progress bar - why???
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Hey! Our customer wants a progress bar for the transmission of messages (which is done by the services on the server...). Why do people need progress bars? don't they believe the computer is actually working? I start to hate this stuff. Why do people need indicators for a device running when it is obvious? My wife got a new computer (Dell AllinOne 23") which has a giant, annoying blue light on the power supply plug. My computer has a LED at the WLAN-Device on the backside of the machine. WTF - who cares for a light on the backside of the computer under the table? My NAS is blinking like lightning when one of us is accessing some data. Why? No one even sees this as the NAS is standing in the basement. The light is totally annoying - I don't need to switch lights on in the basement when the NAS is running. My TV has a LED to show that it's on. It usually shows the TV-program too when it's on - so why does it need a light indicating that it's on? My toaster got a LED to show it's on. My mixer has a light to show it's on. Even the fridge has a LED. I'm actually waiting for a lamp with a LED indicating that it's on.
regards Torsten I never finish anyth...
TorstenH. wrote:
My computer has a LED at the WLAN-Device on the backside of the machine. WTF - who cares for a light on the backside of the computer under the table?
You do, if you ever have problems with network connectivity. The LEDs on the NIC don't just show on/off. They cover, connetivity, activity and speed, all of which can be part of a networking issue.
Michael Martin Australia "I controlled my laughter and simple said "No,I am very busy,so I can't write any code for you". The moment they heard this all the smiling face turned into a sad looking face and one of them farted. So I had to leave the place as soon as possible." - Mr.Prakash One Fine Saturday. 24/04/2004
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There is definitely a difference in between a hanging machine and one that is working on something in the background. In fact a task blocking a machine is bad implemented.
regards Torsten I never finish anyth...
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..then the LED doesn't help anyway. Mostly I would find the TV laying on the ground or a broken beer bottle in front of it.
regards Torsten I never finish anyth...
But if the screen was broken (as in not working rather than smashed) and there was no LED you wouldn't know if there was just a power problem or if you needed to throw a beer bottle through it.
Every man can tell how many goats or sheep he possesses, but not how many friends.
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Hey! Our customer wants a progress bar for the transmission of messages (which is done by the services on the server...). Why do people need progress bars? don't they believe the computer is actually working? I start to hate this stuff. Why do people need indicators for a device running when it is obvious? My wife got a new computer (Dell AllinOne 23") which has a giant, annoying blue light on the power supply plug. My computer has a LED at the WLAN-Device on the backside of the machine. WTF - who cares for a light on the backside of the computer under the table? My NAS is blinking like lightning when one of us is accessing some data. Why? No one even sees this as the NAS is standing in the basement. The light is totally annoying - I don't need to switch lights on in the basement when the NAS is running. My TV has a LED to show that it's on. It usually shows the TV-program too when it's on - so why does it need a light indicating that it's on? My toaster got a LED to show it's on. My mixer has a light to show it's on. Even the fridge has a LED. I'm actually waiting for a lamp with a LED indicating that it's on.
regards Torsten I never finish anyth...
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Hey! Our customer wants a progress bar for the transmission of messages (which is done by the services on the server...). Why do people need progress bars? don't they believe the computer is actually working? I start to hate this stuff. Why do people need indicators for a device running when it is obvious? My wife got a new computer (Dell AllinOne 23") which has a giant, annoying blue light on the power supply plug. My computer has a LED at the WLAN-Device on the backside of the machine. WTF - who cares for a light on the backside of the computer under the table? My NAS is blinking like lightning when one of us is accessing some data. Why? No one even sees this as the NAS is standing in the basement. The light is totally annoying - I don't need to switch lights on in the basement when the NAS is running. My TV has a LED to show that it's on. It usually shows the TV-program too when it's on - so why does it need a light indicating that it's on? My toaster got a LED to show it's on. My mixer has a light to show it's on. Even the fridge has a LED. I'm actually waiting for a lamp with a LED indicating that it's on.
regards Torsten I never finish anyth...
TorstenH. wrote:
Why do people need indicators for a device running when it is obvious?
You are a programmer. Your user is most likely not. The customer is always right. The user is always right. Even though we usually don't agree. They buy/use our software. It's their way or the highway. :)
Just along for the ride. "the meat from that butcher is just the dogs danglies, absolutely amazing cuts of beef." - DaveAuld (2011)
"No, that is just the earthly manifestation of the Great God Retardon." - Nagy Vilmos (2011) -
the TV is digital. it says 'no signal' and presents a blue background when there's nothing to show.
regards Torsten I never finish anyth...
