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  3. Do you Program in Paragraphs or Sentences?

Do you Program in Paragraphs or Sentences?

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  • D dbrenth

    I think the difference is in debugging. If there is an error in your "Sentence" code, the debugger stops at that line and you have at least 5 points of failure on that line to check. You might end up turning it back into a paragraph before you figure it out. With the "paragraph", the debugger stops at the specific line with the error. I usually prefer the paragraph method, for that reason.

    Brent

    M Offline
    M Offline
    Marc Clifton
    wrote on last edited by
    #16

    dbrenth wrote:

    I think the difference is in debugging.

    This is true. Happily the VS2017 debugger is much better (than previous versions of VS) about being able to step into (and even set breakpoints on) anonymous methods. The problem I tend to encounter with complex lambda expressions is, one misplaced , or paren or other typo and the whole expression syntax-errors with really no clue as to what the parser is actually annoyed about.

    Latest Article - Building a Prototype Web-Based Diagramming Tool with SVG and Javascript Learning to code with python is like learning to swim with those little arm floaties. It gives you undeserved confidence and will eventually drown you. - DangerBunny Artificial intelligence is the only remedy for natural stupidity. - CDP1802

    1 Reply Last reply
    0
    • R RandyBuchholz

      This was inspired by Marc Clifton's post [Dumbing down code so it can be maintained by junior devs](https://www.codeproject.com/Lounge.aspx?fid=1159&fr=126#xx0xx) I'm a horizontal programmer. I write chainable methods with (short) descriptive names. The top of my methods usually consists of a few "sentences" composed of these "words". If I can put my code on one line, (braces, etc.) I usually do. Eg, simple method:

      // Not me
      string Foo(int x)
      {
      if(x == 1)
      {
      return "one";
      }
      else
      {
      return "not one";
      }
      }
      }

      // sometimes me
      string Foo(int x){
      if (x == 1) {
      return "one";
      } else {
      return "not one";
      }
      }

      // usually me
      string Foo(int x) => (x == 1) ? "one" : "not one";

      // often me
      string Foo(this int x) => (x == 1) ? "one" : "not one";

      I do things like this. (Not really this weird though :)).

      public static List WhenNotEmpty(this List item) => (item.Count > 0) ? item : null;
      public static string Prepare(this string item, out string prepared) => ((prepared = item + "Appended") == "HelloAppended") ? "ok" : null ;
      public static void Manipulate(this string item, string stuff) => Debug.WriteLine($"{item}:{stuff}");

      So I can write in sentences

      var list = new List {"a", "Hello", "c"};

      list.WhenNotEmpty()?.ForEach(s => s.Prepare(out var r)?.Manipulate(r));

      Instead of paragraphs. (something like (methods would be a little different))

      var list = new List {"a", "Hello", "c"};
      if(list.count > 0){
      foreach(var i in list){
      var (condition, temp) = Prepare(i);
      if(condition != null){
      Manipulate(temp);
      }
      }
      }

      Getting to the point, (finally :zzz: ) The paragraphs approach is clearer at the micro level (the details are clear), but the sentences is clearer at the macro level (the overall intent is clear). Of course you can wrap this paragraph in a method. But when you don't: Do you tend to write more at the macro/sentence level or micro/paragraph level?

      M Offline
      M Offline
      Marc Clifton
      wrote on last edited by
      #17

      Technically: list.WhenNotEmpty()?.ForEach(s => s.Prepare(out var r)?.Manipulate(r)); Would work as well as: list.ForEach(s => s.Prepare(out var r)?.Manipulate(r)); Given that an empty list is, well, empty. But again, to rant more about junior devs vs. experienced devs, IMO (as an experienced dev) a list should never be null. It should be empty or have content. But I see so many "if null" checks because nobody initializes their collections in the constructor, for example. And since the juniors are stuck in the dark ages because they don't get training, even: list?.ForEach(s => s.Prepare(out var r)?.Manipulate(r)); is unknown to them, though I'd still squawk at them for having a null list. Then again, I've also seen the null continuation operator abused in ways that tell me the programmer really had no right to be writing code: [Code Review - What You Can Learn From a Single Line of Code](https://www.codeproject.com/Articles/1223338/Code-Review-What-You-Can-Learn-From-a-Single-Line)

