Is this normal teenage behavior?
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Let's see. Monday a kid in 10th grade was caught drinking in the bathroom and suspended for a week. Last week, two kids skipped P.E. and were suspended for a day (seems a bit harsh there). Last year's senior class trip to Italy (yeah, wow, I know) had several incidences of drinking. Last year, most of the senior class was caught drinking around a bonfire (without permission for that) on school grounds (by the lake) at 11:30 PM. It seems I've picked a Waldorf school that is apparently known for its highschool drinking issues. Anyways, what's your experience with your kid(s) in highschool and their peers? Is this typical? Especially, is it typical for a private school? Granted, parents often choose Waldorf as the last option/hope for their already screwed up kid (I place the responsibility of all of this behavior squarely on the shoulders of the parents, BTW, not the school). Marc
People are just notoriously impossible. --DavidCrow
There's NO excuse for not commenting your code. -- John Simmons / outlaw programmer
People who say that they will refactor their code later to make it "good" don't understand refactoring, nor the art and craft of programming. -- Josh SmithExcept for the drinking in school, sounds pretty mild to me.
Anyone who thinks he has a better idea of what's good for people than people do is a swine. - P.J. O'Rourke
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Let's see. Monday a kid in 10th grade was caught drinking in the bathroom and suspended for a week. Last week, two kids skipped P.E. and were suspended for a day (seems a bit harsh there). Last year's senior class trip to Italy (yeah, wow, I know) had several incidences of drinking. Last year, most of the senior class was caught drinking around a bonfire (without permission for that) on school grounds (by the lake) at 11:30 PM. It seems I've picked a Waldorf school that is apparently known for its highschool drinking issues. Anyways, what's your experience with your kid(s) in highschool and their peers? Is this typical? Especially, is it typical for a private school? Granted, parents often choose Waldorf as the last option/hope for their already screwed up kid (I place the responsibility of all of this behavior squarely on the shoulders of the parents, BTW, not the school). Marc
People are just notoriously impossible. --DavidCrow
There's NO excuse for not commenting your code. -- John Simmons / outlaw programmer
People who say that they will refactor their code later to make it "good" don't understand refactoring, nor the art and craft of programming. -- Josh SmithMarc Clifton wrote:
I place the responsibility of all of this behavior squarely on the shoulders of the parents
I place it on the shoulders of the fifteen and sixteen year olds. After a certain point, there isn't a whole hell of a lot you can do as a parent. My wife and prepared, and are still preparing, our kids the best we can then just cross our fingers. (And, hopefully, you don't have a teenager like my oldest. Thankfully, she didn't quite go completely over the edge like too many of her friends--for one, I'm still not a grandfather.)
Anyone who thinks he has a better idea of what's good for people than people do is a swine. - P.J. O'Rourke
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Let's see. Monday a kid in 10th grade was caught drinking in the bathroom and suspended for a week. Last week, two kids skipped P.E. and were suspended for a day (seems a bit harsh there). Last year's senior class trip to Italy (yeah, wow, I know) had several incidences of drinking. Last year, most of the senior class was caught drinking around a bonfire (without permission for that) on school grounds (by the lake) at 11:30 PM. It seems I've picked a Waldorf school that is apparently known for its highschool drinking issues. Anyways, what's your experience with your kid(s) in highschool and their peers? Is this typical? Especially, is it typical for a private school? Granted, parents often choose Waldorf as the last option/hope for their already screwed up kid (I place the responsibility of all of this behavior squarely on the shoulders of the parents, BTW, not the school). Marc
People are just notoriously impossible. --DavidCrow
There's NO excuse for not commenting your code. -- John Simmons / outlaw programmer
People who say that they will refactor their code later to make it "good" don't understand refactoring, nor the art and craft of programming. -- Josh SmithThis one time, at band camp...
