Did the Red Sea Part?
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It does sound silly when you present it that way, doesn't it? Of course, Christians don't present it that way. Christians believe that God parted the sea, not Moses. The only thing worth trying to attack in regards to what Christians believe is God himself. After all, if they believe in God, why should they have a problem with Him parting a sea? If they believe in God, why should they care whether there is enough "proof" that the sea was indeed parted? The beliefs of a Christian begin and end in God and those beliefs are not based on proof, but on faith. Admittedly, it does not make for a fair debate, but I'm not sure what debate has to do with it anyway. If the existence or non-existence of God could be proven, not many would be arguing one way or the other. But since it cannot, those who believe God is, take it on faith. Those who believe God isn't take it on faith.
Excellent, well said.
Tech, life, family, faith: Give me a visit. I'm currently blogging about: Passover: Do this in remembrance of Me The apostle Paul, modernly speaking: Epistles of Paul Judah Himango
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Exactly. I didn't say he was a Muslim. I said I suspect he is one given that he is a chief archeologist for that 90% Muslim nation and has a Muslim name.
Red Stateler wrote:
Exactly. I didn't say he was a Muslim. I said I suspect he is
Exactly, which is why i suggested that he could be coptic christian
Red Stateler wrote:
I suspect he is one given that he is a chief archeologist for that 90% Muslim nation and has a Muslim name.
That's racism...
Red Stateler wrote:
has a Muslim name
So Muslims can't have names such as Bob, Fred, John, Jane, or Sue. Egyptians can't have historical / region specific, popular names, even if they aren't Muslim?
I win because I have the most fun in life...
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"History is written by the winner" not precisely the quote, but the same gist.
I win because I have the most fun in life...
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Bassam Abdul-Baki wrote:
I'm not saying that I don't trust anything in history, I just find it interesting that what is taken to be true today, may turn out to be false tomorrow.
Welcome to the real world.
I believe the real world has been trademarked by MTV.
"He who joyfully marches to music in rank and file has already earned my contempt. He has been given a large brain by mistake, since for him, the spinal cord would fully suffice. This disgrace to civilization should be done away with at once. Heroism at command, senseless brutality, deplorable love-of-country stance, how violently I hate all this, how despicable an ignorable war is; I would rather be torn to shreds than be a part of so base an action! It is my conviction that killing under the cloak of war is nothing but an act of murder." - Albert Einstein Web - Blog - RSS - Math - LinkedIn - BM
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Red Stateler wrote:
There are numerous non-literal portions of the Bible (both old and new testament...see Revelations). But there are sections that are historical accounts and others that are not. That's nothing new.
I know, I know. God didn't seem to mind when you rejected his literal account of the creation of everything (even though his word is law!), so I'm sure he won't be upset about the Red Sea bit either. It's not like he's going to destroy the world or anything. I can't seem to figure out where the Egyptians got the horses to chase the Israelites though. God had killed all the livestock in Egypt that didn't belong to the Jews. Is that another mistranslation?
Young's Literal translation[^] (in short: a plague on all livestock, but only Egypt's cattle is mentioned as dying)
Tech, life, family, faith: Give me a visit. I'm currently blogging about: Passover: Do this in remembrance of Me The apostle Paul, modernly speaking: Epistles of Paul Judah Himango
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Exactly. I didn't say he was a Muslim. I said I suspect he is one given that he is a chief archeologist for that 90% Muslim nation and has a Muslim name.
Why do you call it a Muslim name? Yu do realie that Arab Christians and Druze also use these names. It's like calling your name a Christian name instead of an American one. Hmmm, maybe yours is a bad example. :confused:
"It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it." - Aristotle Web - Blog - RSS - Math - LinkedIn - BM
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It does sound silly when you present it that way, doesn't it? Of course, Christians don't present it that way. Christians believe that God parted the sea, not Moses. The only thing worth trying to attack in regards to what Christians believe is God himself. After all, if they believe in God, why should they have a problem with Him parting a sea? If they believe in God, why should they care whether there is enough "proof" that the sea was indeed parted? The beliefs of a Christian begin and end in God and those beliefs are not based on proof, but on faith. Admittedly, it does not make for a fair debate, but I'm not sure what debate has to do with it anyway. If the existence or non-existence of God could be proven, not many would be arguing one way or the other. But since it cannot, those who believe God is, take it on faith. Those who believe God isn't take it on faith.
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Le Centriste wrote:
Whatever, it is the same bullsh*t.
Yes. It's the same in that we can see here how atheism is a religion. Though this archeologist is likely a Muslim, we have several atheists jumping to his aid...Asserting truth based on a lack of evidence. That should be the antithesis of atheism, but because the assertion supports the dogma, it's defended.
Well said.