      Latest Article - Building a Prototype Web-Based Diagramming Tool with SVG and Javascript Learning to code with python is like learning to swim with those little arm floaties. It gives you undeserved confidence and will eventually drown you. - DangerBunny Artificial intelligence is the only remedy for natural stupidity. - CDP1802

      Richard DeemingR R 2 Replies Last reply
      0
      • E Eric Lynch

        Personally, when chaining method calls, I like the LINQ convention of each method call in the chain on a separate line. So the following, from your example:

        list.WhenNotEmpty()?.ForEach(s => s.Prepare(out var r)?.Manipulate(r));

        Becomes:

        list
        .WhenNotEmpty()?
        .ForEach(s => s
        .Prepare(out var r)?
        .Manipulate(r));

        Might just be me, but I find it easier to read that way. That said, not sure I completely follow the sentence / paragraph analogy :)

        S Offline
        S Offline
        Slacker007
        wrote on last edited by
        #18

        Eric Lynch wrote:

        Might just be me,

        I do it too.

        1 Reply Last reply
        0
        • M Marc Clifton

          Technically: list.WhenNotEmpty()?.ForEach(s => s.Prepare(out var r)?.Manipulate(r)); Would work as well as: list.ForEach(s => s.Prepare(out var r)?.Manipulate(r)); Given that an empty list is, well, empty. But again, to rant more about junior devs vs. experienced devs, IMO (as an experienced dev) a list should never be null. It should be empty or have content. But I see so many "if null" checks because nobody initializes their collections in the constructor, for example. And since the juniors are stuck in the dark ages because they don't get training, even: list?.ForEach(s => s.Prepare(out var r)?.Manipulate(r)); is unknown to them, though I'd still squawk at them for having a null list. Then again, I've also seen the null continuation operator abused in ways that tell me the programmer really had no right to be writing code: [Code Review - What You Can Learn From a Single Line of Code](https://www.codeproject.com/Articles/1223338/Code-Review-What-You-Can-Learn-From-a-Single-Line)

          Latest Article - Building a Prototype Web-Based Diagramming Tool with SVG and Javascript Learning to code with python is like learning to swim with those little arm floaties. It gives you undeserved confidence and will eventually drown you. - DangerBunny Artificial intelligence is the only remedy for natural stupidity. - CDP1802

          Richard DeemingR Offline
          Richard DeemingR Offline
          Richard Deeming
          wrote on last edited by
          #19

          Marc Clifton wrote:

          a list should never be null

          There's one feature of C# 8 you'll like, then! :) csharplang/nullable-reference-types.md at master · dotnet/csharplang · GitHub[^]


          "These people looked deep within my soul and assigned me a number based on the order in which I joined." - Homer

          "These people looked deep within my soul and assigned me a number based on the order in which I joined" - Homer

          M 1 Reply Last reply
          0
          • M Marc Clifton

            Technically: list.WhenNotEmpty()?.ForEach(s => s.Prepare(out var r)?.Manipulate(r)); Would work as well as: list.ForEach(s => s.Prepare(out var r)?.Manipulate(r)); Given that an empty list is, well, empty. But again, to rant more about junior devs vs. experienced devs, IMO (as an experienced dev) a list should never be null. It should be empty or have content. But I see so many "if null" checks because nobody initializes their collections in the constructor, for example. And since the juniors are stuck in the dark ages because they don't get training, even: list?.ForEach(s => s.Prepare(out var r)?.Manipulate(r)); is unknown to them, though I'd still squawk at them for having a null list. Then again, I've also seen the null continuation operator abused in ways that tell me the programmer really had no right to be writing code: [Code Review - What You Can Learn From a Single Line of Code](https://www.codeproject.com/Articles/1223338/Code-Review-What-You-Can-Learn-From-a-Single-Line)

            Latest Article - Building a Prototype Web-Based Diagramming Tool with SVG and Javascript Learning to code with python is like learning to swim with those little arm floaties. It gives you undeserved confidence and will eventually drown you. - DangerBunny Artificial intelligence is the only remedy for natural stupidity. - CDP1802

            R Offline
            R Offline
            RandyBuchholz
            wrote on last edited by
            #20

            Interesting comment. I was returning the null to abuse the nullco and short circuit the chain, even though the (actual) list itself isn't null, just empty. But you make a good point about things that shouldn't be null. Returning a null when empty does (though only shortly until the nullco) create a null list. Not using the nullco immediately after would turn a null list loose.