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Let's see. Monday a kid in 10th grade was caught drinking in the bathroom and suspended for a week. Last week, two kids skipped P.E. and were suspended for a day (seems a bit harsh there). Last year's senior class trip to Italy (yeah, wow, I know) had several incidences of drinking. Last year, most of the senior class was caught drinking around a bonfire (without permission for that) on school grounds (by the lake) at 11:30 PM. It seems I've picked a Waldorf school that is apparently known for its highschool drinking issues. Anyways, what's your experience with your kid(s) in highschool and their peers? Is this typical? Especially, is it typical for a private school? Granted, parents often choose Waldorf as the last option/hope for their already screwed up kid (I place the responsibility of all of this behavior squarely on the shoulders of the parents, BTW, not the school). Marc
People are just notoriously impossible. --DavidCrow
There's NO excuse for not commenting your code. -- John Simmons / outlaw programmer
People who say that they will refactor their code later to make it "good" don't understand refactoring, nor the art and craft of programming. -- Josh SmithDepends on how you define normal. In my home... no that would not be normal. Not that I plan on being mega-strict. I don't at all. I plan on discussing things with my kids to the point they understand them fully. If my kids choose to drink and be sexually active there's not much I can do by that time so I won't go off and become mega-strict to stop it. But my definition of those behaviors is that no it isn't normal. The drinking age is 21 in Idaho drinking at that point in time (if you feel the need to) is normal behavior. I've never drank in my life and after watching alcoholism destroy one family and kill a few friends on the road I've concluded that alcohol is the worst thing to ever happen to the U.S. and the fact it's legal (while killing so many people every year) baffles me. So... nope! Not normal. Irresponsible, immature and worthy of a nice long and friendly chat. I don't believe that when your kids are teenagers you should use intimidation or an over-bearing method to try and sway them. You have to inform them concisely and trust them to make a *good* choice and that definition of *good* will vary for certain. I had the time of my life as a teenager. I did it soberly and without sex and I remember all of it and have stories my peers now wish they had. We hiked, raced mountain bikes, swept soccer tournaments and had one amazing experience after the next. That's the stuff that seems normal to me but then again most have never considered me normal so take my comments with a grain of salt. I'm probably stuffy and old school by most standards...:rose:
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Let's see. Monday a kid in 10th grade was caught drinking in the bathroom and suspended for a week. Last week, two kids skipped P.E. and were suspended for a day (seems a bit harsh there). Last year's senior class trip to Italy (yeah, wow, I know) had several incidences of drinking. Last year, most of the senior class was caught drinking around a bonfire (without permission for that) on school grounds (by the lake) at 11:30 PM. It seems I've picked a Waldorf school that is apparently known for its highschool drinking issues. Anyways, what's your experience with your kid(s) in highschool and their peers? Is this typical? Especially, is it typical for a private school? Granted, parents often choose Waldorf as the last option/hope for their already screwed up kid (I place the responsibility of all of this behavior squarely on the shoulders of the parents, BTW, not the school). Marc
People are just notoriously impossible. --DavidCrow
There's NO excuse for not commenting your code. -- John Simmons / outlaw programmer
People who say that they will refactor their code later to make it "good" don't understand refactoring, nor the art and craft of programming. -- Josh SmithThe only thing that's abnormal is that for an entire student body you don't have far worse instances to report. I'd tell you about my senior class trip, but I'm sworn to secrecy.;P
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Let's see. Monday a kid in 10th grade was caught drinking in the bathroom and suspended for a week. Last week, two kids skipped P.E. and were suspended for a day (seems a bit harsh there). Last year's senior class trip to Italy (yeah, wow, I know) had several incidences of drinking. Last year, most of the senior class was caught drinking around a bonfire (without permission for that) on school grounds (by the lake) at 11:30 PM. It seems I've picked a Waldorf school that is apparently known for its highschool drinking issues. Anyways, what's your experience with your kid(s) in highschool and their peers? Is this typical? Especially, is it typical for a private school? Granted, parents often choose Waldorf as the last option/hope for their already screwed up kid (I place the responsibility of all of this behavior squarely on the shoulders of the parents, BTW, not the school). Marc
People are just notoriously impossible. --DavidCrow
There's NO excuse for not commenting your code. -- John Simmons / outlaw programmer
People who say that they will refactor their code later to make it "good" don't understand refactoring, nor the art and craft of programming. -- Josh SmithMarc Clifton wrote:
Last year's senior class trip to Italy (yeah, wow, I know) had several incidences of drinking. Last year, most of the senior class was caught drinking around a bonfire (without permission for that) on school grounds (by the lake) at 11:30 PM.
