Well that proves it then
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Why is that? Wasn't my response a direct answer to your question?
I wasn't, now I am, then I won't be anymore.
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Marcus Kramer wrote:
If your god was all-knowing and all-powerful and such, then don't you think he could have come up with 1 perfect set of rules that would stand the test of time as opposed to changing the rules to coincide with man's discoveries and knowledge?
Utter nonsense. The fact that a god is all knowing says absolutely nothing about why such a god would take any single or group of actions. And the very assumption of an all knowing god suggests implicitly that such a god could very well have 'reasons' for any action which is in fact impossible for a human to comprehend.
Marcus Kramer wrote:
What I cannot respect is willful ignorance which is what you are demonstrating here. The only foot you have to stand on is circular-reasoning where you believe what the book told you because the book told you it's right and you have to believe that because the book told you.
More nonsense. If one believes that the bible does in fact have some meaning then the belief itself is the starting point of all that follows. It isn't circular. And even if it were as a belief it is allowed to be just that. There is of course the logical fallacy of attempting to 'prove' some belief. But that ignores both the fact that such a 'proof' originates in another belief system and also ignores the fundamental belief of a god in the first place which by itself is sufficient to explain everything.
jschell wrote:
The fact that a god is all knowing says absolutely nothing about why such a god would take any single or group of actions.
And the very assumption of an all knowing god suggests implicitly that such a god could very well have 'reasons' for any action which is in fact impossible for a human to comprehend.And you call my statement utter nonsense. This comment is nothing more than an apologetic cop out.
jschell wrote:
If one believes that the bible does in fact have some meaning then the belief itself is the starting point of all that follows. It isn't circular. And even if it were as a belief it is allowed to be just that.
Let's try that one out.... 1) Believe in the bible. Why? 2) Because the bible says I should. Why? 3) Because the bible is the perfect word of god. Why? 4) Because the bible says so. 5) So I'll believe in the bible. Why? ... That's not circular reasoning at all. My apologies... :doh:
I wasn't, now I am, then I won't be anymore.
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ryanb31 wrote:
That is straight from the Bible so what specifically would they disagree with?
You would need to ask them. Pretty sure that the have been many disagreements as to what the Bible actually says though.
On this one, we agree. The different interpretations of passages is extreme between different denominations.
I wasn't, now I am, then I won't be anymore.
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How about you prove that it doesn't. In this case the claim has been made here, so using your own logic it is up to you to disprove it rather than for us to prove it.
I wasn't, now I am, then I won't be anymore.
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Why is that? Wasn't my response a direct answer to your question?
I wasn't, now I am, then I won't be anymore.
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ryanb31 wrote:
Then stop trying to use science as your proof for everything.
I don't. I use it for those things for which there is scientific proof. You keep harping on about our having to be 1137 years old, or not being around 400,000 years ago. It reveals a woeful ignorance. Try and think why.
If people made the effort to read something three times before commenting, blogs would be much more useful places. - Anon.
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ryanb31 wrote:
Then stop trying to use science as your proof for everything.
I don't. I use it for those things for which there is scientific proof. You keep harping on about our having to be 1137 years old, or not being around 400,000 years ago. It reveals a woeful ignorance. Try and think why.
If people made the effort to read something three times before commenting, blogs would be much more useful places. - Anon.
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You gave me an example of how man-made religion is changing things. I wanted to know where God has changed the rules.
How about between the Old and New Testaments. You yourself said that.
I wasn't, now I am, then I won't be anymore.
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Provide some references from the Bible to back up what you are saying about the earth and sun.
ryanb31 wrote:
Provide some references from the Bible to back up what you are saying about the earth and sun.
So, you know less about the Bible than I do, and I haven't read it for many years. Tell you what. You find me some Biblical references to the earth being spherical, rotating on its axis, and circling the sun - I've never ever encountered that in the Good Book.
If people made the effort to read something three times before commenting, blogs would be much more useful places. - Anon.
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ryanb31 wrote:
Provide some references from the Bible to back up what you are saying about the earth and sun.
So, you know less about the Bible than I do, and I haven't read it for many years. Tell you what. You find me some Biblical references to the earth being spherical, rotating on its axis, and circling the sun - I've never ever encountered that in the Good Book.
If people made the effort to read something three times before commenting, blogs would be much more useful places. - Anon.
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How about between the Old and New Testaments. You yourself said that.
I wasn't, now I am, then I won't be anymore.
