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  3. VBxxxx (fill in your most hated incarnation) SUCKS

VBxxxx (fill in your most hated incarnation) SUCKS

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  • N Nish Nishant

    From what little I understand, VBx (VB 10) will support the DLR (Dynamic Language Runtime) - just like other dynamic languages like Ruby. Currently VB.NET is not a dynamically typed language (VBers please correct me if I am wrong).

    Regards, Nish


    Nish’s thoughts on MFC, C++/CLI and .NET (my blog)
    My latest book : C++/CLI in Action / Amazon.com link

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    NealAB
    wrote on last edited by
    #18

    Does this mean that my VB program will be able to build a string that describes VB procedure and then run it (passing in params somehow)? And that my procedure will be able to find itself and change itself while it is running? Or is that too much to ask.

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    • N Nish Nishant

      John Simmons / outlaw programmer wrote:

      You have to explain to them what you mean by "typed". their first response is likely to be something like, "Of course my code is typed. Do you think i magically project it onto the screen with the power of my mind?"

      Cruel! :laugh:

      Regards, Nish


      Nish’s thoughts on MFC, C++/CLI and .NET (my blog)
      My latest book : C++/CLI in Action / Amazon.com link

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      TheGreatAndPowerfulOz
      wrote on last edited by
      #19

      Cruel, but TRUE!

      Silence is the voice of complicity. Strange women lying in ponds distributing swords is no basis for a system of government. -- monty python Might I suggest that the universe was always the size of the cosmos. It is just that at one point the cosmos was the size of a marble. -- Colin Angus Mackay

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      • A Al Beback

        John Simmons / outlaw programmer wrote:

        evil incarnation of Visual Baisc.

        It takes time, but you will be assimilated. :) When you start looking at how easy and quickly business apps can be written with it, you might actually start liking it, a little. The syntax? Yep, it sucks. But the IDE practically fills in (and indents) all that wonderful verbosity for you, so you don't feel the pain.


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        Chris Austin
        wrote on last edited by
        #20

        Al Beback wrote:

        you don't feel the pain.

        [Note:] I am assuming VB 1 - 6 Until you try to do something silly like gasp interact with the operating system or use threads.

        My Blog A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects. - -Lazarus Long

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        • D Douglas Troy

          So what are you saying Nish? It will dynamically suck, or suck dynamically? :-D


          :..::. Douglas H. Troy ::..
          Bad Astronomy |VCF|wxWidgets|WTL

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          Anton Afanasyev
          wrote on last edited by
          #21

          Douglas Troy wrote:

          It will dynamically suck, or suck dynamically?

          How about both?:laugh:


          :badger:

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          • J Jim Crafton

            I don't understand this whole "dynamic VB" thing. Isn't VB dynamic already? Doesn't it perform method coupling at runtime, not "compile" time? Is this a change due to VB.Net? Has there been a progression like: VB6 - dynamic VB.NeT - not dynamic VB-X - dynamic Remember, I'm just a caveman. I fell on some ice and later got thawed out by some of your scientists. Your world frightens and confuses me! Sometimes the honking horns of your traffic make me want to get out of my BMW.. and run off into the hills, or wherever.. Sometimes when I get a message on my fax machine, I wonder: "Did little demons get inside and type it?" I don't know! My primitive mind can't grasp these concepts. But there is one thing I do know - when a language like VB has an X after it, then it has to be dynamic. Thank you[^]

            ¡El diablo está en mis pantalones! ¡Mire, mire! Real Mentats use only 100% pure, unfooled around with Sapho Juice(tm)! SELECT * FROM User WHERE Clue > 0 0 rows returned Save an Orange - Use the VCF! VCF Blog

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            A A 0
            wrote on last edited by
            #22

            Jim Crafton wrote:

            I don't understand this whole "dynamic VB" thing.

            Much of the information you will find released in the last couple of days surrounding the “DLR” seems to be marketing speak.

            Jim Crafton wrote:

            Isn't VB dynamic already? Doesn't it perform method coupling at runtime, not "compile" time?

            VB .NET has elements of a dynamically typed language, though unlike previous versions you have to be more explicit about it.

            Who is the creator? Finding Allah (Video) Surah Al-An'aam (Ayah 74-110)

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            • N NealAB

              Does this mean that my VB program will be able to build a string that describes VB procedure and then run it (passing in params somehow)? And that my procedure will be able to find itself and change itself while it is running? Or is that too much to ask.

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              Anton Afanasyev
              wrote on last edited by
              #23

              AFAIK that was possible back in VB6. In the dotNet-ian world (at least 1.1 and 2.0 for sure) you could use the built in tools to compile code (from memory or file(s)) to either file or memory, load it through use of reflection, and execute it. mm, what _IS_ DLR..?


              :badger:

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              • P peterchen

                :~


                We are a big screwed up dysfunctional psychotic happy family - some more screwed up, others more happy, but everybody's psychotic joint venture definition of CP
                My first real C# project | Linkify!|FoldWithUs! | sighist

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                Anton Afanasyev
                wrote on last edited by
                #24

                Thanks, now I'll have nightmares for a few [days|weeks]


                :badger:

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                • C Chris Austin

                  Al Beback wrote:

                  you don't feel the pain.

                  [Note:] I am assuming VB 1 - 6 Until you try to do something silly like gasp interact with the operating system or use threads.