            1 Reply Last reply
            0
            • R RandyBuchholz

              Maintenance can definitely be harder. Sometimes when I do it this way I have to expand the code to debug and then collapse it back down. I think reading it is a little like shorthand. Once you get used to it, you get a lot of information in a small package.

              M Offline
              M Offline
              Mycroft Holmes
              wrote on last edited by
              #21

              I'm with Slacker on this, maintenance is the highest cost of software, make it readable and as simple as possible. Spell it out, let me know why you did something not just what you did. Convoluted, over engineered code is a nightmare for someone else to work with.

              Never underestimate the power of human stupidity RAH

              1 Reply Last reply
              0
              • R RandyBuchholz

                This was inspired by Marc Clifton's post [Dumbing down code so it can be maintained by junior devs](https://www.codeproject.com/Lounge.aspx?fid=1159&fr=126#xx0xx) I'm a horizontal programmer. I write chainable methods with (short) descriptive names. The top of my methods usually consists of a few "sentences" composed of these "words". If I can put my code on one line, (braces, etc.) I usually do. Eg, simple method:

                // Not me
                string Foo(int x)
                {
                if(x == 1)
                {
                return "one";
                }
                else
                {
                return "not one";
                }
                }
                }

                // sometimes me
                string Foo(int x){
                if (x == 1) {
                return "one";
                } else {
                return "not one";
                }
                }

                // usually me
                string Foo(int x) => (x == 1) ? "one" : "not one";

                // often me
                string Foo(this int x) => (x == 1) ? "one" : "not one";

                I do things like this. (Not really this weird though :)).

                public static List WhenNotEmpty(this List item) => (item.Count > 0) ? item : null;
                public static string Prepare(this string item, out string prepared) => ((prepared = item + "Appended") == "HelloAppended") ? "ok" : null ;
                public static void Manipulate(this string item, string stuff) => Debug.WriteLine($"{item}:{stuff}");

                So I can write in sentences

                var list = new List {"a", "Hello", "c"};

                list.WhenNotEmpty()?.ForEach(s => s.Prepare(out var r)?.Manipulate(r));

                Instead of paragraphs. (something like (methods would be a little different))

                var list = new List {"a", "Hello", "c"};
                if(list.count > 0){
                foreach(var i in list){
                var (condition, temp) = Prepare(i);
                if(condition != null){
                Manipulate(temp);
                }
                }
                }

                Getting to the point, (finally :zzz: ) The paragraphs approach is clearer at the micro level (the details are clear), but the sentences is clearer at the macro level (the overall intent is clear). Of course you can wrap this paragraph in a method. But when you don't: Do you tend to write more at the macro/sentence level or micro/paragraph level?

                M Offline
                M Offline
                Munchies_Matt
                wrote on last edited by
                #22

                Your coding style sucks.

                1 Reply Last reply
                0
                • R RandyBuchholz

                  This was inspired by Marc Clifton's post [Dumbing down code so it can be maintained by junior devs](https://www.codeproject.com/Lounge.aspx?fid=1159&fr=126#xx0xx) I'm a horizontal programmer. I write chainable methods with (short) descriptive names. The top of my methods usually consists of a few "sentences" composed of these "words". If I can put my code on one line, (braces, etc.) I usually do. Eg, simple method:

                  // Not me
                  string Foo(int x)
                  {
                  if(x == 1)
                  {
                  return "one";
                  }
                  else
                  {
                  return "not one";
                  }
                  }
                  }

                  // sometimes me
                  string Foo(int x){
                  if (x == 1) {
                  return "one";
                  } else {
                  return "not one";
                  }
                  }

                  // usually me
                  string Foo(int x) => (x == 1) ? "one" : "not one";

                  // often me
                  string Foo(this int x) => (x == 1) ? "one" : "not one";

                  I do things like this. (Not really this weird though :)).

                  public static List WhenNotEmpty(this List item) => (item.Count > 0) ? item : null;
                  public static string Prepare(this string item, out string prepared) => ((prepared = item + "Appended") == "HelloAppended") ? "ok" : null ;
                  public static void Manipulate(this string item, string stuff) => Debug.WriteLine($"{item}:{stuff}");

                  So I can write in sentences

                  var list = new List {"a", "Hello", "c"};

                  list.WhenNotEmpty()?.ForEach(s => s.Prepare(out var r)?.Manipulate(r));

                  Instead of paragraphs. (something like (methods would be a little different))

                  var list = new List {"a", "Hello", "c"};
                  if(list.count > 0){
                  foreach(var i in list){
                  var (condition, temp) = Prepare(i);
                  if(condition != null){
                  Manipulate(temp);
                  }
                  }
                  }

                  Getting to the point, (finally :zzz: ) The paragraphs approach is clearer at the micro level (the details are clear), but the sentences is clearer at the macro level (the overall intent is clear). Of course you can wrap this paragraph in a method. But when you don't: Do you tend to write more at the macro/sentence level or micro/paragraph level?

