, portraying men as childish barbarous ineffectual idiots. Entire sitcoms that ran many seasons on TV mined that vein for all it was worth. Look at most ad's with a woman and a man in them, the man is nearly always portrayed as being an idiot on some level or another with the woman always knowing best. Look at nearly any of those ads and imagine the exact same ad with the sexes reversed and you will quickly realize just how unacceptible those ads would be in modern society. In short it's blatant sexism that started as a backlash of the sexist treatment of women for decades (before that it was irrelevant because the great majority of women were *not* interested in assuming male roles in anything). It's no more right or accurate than it was the other way around in this day and age but for some reason it's more socially acceptable. Men seem in general content to have their traditional male characteristics laughed at and made fun of. Society seems to be trending towards a conscious attempt on the one hand to deny that there is any difference between the sexes all the while negatively percieving the male attitudes. There are no more rights of passage any more, no real outlet for men (especially in urban areas) to have an outlet for their male identity, few opportunities to be a true individual and go your own way. One thread of this movie taps into that, but it's not the only or even main thread of the movie.
When everyone is a hero no one is a hero.
John C wrote:
the progressive trend of men being emasculated in popular culture and society
Too true. That's the province of wives.
John C wrote:
There are no more rights of passage any more, no real outlet for men (especially in urban areas) to have an outlet for their male identity
Peeing standing up. That's all we've got left - and once the women figure out how to do that without dribbling, well it's curtains for male kind.
Deja View - the feeling that you've seen this post before.
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To watch that movie because I abhor unnecessary violence especially in the form of combat for pride. {Lump me into where you were.} I haven't even seen all the Lord of the Rings films or all the Star Wars films or 30 other films I really wanted to see "Tears in the Sun" being one of them (what can I say I like Willis, he was brilliant in Over the Hedge). Since I'll never see this show. My wife won't even watch Gladiator which in my opinion carries some really deep meanings as well (it is also a film I had zero intention of ever watching) and is one of my all-time FAVORITE-FAVORITE-FAVORITE flicks! So what's the deeper meaning? Now that you guys are stepping out about it I'm thinking it has to do with the "trapped" feelings many of us have and the deeper desire to "bust out" every now and then. But that seems ignorant and shallow not having seen the flick or knowing anything about it... Someone loop me in. I'd lay 1000000000000000000000000000000:1 odds that I will ever get to see it. Movies and T.V. just don't really happen in our house.
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John C wrote:
the progressive trend of men being emasculated in popular culture and society
Too true. That's the province of wives.
John C wrote:
There are no more rights of passage any more, no real outlet for men (especially in urban areas) to have an outlet for their male identity
Peeing standing up. That's all we've got left - and once the women figure out how to do that without dribbling, well it's curtains for male kind.
Deja View - the feeling that you've seen this post before.
Pete O'Hanlon wrote:
John C wrote: the progressive trend of men being emasculated in popular culture and society Too true. That's the province of wives.
No, the province of wives is to try and it's in the province of men to fiercely resist with pride but to accept when they are just plain being silly. There are not a lot of women in my estimation that truly in their hearts want a lapdog for a husband.
Pete O'Hanlon wrote:
Peeing standing up. That's all we've got left - and once the women figure out how to do that without dribbling, well it's curtains for male kind.
They already have, there's this disposable cardboard funnel type thing I saw once. Dont' get me wrong, I don't think men or women should adhere to any particular gender role, I think that's long out the window, but the concept of maleness and femaleness and the attitudes that go with them are good things in my opinion no matter who or what sex chooses to live them. Vive le difference! :)
When everyone is a hero no one is a hero.
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code-frog wrote:
So what's the deeper meaning? Now that you guys are stepping out about it I'm thinking it has to do with the "trapped" feelings many of us have and the deeper desire to "bust out" every now and then. But that seems ignorant and shallow not having seen the flick or knowing anything about it...