Tech, life, family, faith: Give me a visit. I'm currently blogging about: Passover: Do this in remembrance of Me The apostle Paul, modernly speaking: Epistles of Paul Judah Himango
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Le Centriste wrote:
If atheism is a religion, then not collecting stamps is a hobby
Although this is funny, I think it's a false analogy. Atheism is not simply a disregard for theism. It is not a lack of belief. Atheism is the acting belief that there is no God. Since it cannot be proven that there is no God, atheists take it on faith that there is no God. It is not as though theists have a belief and atheists don't (as the stamp-collecting analogy humorously suggests). Theists have a belief. They believe there is a God. Atheists have a belief. They believe there is no God. So, to correct (and unfortunately ruin) your analogy: If atheism is a religion, then collecting something other than stamps is a hobby. -- modified at 13:26 Tuesday 3rd April, 2007
Edmundisme wrote:
Atheists have a belief. They believe there is no God.
How is that different than the belief that there are no unicorns? Or Superman? Are those religions as well?
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Red Stateler wrote:
Exactly. I didn't say he was a Muslim. I said I suspect he is
Exactly, which is why i suggested that he could be coptic christian
Red Stateler wrote:
I suspect he is one given that he is a chief archeologist for that 90% Muslim nation and has a Muslim name.
That's racism...
Red Stateler wrote:
has a Muslim name
So Muslims can't have names such as Bob, Fred, John, Jane, or Sue. Egyptians can't have historical / region specific, popular names, even if they aren't Muslim?
I win because I have the most fun in life...
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Edmundisme wrote:
Atheists have a belief. They believe there is no God.
How is that different than the belief that there are no unicorns? Or Superman? Are those religions as well?
oilFactotum wrote:
How is that different than the belief that there are no unicorns? Or Superman? Are those religions as well?
No, because religion specifically deals in theology[^], which is the branch of philosophy dealing with the nature of God. Atheism[^] is a subset of theology, in that it seeks to define the nature of God (specifically stating that He has no nature). Agnosticism is the only true lack of religion, because it doesn't attempt to define God's nature. Stating there's no unicorns or Superman would fall under unicornology or Supermanology.
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VonHagNDaz wrote:
Red Stateler wrote: I suspect he is one given that he is a chief archeologist for that 90% Muslim nation and has a Muslim name. That's racism...
No, that's profiling.
Jimmanuel wrote:
No, that's profiling.
:laugh:
I win because I have the most fun in life...
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oilFactotum wrote:
How is that different than the belief that there are no unicorns? Or Superman? Are those religions as well?
No, because religion specifically deals in theology[^], which is the branch of philosophy dealing with the nature of God. Atheism[^] is a subset of theology, in that it seeks to define the nature of God (specifically stating that He has no nature). Agnosticism is the only true lack of religion, because it doesn't attempt to define God's nature. Stating there's no unicorns or Superman would fall under unicornology or Supermanology.
I don't believe you should name your son Theo. What religion would that fall under? :)
"He who joyfully marches to music in rank and file has already earned my contempt. He has been given a large brain by mistake, since for him, the spinal cord would fully suffice. This disgrace to civilization should be done away with at once. Heroism at command, senseless brutality, deplorable love-of-country stance, how violently I hate all this, how despicable an ignorable war is; I would rather be torn to shreds than be a part of so base an action! It is my conviction that killing under the cloak of war is nothing but an act of murder." - Albert Einstein Web - Blog - RSS - Math - LinkedIn - BM
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Red Stateler wrote:
Exactly. I didn't say he was a Muslim. I said I suspect he is
Exactly, which is why i suggested that he could be coptic christian
Red Stateler wrote:
I suspect he is one given that he is a chief archeologist for that 90% Muslim nation and has a Muslim name.
That's racism...
Red Stateler wrote:
has a Muslim name
So Muslims can't have names such as Bob, Fred, John, Jane, or Sue. Egyptians can't have historical / region specific, popular names, even if they aren't Muslim?
I win because I have the most fun in life...
VonHagNDaz wrote:
Exactly, which is why i suggested that he could be coptic christian
Yeah, but you said that I said he's a Muslim. I just said I suspect he is. That's more than a reasonable suspicion given the fact he has a Muslim name and lives in Egypt.
VonHagNDaz wrote:
That's racism...
Racism is the assertion that one race is inferior to another. I'm applying statistical probability. There's at least a 90% probability that he's Muslim.
VonHagNDaz wrote:
So Muslims can't have names such as Bob, Fred, John, Jane, or Sue. Egyptians can't have historical / region specific, popular names, even if they aren't Muslim?
I've never known one to have a western name. In fact, I've known several who have changed their western names to Muslim names upon conversion.
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I don't believe you should name your son Theo. What religion would that fall under? :)
"He who joyfully marches to music in rank and file has already earned my contempt. He has been given a large brain by mistake, since for him, the spinal cord would fully suffice. This disgrace to civilization should be done away with at once. Heroism at command, senseless brutality, deplorable love-of-country stance, how violently I hate all this, how despicable an ignorable war is; I would rather be torn to shreds than be a part of so base an action! It is my conviction that killing under the cloak of war is nothing but an act of murder." - Albert Einstein Web - Blog - RSS - Math - LinkedIn - BM
Bassam Abdul-Baki wrote:
I don't believe you should name your son Theo. What religion would that fall under?
Unless you believe me to be some sort of deity, none.
