Frustated programmers
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5fingers wrote:
They feel cheated and used up
Because they are. The job is amazingly stressful, and it doesn't help that not only do requirements change constantly management expects original deadlines to be met even when they've altered every aspect of every project. Often one is stuck in a morass of half-done projects and one feels like one is both underpaid and simultaneously like everything one does gets torn up and thrown away as soon as a project is over. Add to that the "what have you done for me lately?" attitude from management and its a wonder a programmer isn't ready to pop off at a moment's notice. And the sarcasm when a manager isn't satisfied rivals a teenager. And the manager reaches into her desk and pulls out another snide "any programmer worth his salt could do ..." And the buzzwords; meaningless scrabble attempts forcing their way into meetings that go on and on. It's an existential nightmare with Orwell humming and rocking in the background. Not enough downtime. Not enough in the world, sometimes.
_____________________________ Give a man a mug, he drinks for a day. Teach a man to mug...
It sounds like the programming profession, as a whole, could learn a lot about management training from the Postal Service. Inexperienced managers can benefit a lot from learning that guns are plentiful, ammunition is cheap, and that having pretty, blued-steel objects pressed gently into one's soft palate can be both uncomfortable and convincing.
Will Rogers never met me.
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It's because we see the success of other people, and jealousy rears it's ugly head. We think we can get rich quick in this industry, and don't see the process the successful ones went through to get where they are, they just see the end product. Not everyone can be Mark Zuckerberg (or whoever created facebook ;-)) or the Dynamic Google Duo.
- S 50 cups of coffee and you know it's on! Code, follow, or get out of the way.
Steve Echols wrote:
Mark Zuckerberg (or whoever created facebook ;-)
Who do you think made Facebook?
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That only appears to be so because we are like Don Quijote, riding against windmills all day. The names of some of the windmills are 'manager', 'client', 'user', 'support' and endless more of them. When there is no windmill in the way, we are bored to death and complain about that :)
"I just exchanged opinions with my boss. I went in with mine and came out with his." - me, 2011 ---
I am endeavoring, Madam, to construct a mnemonic memory circuit using stone knives and bearskins - Mr. Spock 1935 and me 2011CDP1802 wrote:
'manager', 'client', 'user', 'support'
I think you misspelled "code".
FILETIME to time_t
| FoldWithUs! | sighist | WhoIncludes - Analyzing C++ include file hierarchy -
It sounds like the programming profession, as a whole, could learn a lot about management training from the Postal Service. Inexperienced managers can benefit a lot from learning that guns are plentiful, ammunition is cheap, and that having pretty, blued-steel objects pressed gently into one's soft palate can be both uncomfortable and convincing.
Will Rogers never met me.
Too true. Nobody says "Some guy went all systems analyst on the boss today. Cops were everywhere." Folks are very law abiding. Apparently the movies have lied to me. :((
_____________________________ Give a man a mug, he drinks for a day. Teach a man to mug...
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Why is it that most programmers i meet are a frustrated bunch of people. They feel cheated and used up.:confused:
I only read newbie introductory dummy books.
I am not frustrated or used up thankyou. :) I still like writing complex code, never have a problem meeting deadlines, and completely understand that the customer/marketing pays my salary. I have little stress, work the hours I want, drink coffe and listen to music all day. Its creative, challenging, and gives a very quick feedback in terms of idea->implementation->satisfaction. Name one other job as good as software engineering!
Dr D Evans "The whole idea that carbon dioxide is the main cause of the recent global warming is based on a guess that was proved false by empirical evidence during the 1990s" financialpost
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5fingers wrote:
Why is it that most programmers i meet are a frustrated bunch of people.
Because they don't talk honestly and openly to their managers enough, so their managers are left with having to guess at their needs. Seriously. If you're unhappy, go and talk with your manager -- don't shout about "what he did!"/"what they did!"; don't get all wired up; just say, in simple, unemotional language, "This is what makes me unhappy here" and "This is what would make me happier". People can't try to fix a problem if they don't know what the problem is. Let the dog see the rabbit.
I wanna be a eunuchs developer! Pass me a bread knife!
I second that. After my time in the army I decided for myself to never work on a job that I don't like. Until now I only quited once - and I'm willing to do so again if the job becomes something I don't want it to be. regards Torsten
I never finish anyth...
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CDP1802 wrote:
'manager', 'client', 'user', 'support'
I think you misspelled "code".
FILETIME to time_t
| FoldWithUs! | sighist | WhoIncludes - Analyzing C++ include file hierarchyOr more general: Entropy. We fight our battles against entropy. Down with chaos and its servants! :)
"I just exchanged opinions with my boss. I went in with mine and came out with his." - me, 2011 ---
I am endeavoring, Madam, to construct a mnemonic memory circuit using stone knives and bearskins - Mr. Spock 1935 and me 2011 -
Why is it that most programmers i meet are a frustrated bunch of people. They feel cheated and used up.:confused:
I only read newbie introductory dummy books.
I'm frustrated because I am confined to system test these days - except for the small amount I do on my own time to preserve my sanity.
Ger
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Why is it that most programmers i meet are a frustrated bunch of people. They feel cheated and used up.:confused:
I only read newbie introductory dummy books.
5fingers wrote:
Why is it that most programmers i meet are a frustrated bunch of people.
Because people expect us to pull miracles out of are asses on a daily basis.
-- ** You don't hire a handyman to build a house, you hire a carpenter. ** Jack of all trades and master of none.