Well one thing I got out of it is the progressive trend of men being emasculated in popular culture and society. There are really several things going on in this movie and one of the threads is that in the movie a *lot* of men are interested in joining the fight club / society for what appear to be reasons of reinstating their genetic and historic male role in society. Popular culture and advertising has been relentlessly disassembling the traditional role of the man in society, making fun of the very aspects that make men different from women, portraying men as childish barbarous ineffectual idiots. Entire sitcoms that ran many seasons on TV mined that vein for all it was worth. Look at most ad's with a woman and a man in them, the man is nearly always portrayed as being an idiot on some level or another with the woman always knowing best. Look at nearly any of those ads and imagine the exact same ad with the sexes reversed and you will quickly realize just how unacceptible those ads would be in modern society. In short it's blatant sexism that started as a backlash of the sexist treatment of women for decades (before that it was irrelevant because the great majority of women were *not* interested in assuming male roles in anything). It's no more right or accurate than it was the other way around in this day and age but for some reason it's more socially acceptable. Men seem in general content to have their traditional male characteristics laughed at and made fun of. Society seems to be trending towards a conscious attempt on the one hand to deny that there is any difference between the sexes all the while negatively percieving the male attitudes. There are no more rights of passage any more, no real outlet for men (especially in urban areas) to have an outlet for their male identity, few opportunities to be a true individual and go your own way. One thread of this movie taps into that, but it's not the only or even main thread of the movie.
When everyone is a hero no one is a hero.
I couldn't agree more to all of that. Not at all. Those points are so horribly, terrifyingly true. Men have the most bizarre position in our society. It's nearly impossible to put it into words. Right on. I can see what you mean now.
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You know how you see a new movie come along and the advertising for it makes it look like something you won't like, then years later on a whim you rent the movie and discover all the advertising when it came out was completely and utterly misleading? I remember seeing the ads for Fight Club and getting the impression it was a stupid, shallow movie about underground fist fighting with no purpose other than to separate 17 - 30 year old men from their money. After watching it I discovered nothing could be further from the truth. It's a very deep and thought provoking movie and the marketing at the time must have brought in droves of people who absolutely hated it. It seems like the marketing department for most movies works off a one sentence description of the movie and invents the rest to target it to the demographic they are after with no realtion to the actual movie whatsoever. It's funny reading the reviews and discussion of Fight Club online. A lot of people apparently don't take any time at all to really think about the movies they watch, or perhaps you have to have been a 30 something north american male at the time the movie came out then aged a few years to really get the deeper themes of the movie. Anyway, it's highly worth seeing if you haven't yet. It's violent but very deep and interesting on many levels. Clearly a masterpiece of the 20th century.
When everyone is a hero no one is a hero.
John C wrote:
and discover all the advertising when it came out was completely and utterly misleading?
Happens to me with most movies. Whenever I'm flying, I compare the english and the german abstracts for the movies. It's just a few lines that in their difference show clearly how much they are tailored to their target audience rather than the movie.
We are a big screwed up dysfunctional psychotic happy family - some more screwed up, others more happy, but everybody's psychotic joint venture definition of CP
blog: TDD - the Aha! | Linkify!| FoldWithUs! | sighist -
To watch that movie because I abhor unnecessary violence especially in the form of combat for pride. {Lump me into where you were.} I haven't even seen all the Lord of the Rings films or all the Star Wars films or 30 other films I really wanted to see "Tears in the Sun" being one of them (what can I say I like Willis, he was brilliant in Over the Hedge). Since I'll never see this show. My wife won't even watch Gladiator which in my opinion carries some really deep meanings as well (it is also a film I had zero intention of ever watching) and is one of my all-time FAVORITE-FAVORITE-FAVORITE flicks! So what's the deeper meaning? Now that you guys are stepping out about it I'm thinking it has to do with the "trapped" feelings many of us have and the deeper desire to "bust out" every now and then. But that seems ignorant and shallow not having seen the flick or knowing anything about it... Someone loop me in. I'd lay 1000000000000000000000000000000:1 odds that I will ever get to see it. Movies and T.V. just don't really happen in our house.
code-frog wrote:
I absolutely refuse...to watch that movie because I abhor unnecessary violence especially in the form of combat for pride.
That's exactly the point of the original post. Fight Club is absolutely not about "unnecessary violence".