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TorstenH. wrote:
Why do people need indicators for a device running when it is obvious?
You are a programmer. Your user is most likely not. The customer is always right. The user is always right. Even though we usually don't agree. They buy/use our software. It's their way or the highway. :)
Just along for the ride. "the meat from that butcher is just the dogs danglies, absolutely amazing cuts of beef." - DaveAuld (2011)
"No, that is just the earthly manifestation of the Great God Retardon." - Nagy Vilmos (2011) -
I purchased a samsung AC[^] for my bedroom a few months back and it had a GIANT led that will be ON as long as the AC is on. Day or night. It was bright enough to annoy the **** out of me enough that I called them up and gave them a profane verbal bashing. They told me that the light indicates that the AC is on, and I told them I'll know the AC is on, because I'm the ****** one who turns it on. And I'll know it isn't working if it is not blowing out cold air, and the room is not chilling up. I asked them to take their junk back, took a refund and installed a Hitachi. The new one as well has a small light, but it hardly is noticeable.
"Real men drive manual transmission" - Rajesh.
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Hey! Our customer wants a progress bar for the transmission of messages (which is done by the services on the server...). Why do people need progress bars? don't they believe the computer is actually working? I start to hate this stuff. Why do people need indicators for a device running when it is obvious? My wife got a new computer (Dell AllinOne 23") which has a giant, annoying blue light on the power supply plug. My computer has a LED at the WLAN-Device on the backside of the machine. WTF - who cares for a light on the backside of the computer under the table? My NAS is blinking like lightning when one of us is accessing some data. Why? No one even sees this as the NAS is standing in the basement. The light is totally annoying - I don't need to switch lights on in the basement when the NAS is running. My TV has a LED to show that it's on. It usually shows the TV-program too when it's on - so why does it need a light indicating that it's on? My toaster got a LED to show it's on. My mixer has a light to show it's on. Even the fridge has a LED. I'm actually waiting for a lamp with a LED indicating that it's on.
regards Torsten I never finish anyth...
It’s a part of action and response. When someone pushes a button real or virtual something is supposed to happen. Flip a light switch, the light should either turn on or off. If it does neither then something is broken. As an experiment a few years ago, I put a big red button in my cube once and it was connected to a counter and it would illuminate a light bulb. In one week the counter was at 34. The second week I disconnected the light bulb, the counter was at 102 by the end of week. Understanding that this was not controlled in any way as to who passed by my cube or any record kept of who pushed the button, however one can easily conclude that the extra counts are due to people repeatedly pushing the button trying to “see” what the button is supposed to do. I even had one person tell me that it was broken. People love blinky lights, wiggly icons and progress bars, there are volumes of books on user interfaces in hardware, software and architectural interfaces that cover this sort of stuff.
It was broke, so I fixed it.
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Hey! Our customer wants a progress bar for the transmission of messages (which is done by the services on the server...). Why do people need progress bars? don't they believe the computer is actually working? I start to hate this stuff. Why do people need indicators for a device running when it is obvious? My wife got a new computer (Dell AllinOne 23") which has a giant, annoying blue light on the power supply plug. My computer has a LED at the WLAN-Device on the backside of the machine. WTF - who cares for a light on the backside of the computer under the table? My NAS is blinking like lightning when one of us is accessing some data. Why? No one even sees this as the NAS is standing in the basement. The light is totally annoying - I don't need to switch lights on in the basement when the NAS is running. My TV has a LED to show that it's on. It usually shows the TV-program too when it's on - so why does it need a light indicating that it's on? My toaster got a LED to show it's on. My mixer has a light to show it's on. Even the fridge has a LED. I'm actually waiting for a lamp with a LED indicating that it's on.
regards Torsten I never finish anyth...
Many years ago when I was patrolling in XMG we had chimps that would give a tone every ten seconds. This was called a confidence beep. It was necessary. In this case 'Chimps[^]' were the RF Jammers for remote IEDs. (XMG was Crossmaglen in Northern Ireland, aka Bandit Country).
------------------------------------ I will never again mention that I was the poster of the One Millionth Lounge Post, nor that it was complete drivel. Dalek Dave CCC Link[^] Trolls[^]
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Not if it is a silent track...
Real men don't use instructions. They are only the manufacturers opinion on how to put the thing together. Manfred R. Bihy: "Looks as if OP is learning resistant."
