The glory of Vista
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Christian Graus wrote:
but the screen is all faded out, and I can't interact with the dialog box.
But you can interact with big blue 'Cancel' button, and then interact with the dialog box...
There was NO big blue cancel button. No button of any kind, just a greyed out screen through which I could see my notepad and the 'do you want to save' dialog.
Christian Graus Please read this if you don't understand the answer I've given you "also I don't think "TranslateOneToTwoBillion OneHundredAndFortySevenMillion FourHundredAndEightyThreeThousand SixHundredAndFortySeven()" is a very good choice for a function name" - SpacixOne ( offering help to someone who really needed it ) ( spaces added for the benefit of people running at < 1280x1024 )
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Heh, I installed dual boot Vista/XP two weeks ago. So far I haven't seen any major showstoppers, but there are enough annoyances that make me seriously consider switching back. One consistent gripe is new close application that is not responding dialog. I have Zoom Player installed that crashes periodically when rewinding, I suspect due to faulty ffdshow filter, when it does crash Zoom Player still stays on top and "close application" dialog stays behind so I can't click "close application". Dumb. Right clicking repeatedly on the close option in the taskbar solves the problem, but it is still annoying. Similarly I have an old game I play about once a week and when it crashes it does the same thing. The game freezes, and I can only assume that it crashed because it's not responding, of course the close application dialog never comes up and I have to alt-tab to it to force close the game. At least in XP it would throw me back into desktop. It's kind of amazing how small things like that can completely determine the image of a product. As an example before SP1 when you would remote on Vista to XP it would always warn you that you are connecting to previous version and that security may be compromised, so every single time you remote you would have to click YES, plus Vista additionally provided its own child-like interface for asking password for remote session. Very annoying. SP1 added checkbox to "never ask again" and reverted to old traditional way of asking for username/password and suddenly remote is usable again. Small things like that play a huge role in accepting a product. That's where the Vista has failed. It's not the drivers, the driver support will improve later, it's not UAC because it can be disabled. It's small usability features that kill the experience. Like Vista explorer that forgets folder setting, or lack of "up one folder" button, using small triangles instead of dotted lines connecting folders, or complete inability to customize font and smoothing options for tree/detail pane view. It all adds up.
Don't forget, if you have two explorer windows open in the same folder, and try to rename a file, it will confirm twice that you want to do it, then tell you you cannot.
Christian Graus Please read this if you don't understand the answer I've given you "also I don't think "TranslateOneToTwoBillion OneHundredAndFortySevenMillion FourHundredAndEightyThreeThousand SixHundredAndFortySeven()" is a very good choice for a function name" - SpacixOne ( offering help to someone who really needed it ) ( spaces added for the benefit of people running at < 1280x1024 )
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There was NO big blue cancel button. No button of any kind, just a greyed out screen through which I could see my notepad and the 'do you want to save' dialog.
Christian Graus Please read this if you don't understand the answer I've given you "also I don't think "TranslateOneToTwoBillion OneHundredAndFortySevenMillion FourHundredAndEightyThreeThousand SixHundredAndFortySeven()" is a very good choice for a function name" - SpacixOne ( offering help to someone who really needed it ) ( spaces added for the benefit of people running at < 1280x1024 )
I just tried it here, and that's exactly what I got. A red button for 'shutdown now' and a blue one for 'cancel'.
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I just tried it here, and that's exactly what I got. A red button for 'shutdown now' and a blue one for 'cancel'.
OK - well, I got neither. The showing of the 'do you want to save' dialog seemed to create a loop of confusion that I could not get out of.
Christian Graus Please read this if you don't understand the answer I've given you "also I don't think "TranslateOneToTwoBillion OneHundredAndFortySevenMillion FourHundredAndEightyThreeThousand SixHundredAndFortySeven()" is a very good choice for a function name" - SpacixOne ( offering help to someone who really needed it ) ( spaces added for the benefit of people running at < 1280x1024 )
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So, last night for the first time, I tried to close Vista when I had a text file open. I often open notepad and type notes, then save them. So, Vista comes up with a 'do you want to save this file' dialog, but the screen is all faded out, and I can't interact with the dialog box. I was able to alt/tab to go between open programs, but could not gain access to my text file. After a half hour, I gave up and forced a power down. I lost my notes.