We are a big screwed up dysfunctional psychotic happy family - some more screwed up, others more happy, but everybody's psychotic joint venture definition of CP
blog: TDD - the Aha! | Linkify!| FoldWithUs! | sighist -
You know how you see a new movie come along and the advertising for it makes it look like something you won't like, then years later on a whim you rent the movie and discover all the advertising when it came out was completely and utterly misleading? I remember seeing the ads for Fight Club and getting the impression it was a stupid, shallow movie about underground fist fighting with no purpose other than to separate 17 - 30 year old men from their money. After watching it I discovered nothing could be further from the truth. It's a very deep and thought provoking movie and the marketing at the time must have brought in droves of people who absolutely hated it. It seems like the marketing department for most movies works off a one sentence description of the movie and invents the rest to target it to the demographic they are after with no realtion to the actual movie whatsoever. It's funny reading the reviews and discussion of Fight Club online. A lot of people apparently don't take any time at all to really think about the movies they watch, or perhaps you have to have been a 30 something north american male at the time the movie came out then aged a few years to really get the deeper themes of the movie. Anyway, it's highly worth seeing if you haven't yet. It's violent but very deep and interesting on many levels. Clearly a masterpiece of the 20th century.
When everyone is a hero no one is a hero.
-
You know how you see a new movie come along and the advertising for it makes it look like something you won't like, then years later on a whim you rent the movie and discover all the advertising when it came out was completely and utterly misleading? I remember seeing the ads for Fight Club and getting the impression it was a stupid, shallow movie about underground fist fighting with no purpose other than to separate 17 - 30 year old men from their money. After watching it I discovered nothing could be further from the truth. It's a very deep and thought provoking movie and the marketing at the time must have brought in droves of people who absolutely hated it. It seems like the marketing department for most movies works off a one sentence description of the movie and invents the rest to target it to the demographic they are after with no realtion to the actual movie whatsoever. It's funny reading the reviews and discussion of Fight Club online. A lot of people apparently don't take any time at all to really think about the movies they watch, or perhaps you have to have been a 30 something north american male at the time the movie came out then aged a few years to really get the deeper themes of the movie. Anyway, it's highly worth seeing if you haven't yet. It's violent but very deep and interesting on many levels. Clearly a masterpiece of the 20th century.
When everyone is a hero no one is a hero.
Well, that was my initial impression of the movie, too. This is deeper than a stupid fight film. But, after thinking about the thing a while... The movie grosses me out... I mean, If i were that Ed Norton character, I'd be getting pretty sick of getting beat up all the time... Is the guy into S&M or somethin??? In every fight there has to be a loser. That'd usually be me. I don't embrace that aspect of "male"-ness. I see it's attraction to some. But, well, it ain't for me. I thought the whole film had this silent scary "he's a homosexual but doesn't know it" theme... I don't think we have to fight to be male. Hunt maybe. That's pretty necessary on a desert island... I agree that tv makes guys look like dorks, but, well, we are dorks pretty often. But then, so are women. And I don't see them making movies about revolution to get back their female-ness. And in a relationship, well, the woman's gonna win. Mostly because women are COMPLETELY incapable of compromise. (At least, often they are, you know... just like guys are dorks...) You want a relationship? Somebody has to compromise. Men can. You know the old red-green line! "I'm a man. But I can change. If I have to. I GUESS." Ok, that was all pretty sexist what i said there, wasn't it... Oh well. That's life... It's sexist... It distinguishes between em... so do i... ...SteveH http://shazware.com
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Well, that was my initial impression of the movie, too. This is deeper than a stupid fight film. But, after thinking about the thing a while... The movie grosses me out... I mean, If i were that Ed Norton character, I'd be getting pretty sick of getting beat up all the time... Is the guy into S&M or somethin??? In every fight there has to be a loser. That'd usually be me. I don't embrace that aspect of "male"-ness. I see it's attraction to some. But, well, it ain't for me. I thought the whole film had this silent scary "he's a homosexual but doesn't know it" theme... I don't think we have to fight to be male. Hunt maybe. That's pretty necessary on a desert island... I agree that tv makes guys look like dorks, but, well, we are dorks pretty often. But then, so are women. And I don't see them making movies about revolution to get back their female-ness. And in a relationship, well, the woman's gonna win. Mostly because women are COMPLETELY incapable of compromise. (At least, often they are, you know... just like guys are dorks...) You want a relationship? Somebody has to compromise. Men can. You know the old red-green line! "I'm a man. But I can change. If I have to. I GUESS." Ok, that was all pretty sexist what i said there, wasn't it... Oh well. That's life... It's sexist... It distinguishes between em... so do i... ...SteveH http://shazware.com
Steve Hazel wrote:
In every fight there has to be a loser. That'd usually be me. I don't embrace that aspect of "male"-ness.