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So you claimed to be intellectual but clearly are not. Ok, I'll be more specific since you want to wordsmith me. Do not use science as proof when science cannot prove something 400,000 years old.
ryanb31 wrote:
So you claimed to be intellectual but clearly are not.
Now you resort to insulting those you do not know. A fine example you are setting.
I wasn't, now I am, then I won't be anymore.
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Exactly, it doesn't even mention it. You are the one who claimed it said the earth was flat so why would I try to find the reference. Waste of time.
Actually, it does. I suggest you go home and study up. All the references insinuate the world is not spherical.
I wasn't, now I am, then I won't be anymore.
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Here is where you will get lost if we get into that discussion. The adults need to get back to work now. Thanks.
I don't believe I would get lost. I know the bible as well as you do, trust me. You won't get into that argument because you have realized that you have talked yourself into a corner.
I wasn't, now I am, then I won't be anymore.
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ryanb31 wrote:
So you claimed to be intellectual but clearly are not.
Now you resort to insulting those you do not know. A fine example you are setting.
I wasn't, now I am, then I won't be anymore.
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Actually, it does. I suggest you go home and study up. All the references insinuate the world is not spherical.
I wasn't, now I am, then I won't be anymore.
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God spoke with men called as prophets and they wrote exactly what he told them to. At that point, yes the writings were perfect and the EXACT word of God. However, for example, shortly after Christ died the rest of the apostles were also killed and the apostasy began. God's authority was no longer held by man on earth and there was no longer any on-going revelation between God and prophets which is why the Bible ends. Man then began to put its own interpretation on the writings and man translated, not inspired prophets, the Bible. King James had many, many men, not prophets, translate the Bible to the best of their knowledge. So, yes I believe in the Bible as far as it is translated correctly. But some of the plain and precious truths have been removed, even some of them were removed intentionally. For example, the King James version says the the Lord hardened Pharaoh's heart after each of the plagues by Moses. That can't be true because it contradicts all of the other teaching of the Lord's. The Lord will soften hearts, never harden them. But you still have not answered my question. Do you believe the timeline in the Bible? I am not trying to argue religious facts about the Bible but merely do you accept the timeline it presents?
ryanb31 wrote:
So, yes I believe in the Bible as far as it is translated correctly.
ryanb31 wrote:
For example, the King James version says the the Lord hardened Pharaoh's heart after each of the plagues by Moses. That can't be true because it contradicts all of the other teaching of the Lord's.
Well, not each plague, only a selection. Pharoah's heart hardens of its own accord sometimes. Can you tell me what a translation of the Hebrew version of Exodus actually says, and how it was mistranslated.
If people made the effort to read something three times before commenting, blogs would be much more useful places. - Anon.
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So you claimed to be intellectual but clearly are not. Ok, I'll be more specific since you want to wordsmith me. Do not use science as proof when science cannot prove something 400,000 years old.
ryanb31 wrote:
when science cannot prove something 400,000 years old
Prove what is 400,000 years old, exactly? Horses for courses, you know.
If people made the effort to read something three times before commenting, blogs would be much more useful places. - Anon.
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ryanb31 wrote:
If there is so much of it, it should be easy for you to find.
And, equally, for you, too! Hint: Can you see all the kingdoms of a spherical world from the top of a very high mountain?
If people made the effort to read something three times before commenting, blogs would be much more useful places. - Anon.
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Provide some references from the Bible to back up what you are saying about the earth and sun.
The Genesis creation story says the earth is covered by a vault (firmament) and that the celestial bodies move inside the vault. (See Genesis 1:6-8) This makes no sense unless one assumes that the earth is essentially flat. Joshua 10:12 puts the Sun and Moon over the earth. Isaiah 40:22 - the heavens are a curtain spread like a tent over the earth. Now I know you're going to say it's OT so it doesn't count, so herre's some NT for you. Revelations 1:7, they'll only see Him from everywhere if the earth is flat. Revelations 7:1 talks of the four corners of the earth, that sounds like a flat finite area to me. There you go, five references.
Panic, Chaos, Destruction. My work here is done. Drink. Get drunk. Fall over - P O'H OK, I will win to day or my name isn't Ethel Crudacre! - DD Ethel Crudacre I cannot live by bread alone. Bacon and ketchup are needed as well. - Trollslayer Have a bit more patience with newbies. Of course some of them act dumb - they're often *students*, for heaven's sake - Terry Pratchett