Is C++ dead?
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Paul Watson wrote:
Actually, he is.
My mate Elvis is dead? Oh good god. Why didn't anybody tell me sooner? :(( ;P Michael CP Blog [^] Development Blog [^]
Elvis was your mate :| I thought you were younger than that ;) regards, Paul Watson Ireland Colib and ilikecameras. K(arl) wrote: oh, and BTW, CHRISTIAN ISN'T A PARADOX, HE IS A TASMANIAN!
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NO C++ wont die but yeh developers need to lear the Managed Way of coding , any how After year's is see future of Multiplatform programing bright :cool: Vikas Amin Embin Technology Bombay
vikas amin wrote:
After year's is see future of Multiplatform programing bright
Come again? regards, Paul Watson Ireland Colib and ilikecameras. K(arl) wrote: oh, and BTW, CHRISTIAN ISN'T A PARADOX, HE IS A TASMANIAN!
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I think we have to remember there are two distinct markets in software development. Shrinkwrap like Microsoft does and bespoke for internal, business applications. I think the former is still C++ dominated while the later is the ripest for .NET/Java/etc. They have different needs and environments which is why there is such a rift in stats between the two. regards, Paul Watson Ireland Colib and ilikecameras. K(arl) wrote: oh, and BTW, CHRISTIAN ISN'T A PARADOX, HE IS A TASMANIAN!
My career has illustrated that point Game development: C++ Realtime: C++ Shrinkwrapped application: C++, MFC Bespoke: .NET, ASP.NET .NET helps us get a working application much more quickly than we could manage in VB6 or C++, which means a significantly lower price for the customer or more features for their budget.
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Good point, I reckon they are testing the water. I had few .net exceptions being throw using the SQL Server 2005 Mangament Studio, rather than the error being handling nicely its seems they are being throw straight to screen. I would expect to see a few patches to fix this. Overall it's a nice product considering the GUI is .net. Blogless
Ask and ye shall recieve. Derek has a "managed code myth" post[^] which lists some LOC numbers. regards, Paul Watson Ireland Colib and ilikecameras. K(arl) wrote: oh, and BTW, CHRISTIAN ISN'T A PARADOX, HE IS A TASMANIAN!
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vikas amin wrote:
After year's is see future of Multiplatform programing bright
Come again? regards, Paul Watson Ireland Colib and ilikecameras. K(arl) wrote: oh, and BTW, CHRISTIAN ISN'T A PARADOX, HE IS A TASMANIAN!
Paul Watson wrote:
Come again?
probably he is refering to java thing w.r.t .net, Write once and run everywhere that is if .net is available on other platforms too.
-Prakash
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Elvis was your mate :| I thought you were younger than that ;) regards, Paul Watson Ireland Colib and ilikecameras. K(arl) wrote: oh, and BTW, CHRISTIAN ISN'T A PARADOX, HE IS A TASMANIAN!
Paul Watson wrote:
Elvis was your mate I thought you were younger than that
Who do you think taught him to dance :-D Michael CP Blog [^] Development Blog [^]
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Paul Watson wrote:
Elvis was your mate I thought you were younger than that
Who do you think taught him to dance :-D Michael CP Blog [^] Development Blog [^]
:laugh: Nice one. (Actually, I thought Forest Gump taught Elvis how to dance.) regards, Paul Watson Ireland Colib and ilikecameras. K(arl) wrote: oh, and BTW, CHRISTIAN ISN'T A PARADOX, HE IS A TASMANIAN! -- modified at 7:14 Wednesday 11th January, 2006
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NO C++ wont die but yeh developers need to lear the Managed Way of coding , any how After year's is see future of Multiplatform programing bright :cool: Vikas Amin Embin Technology Bombay
I hope not. There should be a version 2 of the ISO standard coming out soon. I think it depends on the Industry where one is working and which OS e.g. C\C++ on Linux. I prefer C++ (unmanaged) as there I have total control. Lets see in 5 years time. Any way the more programming languages one has under the belt so much the better. I have been using C# a lot lately but I am not very impressed. I am the handsome one in the crowd.