I think the point was to fight in the first place, not the winning or losing.
Steve Hazel wrote:
And I don't see them making movies about revolution to get back their female-ness.
Actually, there have been more than a few but they aren't the sort of movies most guys enjoy. I think we'll see more in future.
Steve Hazel wrote:
And in a relationship, well, the woman's gonna win.
Of course because the key to that whole thing is that men think of it in terms of winning and losing and women usually don't which is one of the fundamental reasons why men always think they don't understand women.
Steve Hazel wrote:
Mostly because women are COMPLETELY incapable of compromise.
Many may seem that way but usually how it transpires is that the man is roped into taking a side on something that he normally wouldn't give a crap about and because men are competitive by nature rather than just saying they don't care and having over with it they will start to argue about it and then it spirals out of control. These are the sorts of problems that we get into as a society when we ignore our basic differences and try to be something we aren't. If men stuck to their domain of responsibility (i.e. stuff they really actually truly care about) and women stuck to theirs (i.e. stuff they actually truly care about, anything really as long as it's something they truly care about) the world would be a much better place. Next time a women asks you about something you don't care about, be honest, say "I don't care at all about it, why don't you tell me what you've decided", keep at it and when it's something you truly care about chances are the women doesn't and will have no problem with your opinion on the subject given that you've stayed out of her domain. Sometimes domains overlap, my wife and I both care about landscaping around the house, we both have ideas, but because we both truly care about it we never argue about it. The best idea always wins.
When everyone is a hero no one is a hero.
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code-frog wrote:
I absolutely refuse...to watch that movie because I abhor unnecessary violence especially in the form of combat for pride.
That's exactly the point of the original post. Fight Club is absolutely not about "unnecessary violence".
We are a big screwed up dysfunctional psychotic happy family - some more screwed up, others more happy, but everybody's psychotic joint venture definition of CP
blog: TDD - the Aha! | Linkify!| FoldWithUs! | sighistRight I think most people misunderstood that I was "taking" that stance prior to John's post. Once I read his comments I was actually curious to know more about it. :-D
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Well, that was my initial impression of the movie, too. This is deeper than a stupid fight film. But, after thinking about the thing a while... The movie grosses me out... I mean, If i were that Ed Norton character, I'd be getting pretty sick of getting beat up all the time... Is the guy into S&M or somethin??? In every fight there has to be a loser. That'd usually be me. I don't embrace that aspect of "male"-ness. I see it's attraction to some. But, well, it ain't for me. I thought the whole film had this silent scary "he's a homosexual but doesn't know it" theme... I don't think we have to fight to be male. Hunt maybe. That's pretty necessary on a desert island... I agree that tv makes guys look like dorks, but, well, we are dorks pretty often. But then, so are women. And I don't see them making movies about revolution to get back their female-ness. And in a relationship, well, the woman's gonna win. Mostly because women are COMPLETELY incapable of compromise. (At least, often they are, you know... just like guys are dorks...) You want a relationship? Somebody has to compromise. Men can. You know the old red-green line! "I'm a man. But I can change. If I have to. I GUESS." Ok, that was all pretty sexist what i said there, wasn't it... Oh well. That's life... It's sexist... It distinguishes between em... so do i... ...SteveH http://shazware.com
Steve Hazel wrote:
And in a relationship, well, the woman's gonna win. Mostly because women are COMPLETELY incapable of compromise. (At least, often they are, you know... just like guys are dorks...) You want a relationship? Somebody has to compromise. Men can. You know the old red-green line! "I'm a man. But I can change. If I have to. I GUESS."
That sounds very depressing. To quote Pop-eye: "I yam what I yam." I don't feel anybody should have to change in a relationship. Don't like who I am? There's the door. In my opinion the more you have to compromise the more you should realize you're with the wrong person.