Christian Graus Please read this if you don't understand the answer I've given you "also I don't think "TranslateOneToTwoBillion OneHundredAndFortySevenMillion FourHundredAndEightyThreeThousand SixHundredAndFortySeven()" is a very good choice for a function name" - SpacixOne ( offering help to someone who really needed it ) ( spaces added for the benefit of people running at < 1280x1024 )
I recall having this happen with XP. (And then you have Visual Studio which just plain closes if you don't get to the "Yes" button fast enough.)
Anyone who thinks he has a better idea of what's good for people than people do is a swine. - P.J. O'Rourke
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The system is dual boot. RIght now I am away from home, I need Vista for VS2008, I am on the notebook but on XP right now.
Christian Graus Please read this if you don't understand the answer I've given you "also I don't think "TranslateOneToTwoBillion OneHundredAndFortySevenMillion FourHundredAndEightyThreeThousand SixHundredAndFortySeven()" is a very good choice for a function name" - SpacixOne ( offering help to someone who really needed it ) ( spaces added for the benefit of people running at < 1280x1024 )
Christian Graus wrote:
The system is dual boot.
Ah! that :^) I also installed that thing in dual boot when asked for a test last year. I cannot remember the last time I touched it...hell the very first day IE stopped responding. Best regard, Paul.
Jesus Christ is LOVE! Please tell somebody.
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So, last night for the first time, I tried to close Vista when I had a text file open. I often open notepad and type notes, then save them. So, Vista comes up with a 'do you want to save this file' dialog, but the screen is all faded out, and I can't interact with the dialog box. I was able to alt/tab to go between open programs, but could not gain access to my text file. After a half hour, I gave up and forced a power down. I lost my notes.
Christian Graus Please read this if you don't understand the answer I've given you "also I don't think "TranslateOneToTwoBillion OneHundredAndFortySevenMillion FourHundredAndEightyThreeThousand SixHundredAndFortySeven()" is a very good choice for a function name" - SpacixOne ( offering help to someone who really needed it ) ( spaces added for the benefit of people running at < 1280x1024 )
CG, please stop posting what are obviously hardware problems as attacks on Vista. If your video drivers had supported the required
IOCTL_SHOW_MESSAGE_ABOVE_GREY_SCREEN_OF_DEATHcommand, then all would have been fine.Citizen 20.1.01
'The question is,' said Humpty Dumpty, 'which is to be master - that's all.'
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CG, please stop posting what are obviously hardware problems as attacks on Vista. If your video drivers had supported the required
IOCTL_SHOW_MESSAGE_ABOVE_GREY_SCREEN_OF_DEATHcommand, then all would have been fine.Citizen 20.1.01
'The question is,' said Humpty Dumpty, 'which is to be master - that's all.'
Funny you mention that, but the fan on my new notebook is making a rattling sound every hour or so. Could be related.....
Christian Graus Please read this if you don't understand the answer I've given you "also I don't think "TranslateOneToTwoBillion OneHundredAndFortySevenMillion FourHundredAndEightyThreeThousand SixHundredAndFortySeven()" is a very good choice for a function name" - SpacixOne ( offering help to someone who really needed it ) ( spaces added for the benefit of people running at < 1280x1024 )
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So, last night for the first time, I tried to close Vista when I had a text file open. I often open notepad and type notes, then save them. So, Vista comes up with a 'do you want to save this file' dialog, but the screen is all faded out, and I can't interact with the dialog box. I was able to alt/tab to go between open programs, but could not gain access to my text file. After a half hour, I gave up and forced a power down. I lost my notes.
Christian Graus Please read this if you don't understand the answer I've given you "also I don't think "TranslateOneToTwoBillion OneHundredAndFortySevenMillion FourHundredAndEightyThreeThousand SixHundredAndFortySeven()" is a very good choice for a function name" - SpacixOne ( offering help to someone who really needed it ) ( spaces added for the benefit of people running at < 1280x1024 )
God what are people's problems with Vista? :suss: I've been running it for a year non-stop now and haven't had an issue with it at all. In fact it's been running sweeter than XP ever did. Hasn't slowed down anything like XP used to either. One machine is an x86 laptop and the other was a home built x64 machine and both are running very sweetly indeed. Although the desktop's been switched over to Windows Server 2003 temporarily while I'm away at Uni.
I doubt it. If it isn't intuitive then we need to fix it. - Chris Maunder
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So, last night for the first time, I tried to close Vista when I had a text file open. I often open notepad and type notes, then save them. So, Vista comes up with a 'do you want to save this file' dialog, but the screen is all faded out, and I can't interact with the dialog box. I was able to alt/tab to go between open programs, but could not gain access to my text file. After a half hour, I gave up and forced a power down. I lost my notes.