                  G Offline
                  G Offline
                  GenJerDan
                  wrote on last edited by
                  #23

                  Paragraphs, then collapse all the functions I'm not actively messing around with.

                  We won't sit down. We won't shut up. We won't go quietly away. YouTube, VidMe and My Mu[sic], Films and Windows Programs, etc. and FB

                  K 1 Reply Last reply
                  0
                  • R RandyBuchholz

                    This was inspired by Marc Clifton's post [Dumbing down code so it can be maintained by junior devs](https://www.codeproject.com/Lounge.aspx?fid=1159&fr=126#xx0xx) I'm a horizontal programmer. I write chainable methods with (short) descriptive names. The top of my methods usually consists of a few "sentences" composed of these "words". If I can put my code on one line, (braces, etc.) I usually do. Eg, simple method:

                    // Not me
                    string Foo(int x)
                    {
                    if(x == 1)
                    {
                    return "one";
                    }
                    else
                    {
                    return "not one";
                    }
                    }
                    }

                    // sometimes me
                    string Foo(int x){
                    if (x == 1) {
                    return "one";
                    } else {
                    return "not one";
                    }
                    }

                    // usually me
                    string Foo(int x) => (x == 1) ? "one" : "not one";

                    // often me
                    string Foo(this int x) => (x == 1) ? "one" : "not one";

                    I do things like this. (Not really this weird though :)).

                    public static List WhenNotEmpty(this List item) => (item.Count > 0) ? item : null;
                    public static string Prepare(this string item, out string prepared) => ((prepared = item + "Appended") == "HelloAppended") ? "ok" : null ;
                    public static void Manipulate(this string item, string stuff) => Debug.WriteLine($"{item}:{stuff}");

                    So I can write in sentences

                    var list = new List {"a", "Hello", "c"};

                    list.WhenNotEmpty()?.ForEach(s => s.Prepare(out var r)?.Manipulate(r));

                    Instead of paragraphs. (something like (methods would be a little different))

                    var list = new List {"a", "Hello", "c"};
                    if(list.count > 0){
                    foreach(var i in list){
                    var (condition, temp) = Prepare(i);
                    if(condition != null){
                    Manipulate(temp);
                    }
                    }
                    }

                    Getting to the point, (finally :zzz: ) The paragraphs approach is clearer at the micro level (the details are clear), but the sentences is clearer at the macro level (the overall intent is clear). Of course you can wrap this paragraph in a method. But when you don't: Do you tend to write more at the macro/sentence level or micro/paragraph level?

                    S Offline
                    S Offline
                    soulesurfer
                    wrote on last edited by
                    #24

                    In your example:

                    list.WhenNotEmpty()?.ForEach(s => s.Prepare(out var r)?.Manipulate(r));

                    The WhenNotEmpty()?. isn't really needed, is it?

                    R 1 Reply Last reply
                    0
                    • R RandyBuchholz

                      This was inspired by Marc Clifton's post [Dumbing down code so it can be maintained by junior devs](https://www.codeproject.com/Lounge.aspx?fid=1159&fr=126#xx0xx) I'm a horizontal programmer. I write chainable methods with (short) descriptive names. The top of my methods usually consists of a few "sentences" composed of these "words". If I can put my code on one line, (braces, etc.) I usually do. Eg, simple method:

                      // Not me
                      string Foo(int x)
                      {
                      if(x == 1)
                      {
                      return "one";
                      }
                      else
                      {
                      return "not one";
                      }
                      }
                      }

                      // sometimes me
                      string Foo(int x){
                      if (x == 1) {
                      return "one";
                      } else {
                      return "not one";
                      }
                      }

                      // usually me
                      string Foo(int x) => (x == 1) ? "one" : "not one";

                      // often me
                      string Foo(this int x) => (x == 1) ? "one" : "not one";

                      I do things like this. (Not really this weird though :)).