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You know how you see a new movie come along and the advertising for it makes it look like something you won't like, then years later on a whim you rent the movie and discover all the advertising when it came out was completely and utterly misleading? I remember seeing the ads for Fight Club and getting the impression it was a stupid, shallow movie about underground fist fighting with no purpose other than to separate 17 - 30 year old men from their money. After watching it I discovered nothing could be further from the truth. It's a very deep and thought provoking movie and the marketing at the time must have brought in droves of people who absolutely hated it. It seems like the marketing department for most movies works off a one sentence description of the movie and invents the rest to target it to the demographic they are after with no realtion to the actual movie whatsoever. It's funny reading the reviews and discussion of Fight Club online. A lot of people apparently don't take any time at all to really think about the movies they watch, or perhaps you have to have been a 30 something north american male at the time the movie came out then aged a few years to really get the deeper themes of the movie. Anyway, it's highly worth seeing if you haven't yet. It's violent but very deep and interesting on many levels. Clearly a masterpiece of the 20th century.
When everyone is a hero no one is a hero.
Fight Club is truly awesome. The movie like many is based on the book. This is one of the very rare cases where the movie is much better than the book. I read the book a few years after the movie came out. The only really interesting part of it was a forward written by the author describing all the stupid/violent/hilarious things people did after seeing the movie.
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Steve Hazel wrote:
And in a relationship, well, the woman's gonna win. Mostly because women are COMPLETELY incapable of compromise. (At least, often they are, you know... just like guys are dorks...) You want a relationship? Somebody has to compromise. Men can. You know the old red-green line! "I'm a man. But I can change. If I have to. I GUESS."
That sounds very depressing. To quote Pop-eye: "I yam what I yam." I don't feel anybody should have to change in a relationship. Don't like who I am? There's the door. In my opinion the more you have to compromise the more you should realize you're with the wrong person.
Not tryin to be a jerk, but are ya married? You gotta compromise if you wanna stay that way :) Nobody's gonna go along with EVERYthing about another person. Anyways, it ain't depressing. Marriage is wonderful. Just because you go along with something doesn't mean you have to admit defeat. Ain't nothin wrong bout compromising. It usually takes the better man to compromise :) Ok, I'll shut up. I'm startin' to get preachy. Sorry. ...SteveH http://shazware.com
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Steve Hazel wrote:
In every fight there has to be a loser. That'd usually be me. I don't embrace that aspect of "male"-ness.
I think the point was to fight in the first place, not the winning or losing.
Steve Hazel wrote:
And I don't see them making movies about revolution to get back their female-ness.
Actually, there have been more than a few but they aren't the sort of movies most guys enjoy. I think we'll see more in future.
Steve Hazel wrote:
And in a relationship, well, the woman's gonna win.
Of course because the key to that whole thing is that men think of it in terms of winning and losing and women usually don't which is one of the fundamental reasons why men always think they don't understand women.
Steve Hazel wrote:
Mostly because women are COMPLETELY incapable of compromise.
Many may seem that way but usually how it transpires is that the man is roped into taking a side on something that he normally wouldn't give a crap about and because men are competitive by nature rather than just saying they don't care and having over with it they will start to argue about it and then it spirals out of control. These are the sorts of problems that we get into as a society when we ignore our basic differences and try to be something we aren't. If men stuck to their domain of responsibility (i.e. stuff they really actually truly care about) and women stuck to theirs (i.e. stuff they actually truly care about, anything really as long as it's something they truly care about) the world would be a much better place. Next time a women asks you about something you don't care about, be honest, say "I don't care at all about it, why don't you tell me what you've decided", keep at it and when it's something you truly care about chances are the women doesn't and will have no problem with your opinion on the subject given that you've stayed out of her domain. Sometimes domains overlap, my wife and I both care about landscaping around the house, we both have ideas, but because we both truly care about it we never argue about it. The best idea always wins.
When everyone is a hero no one is a hero.
John C wrote:
I think the point was to fight in the first place, not the winning or losing.
