Poor experience with Vista today
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I've put together a new computer today, dual Opteron 2.6 GHz, 2 GB RAM (ECC REG), ATI X1650 Pro, Silicon Image onboard SATA raid controller + SATA drives. Should be sufficient for Vista Ultimate. First problem was that the setup didn't had the driver for the Silicon Image RAID controller, so Setup couldn't detect the hard drives. The XP drivers didn't worked, but luckily there where some drivers for Vista Beta 2 on the Silicon Image website. Setup loaded the driver from the USB key flawlessly and the installation went smooth and fast, until the computer rebooted during the performance rating. After the reboot Vista asked me again to create a user account, unfortunately my account was already created last time and I couldn't skip the dialog, so I had to create a dummy account. Finaly Vista welcomed me with the Basic UI, because it didn't had the drivers for the X1650 Pro. Instead a "LE 750 WDDM" (or similar) driver had been installed and the PC crashed once every minute. I couldn't even install the correct driver. I've then exchanged the X1650 with a 7600GS and Vista detected the graphic card correctly and already had the drivers. Everything seemed to be fine and stable then, the performance rating was 4.2 for the graphic card, 4.9 for the memory, 5.1 for the CPUs and 5.5 for the HDs. I then started to change some settings and the screen frequently turned black and I always had to reboot. After a while I got the idea that that happens everytime after I confirmed the UAC prompt, or when the UAC prompt should have been shown. Not every time, but in about 3/4 of the cases. Luckily I was able to disable UAC using MSCONFIG and then I could change all settings without a problem. All settings but the desktop background. The screen turned black then again. I don't know wheter a new graphic card driver will solve the problem, but Vista has definitely made my day X| I'm glad that I'm sitting on my old dual P3 now, with passively cooled CPUs. Rock stable with XP SP2 and runs Vista in VMWare without a problem :rolleyes: Vista reminded me of the glorious days of Win95 A X| I'll stick with XP and Server 2003 until Longhorn Server and Vista SP1 is available. I'm not saying that Vista is a bad OS, if it would be stable and all drivers were available it would be better than XP. Well, atleast after disabling UAC, Sidebar, Windows Defender, Auto Update, ... and getting a replacement for the crippled Explorer. X|
Interestingly, my friend was swearing at Vista just yesterday :-) We went to Bestbuy and he bought himself an iPod. Unfortunately iTunes had an incompatibility with Vista (which is what he had in his laptop). The stupid iPod does not provide a direct USB disk interface - so there was no alternate way to copy music into it. I can't believe people buy that sort of dumbed down device. Anyway we returned it and got a Samsung player - less than half the price of the iPod, works fine on Vista :-)
Regards, Nish
Nish’s thoughts on MFC, C++/CLI and .NET (my blog)
Currently working on C++/CLI in Action for Manning Publications. (*Sample chapter available online*) -
Interestingly, my friend was swearing at Vista just yesterday :-) We went to Bestbuy and he bought himself an iPod. Unfortunately iTunes had an incompatibility with Vista (which is what he had in his laptop). The stupid iPod does not provide a direct USB disk interface - so there was no alternate way to copy music into it. I can't believe people buy that sort of dumbed down device. Anyway we returned it and got a Samsung player - less than half the price of the iPod, works fine on Vista :-)
Regards, Nish
Nish’s thoughts on MFC, C++/CLI and .NET (my blog)
Currently working on C++/CLI in Action for Manning Publications. (*Sample chapter available online*)I've installed Vista Enterprise on a 'out of the box' Fujitsu Athlon64 last month without any problem. I haven't done anything with the PC because it was too slow as a replacement for my main machine, but everything seemed to run fine. The problem with Vista is that sooner or later a problem my spoil the day, and the goodies Vista has to ofter a not worth that.
