Yo espeir!
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Thomas George wrote:
created by the preachers and pastors that caused this unfortunate event.
That is absurd. Lets give credit where credit is due. This happened not because of the man's religion but because he was fricking crazy. Healthy, sane people do not just start shooting at people. If there is any blame to be placed it would be on any people who saw this coming and didn't try to get the man help.
A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects. - -Lazarus Long, Time Enough For Love
I don't think he was crazy at all. I think he was overcome by evil. If you read what happened, he was completely lucid and planned the whole thing in great detail. Crazy people do not write clear letters of intent to their wives, spend the morning delivering milk, then shoot up a school of little girls. Let's not confuse evil with insanity (which is an inability to recognize your own actions).
"You act like jew." -Score: 1.0 (3 votes).
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Unless I'm mad, I have evidence that my wife exists. There is no evidence that God exists. Metaphorical anger with God to indicated Godlessness is not uncommon. At a minimum he actively rejected Christianity.
"You act like jew." -Score: 1.0 (3 votes).
Red Stateler wrote:
At a minimum he actively rejected Christianity.
By that logic every christian who has ever sinned is not a christian.
"Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind." - Dr. Seuss
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Red Stateler wrote:
Anger with God is usually associated with the fact that he doesn't intervene in your daily life, so blame is placed on his absence (the foundation of atheism).
I see. So anger over God not responding to prayers leads people to the conclusion that God must not exist, which is then followed by rampant immorality, like rape, murder, incest, child molestation, abortion, homosexuality, and adultery. Is this what your research has concluded?
If [God] knows what we are going to do then we have no free will and are just characters in a play written by him. Without free will, morality for humans makes no sense. Without free will and morality, any sort of punishment or reward system loses any justification. Heaven and hell would be places where [God] could watch the souls he created, predestined just for eternal happiness or agony. - Mark Thomas
Alvaro Mendez wrote:
So anger over God not responding to prayers leads people to the conclusion that God must not exist, which is then followed by rampant immorality, like rape, murder, incest, child molestation, abortion, homosexuality, and adultery. Is this what your research has concluded?
In the case of this man...That's entirely plausible.
"You act like jew." -Score: 1.0 (3 votes).
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Unless I'm mad, I have evidence that my wife exists. There is no evidence that God exists. Metaphorical anger with God to indicated Godlessness is not uncommon. At a minimum he actively rejected Christianity.
"You act like jew." -Score: 1.0 (3 votes).
By that definition, all crimes are committed by atheists; but, still it is his disappointment with the Christian God to fulfill the promises made by the Bible and the preachers that caused the reaction. If he never believed in God, then he may not have had the same reaction to whatever stimulus he had. Hey, I am not the one looking at the banana and say that "God exists. He designed the handle for us. How considerate.". I don't go around saying that God cured me of my illnesses. All these are supposed to be evidences that draw people to God. These "evidences" did not disappear -- did they? but, these miracles did not happen to him when he needed it most. The violence was because his *love* changed to *hate*. If he were a non-believer and did not care about God ever, he would never have had this outburst of emotion.
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I don't think he was crazy at all. I think he was overcome by evil. If you read what happened, he was completely lucid and planned the whole thing in great detail. Crazy people do not write clear letters of intent to their wives, spend the morning delivering milk, then shoot up a school of little girls. Let's not confuse evil with insanity (which is an inability to recognize your own actions).
"You act like jew." -Score: 1.0 (3 votes).
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Red Stateler wrote:
At a minimum he actively rejected Christianity.
By that logic every christian who has ever sinned is not a christian.
"Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind." - Dr. Seuss
Actually there's a specific sin that denotes rejection of Christianity. Otherwise, sin itself is recognized by Christians as an inherent part of the human condition.
"You act like jew." -Score: 1.0 (3 votes).
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Red Stateler wrote:
At a minimum he actively rejected Christianity.
By that logic every christian who has ever sinned is not a christian.
"Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind." - Dr. Seuss
Exactly. Mr. Stateler just makes some bizarre arguments.
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By that definition, all crimes are committed by atheists; but, still it is his disappointment with the Christian God to fulfill the promises made by the Bible and the preachers that caused the reaction. If he never believed in God, then he may not have had the same reaction to whatever stimulus he had. Hey, I am not the one looking at the banana and say that "God exists. He designed the handle for us. How considerate.". I don't go around saying that God cured me of my illnesses. All these are supposed to be evidences that draw people to God. These "evidences" did not disappear -- did they? but, these miracles did not happen to him when he needed it most. The violence was because his *love* changed to *hate*. If he were a non-believer and did not care about God ever, he would never have had this outburst of emotion.
Thomas George wrote:
By that definition, all crimes are committed by atheists; but, still it is his disappointment with the Christian God to fulfill the promises made by the Bible and the preachers that caused the reaction. If he never believed in God, then he may not have had the same reaction to whatever stimulus he had.
How does that fit the definition I gave?