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Hey! Our customer wants a progress bar for the transmission of messages (which is done by the services on the server...). Why do people need progress bars? don't they believe the computer is actually working? I start to hate this stuff. Why do people need indicators for a device running when it is obvious? My wife got a new computer (Dell AllinOne 23") which has a giant, annoying blue light on the power supply plug. My computer has a LED at the WLAN-Device on the backside of the machine. WTF - who cares for a light on the backside of the computer under the table? My NAS is blinking like lightning when one of us is accessing some data. Why? No one even sees this as the NAS is standing in the basement. The light is totally annoying - I don't need to switch lights on in the basement when the NAS is running. My TV has a LED to show that it's on. It usually shows the TV-program too when it's on - so why does it need a light indicating that it's on? My toaster got a LED to show it's on. My mixer has a light to show it's on. Even the fridge has a LED. I'm actually waiting for a lamp with a LED indicating that it's on.
regards Torsten I never finish anyth...
Reminds me of that Simpsons when Homer became an inventor. He invented the "Everythings OK Alarm." Homer - "THIS ALARM..." Alarm - "BEEEEEP BEEEP" Homer - "WILL CONTINUE..." Alarm - "BEEEEEP BEEEP" Homer - "TO GO OFF..." Alarm - "BEEEEEP BEEEP" Homer - "AS LONG AS..." Alarm - "BEEEEEP BEEEP" Homer - "EVERYTHING..." Alarm - "BEEEEEP BEEEP" Homer - "IS OK!" ALARM - "BEEEEEP BEEEP" But I agree with most people here. Indicators are useful. Some may seem pointless to you. But that is likely because you have yet had to troubleshoot it not working. I do understand your point though. In many cases it is highly ineffective to add progress bars as it hurts the performance. I had a system once that did a lot of number crunching. At my fault the algorithm was not ideal at first and the users complained about responce time and wanted a progress bar. So I added it (just want to point out at this point I was very much Jr. at this time). Eventually I caught the flaw in my algorithm and adjusted it. Much faster but I remember thinking, what the heck it still seems kinda slow. Caught rid of the progress bar and blamo it was not even noticable. Lesson learned: Give the EUs what they need for updating, but always go back and double check if it is still needed. This goes for more than just the progress bar. Running out of realstate space. "What the heck is this checkbox?". Hmmm looks like it some some business logic but is eventually dropped. A little digging shows it 'was' a requirement but was changed to be a enum combo selector else where on the UI.
Computers have been intelligent for a long time now. It just so happens that the program writers are about as effective as a room full of monkeys trying to crank out a copy of Hamlet.
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Hey! Our customer wants a progress bar for the transmission of messages (which is done by the services on the server...). Why do people need progress bars? don't they believe the computer is actually working? I start to hate this stuff. Why do people need indicators for a device running when it is obvious? My wife got a new computer (Dell AllinOne 23") which has a giant, annoying blue light on the power supply plug. My computer has a LED at the WLAN-Device on the backside of the machine. WTF - who cares for a light on the backside of the computer under the table? My NAS is blinking like lightning when one of us is accessing some data. Why? No one even sees this as the NAS is standing in the basement. The light is totally annoying - I don't need to switch lights on in the basement when the NAS is running. My TV has a LED to show that it's on. It usually shows the TV-program too when it's on - so why does it need a light indicating that it's on? My toaster got a LED to show it's on. My mixer has a light to show it's on. Even the fridge has a LED. I'm actually waiting for a lamp with a LED indicating that it's on.
regards Torsten I never finish anyth...