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I've put together a new computer today, dual Opteron 2.6 GHz, 2 GB RAM (ECC REG), ATI X1650 Pro, Silicon Image onboard SATA raid controller + SATA drives. Should be sufficient for Vista Ultimate. First problem was that the setup didn't had the driver for the Silicon Image RAID controller, so Setup couldn't detect the hard drives. The XP drivers didn't worked, but luckily there where some drivers for Vista Beta 2 on the Silicon Image website. Setup loaded the driver from the USB key flawlessly and the installation went smooth and fast, until the computer rebooted during the performance rating. After the reboot Vista asked me again to create a user account, unfortunately my account was already created last time and I couldn't skip the dialog, so I had to create a dummy account. Finaly Vista welcomed me with the Basic UI, because it didn't had the drivers for the X1650 Pro. Instead a "LE 750 WDDM" (or similar) driver had been installed and the PC crashed once every minute. I couldn't even install the correct driver. I've then exchanged the X1650 with a 7600GS and Vista detected the graphic card correctly and already had the drivers. Everything seemed to be fine and stable then, the performance rating was 4.2 for the graphic card, 4.9 for the memory, 5.1 for the CPUs and 5.5 for the HDs. I then started to change some settings and the screen frequently turned black and I always had to reboot. After a while I got the idea that that happens everytime after I confirmed the UAC prompt, or when the UAC prompt should have been shown. Not every time, but in about 3/4 of the cases. Luckily I was able to disable UAC using MSCONFIG and then I could change all settings without a problem. All settings but the desktop background. The screen turned black then again. I don't know wheter a new graphic card driver will solve the problem, but Vista has definitely made my day X| I'm glad that I'm sitting on my old dual P3 now, with passively cooled CPUs. Rock stable with XP SP2 and runs Vista in VMWare without a problem :rolleyes: Vista reminded me of the glorious days of Win95 A X| I'll stick with XP and Server 2003 until Longhorn Server and Vista SP1 is available. I'm not saying that Vista is a bad OS, if it would be stable and all drivers were available it would be better than XP. Well, atleast after disabling UAC, Sidebar, Windows Defender, Auto Update, ... and getting a replacement for the crippled Explorer. X|
Are you saying that lack of Vista comparable drivers is MS fault? If yes how so? You should have verified with hardware manufacturers that they have the Vista comparable drivers before you bought your hardware. If you did it your experience with Vista would have been much smoother.
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I've put together a new computer today, dual Opteron 2.6 GHz, 2 GB RAM (ECC REG), ATI X1650 Pro, Silicon Image onboard SATA raid controller + SATA drives. Should be sufficient for Vista Ultimate. First problem was that the setup didn't had the driver for the Silicon Image RAID controller, so Setup couldn't detect the hard drives. The XP drivers didn't worked, but luckily there where some drivers for Vista Beta 2 on the Silicon Image website. Setup loaded the driver from the USB key flawlessly and the installation went smooth and fast, until the computer rebooted during the performance rating. After the reboot Vista asked me again to create a user account, unfortunately my account was already created last time and I couldn't skip the dialog, so I had to create a dummy account. Finaly Vista welcomed me with the Basic UI, because it didn't had the drivers for the X1650 Pro. Instead a "LE 750 WDDM" (or similar) driver had been installed and the PC crashed once every minute. I couldn't even install the correct driver. I've then exchanged the X1650 with a 7600GS and Vista detected the graphic card correctly and already had the drivers. Everything seemed to be fine and stable then, the performance rating was 4.2 for the graphic card, 4.9 for the memory, 5.1 for the CPUs and 5.5 for the HDs. I then started to change some settings and the screen frequently turned black and I always had to reboot. After a while I got the idea that that happens everytime after I confirmed the UAC prompt, or when the UAC prompt should have been shown. Not every time, but in about 3/4 of the cases. Luckily I was able to disable UAC using MSCONFIG and then I could change all settings without a problem. All settings but the desktop background. The screen turned black then again. I don't know wheter a new graphic card driver will solve the problem, but Vista has definitely made my day X| I'm glad that I'm sitting on my old dual P3 now, with passively cooled CPUs. Rock stable with XP SP2 and runs Vista in VMWare without a problem :rolleyes: Vista reminded me of the glorious days of Win95 A X| I'll stick with XP and Server 2003 until Longhorn Server and Vista SP1 is available. I'm not saying that Vista is a bad OS, if it would be stable and all drivers were available it would be better than XP. Well, atleast after disabling UAC, Sidebar, Windows Defender, Auto Update, ... and getting a replacement for the crippled Explorer. X|
Pretty much all vista graphics drivers are beta right now. Hang in there.