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Why do you call it a Muslim name? Yu do realie that Arab Christians and Druze also use these names. It's like calling your name a Christian name instead of an American one. Hmmm, maybe yours is a bad example. :confused:
"It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it." - Aristotle Web - Blog - RSS - Math - LinkedIn - BM
Bassam Abdul-Baki wrote:
Why do you call it a Muslim name? Yu do realie that Arab Christians and Druze also use these names. It's like calling your name a Christian name instead of an American one. Hmmm, maybe yours is a bad example.
There are Christian names like Matthew, Mark, Luke, John, Mary, etc... Do you think Egypt, which is 90% Muslim, would hire a non-Muslim to head their national archeology projects? I doubt it. Of course, my suspicion is perfectly reasonable since the country is 90% Muslim. Those are good enough odds to double-down.
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It does sound silly when you present it that way, doesn't it? Of course, Christians don't present it that way. Christians believe that God parted the sea, not Moses. The only thing worth trying to attack in regards to what Christians believe is God himself. After all, if they believe in God, why should they have a problem with Him parting a sea? If they believe in God, why should they care whether there is enough "proof" that the sea was indeed parted? The beliefs of a Christian begin and end in God and those beliefs are not based on proof, but on faith. Admittedly, it does not make for a fair debate, but I'm not sure what debate has to do with it anyway. If the existence or non-existence of God could be proven, not many would be arguing one way or the other. But since it cannot, those who believe God is, take it on faith. Those who believe God isn't take it on faith.
Actually, there are more important things to argue about than irrational belief that would be seen as madness in any other light. Things like cricket, way more important :) -- modified at 14:36 Tuesday 3rd April, 2007
regards, Paul Watson Ireland & South Africa
Shog9 wrote:
And with that, Paul closed his browser, sipped his herbal tea, fixed the flower in his hair, and smiled brightly at the multitude of cute, furry animals flocking around the grassy hillside where he sat coding Ruby on his Mac...
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Actually, there are more important things to argue about than irrational belief that would be seen as madness in any other light. Things like cricket, way more important :) -- modified at 14:36 Tuesday 3rd April, 2007
regards, Paul Watson Ireland & South Africa
Shog9 wrote:
And with that, Paul closed his browser, sipped his herbal tea, fixed the flower in his hair, and smiled brightly at the multitude of cute, furry animals flocking around the grassy hillside where he sat coding Ruby on his Mac...
Paul Watson wrote:
Others would call it the scientific method, that of proof required not lack of proof.
And yet your lack of proof in the non-existence of God is enough to prove He doesn't exist? :confused:
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VonHagNDaz wrote:
Exactly, which is why i suggested that he could be coptic christian
Yeah, but you said that I said he's a Muslim. I just said I suspect he is. That's more than a reasonable suspicion given the fact he has a Muslim name and lives in Egypt.
VonHagNDaz wrote:
That's racism...
Racism is the assertion that one race is inferior to another. I'm applying statistical probability. There's at least a 90% probability that he's Muslim.
VonHagNDaz wrote:
So Muslims can't have names such as Bob, Fred, John, Jane, or Sue. Egyptians can't have historical / region specific, popular names, even if they aren't Muslim?
I've never known one to have a western name. In fact, I've known several who have changed their western names to Muslim names upon conversion.
Red Stateler wrote:
Yeah, but you said that I said he's a Muslim. I just said I suspect he is. That's more than a reasonable suspicion given the fact he has a Muslim name and lives in Egypt.
we know, you keep insisting, which is a pretty strong suspicion for have no actual evidence
Red Stateler wrote:
Racism is the assertion that one race is inferior to another. I'm applying statistical probability. There's at least a 90% probability that he's Muslim.
and a 10% chance he's not, look at what region he is from, then give me a number of muslims to non muslims from that area.
Red Stateler wrote:
I've never known one to have a western name. In fact, I've known several who have changed their western names to Muslim names upon conversion.
im not talking about your limited interaction with islamic people. im stating that all religions have intermingled names. Are all davids and elishas jews? are all marks, peters, pauls christians?
I win because I have the most fun in life...
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Actually, there are more important things to argue about than irrational belief that would be seen as madness in any other light. Things like cricket, way more important :) -- modified at 14:36 Tuesday 3rd April, 2007
regards, Paul Watson Ireland & South Africa
Shog9 wrote:
And with that, Paul closed his browser, sipped his herbal tea, fixed the flower in his hair, and smiled brightly at the multitude of cute, furry animals flocking around the grassy hillside where he sat coding Ruby on his Mac...
You said, "God may have parted the water but who did the walking over the sea floor?" This is not different than your original objection that it is impossible for a sea to part in the manner described in the bible. We believe God parted the sea. Why should we then stumble on the sea floor? We Science bows to God, not the other way around. I said, "Those who believe God isn't take it on faith." You responded, "If you call not believing in a pink tea-pot orbiting the Sun then yes, I have faith. Others would call it the scientific method, that of proof required not lack of proof." Atheism isn't the lack of a belief in God. It is the acting belief that he does not exist. Where is your proof that God does not exist? You cannot prove God does not exist any more than I can prove that He does. How is does your belief require less faith than mine?