I get that. My point is that I am male and I don't think that fighting is a key characteristic of being male. In fact, I don't think it's something to be embracing at all. I don't think that war was one of man's better ideas. Hunting? Good idea. Caring for kids? Good idea. Punching people in the face or worse? No so good. I don't think I lose if I compromise. I think I'm the better, umm, person. ...SteveH
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Well, that was my initial impression of the movie, too. This is deeper than a stupid fight film. But, after thinking about the thing a while... The movie grosses me out... I mean, If i were that Ed Norton character, I'd be getting pretty sick of getting beat up all the time... Is the guy into S&M or somethin??? In every fight there has to be a loser. That'd usually be me. I don't embrace that aspect of "male"-ness. I see it's attraction to some. But, well, it ain't for me. I thought the whole film had this silent scary "he's a homosexual but doesn't know it" theme... I don't think we have to fight to be male. Hunt maybe. That's pretty necessary on a desert island... I agree that tv makes guys look like dorks, but, well, we are dorks pretty often. But then, so are women. And I don't see them making movies about revolution to get back their female-ness. And in a relationship, well, the woman's gonna win. Mostly because women are COMPLETELY incapable of compromise. (At least, often they are, you know... just like guys are dorks...) You want a relationship? Somebody has to compromise. Men can. You know the old red-green line! "I'm a man. But I can change. If I have to. I GUESS." Ok, that was all pretty sexist what i said there, wasn't it... Oh well. That's life... It's sexist... It distinguishes between em... so do i... ...SteveH http://shazware.com
Steve Hazel wrote:
I thought the whole film had this silent scary "he's a homosexual but doesn't know it" theme...
It does... i guess... until you realize that both characters are the same person. When you're standing in a basement punching your own face into a bloody mess, who's the loser? You. In love with an inflated image of yourself, looking for realization while ignoring reality. The movie is deeper than a lot of people give it credit for. It sets up a false ideal of machismo, strength, revolution against the emasculating system... and then shows how that, too, is meaningless and humiliating.
Steve Hazel wrote:
I agree that tv makes guys look like dorks, but, well, we are dorks pretty often. But then, so are women. And I don't see them making movies about revolution to get back their female-ness.
They do though. They're not good. Avoid "Lifetime".
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Not tryin to be a jerk, but are ya married? You gotta compromise if you wanna stay that way :) Nobody's gonna go along with EVERYthing about another person. Anyways, it ain't depressing. Marriage is wonderful. Just because you go along with something doesn't mean you have to admit defeat. Ain't nothin wrong bout compromising. It usually takes the better man to compromise :) Ok, I'll shut up. I'm startin' to get preachy. Sorry. ...SteveH http://shazware.com
Nope, marriage isn't for me. Much to the dismay of my girlfriend. I guess it come down to what your compromising. Stuff like where to eat dinner, or what side of the room the couch goes on, no problem. Things like: I don't want you to see friend X, we should go to yard sales on Sunday instead of watching football, let's raise the kids Klingon... Compromise on things like these are more or less attempts of your partner to change you. The you they supposedly love in the first place. If the person your with doesn't like who you currently are, i think you/they need to seek the exits. i'll get off the soap box now
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Steve Hazel wrote:
I thought the whole film had this silent scary "he's a homosexual but doesn't know it" theme...
It does... i guess... until you realize that both characters are the same person. When you're standing in a basement punching your own face into a bloody mess, who's the loser? You. In love with an inflated image of yourself, looking for realization while ignoring reality. The movie is deeper than a lot of people give it credit for. It sets up a false ideal of machismo, strength, revolution against the emasculating system... and then shows how that, too, is meaningless and humiliating.
Steve Hazel wrote:
I agree that tv makes guys look like dorks, but, well, we are dorks pretty often. But then, so are women. And I don't see them making movies about revolution to get back their female-ness.
They do though. They're not good. Avoid "Lifetime".
Shog9 wrote:
until you realize that both characters are the same person
They are??? Hmmm, I didn't catch that... I guess I don't pay attention very well... Like most SORRY... Ah yes, I've taken lifetime off the channels to surf. I'd almost forgotten it UNTIL NOW...X| I can handle a 2 vote as long as I can hear Shog9 weigh in on the subject...:cool: (sorry bout butchering the name there)