Following on form Daves harrowing account in the Lounge...
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That does not sound like a lot! Although I live in a large town, Cambridge, and since I moved here in 1995 there have been many more houses built and it is definitely more crowded than it was 16 years ago - probably to do with people gravitating towards where the money is...
Continuous effort - not strength or intelligence - is the key to unlocking our potential.(Winston Churchill)
Cambridge has become a kind of IT center for the UK, so it has seen growth. But, do not forget, as I showed earlier, the birth rate in the UK has been declining steadilly for many decades. The only population growth over this time comes from imigration.
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So you dont have any figures then to back up your assertion. Untill you can, I can not accept what you say as true.
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Figures and reports are all over the internet. It isn't important enough to me to spend time pulling them together into a neat summary for you. If you want to just believe something rather than actually looking up what has been going on then that effects me not one bit. Numbers of children prison has actually gone down a lot in the last 2 years but only because they have run out of money. The vast majority of children in prison were convicted of non-violent crimes anyway.
Every man can tell how many goats or sheep he possesses, but not how many friends.
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Cambridge has become a kind of IT center for the UK, so it has seen growth. But, do not forget, as I showed earlier, the birth rate in the UK has been declining steadilly for many decades. The only population growth over this time comes from imigration.
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Erudite__Eric wrote:
The only population growth over this time comes from imigration.
As of 2009: UK birth rate - 10.65 / 1000 UK death rate = 10.02 / 1000 I know maths is hard, but ...
Panic, Chaos, Destruction. My work here is done. Drink. Get drunk. Fall over - P O'H OK, I will win to day or my name isn't Ethel Crudacre! - DD Ethel Crudacre I cannot live by bread alone. Bacon and ketchup are needed as well. - Trollslayer Have a bit more patience with newbies. Of course some of them act dumb - they're often *students*, for heaven's sake - Terry Pratchett
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Figures and reports are all over the internet. It isn't important enough to me to spend time pulling them together into a neat summary for you. If you want to just believe something rather than actually looking up what has been going on then that effects me not one bit. Numbers of children prison has actually gone down a lot in the last 2 years but only because they have run out of money. The vast majority of children in prison were convicted of non-violent crimes anyway.
Every man can tell how many goats or sheep he possesses, but not how many friends.
This is sounding more and more like an opinion you hold due to something you heard that has no basis in fact. We know that the borstals were shut, yet you say there are more kids in detendtion than before. Can you see where I have a problem believing you? In any case, lets say you are right, that there are more under 16s in custody today than in the 90s, how does this compare with the 70s since it is well before the last ten years that uncontrolable kids became a problem in spociety.
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Erudite__Eric wrote:
The only population growth over this time comes from imigration.
As of 2009: UK birth rate - 10.65 / 1000 UK death rate = 10.02 / 1000 I know maths is hard, but ...
Panic, Chaos, Destruction. My work here is done. Drink. Get drunk. Fall over - P O'H OK, I will win to day or my name isn't Ethel Crudacre! - DD Ethel Crudacre I cannot live by bread alone. Bacon and ketchup are needed as well. - Trollslayer Have a bit more patience with newbies. Of course some of them act dumb - they're often *students*, for heaven's sake - Terry Pratchett
Nagy Vilmos wrote:
I know maths is hard, but ...
Man, you rerally do like it simple dont you. Births by native British people are declining to the point of non replacement. Meanwhile the population has increased due to immigration, immigrants who happen to die in Britain, unsurprisingly, and happen to have more children than British people. And also something like 0.5 million British people live in France (let alone Spain and elsewhere). Time to redo your maths. :laugh:
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wizardzz wrote:
This is not the exact case, but it happens all the time:
http://archive.chicagobreakingnews.com/2010/08/officer-struck-by-a-vehicle-in-south-chicago-neighborhood.html[^]I love google map's street view, I can see exactly the intersection where it happened. It even has an elevated train, very cool. I've been invited to visit our office in Chicago this year but there seems to always be a reason to keep putting it off.
_Josh_ wrote:
I've been invited to visit our office in Chicago this year but there seems to always be a reason to keep putting it off.
Come during the summer months, and only if the Chicago office is in the city. People use Chicago as a term to include the suburbs to nonnatives, and the 'burbs are mostly an entertainment and culinary wasteland.
"I have a theory that the truth is never told during the nine-to-five hours. " — Hunter S. Thompson My comedy.
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This is sounding more and more like an opinion you hold due to something you heard that has no basis in fact. We know that the borstals were shut, yet you say there are more kids in detendtion than before. Can you see where I have a problem believing you? In any case, lets say you are right, that there are more under 16s in custody today than in the 90s, how does this compare with the 70s since it is well before the last ten years that uncontrolable kids became a problem in spociety.
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Erudite__Eric wrote:
We know that the borstals were shut, yet you say there are more kids in detendtion than before.
They didn't just shit the borstals down, kick everyone and out and stop locking anymore up you know, they just renamed them or created new institutions. The names have changed a number of times since then too. I have been in 3 of them myself for various different reasons and live quite close to one now. In fact I watched the police beating up a stocky ginger kid who had escaped from it just last week.
Every man can tell how many goats or sheep he possesses, but not how many friends.
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Erudite__Eric wrote:
We know that the borstals were shut, yet you say there are more kids in detendtion than before.
They didn't just shit the borstals down, kick everyone and out and stop locking anymore up you know, they just renamed them or created new institutions. The names have changed a number of times since then too. I have been in 3 of them myself for various different reasons and live quite close to one now. In fact I watched the police beating up a stocky ginger kid who had escaped from it just last week.
Every man can tell how many goats or sheep he possesses, but not how many friends.