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I am not frustrated or used up thankyou. :) I still like writing complex code, never have a problem meeting deadlines, and completely understand that the customer/marketing pays my salary. I have little stress, work the hours I want, drink coffe and listen to music all day. Its creative, challenging, and gives a very quick feedback in terms of idea->implementation->satisfaction. Name one other job as good as software engineering!
Dr D Evans "The whole idea that carbon dioxide is the main cause of the recent global warming is based on a guess that was proved false by empirical evidence during the 1990s" financialpost
We all no you live the perfect life fat body, you don't have to rub it in our faces. You kernel developer you. ;)
-- ** You don't hire a handyman to build a house, you hire a carpenter. ** Jack of all trades and master of none.
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I am not frustrated or used up thankyou. :) I still like writing complex code, never have a problem meeting deadlines, and completely understand that the customer/marketing pays my salary. I have little stress, work the hours I want, drink coffe and listen to music all day. Its creative, challenging, and gives a very quick feedback in terms of idea->implementation->satisfaction. Name one other job as good as software engineering!
Dr D Evans "The whole idea that carbon dioxide is the main cause of the recent global warming is based on a guess that was proved false by empirical evidence during the 1990s" financialpost
fat_boy wrote:
Name one other job as good as software engineering!
Reserve goalkeeper. You get paid a few thousand pounds a week, for that you are expected to put in a few hours gentle training, play the odd reserve match that nobody cares about the result of, and if you are not at a top club can be fairly safe in the knowledge that if anything does actually go wrong your club will simply loan someone else in to play.
Every man can tell how many goats or sheep he possesses, but not how many friends.
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Steve Echols wrote:
Mark Zuckerberg (or whoever created facebook ;-)
Who do you think made Facebook?
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Why is it that most programmers i meet are a frustrated bunch of people. They feel cheated and used up.:confused:
I only read newbie introductory dummy books.
Because no hot girls sit beside us and listen as we explain Design Patterns.
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fat_boy wrote:
Name one other job as good as software engineering!
Reserve goalkeeper. You get paid a few thousand pounds a week, for that you are expected to put in a few hours gentle training, play the odd reserve match that nobody cares about the result of, and if you are not at a top club can be fairly safe in the knowledge that if anything does actually go wrong your club will simply loan someone else in to play.
Every man can tell how many goats or sheep he possesses, but not how many friends.
Nope, thats just boring. Plus he has only got a 10 year or so career. I can make almost a few thousand a week and can kep doing so till I am 80! :)
Dr D Evans "The whole idea that carbon dioxide is the main cause of the recent global warming is based on a guess that was proved false by empirical evidence during the 1990s" financialpost
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We all no you live the perfect life fat body, you don't have to rub it in our faces. You kernel developer you. ;)
-- ** You don't hire a handyman to build a house, you hire a carpenter. ** Jack of all trades and master of none.
The nice thing about being in the kernel is that very few can do it and thus one tends to get left alone to get on with it. Managers cant pester you, they are shit scared you will leave (and it took them months to find you to rescue their product from certain death). The probelm is there isnt a lot of demand, and what there is is wide spread, so I work all over europe. Of course thats nice too, get to see lots of paces, but it gets a bit of a pain sometimes. But it pays well, doesnt change (no new technology to learn) and is interesting and very challenging (being so damned complex). Its also nice working with hardware; osciliscopes, logicanalyzers and that kind of thing. Its real engineering, not just coding.
Dr D Evans "The whole idea that carbon dioxide is the main cause of the recent global warming is based on a guess that was proved false by empirical evidence during the 1990s" financialpost
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So you have seen the movie “The Social Network”. I don't know why would someone downvote me for posting that :sigh:
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I am not frustrated or used up thankyou. :) I still like writing complex code, never have a problem meeting deadlines, and completely understand that the customer/marketing pays my salary. I have little stress, work the hours I want, drink coffe and listen to music all day. Its creative, challenging, and gives a very quick feedback in terms of idea->implementation->satisfaction. Name one other job as good as software engineering!
Dr D Evans "The whole idea that carbon dioxide is the main cause of the recent global warming is based on a guess that was proved false by empirical evidence during the 1990s" financialpost
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Why is it that most programmers i meet are a frustrated bunch of people. They feel cheated and used up.:confused:
I only read newbie introductory dummy books.
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I am not frustrated or used up thankyou. :) I still like writing complex code, never have a problem meeting deadlines, and completely understand that the customer/marketing pays my salary. I have little stress, work the hours I want, drink coffe and listen to music all day. Its creative, challenging, and gives a very quick feedback in terms of idea->implementation->satisfaction. Name one other job as good as software engineering!
Dr D Evans "The whole idea that carbon dioxide is the main cause of the recent global warming is based on a guess that was proved false by empirical evidence during the 1990s" financialpost
As a professional group we are often treated no better than plumbers called in for house repairs. We often work with people who do not understand what we are talking about while those same people expect us to come up with "magical" solutions to their ridiculously unfeasible implementation ideas at light-speed with no defects. All this and the fact that no pretty girls sit beside us providing sympathy for our pain... :-)
Steve Naidamast Black Falcon Software, Inc. blackfalconsoftware@ix.netcom.com
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Or more general: Entropy. We fight our battles against entropy. Down with chaos and its servants! :)
"I just exchanged opinions with my boss. I went in with mine and came out with his." - me, 2011 ---
I am endeavoring, Madam, to construct a mnemonic memory circuit using stone knives and bearskins - Mr. Spock 1935 and me 2011