Christian Graus Please read this if you don't understand the answer I've given you "also I don't think "TranslateOneToTwoBillion OneHundredAndFortySevenMillion FourHundredAndEightyThreeThousand SixHundredAndFortySeven()" is a very good choice for a function name" - SpacixOne ( offering help to someone who really needed it ) ( spaces added for the benefit of people running at < 1280x1024 )
Christian, you really ought to blog about these adventures you have with Vista. I was annoyed by it several times but nowhere near what you're going through. Think on it.
"Every time Lotus Notes starts up, somewhere a puppy, a kitten, a lamb, and a baby seal are killed. Lotus Notes is a conspiracy by the forces of Satan to drive us over the brink into madness. The CRC-32 for each file in the installation includes the numbers 666." Gary Wheeler "You're an idiot." John Simmons, THE Outlaw programmer "I realised that all of my best anecdotes started with "So there we were, pissed". Pete O'Hanlon
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Funny you mention that, but the fan on my new notebook is making a rattling sound every hour or so. Could be related.....
Christian Graus Please read this if you don't understand the answer I've given you "also I don't think "TranslateOneToTwoBillion OneHundredAndFortySevenMillion FourHundredAndEightyThreeThousand SixHundredAndFortySeven()" is a very good choice for a function name" - SpacixOne ( offering help to someone who really needed it ) ( spaces added for the benefit of people running at < 1280x1024 )
Christian Graus wrote:
Could be related...
Oh, totally! Vista hates annoying noises, and will passive-aggressively exact revenge upon you if it is subjected to them. Along those lines, don't ever play any of that heavy-metal rocks music around a Vista computer; instead, try some soothing recordings of whale song, or perhaps a bit of Phillip Glass...
Citizen 20.1.01
'The question is,' said Humpty Dumpty, 'which is to be master - that's all.'
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God what are people's problems with Vista? :suss: I've been running it for a year non-stop now and haven't had an issue with it at all. In fact it's been running sweeter than XP ever did. Hasn't slowed down anything like XP used to either. One machine is an x86 laptop and the other was a home built x64 machine and both are running very sweetly indeed. Although the desktop's been switched over to Windows Server 2003 temporarily while I'm away at Uni.
I doubt it. If it isn't intuitive then we need to fix it. - Chris Maunder
Ed.Poore wrote:
God what are people's problems with Vista?
Seems that Christian did a pretty good job of explaining his problem. No?
Ed.Poore wrote:
I've been running it for a year non-stop now and haven't had an issue with it at all.
Glad to hear it, but if you want to progress as a developer you might want to consider the possibility that there are other people in the world whose experiences differ from your own.
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Christian Graus wrote:
The system is dual boot.
Ah! that :^) I also installed that thing in dual boot when asked for a test last year. I cannot remember the last time I touched it...hell the very first day IE stopped responding. Best regard, Paul.
Jesus Christ is LOVE! Please tell somebody.
Why do you need vista for VS2008? Don't have it installed under XP?
Todd Smith
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John Simmons / outlaw programmer wrote:
I took the original drive out and put it in the closet...
I can't wait to hear what happens when it comes out.
"Love people and use things, not love things and use people." - Unknown
"To have a respect for ourselves guides our morals; to have deference for others governs our manners." - Laurence Sterne
Damn that kid-sister rule! :laugh:
Software Zen:
delete this; -
God what are people's problems with Vista? :suss: I've been running it for a year non-stop now and haven't had an issue with it at all. In fact it's been running sweeter than XP ever did. Hasn't slowed down anything like XP used to either. One machine is an x86 laptop and the other was a home built x64 machine and both are running very sweetly indeed. Although the desktop's been switched over to Windows Server 2003 temporarily while I'm away at Uni.
I doubt it. If it isn't intuitive then we need to fix it. - Chris Maunder
Back in the day, PC Magazine columnist / troll John C. Dvorak wrote a column about the people he encountered who never experienced any problems with Windows 95 (or maybe 3.1, hard to remember now). "Perfect Dog Syndrome", he called it, comparing it to the occasional dog you'll see waiting patiently for its owner outside of a shop or restaurant, with no leash, no running after passing cars or barking at passers-by... in short, a perfect dog. Of course, any dog he'd ever owned would run amok in that situation... I recall this column, because i really like the comparison. Most software can be a "perfect dog", if it's treated right, in the right conditions. This fact does not help the rest of us though. Given the choice, we're better off not owning dogs...