                      public static List WhenNotEmpty(this List item) => (item.Count > 0) ? item : null;
                      public static string Prepare(this string item, out string prepared) => ((prepared = item + "Appended") == "HelloAppended") ? "ok" : null ;
                      public static void Manipulate(this string item, string stuff) => Debug.WriteLine($"{item}:{stuff}");

                      So I can write in sentences

                      var list = new List {"a", "Hello", "c"};

                      list.WhenNotEmpty()?.ForEach(s => s.Prepare(out var r)?.Manipulate(r));

                      Instead of paragraphs. (something like (methods would be a little different))

                      var list = new List {"a", "Hello", "c"};
                      if(list.count > 0){
                      foreach(var i in list){
                      var (condition, temp) = Prepare(i);
                      if(condition != null){
                      Manipulate(temp);
                      }
                      }
                      }

                      Getting to the point, (finally :zzz: ) The paragraphs approach is clearer at the micro level (the details are clear), but the sentences is clearer at the macro level (the overall intent is clear). Of course you can wrap this paragraph in a method. But when you don't: Do you tend to write more at the macro/sentence level or micro/paragraph level?

                      M Offline
                      M Offline
                      maze3
                      wrote on last edited by
                      #25

                      Ah good, learnt something new first thing in the morning, now the rest for the day. the this class extensions parameter looks interesting. Might see if can use a bit of it. thanks

                      1 Reply Last reply
                      0
                      • R RandyBuchholz

                        This was inspired by Marc Clifton's post [Dumbing down code so it can be maintained by junior devs](https://www.codeproject.com/Lounge.aspx?fid=1159&fr=126#xx0xx) I'm a horizontal programmer. I write chainable methods with (short) descriptive names. The top of my methods usually consists of a few "sentences" composed of these "words". If I can put my code on one line, (braces, etc.) I usually do. Eg, simple method:

                        // Not me
                        string Foo(int x)
                        {
                        if(x == 1)
                        {
                        return "one";
                        }
                        else
                        {
                        return "not one";
                        }
                        }
                        }

                        // sometimes me
                        string Foo(int x){
                        if (x == 1) {
                        return "one";
                        } else {
                        return "not one";
                        }
                        }

                        // usually me
                        string Foo(int x) => (x == 1) ? "one" : "not one";

                        // often me
                        string Foo(this int x) => (x == 1) ? "one" : "not one";

                        I do things like this. (Not really this weird though :)).

                        public static List WhenNotEmpty(this List item) => (item.Count > 0) ? item : null;
                        public static string Prepare(this string item, out string prepared) => ((prepared = item + "Appended") == "HelloAppended") ? "ok" : null ;
                        public static void Manipulate(this string item, string stuff) => Debug.WriteLine($"{item}:{stuff}");

                        So I can write in sentences

                        var list = new List {"a", "Hello", "c"};

                        list.WhenNotEmpty()?.ForEach(s => s.Prepare(out var r)?.Manipulate(r));

                        Instead of paragraphs. (something like (methods would be a little different))

                        var list = new List {"a", "Hello", "c"};
                        if(list.count > 0){
                        foreach(var i in list){
                        var (condition, temp) = Prepare(i);
                        if(condition != null){
                        Manipulate(temp);
                        }
                        }
                        }

                        Getting to the point, (finally :zzz: ) The paragraphs approach is clearer at the micro level (the details are clear), but the sentences is clearer at the macro level (the overall intent is clear). Of course you can wrap this paragraph in a method. But when you don't: Do you tend to write more at the macro/sentence level or micro/paragraph level?

                        J Offline
                        J Offline
                        Jacquers
                        wrote on last edited by
                        #26

                        I prefer funnels ;P [Modern Art: The Funnel - The Daily WTF](https://thedailywtf.com/articles/modern-art-the-funnel)

                        K 1 Reply Last reply
                        0
                        • R RandyBuchholz

                          This was inspired by Marc Clifton's post [Dumbing down code so it can be maintained by junior devs](https://www.codeproject.com/Lounge.aspx?fid=1159&fr=126#xx0xx) I'm a horizontal programmer. I write chainable methods with (short) descriptive names. The top of my methods usually consists of a few "sentences" composed of these "words". If I can put my code on one line, (braces, etc.) I usually do. Eg, simple method:

                          // Not me
                          string Foo(int x)
                          {
                          if(x == 1)
                          {
                          return "one";
                          }
                          else
                          {
                          return "not one";
                          }
                          }
                          }

                          // sometimes me
                          string Foo(int x){
                          if (x == 1) {
                          return "one";
                          } else {
                          return "not one";
                          }
                          }

                          // usually me
                          string Foo(int x) => (x == 1) ? "one" : "not one";

                          // often me
                          string Foo(this int x) => (x == 1) ? "one" : "not one";

                          I do things like this. (Not really this weird though :)).