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These are the kind of people he encountered: Man dragged off scooter by mob in Croydon riot [^] I can hear ll the usual shouts fomr the liberals of 'oh, poor them, they are underprivaledged, society is unequal' and all that crap. Here is the proof it is crap: An aspiring ballerina was among a group of girls caught on CCTV standing outside an electrical store deciding what to steal. [^] Underpriviledged is she? Deprived in some way? And those scum terrorising people with impunity in the first link? Underprivaledged are they? To live in one of the worlds richest cities? In one of the worlds most advanced and tolerant countries, where equal oppportunity is the law, and possibilities to improve ones life abound. Disenfranchised are they? They are thieving violent scum. The army should have gone in and shot the lot of them. They dont deserve to live in the same society as the rest of us.
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Erudite__Eric wrote:
And those scum terrorising people with impunity in the first link? Underprivaledged are they? To live in one of the worlds richest cities?
Liberal straw man, or at least stupid liberals. But you can find the rich kid in about any crowd of delinquents, so I'm not sure what would surprise you about this one.
Erudite__Eric wrote:
In one of the worlds most advanced and tolerant countries, where equal oppportunity is the law, and possibilities to improve ones life abound. Disenfranchised are they?
Probably. Look at the world from the view of someone born some point late enough they hardly remember the fall of the Berlin Wall. I was 4 myself. Don't remember squat. I live in what is apparently one of the most solid economies in the US right now, only because it was already long dead and there's plenty left of the corpses of the old companies to pick over. At the same time after inflation I earn less than my parents did at my age, despite being in a considerably better position for myself than they were. I spent more of my time and money to get there. There's a larger gap between me and some twat born into money than they had, even accounting for inflation. The scariest thing here, despite all of this, I still make more than the average American. Toss on to that the near certainty that no social safety net will exist by the time I'd be able to use it. Fling on a bit of political stupidity and paranoia which has steadily eroded anything resembling respect or pride in my government. Could you explain to me at this point why the average idiot wouldn't just start burning shit to take the old twats who set the lot of this up with them? There's nothing to be proud of. There's nothing I can expect back for about a tenth of my paycheck. There's squat for a reason to respect much of anyone. Could just be the US, but I've seen plenty of narcissistic little turds who'd happily cave someone's skull in for a bluray player, and the same idiots who have left me hoping to die before I'm 40 so I won't have to deal with the problems raised them. I'm just fatalistic about the whole thing, but there are plenty of people who see it as a wonderful excuse. I know, as I grew up with them. Though you may be right, they may not be disenfranchised, just never franchised to begin with. Tends to happen when no one really has a reason to care. No pride, no respect, no future and no
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Erudite__Eric wrote:
And those scum terrorising people with impunity in the first link? Underprivaledged are they? To live in one of the worlds richest cities?
Liberal straw man, or at least stupid liberals. But you can find the rich kid in about any crowd of delinquents, so I'm not sure what would surprise you about this one.
Erudite__Eric wrote:
In one of the worlds most advanced and tolerant countries, where equal oppportunity is the law, and possibilities to improve ones life abound. Disenfranchised are they?
Probably. Look at the world from the view of someone born some point late enough they hardly remember the fall of the Berlin Wall. I was 4 myself. Don't remember squat. I live in what is apparently one of the most solid economies in the US right now, only because it was already long dead and there's plenty left of the corpses of the old companies to pick over. At the same time after inflation I earn less than my parents did at my age, despite being in a considerably better position for myself than they were. I spent more of my time and money to get there. There's a larger gap between me and some twat born into money than they had, even accounting for inflation. The scariest thing here, despite all of this, I still make more than the average American. Toss on to that the near certainty that no social safety net will exist by the time I'd be able to use it. Fling on a bit of political stupidity and paranoia which has steadily eroded anything resembling respect or pride in my government. Could you explain to me at this point why the average idiot wouldn't just start burning shit to take the old twats who set the lot of this up with them? There's nothing to be proud of. There's nothing I can expect back for about a tenth of my paycheck. There's squat for a reason to respect much of anyone. Could just be the US, but I've seen plenty of narcissistic little turds who'd happily cave someone's skull in for a bluray player, and the same idiots who have left me hoping to die before I'm 40 so I won't have to deal with the problems raised them. I'm just fatalistic about the whole thing, but there are plenty of people who see it as a wonderful excuse. I know, as I grew up with them. Though you may be right, they may not be disenfranchised, just never franchised to begin with. Tends to happen when no one really has a reason to care. No pride, no respect, no future and no
OK, I was talking abouit London, but if you want to broaden this discussion to the US then OK.
Distind wrote:
At the same time after inflation I earn less than my parents did at my age,
In what terms? Loafs of bread a week? I hope not house price, thats too inflated today to be a good measure of wealth. I think today we have greater consumption, thus greater wealth than our parents. However to maintain todays lifestyle needs two parents working. In my parents day one wage was enough. What IS true is that SW engineers wages haven't gone up in 10 years. :( Still 40K sterling for a senior engineer. Anyway, I think you are being unnecesarially negative. I dont perceive life today as having less oportunites than the life of my parents. Yes, it is less stable, but yes, it is less constrained today. We have more choice today. Almost too much, and that can make life more complicated. I thin the US might be different to the UK. In the 60s the US was doing really well; better than the UK, and probably gave your parents a lifestyle that set a standard. The UK was doing alright, but not so good IMO. Anyway the chances are there today. YEs it needs work, but when did anything worthwile ever come easy? Perhaps that is the failing of this generation. They don't know how to work for the good things in life. I was always taught it doesn't come on a plate. And by god it doesn't! :)
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