I was blitzed pretty much the whole length of time between January 1 of my junior year and January 1 of my senior year in high school, so for me, anyway, this sounds pretty normal. I never drank during school or on school property, though. It was always at a house party or out in the country.
Jon Sagara Laziness is nothing more than the habit of resting before you get tired. -- Unknown Blog | Site | Articles
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How old are 10th graders ?
Marc Clifton wrote:
I place the responsibility of all of this behavior squarely on the shoulders of the parents, BTW, not the school
I agree with you.
Maximilien Lincourt Your Head A Splode - Strong Bad
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Marc Clifton wrote:
I place the responsibility of all of this behavior squarely on the shoulders of the parents
I place it on the shoulders of the fifteen and sixteen year olds. After a certain point, there isn't a whole hell of a lot you can do as a parent. My wife and prepared, and are still preparing, our kids the best we can then just cross our fingers. (And, hopefully, you don't have a teenager like my oldest. Thankfully, she didn't quite go completely over the edge like too many of her friends--for one, I'm still not a grandfather.)
Anyone who thinks he has a better idea of what's good for people than people do is a swine. - P.J. O'Rourke
Joe Woodbury wrote:
I place it on the shoulders of the fifteen and sixteen year olds.
Good point. The parents can't do much at this point anyways. Marc
People are just notoriously impossible. --DavidCrow
There's NO excuse for not commenting your code. -- John Simmons / outlaw programmer
People who say that they will refactor their code later to make it "good" don't understand refactoring, nor the art and craft of programming. -- Josh Smith -
Chris Austin wrote:
To me what is abnormal, is being caught or rather needing to show off in public.
That's what really amazes me. How stupid do you have to be to get caught drinking in the bathroom? Marc
People are just notoriously impossible. --DavidCrow
There's NO excuse for not commenting your code. -- John Simmons / outlaw programmer
People who say that they will refactor their code later to make it "good" don't understand refactoring, nor the art and craft of programming. -- Josh SmithMarc Clifton wrote:
How stupid do you have to be to get caught drinking in the bathroom?
Stupid enough to be drinking in a bathroom! X|
Simply Elegant Designs JimmyRopes Designs
Think inside the box! ProActive Secure Systems
I'm on-line therefore I am. JimmyRopes -
Let's see. Monday a kid in 10th grade was caught drinking in the bathroom and suspended for a week. Last week, two kids skipped P.E. and were suspended for a day (seems a bit harsh there). Last year's senior class trip to Italy (yeah, wow, I know) had several incidences of drinking. Last year, most of the senior class was caught drinking around a bonfire (without permission for that) on school grounds (by the lake) at 11:30 PM. It seems I've picked a Waldorf school that is apparently known for its highschool drinking issues. Anyways, what's your experience with your kid(s) in highschool and their peers? Is this typical? Especially, is it typical for a private school? Granted, parents often choose Waldorf as the last option/hope for their already screwed up kid (I place the responsibility of all of this behavior squarely on the shoulders of the parents, BTW, not the school). Marc
People are just notoriously impossible. --DavidCrow
There's NO excuse for not commenting your code. -- John Simmons / outlaw programmer
People who say that they will refactor their code later to make it "good" don't understand refactoring, nor the art and craft of programming. -- Josh SmithFrom everything I heard it doesn't sound terribly out of line for that age bracket. My girls are still younger (12 and 10) but my wife and I spend a great deal of effort trying to convince them to being leaders and not followers (we call it leaders and sheep) so that (hopefully) they will be independent and strong enough to resist the peer pressure to do things that they know in their heart is not appropriate. The other thing we focus on is problem solving and trying to get them to put aside emotions when they are presented with a problem and need to think it through. They routinely work through these steps: 1) What is the Problem? 2) Is it really a problem? (often it isn't) 3) What is the solution to the problem? From my viewpoint "everything" is a problem to be solved (some more important than others). If they can rationally solve the problems they run into (drinking, drugs, sex, bullying, schoolwork, peers, etc.) then hopefully they will get through the invincible teen years relatively unscathed. I think you have to start young with this approach because they sure wont listen to you when they are older. And I agree it sure isnt the responsibility of the school to teach this (but they sure can help with the process if they buy into it) Hopefully we successfully provided the girls with the tools in the toolbox to manage the challenges in life. Time will tell. Cheers, David