Found on Bash.org [erno] hm. I've lost a machine.. literally _lost_. it responds to ping, it works completely, I just can't figure out where in my apartment it is.
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Are you saying that lack of Vista comparable drivers is MS fault? If yes how so? You should have verified with hardware manufacturers that they have the Vista comparable drivers before you bought your hardware. If you did it your experience with Vista would have been much smoother.
Igor Vigdorchik wrote:
Are you saying that lack of Vista comparable drivers is MS fault? If yes how so?
An OS without drivers is useless. And Linux is often blamed for the lack of drivers. Microsoft has decided to break compatibility with XP drivers so it's their task to ensure that new drivers are available. I don't care who to blame, at the end of the day it is Vista that crashes. And the box of the X1650 says certified for Vista, and there weren't even Vista drivers on the CD. They are available on the ATI (AMD) website, but if Vista can't even load a stable default VGA driver until I get the chance to install the right driver, then it is indeed Microsofts fault.
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Are you saying that lack of Vista comparable drivers is MS fault? If yes how so? You should have verified with hardware manufacturers that they have the Vista comparable drivers before you bought your hardware. If you did it your experience with Vista would have been much smoother.
Igor Vigdorchik wrote:
Are you saying that lack of Vista comparable drivers is MS fault? If yes how so?
I don't think he said anything about Microsoft being at fault here. He had a poor experience with Vista and he posted about it. Irrespective of whether there's anyone at fault here, the core fact is that until all popular hardware vendors provide proper driver support for Vista, using it is always going to be a bit of a gamble.
Regards, Nish
Nish’s thoughts on MFC, C++/CLI and .NET (my blog)
Currently working on C++/CLI in Action for Manning Publications. (*Sample chapter available online*) -
Igor Vigdorchik wrote:
Are you saying that lack of Vista comparable drivers is MS fault? If yes how so?
I don't think he said anything about Microsoft being at fault here. He had a poor experience with Vista and he posted about it. Irrespective of whether there's anyone at fault here, the core fact is that until all popular hardware vendors provide proper driver support for Vista, using it is always going to be a bit of a gamble.
Regards, Nish
Nish’s thoughts on MFC, C++/CLI and .NET (my blog)
Currently working on C++/CLI in Action for Manning Publications. (*Sample chapter available online*)Exactly. My main message was that it could be risky to rely on a Vista machine. I definitely wouldn't install Vista on a stable running XP system if that is your main workstation which you need for your everyday work. I would only recommend to install it on a new system and then try wheter all the drivers are available and stable and if all applications run before you format your old PC.
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Igor Vigdorchik wrote:
Are you saying that lack of Vista comparable drivers is MS fault? If yes how so?
I don't think he said anything about Microsoft being at fault here. He had a poor experience with Vista and he posted about it. Irrespective of whether there's anyone at fault here, the core fact is that until all popular hardware vendors provide proper driver support for Vista, using it is always going to be a bit of a gamble.
Regards, Nish
Nish’s thoughts on MFC, C++/CLI and .NET (my blog)
Currently working on C++/CLI in Action for Manning Publications. (*Sample chapter available online*)Nishant Sivakumar wrote:
I don't think he said anything
That's why I asked him a question whether I understood him the way I did.
Nishant Sivakumar wrote:
it is always going to be a bit of a gamble
Not exactly. MS provided the Windows Vista Upgrade Advisor that would scan your system and create a software and hardware comparability report. In my case it was very accurate.
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Igor Vigdorchik wrote:
Are you saying that lack of Vista comparable drivers is MS fault? If yes how so?