                          public static List WhenNotEmpty(this List item) => (item.Count > 0) ? item : null;
                          public static string Prepare(this string item, out string prepared) => ((prepared = item + "Appended") == "HelloAppended") ? "ok" : null ;
                          public static void Manipulate(this string item, string stuff) => Debug.WriteLine($"{item}:{stuff}");

                          So I can write in sentences

                          var list = new List {"a", "Hello", "c"};

                          list.WhenNotEmpty()?.ForEach(s => s.Prepare(out var r)?.Manipulate(r));

                          Instead of paragraphs. (something like (methods would be a little different))

                          var list = new List {"a", "Hello", "c"};
                          if(list.count > 0){
                          foreach(var i in list){
                          var (condition, temp) = Prepare(i);
                          if(condition != null){
                          Manipulate(temp);
                          }
                          }
                          }

                          Getting to the point, (finally :zzz: ) The paragraphs approach is clearer at the micro level (the details are clear), but the sentences is clearer at the macro level (the overall intent is clear). Of course you can wrap this paragraph in a method. But when you don't: Do you tend to write more at the macro/sentence level or micro/paragraph level?

                          Sander RosselS Offline
                          Sander RosselS Offline
                          Sander Rossel
                          wrote on last edited by
                          #27

                          The one problem I have with the everything-on-one-line approach style of programming (which I also do a lot) is that it's impossible to debug. You don't get intermediate values and you don't get to set breakpoints at specific functions. The readability aspect is not that big of a deal, I can read it just fine (usually). However, since you write code only once and read and debug it a gazillion times I prefer to write my code so I can step through it. Sometimes I put it back together for readability afterwards. For example:

                          // Debuggable
                          var filtered = myList.Where(...);
                          var ordered = filtered.OrderBy(...);
                          var result = ordered.ToList();
                          return result;

                          // Readable
                          return myList
                          .Where(...)
                          .OrderBy(...)
                          .ToList();

                          Best, Sander Continuous Integration, Delivery, and Deployment arrgh.js - Bringing LINQ to JavaScript Object-Oriented Programming in C# Succinctly

                          K 1 Reply Last reply
                          0
                          • R RandyBuchholz

                            This was inspired by Marc Clifton's post [Dumbing down code so it can be maintained by junior devs](https://www.codeproject.com/Lounge.aspx?fid=1159&fr=126#xx0xx) I'm a horizontal programmer. I write chainable methods with (short) descriptive names. The top of my methods usually consists of a few "sentences" composed of these "words". If I can put my code on one line, (braces, etc.) I usually do. Eg, simple method:

                            // Not me
                            string Foo(int x)
                            {
                            if(x == 1)
                            {
                            return "one";
                            }
                            else
                            {
                            return "not one";
                            }
                            }
                            }

                            // sometimes me
                            string Foo(int x){
                            if (x == 1) {
                            return "one";
                            } else {
                            return "not one";
                            }
                            }

                            // usually me
                            string Foo(int x) => (x == 1) ? "one" : "not one";

                            // often me
                            string Foo(this int x) => (x == 1) ? "one" : "not one";

                            I do things like this. (Not really this weird though :)).

                            public static List WhenNotEmpty(this List item) => (item.Count > 0) ? item : null;
                            public static string Prepare(this string item, out string prepared) => ((prepared = item + "Appended") == "HelloAppended") ? "ok" : null ;
                            public static void Manipulate(this string item, string stuff) => Debug.WriteLine($"{item}:{stuff}");

                            So I can write in sentences

                            var list = new List {"a", "Hello", "c"};

                            list.WhenNotEmpty()?.ForEach(s => s.Prepare(out var r)?.Manipulate(r));

                            Instead of paragraphs. (something like (methods would be a little different))

                            var list = new List {"a", "Hello", "c"};
                            if(list.count > 0){
                            foreach(var i in list){
                            var (condition, temp) = Prepare(i);
                            if(condition != null){
                            Manipulate(temp);
                            }
                            }
                            }

                            Getting to the point, (finally :zzz: ) The paragraphs approach is clearer at the micro level (the details are clear), but the sentences is clearer at the macro level (the overall intent is clear). Of course you can wrap this paragraph in a method. But when you don't: Do you tend to write more at the macro/sentence level or micro/paragraph level?