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Let's see. Monday a kid in 10th grade was caught drinking in the bathroom and suspended for a week. Last week, two kids skipped P.E. and were suspended for a day (seems a bit harsh there). Last year's senior class trip to Italy (yeah, wow, I know) had several incidences of drinking. Last year, most of the senior class was caught drinking around a bonfire (without permission for that) on school grounds (by the lake) at 11:30 PM. It seems I've picked a Waldorf school that is apparently known for its highschool drinking issues. Anyways, what's your experience with your kid(s) in highschool and their peers? Is this typical? Especially, is it typical for a private school? Granted, parents often choose Waldorf as the last option/hope for their already screwed up kid (I place the responsibility of all of this behavior squarely on the shoulders of the parents, BTW, not the school). Marc
People are just notoriously impossible. --DavidCrow
There's NO excuse for not commenting your code. -- John Simmons / outlaw programmer
People who say that they will refactor their code later to make it "good" don't understand refactoring, nor the art and craft of programming. -- Josh SmithThat all sounds like very typical teenage behaviour where I went to high school (in Aurora, an upper-middle-class suburb of Toronto) in the early 1990's I can't remember a single dance where there wasn't someone who spent the night in the washroom wishing they hadn't had too much to drink. And there was also a large portion of the school that "put the high in high-school". Many of them are doctors, lawyers, MBAs, professors, engineers (etc), so don't think that it will all end in disaster... :)
www.IconsReview.com[^] Huge list of stock icon collections (both free and commercial)
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Marc Clifton wrote:
I place the responsibility of all of this behavior squarely on the shoulders of the parents
I place it on the shoulders of the fifteen and sixteen year olds. After a certain point, there isn't a whole hell of a lot you can do as a parent. My wife and prepared, and are still preparing, our kids the best we can then just cross our fingers. (And, hopefully, you don't have a teenager like my oldest. Thankfully, she didn't quite go completely over the edge like too many of her friends--for one, I'm still not a grandfather.)
Anyone who thinks he has a better idea of what's good for people than people do is a swine. - P.J. O'Rourke
Joe Woodbury wrote:
I place it on the shoulders of the fifteen and sixteen year olds
Yep. They ain't babies no more. You've (hopefully) done all you could =well= before this point. For my daughter, it all hit RIGHT at 13. Well, we had rumbles before that, but she basically blew the hell apart. It started simmering down at 15, and now it's basically just dome building activity... Mostly about boyfriends and household rules and the constant yelling she can do - hoo boy.
Joe Woodbury wrote:
for one, I'm still not a grandfather
Preach it !! Thank god for birth control...:(( Sometimes it's mighty hard bein' a Dad... Almost as hard as it was bein THAT age. Wouldn't wanna go thru THAT again... ...Steve
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That all sounds like very typical teenage behaviour where I went to high school (in Aurora, an upper-middle-class suburb of Toronto) in the early 1990's I can't remember a single dance where there wasn't someone who spent the night in the washroom wishing they hadn't had too much to drink. And there was also a large portion of the school that "put the high in high-school". Many of them are doctors, lawyers, MBAs, professors, engineers (etc), so don't think that it will all end in disaster... :)
www.IconsReview.com[^] Huge list of stock icon collections (both free and commercial)
I'm in no way wanting to start a soapy war at all. Your comments just made me want to add this for other readers. Many of them may be doctors, lawyers, MBAs, professors and engineers but how many of them also struggle with alcohol addiction? That's the one thing you don't have to put on a job application or resume. Again, I don't add that to be argumentive just to point out that there's a flawed assumption in your statement that overlooks a very important detail of alcohol abuse and that detail would be addiction.
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This one time, at band camp...