An OS without drivers is useless. And Linux is often blamed for the lack of drivers. Microsoft has decided to break compatibility with XP drivers so it's their task to ensure that new drivers are available. I don't care who to blame, at the end of the day it is Vista that crashes. And the box of the X1650 says certified for Vista, and there weren't even Vista drivers on the CD. They are available on the ATI (AMD) website, but if Vista can't even load a stable default VGA driver until I get the chance to install the right driver, then it is indeed Microsofts fault.
The following tools can be of help: Windows Vista Upgrade Advisor[^] Driver Detective[^]
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Nishant Sivakumar wrote:
I don't think he said anything
That's why I asked him a question whether I understood him the way I did.
Nishant Sivakumar wrote:
it is always going to be a bit of a gamble
Not exactly. MS provided the Windows Vista Upgrade Advisor that would scan your system and create a software and hardware comparability report. In my case it was very accurate.
Igor Vigdorchik wrote:
Not exactly. MS provided the Windows Vista Upgrade Advisor that would scan your system and create a software and hardware comparability report. In my case it was very accurate.
That's fine when you're upgrading your PC, but not if you're building a new one.
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I've put together a new computer today, dual Opteron 2.6 GHz, 2 GB RAM (ECC REG), ATI X1650 Pro, Silicon Image onboard SATA raid controller + SATA drives. Should be sufficient for Vista Ultimate. First problem was that the setup didn't had the driver for the Silicon Image RAID controller, so Setup couldn't detect the hard drives. The XP drivers didn't worked, but luckily there where some drivers for Vista Beta 2 on the Silicon Image website. Setup loaded the driver from the USB key flawlessly and the installation went smooth and fast, until the computer rebooted during the performance rating. After the reboot Vista asked me again to create a user account, unfortunately my account was already created last time and I couldn't skip the dialog, so I had to create a dummy account. Finaly Vista welcomed me with the Basic UI, because it didn't had the drivers for the X1650 Pro. Instead a "LE 750 WDDM" (or similar) driver had been installed and the PC crashed once every minute. I couldn't even install the correct driver. I've then exchanged the X1650 with a 7600GS and Vista detected the graphic card correctly and already had the drivers. Everything seemed to be fine and stable then, the performance rating was 4.2 for the graphic card, 4.9 for the memory, 5.1 for the CPUs and 5.5 for the HDs. I then started to change some settings and the screen frequently turned black and I always had to reboot. After a while I got the idea that that happens everytime after I confirmed the UAC prompt, or when the UAC prompt should have been shown. Not every time, but in about 3/4 of the cases. Luckily I was able to disable UAC using MSCONFIG and then I could change all settings without a problem. All settings but the desktop background. The screen turned black then again. I don't know wheter a new graphic card driver will solve the problem, but Vista has definitely made my day X| I'm glad that I'm sitting on my old dual P3 now, with passively cooled CPUs. Rock stable with XP SP2 and runs Vista in VMWare without a problem :rolleyes: Vista reminded me of the glorious days of Win95 A X| I'll stick with XP and Server 2003 until Longhorn Server and Vista SP1 is available. I'm not saying that Vista is a bad OS, if it would be stable and all drivers were available it would be better than XP. Well, atleast after disabling UAC, Sidebar, Windows Defender, Auto Update, ... and getting a replacement for the crippled Explorer. X|
No offense, but did you even think that it might be wise to check the hardware manufacturers site for Vista drivers BEFORE making your hardware selections? Or perhaps to check against the Vista HCL to seeif the choices were already listed? You blame your misadventures on Vista, but frankly, you made some really stupid choices, not the least of which was trying an install before finding out if your HW was compatible.