                            K Offline
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                            KBZX5000
                            wrote on last edited by
                            #28

                            This I can parse and validate, at a glance, without trying:

                            string Foo(int x)
                            {
                            if(x == 1)
                            {
                            return "one";
                            }
                            else
                            {
                            return "not one";
                            }
                            }
                            }

                            This requires me to actually read the words on screen and consciously think about them:

                            string Foo(this int x) => (x == 1) ? "one" : "not one";

                            It's not "more clear" on a macro level. It's "more clear" to you personally. If you were one of my juniors, I'd reprimand you for using an esoteric personal style at work. If you were a senior colleague, I'd just skip all formalities and just stab you with a kitchen knife. :)

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                            0
                            • L Lost User

                              missing a close brace in your first // sometimes me example. and yeah, sometimes I do the same with similar (obvious) crap.

                              This internet thing is amazing! Letting people use it: worst idea ever!

                              S Offline
                              S Offline
                              S Houghtelin
                              wrote on last edited by
                              #29

                              Lopatir wrote:

                              missing a close brace in your first // sometimes me example.

                              Definitely me sometimes. :laugh:

                              It was broke, so I fixed it.

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                              0
                              • S soulesurfer

                                In your example:

                                list.WhenNotEmpty()?.ForEach(s => s.Prepare(out var r)?.Manipulate(r));

                                The WhenNotEmpty()?. isn't really needed, is it?

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                                R Offline
                                RandyBuchholz
                                wrote on last edited by
                                #30

                                No, not really in this case. Something like `.When(predicate)` that might have been better. Or following it with something where it did matter.

                                S 1 Reply Last reply
                                0
                                • R RandyBuchholz

                                  No, not really in this case. Something like `.When(predicate)` that might have been better. Or following it with something where it did matter.

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                                  soulesurfer
                                  wrote on last edited by
                                  #31

                                  I was saying that you can use an empty collection with foreach, which will basically do nothing. You shouldn't need anything there.

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                                  0
                                  • S soulesurfer

                                    I was saying that you can use an empty collection with foreach, which will basically do nothing. You shouldn't need anything there.

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                                    R Offline
                                    RandyBuchholz
                                    wrote on last edited by
                                    #32

                                    Right. That's what I meant by "following it with something that did matter".

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                                    0
                                    • Richard DeemingR Richard Deeming

                                      Marc Clifton wrote:

                                      a list should never be null

                                      There's one feature of C# 8 you'll like, then! :) csharplang/nullable-reference-types.md at master · dotnet/csharplang · GitHub[^]


                                      "These people looked deep within my soul and assigned me a number based on the order in which I joined." - Homer

                                      M Offline
                                      M Offline
                                      Marc Clifton
                                      wrote on last edited by
                                      #33

                                      Richard Deeming wrote:

                                      There's one feature of C# 8 you'll like, then!

                                      Quite so. Still, I wonder where they're going with this -- nullable value types are great, and so it makes sense that the complement, non-nullable reference types, should exist, it certainly provides symmetry. But oh boy, there are going to be thousands of warnings in the code base I work with at work when (if ever) they opt-in for this. But it'll probably be a few years before they get their build systems onto the C# 8, which by then they still will probably be several versions behind, as they are now. :^)

                                      Latest Article - Building a Prototype Web-Based Diagramming Tool with SVG and Javascript Learning to code with python is like learning to swim with those little arm floaties. It gives you undeserved confidence and will eventually drown you. - DangerBunny Artificial intelligence is the only remedy for natural stupidity. - CDP1802

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                                      • R RandyBuchholz

                                        This was inspired by Marc Clifton's post [Dumbing down code so it can be maintained by junior devs](https://www.codeproject.com/Lounge.aspx?fid=1159&fr=126#xx0xx) I'm a horizontal programmer. I write chainable methods with (short) descriptive names. The top of my methods usually consists of a few "sentences" composed of these "words". If I can put my code on one line, (braces, etc.) I usually do. Eg, simple method:

                                        // Not me
                                        string Foo(int x)
                                        {
                                        if(x == 1)
                                        {
                                        return "one";
                                        }
                                        else
                                        {
                                        return "not one";
                                        }
                                        }
                                        }

                                        // sometimes me
                                        string Foo(int x){
                                        if (x == 1) {
                                        return "one";
                                        } else {
                                        return "not one";
                                        }
                                        }

                                        // usually me
                                        string Foo(int x) => (x == 1) ? "one" : "not one";

                                        // often me
                                        string Foo(this int x) => (x == 1) ? "one" : "not one";

                                        I do things like this. (Not really this weird though :)).