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Ask and ye shall recieve. Derek has a "managed code myth" post[^] which lists some LOC numbers. regards, Paul Watson Ireland Colib and ilikecameras. K(arl) wrote: oh, and BTW, CHRISTIAN ISN'T A PARADOX, HE IS A TASMANIAN!
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norm.net wrote:
I wouldn't see it being one of the top language of the future
I agree. I used to be a big C++ buff and now I am drifting more and more towards C#. Paul
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I asked a conference speaker a few weeks back if Microsoft ate its own dog food by producing any applications with .NET. His reply was yes and no. Yes, some internal tools and one small part of BizTalk Server (I think it was BizTalk) but otherwise no. I don't see Office, Visual Studio or any of their main applications being written in .NET and not for a very long time either. (I am a .NET developer BTW so I am for it rather than biased against it.) regards, Paul Watson Ireland Colib and ilikecameras. K(arl) wrote: oh, and BTW, CHRISTIAN ISN'T A PARADOX, HE IS A TASMANIAN!
Given the number of messages about .NET 2.0 being so slow I don't blame them! The tigress is here :-D
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I go back with C++ a LONG way, not quite to the cfront days, but close. I moved away from it for a few years, working mostly with .NET and ASP (something I swore i'd never do). I'm looking around now, and I'm seeing almost NO activity on the C++ front anymore. Very few jobs available, and fewer tools and articles. I know there's still a strong C++ contingent here on Code Project, but honestly? Is this a dead horse? Oh, don't get me wrong, I know that C and C++ will probably always have a VERY strong presence the unmanaged world, but that world seems to be shrinking daily. I'm seeing more desktop apps written in Java and .NET, and web based apps are starting to replace many of teh classic desktop apps. I feel like such a dinosaur. Oh, granted, i've got updated skills in Java and .NET, so maybe it's a dinosaur with sunglasses. Is this what COBOL developers feel like? So, i've been contemplating trying to get more work in native code, but i'm just not sure... What are your opinions? -- Where are we going? And why am I in this handbasket?
C++ will probably never be dead, the same as C/ASM/Cobal/B?SIC and a ton of other languages still continue to this day. How often do you see an ASM job though? Same for C/C++, the jobs are fewer every day. From what I can see, the future is .NET and Java with a few others on a smaller scale such as Python, Ruby, etc. The primary focus though is on the two big boys and more jobs are moving to the front daily. Of course, this does not matter if you are self employed designing products of the market, you simply use what you like, but for the future job market, it is best to be in one of the two main camps. I first got hooked on computers back in 1981 and have moved through quite a bit of technology, but the longest run was C\C++ which dominated most of the development world for about a decade or so. The future is still a blank page though, someone could come out with a new hot language/technology and the switch would be on. I know this is how I felt when C#/.NET first hit the public betas, even after the best part of two decades developing C/C++, I moved like a rabid dog to C#/.NET and have not looked back. It saves me time and allows for much more feature rich applications/sites than prior technologies. That is what is important to me. If something better comes out tomorrow, I will probably cut and run to the next new thing that saves me time and empowers my creative side. In the job market though, there is usually a lag in jobs for new technology. I think the .NET job market is still just settling in and will be a couple more years before it is at the peak. A lot will depend on how well Windows Vista does in the market and of course, what Google does to attack MS :) Rocky <>< Latest Post: SQL2005 Server Managemnet Studio timeouts! Blog: www.RockyMoore.com/TheCoder/[^]
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I go back with C++ a LONG way, not quite to the cfront days, but close. I moved away from it for a few years, working mostly with .NET and ASP (something I swore i'd never do). I'm looking around now, and I'm seeing almost NO activity on the C++ front anymore. Very few jobs available, and fewer tools and articles. I know there's still a strong C++ contingent here on Code Project, but honestly? Is this a dead horse? Oh, don't get me wrong, I know that C and C++ will probably always have a VERY strong presence the unmanaged world, but that world seems to be shrinking daily. I'm seeing more desktop apps written in Java and .NET, and web based apps are starting to replace many of teh classic desktop apps. I feel like such a dinosaur. Oh, granted, i've got updated skills in Java and .NET, so maybe it's a dinosaur with sunglasses. Is this what COBOL developers feel like? So, i've been contemplating trying to get more work in native code, but i'm just not sure... What are your opinions? -- Where are we going? And why am I in this handbasket?