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I've put together a new computer today, dual Opteron 2.6 GHz, 2 GB RAM (ECC REG), ATI X1650 Pro, Silicon Image onboard SATA raid controller + SATA drives. Should be sufficient for Vista Ultimate. First problem was that the setup didn't had the driver for the Silicon Image RAID controller, so Setup couldn't detect the hard drives. The XP drivers didn't worked, but luckily there where some drivers for Vista Beta 2 on the Silicon Image website. Setup loaded the driver from the USB key flawlessly and the installation went smooth and fast, until the computer rebooted during the performance rating. After the reboot Vista asked me again to create a user account, unfortunately my account was already created last time and I couldn't skip the dialog, so I had to create a dummy account. Finaly Vista welcomed me with the Basic UI, because it didn't had the drivers for the X1650 Pro. Instead a "LE 750 WDDM" (or similar) driver had been installed and the PC crashed once every minute. I couldn't even install the correct driver. I've then exchanged the X1650 with a 7600GS and Vista detected the graphic card correctly and already had the drivers. Everything seemed to be fine and stable then, the performance rating was 4.2 for the graphic card, 4.9 for the memory, 5.1 for the CPUs and 5.5 for the HDs. I then started to change some settings and the screen frequently turned black and I always had to reboot. After a while I got the idea that that happens everytime after I confirmed the UAC prompt, or when the UAC prompt should have been shown. Not every time, but in about 3/4 of the cases. Luckily I was able to disable UAC using MSCONFIG and then I could change all settings without a problem. All settings but the desktop background. The screen turned black then again. I don't know wheter a new graphic card driver will solve the problem, but Vista has definitely made my day X| I'm glad that I'm sitting on my old dual P3 now, with passively cooled CPUs. Rock stable with XP SP2 and runs Vista in VMWare without a problem :rolleyes: Vista reminded me of the glorious days of Win95 A X| I'll stick with XP and Server 2003 until Longhorn Server and Vista SP1 is available. I'm not saying that Vista is a bad OS, if it would be stable and all drivers were available it would be better than XP. Well, atleast after disabling UAC, Sidebar, Windows Defender, Auto Update, ... and getting a replacement for the crippled Explorer. X|
if it makes you feel any better Iam waiting till service pack 1 of vista is out before I start playing with it. I have been debating buying a new laptop with vista already installed so I can start playing with it, but I think the cost of them at the moment is enough to put me off, as there is not enough attraction there for me. I think a move to vista is still about a year away for myself.
Kind Regards, Gary
My Website || My Blog || My Articles
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Igor Vigdorchik wrote:
Not exactly. MS provided the Windows Vista Upgrade Advisor that would scan your system and create a software and hardware comparability report. In my case it was very accurate.
That's fine when you're upgrading your PC, but not if you're building a new one.
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I've put together a new computer today, dual Opteron 2.6 GHz, 2 GB RAM (ECC REG), ATI X1650 Pro, Silicon Image onboard SATA raid controller + SATA drives. Should be sufficient for Vista Ultimate. First problem was that the setup didn't had the driver for the Silicon Image RAID controller, so Setup couldn't detect the hard drives. The XP drivers didn't worked, but luckily there where some drivers for Vista Beta 2 on the Silicon Image website. Setup loaded the driver from the USB key flawlessly and the installation went smooth and fast, until the computer rebooted during the performance rating. After the reboot Vista asked me again to create a user account, unfortunately my account was already created last time and I couldn't skip the dialog, so I had to create a dummy account. Finaly Vista welcomed me with the Basic UI, because it didn't had the drivers for the X1650 Pro. Instead a "LE 750 WDDM" (or similar) driver had been installed and the PC crashed once every minute. I couldn't even install the correct driver. I've then exchanged the X1650 with a 7600GS and Vista detected the graphic card correctly and already had the drivers. Everything seemed to be fine and stable then, the performance rating was 4.2 for the graphic card, 4.9 for the memory, 5.1 for the CPUs and 5.5 for the HDs. I then started to change some settings and the screen frequently turned black and I always had to reboot. After a while I got the idea that that happens everytime after I confirmed the UAC prompt, or when the UAC prompt should have been shown. Not every time, but in about 3/4 of the cases. Luckily I was able to disable UAC using MSCONFIG and then I could change all settings without a problem. All settings but the desktop background. The screen turned black then again. I don't know wheter a new graphic card driver will solve the problem, but Vista has definitely made my day X| I'm glad that I'm sitting on my old dual P3 now, with passively cooled CPUs. Rock stable with XP SP2 and runs Vista in VMWare without a problem :rolleyes: Vista reminded me of the glorious days of Win95 A X| I'll stick with XP and Server 2003 until Longhorn Server and Vista SP1 is available. I'm not saying that Vista is a bad OS, if it would be stable and all drivers were available it would be better than XP. Well, atleast after disabling UAC, Sidebar, Windows Defender, Auto Update, ... and getting a replacement for the crippled Explorer. X|
You can hit Alt+C at a UAC prompt for Continue. The first thing I do is turn off the group policy setting that makes UAC use the secure desktop. My nVidia drivers are still flaky when I'm running two monitors, and switching to the secure desktop takes about 3 seconds. X|
--Mike-- Visual C++ MVP :cool: LINKS~! Ericahist | PimpFish | CP SearchBar v3.0 | C++ Forum FAQ Ford, what's this fish doing in my ear?