Sunrise Wallpaper Project | The StartPage Randomizer | A Random Web Page
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Let's see. Monday a kid in 10th grade was caught drinking in the bathroom and suspended for a week. Last week, two kids skipped P.E. and were suspended for a day (seems a bit harsh there). Last year's senior class trip to Italy (yeah, wow, I know) had several incidences of drinking. Last year, most of the senior class was caught drinking around a bonfire (without permission for that) on school grounds (by the lake) at 11:30 PM. It seems I've picked a Waldorf school that is apparently known for its highschool drinking issues. Anyways, what's your experience with your kid(s) in highschool and their peers? Is this typical? Especially, is it typical for a private school? Granted, parents often choose Waldorf as the last option/hope for their already screwed up kid (I place the responsibility of all of this behavior squarely on the shoulders of the parents, BTW, not the school). Marc
People are just notoriously impossible. --DavidCrow
There's NO excuse for not commenting your code. -- John Simmons / outlaw programmer
People who say that they will refactor their code later to make it "good" don't understand refactoring, nor the art and craft of programming. -- Josh SmithIn my experience (public highschool in suburban/rural Georgia), it sounds like that's a relatively tame bunch of HS kids :) I myself didn't drink but a few times in HS (I hung out with the "smart" crowd, not the "cool" crowd, although they intersected a bit sometimes). I had a few friends who did a good bit of drinking towards the end of HS, and there were plenty more where that came from. There's even a picture of the "cool" crowds's drinking shack in my senior-year annual. I saved all of my drinking for my freshman and first sophomore year in college. At the start of my second sophomore year, I got a friendly letter from college saying that if I didn't get my grades up they were going to stop cashing my tuition checks. Bit of wake-up call there :laugh:. I actually wish I'd done more partying in HS, as I would have got it out of my system (and figured out how to deal with it) before I hit college, and I'd have been able to get my college degree with honors instead of being 2 tenths of a point shy. Crap - my GPA in college was under 3.00 from my third quarter freshman year until AFTER my grades were posted for my final semester 5 years later (3.01)! :laugh:
"I hope he can see this, because I'm doing it as hard as I can" - Ignignot
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Let's see. Monday a kid in 10th grade was caught drinking in the bathroom and suspended for a week. Last week, two kids skipped P.E. and were suspended for a day (seems a bit harsh there). Last year's senior class trip to Italy (yeah, wow, I know) had several incidences of drinking. Last year, most of the senior class was caught drinking around a bonfire (without permission for that) on school grounds (by the lake) at 11:30 PM. It seems I've picked a Waldorf school that is apparently known for its highschool drinking issues. Anyways, what's your experience with your kid(s) in highschool and their peers? Is this typical? Especially, is it typical for a private school? Granted, parents often choose Waldorf as the last option/hope for their already screwed up kid (I place the responsibility of all of this behavior squarely on the shoulders of the parents, BTW, not the school). Marc
People are just notoriously impossible. --DavidCrow
There's NO excuse for not commenting your code. -- John Simmons / outlaw programmer
People who say that they will refactor their code later to make it "good" don't understand refactoring, nor the art and craft of programming. -- Josh SmithOkay, my theory. If you have a 'wild' kid, no matter how much you try to teach them the principles, they will get into some trouble. Quiet kids you usually don't have a problem. There was no alcohol in my house. I learned about sex from late night HBO. My parents did not prepare me for anything. Plus it was a bad environment so I was a prime candidate for becoming 'troubled.' But I didn't. I didn't drink until I went to Australia in high school, and even after that I went to only two high school drinking parties (including the senior kegger). I drank in college--I was a bit severe in my freshman year. I've never tried pot or even cigarettes. Then I look at my classmate Danny. He comes from a prominent family of do-gooders. But Danny was the odd-ball. He constantly got into trouble including a high speed car chase during his junior year and in college he and his brother set off bottle rockets from a pipe while they were in a boat on the lake. One hit a 25 year old lady who had to have a hysterectomy and has hip problems. I think most kids are in the middle. They want to try, they want to fit it. It takes an awfully strong teenager to rise above the peer pressure. Unless it's YOUR kid caught in the bathroom I wouldn't worry. But then again, I don't have kids. And just an FYI, cockatoos don't like beer. Oh, and don't drink and combine at the same time.