Let's just say, C++'s honeymoon is over. It's become a workhorse tool, not a passion. Well, except for the diehard fanatics you find in every crowd--the ones that don't grow out of their "newest gadget" fanatacism. :) Marc Pensieve
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I wouldn't see it being one of the top language of the future, things move on, I reckon they .net framework is the future for windows develop and maybe C# being one of the top langauges to develop with, maybe I'm right maybe I'm wrong, but look at it this way, microsoft are not going to drop .net in the near future, they've but far too much investment. Some of the layers of the Windows O/S are rumoured to be written in C#, infact C# is being used to develop new apps in Microsoft. Maybe the C++ clan will tell you different, people want to hang on to all their knowlegde investment on a particular language but sometimes you have to let go and move on or risk being left behind like. Blogless
norm.net wrote:
Some of the layers of the Windows O/S are rumoured to be written in C#
I read in an MSDN chat that Windows Vista is written in a mixture of C, C++, Assembler, Managed C++ and C#. Kevin
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I go back with C++ a LONG way, not quite to the cfront days, but close. I moved away from it for a few years, working mostly with .NET and ASP (something I swore i'd never do). I'm looking around now, and I'm seeing almost NO activity on the C++ front anymore. Very few jobs available, and fewer tools and articles. I know there's still a strong C++ contingent here on Code Project, but honestly? Is this a dead horse? Oh, don't get me wrong, I know that C and C++ will probably always have a VERY strong presence the unmanaged world, but that world seems to be shrinking daily. I'm seeing more desktop apps written in Java and .NET, and web based apps are starting to replace many of teh classic desktop apps. I feel like such a dinosaur. Oh, granted, i've got updated skills in Java and .NET, so maybe it's a dinosaur with sunglasses. Is this what COBOL developers feel like? So, i've been contemplating trying to get more work in native code, but i'm just not sure... What are your opinions? -- Where are we going? And why am I in this handbasket?
Erik Funkenbusch wrote:
Oh, don't get me wrong, I know that C and C++ will probably always have a VERY strong presence the unmanaged world, but that world seems to be shrinking daily. I'm seeing more desktop apps written in Java and .NET, and web based apps are starting to replace many of teh classic desktop apps.
C and C++ will just get more and more restricted to systems programming, games, high-performance computing, device drivers, embedded, etc. Typical business apps. will tend to be written in Java,.NET and, as you say elsewhere, Python, Ruby et al. In general C++ will be wheeled out for those tasks where nothing else will do. This will apply even for some aspects of .NET. Kevin
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I think we have to remember there are two distinct markets in software development. Shrinkwrap like Microsoft does and bespoke for internal, business applications. I think the former is still C++ dominated while the later is the ripest for .NET/Java/etc. They have different needs and environments which is why there is such a rift in stats between the two. regards, Paul Watson Ireland Colib and ilikecameras. K(arl) wrote: oh, and BTW, CHRISTIAN ISN'T A PARADOX, HE IS A TASMANIAN!
My thoughts exactly. Wether people realize it or not, .NET will be dominating the world that classic VB used to. Jeremy Falcon
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Erik Funkenbusch wrote:
Oh, don't get me wrong, I know that C and C++ will probably always have a VERY strong presence the unmanaged world, but that world seems to be shrinking daily. I'm seeing more desktop apps written in Java and .NET, and web based apps are starting to replace many of teh classic desktop apps.
C and C++ will just get more and more restricted to systems programming, games, high-performance computing, device drivers, embedded, etc. Typical business apps. will tend to be written in Java,.NET and, as you say elsewhere, Python, Ruby et al. In general C++ will be wheeled out for those tasks where nothing else will do. This will apply even for some aspects of .NET. Kevin
Kevin McFarlane wrote:
C and C++ will just get more and more restricted to systems programming, games, high-performance computing, device drivers, embedded, etc
True..A lot of financial systems are(will be) using C++.
Kevin McFarlane wrote:
Typical business apps. will tend to be written in Java,.NET and, as you say elsewhere, Python, Ruby et al.