Citizen 20.1.01
'The question is,' said Humpty Dumpty, 'which is to be master - that's all.'
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Back in the day, PC Magazine columnist / troll John C. Dvorak wrote a column about the people he encountered who never experienced any problems with Windows 95 (or maybe 3.1, hard to remember now). "Perfect Dog Syndrome", he called it, comparing it to the occasional dog you'll see waiting patiently for its owner outside of a shop or restaurant, with no leash, no running after passing cars or barking at passers-by... in short, a perfect dog. Of course, any dog he'd ever owned would run amok in that situation... I recall this column, because i really like the comparison. Most software can be a "perfect dog", if it's treated right, in the right conditions. This fact does not help the rest of us though. Given the choice, we're better off not owning dogs...
Citizen 20.1.01
'The question is,' said Humpty Dumpty, 'which is to be master - that's all.'
Well that explains it! My lab is exactly like that owner's dog. There aren't many dogs that I've come across who you give a biscuit to and tell her to stop and wait and she'll just sit there with the biscuit half-chewed until you say she can start again. Mean I know but shows the love she has for us to trust us with that. The two pups on the other hand only pay that much attention when you have a gun in your hand (no, not threatening them, it means we're out hunting and they'll do as their told). Otherwise they're no-where near as good as mummy dog but then when the pups are near by she does tend to think she's above it all, get her alone and she'll do anything you say.
I doubt it. If it isn't intuitive then we need to fix it. - Chris Maunder
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Heh, I installed dual boot Vista/XP two weeks ago. So far I haven't seen any major showstoppers, but there are enough annoyances that make me seriously consider switching back. One consistent gripe is new close application that is not responding dialog. I have Zoom Player installed that crashes periodically when rewinding, I suspect due to faulty ffdshow filter, when it does crash Zoom Player still stays on top and "close application" dialog stays behind so I can't click "close application". Dumb. Right clicking repeatedly on the close option in the taskbar solves the problem, but it is still annoying. Similarly I have an old game I play about once a week and when it crashes it does the same thing. The game freezes, and I can only assume that it crashed because it's not responding, of course the close application dialog never comes up and I have to alt-tab to it to force close the game. At least in XP it would throw me back into desktop. It's kind of amazing how small things like that can completely determine the image of a product. As an example before SP1 when you would remote on Vista to XP it would always warn you that you are connecting to previous version and that security may be compromised, so every single time you remote you would have to click YES, plus Vista additionally provided its own child-like interface for asking password for remote session. Very annoying. SP1 added checkbox to "never ask again" and reverted to old traditional way of asking for username/password and suddenly remote is usable again. Small things like that play a huge role in accepting a product. That's where the Vista has failed. It's not the drivers, the driver support will improve later, it's not UAC because it can be disabled. It's small usability features that kill the experience. Like Vista explorer that forgets folder setting, or lack of "up one folder" button, using small triangles instead of dotted lines connecting folders, or complete inability to customize font and smoothing options for tree/detail pane view. It all adds up.
I *so* agree. BTW, in case you don't know, Alt + Up arrow takes you one folder up.
Cheers, Vikram.
The hands that help are holier than the lips that pray.
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So, last night for the first time, I tried to close Vista when I had a text file open. I often open notepad and type notes, then save them. So, Vista comes up with a 'do you want to save this file' dialog, but the screen is all faded out, and I can't interact with the dialog box. I was able to alt/tab to go between open programs, but could not gain access to my text file. After a half hour, I gave up and forced a power down. I lost my notes.
Christian Graus Please read this if you don't understand the answer I've given you "also I don't think "TranslateOneToTwoBillion OneHundredAndFortySevenMillion FourHundredAndEightyThreeThousand SixHundredAndFortySeven()" is a very good choice for a function name" - SpacixOne ( offering help to someone who really needed it ) ( spaces added for the benefit of people running at < 1280x1024 )
I have had something like that happen a couple of times, mostly when closing VS2008. It appears that another dialog has focus but is hidden. In VS one time, I believe it happened when I was opening a web site project and it prompted for user name / password, but the window never was shown, was hidden somehow and cycling windows did nto help. After an issue like that, you might check the application and system error logs to see if any error was generated (if it was an error duing in the background with a hidden popup it may have caused the issue). Window priority and order sometimes can get hung, but it has only happen 4-6 times since I started using Vista, back at Vista 64 Beta. Not bad for that length of time.
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