_________________________________________ You can't fix stupid, but you can medicate crazy.
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Joe Woodbury wrote:
I place it on the shoulders of the fifteen and sixteen year olds
Yep. They ain't babies no more. You've (hopefully) done all you could =well= before this point. For my daughter, it all hit RIGHT at 13. Well, we had rumbles before that, but she basically blew the hell apart. It started simmering down at 15, and now it's basically just dome building activity... Mostly about boyfriends and household rules and the constant yelling she can do - hoo boy.
Joe Woodbury wrote:
for one, I'm still not a grandfather
Preach it !! Thank god for birth control...:(( Sometimes it's mighty hard bein' a Dad... Almost as hard as it was bein THAT age. Wouldn't wanna go thru THAT again... ...Steve
Steve Hazel wrote:
For my daughter, it all hit RIGHT at 13.
You're lucky, since my oldest girl was born, she wanted to be eighteen. Fortunately, our youngest, also a girl, now eleven, is pretty much the opposite. On the flip side, my almost nineteen-year-old not only just got her hair cutting license, but announced she's going to start college in the fall studying accounting. (Yes, we almost rushed her to Area 51 to make sure she wasn't an alien who had taken over her body:)) Now if only her fifteen year old brother would grow up....
Anyone who thinks he has a better idea of what's good for people than people do is a swine. - P.J. O'Rourke
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That all sounds like very typical teenage behaviour where I went to high school (in Aurora, an upper-middle-class suburb of Toronto) in the early 1990's I can't remember a single dance where there wasn't someone who spent the night in the washroom wishing they hadn't had too much to drink. And there was also a large portion of the school that "put the high in high-school". Many of them are doctors, lawyers, MBAs, professors, engineers (etc), so don't think that it will all end in disaster... :)
www.IconsReview.com[^] Huge list of stock icon collections (both free and commercial)
Warren Stevens wrote:
Many of them are doctors, lawyers, MBAs, professors, engineers (etc)
True, but some are jail, and others did not live long enough to graduate from high school. Chances are the successful ones would still have been successful without the alcohol and drugs, but there is a far better chance that the dead ones or the ones in jail would have turned out better without it.
You may be right
I may be crazy
-- Billy Joel --Within you lies the power for good, use it!!!
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I'm in no way wanting to start a soapy war at all. Your comments just made me want to add this for other readers. Many of them may be doctors, lawyers, MBAs, professors and engineers but how many of them also struggle with alcohol addiction? That's the one thing you don't have to put on a job application or resume. Again, I don't add that to be argumentive just to point out that there's a flawed assumption in your statement that overlooks a very important detail of alcohol abuse and that detail would be addiction.
code-frog wrote:
Many of them may be doctors, lawyers, MBAs, professors and engineers but how many of them also struggle with alcohol addiction? That's the one thing you don't have to put on a job application or resume.
Actually none of the people I was thinking about "struggle with alcohol addiction". Not everyone who drinks when they are teenagers turns into an alcoholic.
code-frog wrote:
very important detail of alcohol abuse and that detail would be addiction.
Alcohol is not addictive (chemically). My point was that finding out that your child drinks is not unusual or anything to really get freaked out about.
www.IconsReview.com[^] Huge list of stock icon collections (both free and commercial)
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code-frog wrote:
Many of them may be doctors, lawyers, MBAs, professors and engineers but how many of them also struggle with alcohol addiction? That's the one thing you don't have to put on a job application or resume.
Actually none of the people I was thinking about "struggle with alcohol addiction". Not everyone who drinks when they are teenagers turns into an alcoholic.
code-frog wrote:
very important detail of alcohol abuse and that detail would be addiction.
Alcohol is not addictive (chemically). My point was that finding out that your child drinks is not unusual or anything to really get freaked out about.
www.IconsReview.com[^] Huge list of stock icon collections (both free and commercial)
Again not going to go much past this reply but this statement:
Warren Stevens wrote:
Alcohol is not addictive (chemically).
Is utterly false. http://www.addictionrecov.org/cdwhat.htm#alcohol[^]