That is always the case. Before .NET, a lot of people were using VB or PowerBuilder etc for such things. C++ has evolved (or changed a lot??) in the last 10 years. Things like templates, BOOST, MetaProgramming, Policy Based Designs have put C++ in a different level. A lot of people still think C++ as "C with some classes and some OO things". These days you can do a lot of things in C++ very easily(just like C# or Java). But people have moved away from C++ to either C# or Java and it is difficult to go back. -Madhu.
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Kevin McFarlane wrote:
C and C++ will just get more and more restricted to systems programming, games, high-performance computing, device drivers, embedded, etc
True..A lot of financial systems are(will be) using C++.
Kevin McFarlane wrote:
Typical business apps. will tend to be written in Java,.NET and, as you say elsewhere, Python, Ruby et al.
That is always the case. Before .NET, a lot of people were using VB or PowerBuilder etc for such things. C++ has evolved (or changed a lot??) in the last 10 years. Things like templates, BOOST, MetaProgramming, Policy Based Designs have put C++ in a different level. A lot of people still think C++ as "C with some classes and some OO things". These days you can do a lot of things in C++ very easily(just like C# or Java). But people have moved away from C++ to either C# or Java and it is difficult to go back. -Madhu.
Madhu Cheriyedath wrote:
C++ has evolved (or changed a lot??) in the last 10 years. Things like templates, BOOST, MetaProgramming, Policy Based Designs have put C++ in a different level. A lot of people still think C++ as "C with some classes and some OO things".
Yes, I know. And one of the big problems with C++ is that most C++ developers continue to program in the style of 10 years ago. I know this from having to maintain their code from time to time. That's one reason why I seek to get away from it now. I don't mind writing my own C++ but I hate maintaining others' sloppy code! Kevin
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I go back with C++ a LONG way, not quite to the cfront days, but close. I moved away from it for a few years, working mostly with .NET and ASP (something I swore i'd never do). I'm looking around now, and I'm seeing almost NO activity on the C++ front anymore. Very few jobs available, and fewer tools and articles. I know there's still a strong C++ contingent here on Code Project, but honestly? Is this a dead horse? Oh, don't get me wrong, I know that C and C++ will probably always have a VERY strong presence the unmanaged world, but that world seems to be shrinking daily. I'm seeing more desktop apps written in Java and .NET, and web based apps are starting to replace many of teh classic desktop apps. I feel like such a dinosaur. Oh, granted, i've got updated skills in Java and .NET, so maybe it's a dinosaur with sunglasses. Is this what COBOL developers feel like? So, i've been contemplating trying to get more work in native code, but i'm just not sure... What are your opinions? -- Where are we going? And why am I in this handbasket?
That depends upon the 'problem space' in which you like to work. If you develop line-of-business applications (data bases, web stuff, that sort of thing), then yes, C++ is probably not as useful as it once was. Languages like Java and C# and their more secure environments are a better solution, since applications are sandboxed by the environment rather than having to secure themselves. Process control (which is basically what I do) is still heavily C++. Some of this is due to performance considerations; there's a belief (possibly mistaken) that .NET and other 'managed' environments would have latency problems when handling real-time and near real-time events. The other influence would be the native code libraries used for custom hardware. I have yet to see anyone in the data acquisition arena provide a .NET assembly to talk to their hardware. Embedded development has been moving from C to C++ in recent years, so there actually seems to be some growth there.
Software Zen:
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I wouldn't see it being one of the top language of the future, things move on, I reckon they .net framework is the future for windows develop and maybe C# being one of the top langauges to develop with, maybe I'm right maybe I'm wrong, but look at it this way, microsoft are not going to drop .net in the near future, they've but far too much investment. Some of the layers of the Windows O/S are rumoured to be written in C#, infact C# is being used to develop new apps in Microsoft. Maybe the C++ clan will tell you different, people want to hang on to all their knowlegde investment on a particular language but sometimes you have to let go and move on or risk being left behind like. Blogless
> .net framework is the future for windows develop I keep hearing that, but how many years has it been since .Net came out? And yet I still have nothing in my "must install on a clean PC" software list that's been written in .Net. Somebody please point me to a killer .Net app.