Thomas George wrote:
Hey, I am not the one looking at the banana and say that "God exists. He designed the handle for us. How considerate.". I don't go around saying that God cured me of my illnesses. All these are supposed to be evidences that draw people to God. These "evidences" did not disappear -- did they? but, these miracles did not happen to him when he needed it most. The violence was because his *love* changed to *hate*. If he were a non-believer and did not care about God ever, he would never have had this outburst of emotion.
I can't attempt to identify what caused him to actively reject God, just that (per his own letter) he did.
"You act like jew." -Score: 1.0 (3 votes).
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Mike Mullikin wrote:
Shooter was NOT atheist
Says who? Nietzsche said "God is dead" and he was an atheist.
"You act like jew." -Score: 1.0 (3 votes).
If you're gonna quote something, make sure you understand it first. Ok? :)
-- Mit viel Oktan und frei von Blei, eine Kraftstoff wie Benziiiiiiin!
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Thomas George wrote:
created by the preachers and pastors that caused this unfortunate event.
That is absurd. Lets give credit where credit is due. This happened not because of the man's religion but because he was fricking crazy. Healthy, sane people do not just start shooting at people. If there is any blame to be placed it would be on any people who saw this coming and didn't try to get the man help.
A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects. - -Lazarus Long, Time Enough For Love
Of course, he is nuts. But, I am just making the point that it could be argued both ways. But, when a nutcase gets disappointed, and he got disappointed because he believed that God will save him from all problems, the outcome will not be good. Sanity demands that religion be taken with a pinch of salt.
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I don't think he was crazy at all. I think he was overcome by evil. If you read what happened, he was completely lucid and planned the whole thing in great detail. Crazy people do not write clear letters of intent to their wives, spend the morning delivering milk, then shoot up a school of little girls. Let's not confuse evil with insanity (which is an inability to recognize your own actions).
"You act like jew." -Score: 1.0 (3 votes).
Red Stateler wrote:
I think he was overcome by evil.
please. This is more supernaturalist nonsense.
A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects. - -Lazarus Long, Time Enough For Love
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If you're gonna quote something, make sure you understand it first. Ok? :)
-- Mit viel Oktan und frei von Blei, eine Kraftstoff wie Benziiiiiiin!
I do, and that's kind of the point.
"You act like jew." -Score: 1.0 (3 votes).
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Red Stateler wrote:
I think he was overcome by evil.
As in, the 'devil' made him do it? :confused: :omg:
"Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind." - Dr. Seuss
As in whatever your concept of evil may be, we need to differentiate between evil and simple madness. The failure to recognize evil is my primary complaint with atheism.
"You act like jew." -Score: 1.0 (3 votes).
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I do, and that's kind of the point.
"You act like jew." -Score: 1.0 (3 votes).
Well, you're not demonstrating it.
-- Mit viel Oktan und frei von Blei, eine Kraftstoff wie Benziiiiiiin!
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Actually there's a specific sin that denotes rejection of Christianity. Otherwise, sin itself is recognized by Christians as an inherent part of the human condition.
"You act like jew." -Score: 1.0 (3 votes).
So what makes you think this bastard rejected Christianity rather than simply sinning? Just the fact that he expressed anger towards God?
"Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind." - Dr. Seuss
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Red Stateler wrote:
I think he was overcome by evil.
please. This is more supernaturalist nonsense.
A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects. - -Lazarus Long, Time Enough For Love
Congratulations. You just justified his actions as...reasonable.
"You act like jew." -Score: 1.0 (3 votes).
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Well, you're not demonstrating it.
-- Mit viel Oktan und frei von Blei, eine Kraftstoff wie Benziiiiiiin!
Neither was Mike Mullikin "angry with God" reference. Again...Kind of the point.
"You act like jew." -Score: 1.0 (3 votes).
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Neither was Mike Mullikin "angry with God" reference. Again...Kind of the point.
"You act like jew." -Score: 1.0 (3 votes).
Bullshit. :)
-- Mit viel Oktan und frei von Blei, eine Kraftstoff wie Benziiiiiiin!
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Congratulations. You just justified his actions as...reasonable.
"You act like jew." -Score: 1.0 (3 votes).
Red Stateler wrote:
Congratulations. You just justified his actions as...reasonable.
No, he said you are a fucking head case sprouting Jesus jiberish. You said that he said the shooters actions were reasonable. If you have any doubts scroll back up and look at who has reasnable in their post.
Michael Martin Australia "I controlled my laughter and simple said "No,I am very busy,so I can't write any code for you". The moment they heard this all the smiling face turned into a sad looking face and one of them farted. So I had to leave the place as soon as possible." - Mr.Prakash 24/04/2004
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As in whatever your concept of evil may be, we need to differentiate between evil and simple madness. The failure to recognize evil is my primary complaint with atheism.
"You act like jew." -Score: 1.0 (3 votes).
Through literature and/or Hollywood I've always thought of evil as having it's origin in the devil (Satan, Beelzebub, Lucifer, Mephistopheles, Prince of Darkness). Care to elaborate? P.S. When a crime is committed, how do we decide if it was madness, evil or contempt for the law?
"Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind." - Dr. Seuss