                                        public static List WhenNotEmpty(this List item) => (item.Count > 0) ? item : null;
                                        public static string Prepare(this string item, out string prepared) => ((prepared = item + "Appended") == "HelloAppended") ? "ok" : null ;
                                        public static void Manipulate(this string item, string stuff) => Debug.WriteLine($"{item}:{stuff}");

                                        So I can write in sentences

                                        var list = new List {"a", "Hello", "c"};

                                        list.WhenNotEmpty()?.ForEach(s => s.Prepare(out var r)?.Manipulate(r));

                                        Instead of paragraphs. (something like (methods would be a little different))

                                        var list = new List {"a", "Hello", "c"};
                                        if(list.count > 0){
                                        foreach(var i in list){
                                        var (condition, temp) = Prepare(i);
                                        if(condition != null){
                                        Manipulate(temp);
                                        }
                                        }
                                        }

                                        Getting to the point, (finally :zzz: ) The paragraphs approach is clearer at the micro level (the details are clear), but the sentences is clearer at the macro level (the overall intent is clear). Of course you can wrap this paragraph in a method. But when you don't: Do you tend to write more at the macro/sentence level or micro/paragraph level?

                                        K Offline
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                                        kalberts
                                        wrote on last edited by
                                        #34

                                        Your first example has one great advantage: When your productivity is measured in number of code lines produced, it wins by a large margin. The disadvantage is that to get an overview over even a fairly trivial function that really should fit in a screenful, you have to flip back and forth though a pile of pages. In any sufficiently fancy editor you can split the window so you can correlate various parts of the function logic, but then you can fit half as much logic in each tile, and that may be too little! A second disadvantage: With all that whitespace (frequently, programmers add at least one blank line before and after every loop, after function initialization, ... everywhere!), you have to look really close to see where this function ends and the next function starts. Except that those blank line lovers usually also add a huge comment block before every function to explain that ThePriceOfApplesPerKilogram argument is the price of apples per kilogram, that pi has the value of 3.1415926535897932384626433 and similar essential information. To some of these programmers, "readability" is a synonym for "whitespace percentage". Sort of homeopathic programming: The more diluted, the more powerful. On the other hand: The APL ideal of "There is no programming task so complex that it cannot be solved in a single line of APL" goes too far for my taste. An example from Wikipedia -The game of Life: life←{↑1 ⍵∨.∧3 4=+/,¯1 0 1∘.⊖¯1 0 1∘.⌽⊂⍵} I put most regex in the same category. Geek & Poke: Yesterday's regex[^] I'd like to place myself in the middle of the road, but I cannot deny that those homeopatic programmers raises such protests in me that I lean somewhat over to the other side. If you cannot fit every function in its entirety on a single screenful, then you have used too much whitespace.

                                        1 Reply Last reply
                                        0
                                        • K KBZX5000

                                          This I can parse and validate, at a glance, without trying:

                                          string Foo(int x)
                                          {
                                          if(x == 1)
                                          {
                                          return "one";
                                          }
                                          else
                                          {
                                          return "not one";
                                          }
                                          }
                                          }

                                          This requires me to actually read the words on screen and consciously think about them:

                                          string Foo(this int x) => (x == 1) ? "one" : "not one";

                                          It's not "more clear" on a macro level. It's "more clear" to you personally. If you were one of my juniors, I'd reprimand you for using an esoteric personal style at work. If you were a senior colleague, I'd just skip all formalities and just stab you with a kitchen knife. :)

                                          K Offline
                                          K Offline
                                          kalberts
                                          wrote on last edited by
                                          #35

                                          Do you really have parsing problems with

                                          string Foo(int x) {
                                          if (x == 1) return "one";
                                          else return "not one";
                                          }

                                          This style gives me a third as many source "code lines" to relate to. I can easily overview the entire function. In a larger function, a less whitespaced layout makes it much easier to spot the start/end of loops and condition blocks etc.

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