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Igor Vigdorchik wrote:
Are you saying that lack of Vista comparable drivers is MS fault? If yes how so?
An OS without drivers is useless. And Linux is often blamed for the lack of drivers. Microsoft has decided to break compatibility with XP drivers so it's their task to ensure that new drivers are available. I don't care who to blame, at the end of the day it is Vista that crashes. And the box of the X1650 says certified for Vista, and there weren't even Vista drivers on the CD. They are available on the ATI (AMD) website, but if Vista can't even load a stable default VGA driver until I get the chance to install the right driver, then it is indeed Microsofts fault.
Andre Buenger wrote:
Microsoft has decided to break compatibility with XP drivers so it's their task to ensure that new drivers are available.
I disagree. This is the hardware manufacturers responsibility. Driver development SW kits for Vista have been available for well over a year. Any manufacturer selling PC hardware today has a responsibility to either provide compatible drivers or clearly state that they are not compatible. Microsoft can't be held responsible here at all. Most hardware has proprietary features that the manufacturer will not share with anyone, so only they can realistically write the drivers.
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The X1650 as well as the 7600GS are supposed to run under Vista, the box even says certified for Vista. Also for some people other requirements are more important than Vista, there is no real benefit that Vista has to offer over XP. So if Vista doesn't run I'll install XP on the new machine and Microsoft has lost a sale. That's it.
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The X1650 as well as the 7600GS are supposed to run under Vista, the box even says certified for Vista. Also for some people other requirements are more important than Vista, there is no real benefit that Vista has to offer over XP. So if Vista doesn't run I'll install XP on the new machine and Microsoft has lost a sale. That's it.
Andre Buenger wrote:
The X1650 as well as the 7600GS are supposed to run under Vista, the box even says certified for Vista.
I would be calling the manufacturer then, and asking them to back up their "certified for Vista" claim. Again, you are blaming the wrong folks.
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Andre Buenger wrote:
Microsoft has decided to break compatibility with XP drivers so it's their task to ensure that new drivers are available.
I disagree. This is the hardware manufacturers responsibility. Driver development SW kits for Vista have been available for well over a year. Any manufacturer selling PC hardware today has a responsibility to either provide compatible drivers or clearly state that they are not compatible. Microsoft can't be held responsible here at all. Most hardware has proprietary features that the manufacturer will not share with anyone, so only they can realistically write the drivers.
Microsoft and the hardware manufacturers are sitting in the same boat. Do you really believe that an average Joe who has just spent $500 on Vista Ultimate retail cares who to blame? Microsoft sold a DVD with Vista and drivers and it doesn't run. And if the box says certified for Vista and both the ATI and Nvidia card doesn't work properly, than I wonder who gave them the certification.
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Andre Buenger wrote:
The X1650 as well as the 7600GS are supposed to run under Vista, the box even says certified for Vista.
I would be calling the manufacturer then, and asking them to back up their "certified for Vista" claim. Again, you are blaming the wrong folks.
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You're claiming that Microsoft is responsible for every hardware manufacturer who claims that their hardware runs on Vista ?
Christian Graus - Microsoft MVP - C++ Metal Musings - Rex and my new metal blog "I am working on a project that will convert a FORTRAN code to corresponding C++ code.I am not aware of FORTRAN syntax" ( spotted in the C++/CLI forum )