There's so many things that can go wrong when software is involved, a simple LED isn't sufficient to indicate the current state. E. g. if the LED isn't on, it might mean any of the following: - there's nothing to transfer (i. e. all is well) - the transfer has already completed (and it was so fast you missed out on the 1/100th second it was actually on) - the LED is defective - the software isn't properly activating the LED, but otherwise working fine - the software is broken - the hardware is broken - the network is broken - the server isn't responding - you're blind :cool: OTOH is the LED is on, it might mean - transferring (i. e. all is well) - hanging - the LED is defective - the software isn't properly deactivating the LED, but otherwise working fine - the software is broken - the hardware is broken - the network is broken - the server isn't responding A progress bar can offer a lot more information: if it keeps updating, this indicates: - the task is, in fact, progressing - in particular it doesn't hang, even if it is taking longer than you expected - your software, hardware, and network is fine - server is working as well - you get a rough estimate of how long it will take to finish (provided the bar is non-cyclic) It is much more unlikely that there is a problem with the progress bar when it does indicate progress. OTOH if it doesn't progress, it's not so much different from the LED ;)
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Reminds me of that Simpsons when Homer became an inventor. He invented the "Everythings OK Alarm." Homer - "THIS ALARM..." Alarm - "BEEEEEP BEEEP" Homer - "WILL CONTINUE..." Alarm - "BEEEEEP BEEEP" Homer - "TO GO OFF..." Alarm - "BEEEEEP BEEEP" Homer - "AS LONG AS..." Alarm - "BEEEEEP BEEEP" Homer - "EVERYTHING..." Alarm - "BEEEEEP BEEEP" Homer - "IS OK!" ALARM - "BEEEEEP BEEEP" But I agree with most people here. Indicators are useful. Some may seem pointless to you. But that is likely because you have yet had to troubleshoot it not working. I do understand your point though. In many cases it is highly ineffective to add progress bars as it hurts the performance. I had a system once that did a lot of number crunching. At my fault the algorithm was not ideal at first and the users complained about responce time and wanted a progress bar. So I added it (just want to point out at this point I was very much Jr. at this time). Eventually I caught the flaw in my algorithm and adjusted it. Much faster but I remember thinking, what the heck it still seems kinda slow. Caught rid of the progress bar and blamo it was not even noticable. Lesson learned: Give the EUs what they need for updating, but always go back and double check if it is still needed. This goes for more than just the progress bar. Running out of realstate space. "What the heck is this checkbox?". Hmmm looks like it some some business logic but is eventually dropped. A little digging shows it 'was' a requirement but was changed to be a enum combo selector else where on the UI.
Computers have been intelligent for a long time now. It just so happens that the program writers are about as effective as a room full of monkeys trying to crank out a copy of Hamlet.
Collin Jasnoch wrote:
I had a system once that did a lot of number crunching. At my fault the algorithm was not ideal at first and the users complained about responce time and wanted a progress bar.
A previous system I worked on had a process or report that took about 10 minutes to run. Had done for years. We then got it down to under a minute. Users complained. They liked to be able to kick it off running then go outside for a cigarette while it did so. We had stolen a smoke break from them.
Every man can tell how many goats or sheep he possesses, but not how many friends.
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You regularly change the volume when listening to blank CDs do you?
============================== Nothing to say.
No, but if it is a silent track (and they do exist : 4'33"[^] and "Three Minutes of Silence" - can't find a reference quickly) you might not realize and assume the volume is not up high enough.
Real men don't use instructions. They are only the manufacturers opinion on how to put the thing together. Manfred R. Bihy: "Looks as if OP is learning resistant."
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The customer is not always right. The customer is able to ask for wired stuff that doesn't make sense. Check this: http://clientsfromhell.net/[^] - the link was posted today by someone here. Nice one.
regards Torsten I never finish anyth...
My take on this is: The customer is always right. If you want to keep them as a customer then do it their way. If you don't want to do it their way, then drop them as a client. If I want to keep my customer's business and they want their forms to be hot pink, then guess what? Pink it is. Progress bars galore. Stupid shite will be the order of the day.
Just along for the ride. "the meat from that butcher is just the dogs danglies, absolutely amazing cuts of beef." - DaveAuld (2011)
"No, that is just the earthly manifestation of the Great God Retardon." - Nagy Vilmos (2011) -
No, but if it is a silent track (and they do exist : 4'33"[^] and "Three Minutes of Silence" - can't find a reference quickly) you might not realize and assume the volume is not up high enough.
Real men don't use instructions. They are only the manufacturers opinion on how to put the thing together. Manfred R. Bihy: "Looks as if OP is learning resistant."
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My take on this is: The customer is always right. If you want to keep them as a customer then do it their way. If you don't want to do it their way, then drop them as a client. If I want to keep my customer's business and they want their forms to be hot pink, then guess what? Pink it is. Progress bars galore. Stupid shite will be the order of the day.
Just along for the ride. "the meat from that butcher is just the dogs danglies, absolutely amazing cuts of beef." - DaveAuld (2011)
"No, that is just the earthly manifestation of the Great God Retardon." - Nagy Vilmos (2011) -
Is it just me who has to have the volume on an even number?
Every man can tell how many goats or sheep he possesses, but not how many friends.
It's just you. I think. Damnit, I'll have to look now!:~
Real men don't use instructions. They are only the manufacturers opinion on how to put the thing together. Manfred R. Bihy: "Looks as if OP is learning resistant."