                  My Blog A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects. - -Lazarus Long

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                  Anton Afanasyev
                  wrote on last edited by
                  #25

                  Chris Austin wrote:

                  interact with the operating system or use threads.

                  VB6 (maybe 1-5 too, never used those) wasn't _completely_ impossible to interact with the OS/use threads. Sure, you'd have to spend all you work AND free time to get it working, but it sure was possible. And sure, you'd have more code that actually made sure things produce the correct result than code that actually does what the program is supposed to do, but at the end of the day it worked anyway, albeit sluggishly...and that it would be the end of the _next_ day.


                  :badger:

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                  • A Anton Afanasyev

                    Chris Austin wrote:

                    interact with the operating system or use threads.

                    VB6 (maybe 1-5 too, never used those) wasn't _completely_ impossible to interact with the OS/use threads. Sure, you'd have to spend all you work AND free time to get it working, but it sure was possible. And sure, you'd have more code that actually made sure things produce the correct result than code that actually does what the program is supposed to do, but at the end of the day it worked anyway, albeit sluggishly...and that it would be the end of the _next_ day.


                    :badger:

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                    Chris Austin
                    wrote on last edited by
                    #26

                    Anton Afanasyev wrote:

                    albeit sluggishly...and that it would be the end of the _next_ day.

                    :laugh: You made my point for me, much better than I could. It shouldn't require so much extra effort.

                    My Blog A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects. - -Lazarus Long

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                    • C Chris Austin

                      Al Beback wrote:

                      you don't feel the pain.

                      [Note:] I am assuming VB 1 - 6 Until you try to do something silly like gasp interact with the operating system or use threads.

                      My Blog A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects. - -Lazarus Long

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                      El Corazon
                      wrote on last edited by
                      #27

                      Chris Austin wrote:

                      interact with the operating system

                      this is difficult... don't do it....

                      Chris Austin wrote:

                      use threads.

                      this is difficult don't do it.... other things difficult and discouraged: loops, recursion, creativity, thought.... so don't do it! :rolleyes:

                      _________________________ Asu no koto o ieba, tenjo de nezumi ga warau. Talk about things of tomorrow and the mice in the ceiling laugh. (Japanese Proverb)

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                      • E El Corazon

                        Chris Austin wrote:

                        interact with the operating system

                        this is difficult... don't do it....

                        Chris Austin wrote:

                        use threads.

                        this is difficult don't do it.... other things difficult and discouraged: loops, recursion, creativity, thought.... so don't do it! :rolleyes:

                        _________________________ Asu no koto o ieba, tenjo de nezumi ga warau. Talk about things of tomorrow and the mice in the ceiling laugh. (Japanese Proverb)

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                        Chris Austin
                        wrote on last edited by
                        #28

                        El Corazon wrote:

                        so don't do it!

                        But I already have!? Oh no, what do I do now? Will I get in trouble for it? :)

                        My Blog A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects. - -Lazarus Long

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                        • C Chris Austin

                          El Corazon wrote:

                          so don't do it!

                          But I already have!? Oh no, what do I do now? Will I get in trouble for it? :)

                          My Blog A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects. - -Lazarus Long

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                          El Corazon
                          wrote on last edited by
                          #29

                          Chris Austin wrote:

                          Will I get in trouble for it?

                          Yes... you will be caught in a VB.Net, and forced to write VB-X. :omg::omg:

                          _________________________ Asu no koto o ieba, tenjo de nezumi ga warau. Talk about things of tomorrow and the mice in the ceiling laugh. (Japanese Proverb)

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                          • R Rob Graham

                            Nishant Sivakumar wrote:

                            Currently VB.NET is not a dynamically typed language

                            Sure it is. Just set Option Strict and Option Explicit to OFF and enjoy the benefits of data type that magically adapt to the context they are used in, even at the expense of loss of precision or meaning. So we are moving from the Common Language Runtime To the Damaged Language Runtime to support a return to bugs inherent in runtime type definition. Great.

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                            S Senthil Kumar
                            wrote on last edited by
                            #30

                            I think you are mixing up static/dynamic typing and strong/weak typing. VBScript, for example is a weakly typed language, whereas JavaScript and Python are strongly typed languages - only that the type checking happens at runtime instead of (or in addition to) compile time.

                            Regards Senthil [MVP - Visual C#] _____________________________ My Blog | My Articles | My Flickr | WinMacro

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                            • A Al Beback

                              John Simmons / outlaw programmer wrote:

                              evil incarnation of Visual Baisc.

                              It takes time, but you will be assimilated. :) When you start looking at how easy and quickly business apps can be written with it, you might actually start liking it, a little. The syntax? Yep, it sucks. But the IDE practically fills in (and indents) all that wonderful verbosity for you, so you don't feel the pain.


                              SUPPORT OUR TROOPS

                              S Offline
                              S Offline
                              Shog9 0
                              wrote on last edited by
                              #31

                              Al Beback wrote:

                              When you start looking at how easy and quickly business apps can be written with it, you might actually start liking it, a little.

                              See also: Stockholm Syndrome...

                              ----

                              It appears that everybody is under the impression that I approve of the documentation. You probably also blame Ken Burns for supporting slavery.

                              --Raymond Chen on MSDN

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                              • K Kevin McFarlane

                                John Simmons / outlaw programmer wrote:

                                lately we find that almost all of the work we're doing right now involves some evil incarnation of Visual Baisc.

                                Prior to .NET I noticed a trend away from C++ and towards VB, especially for GUI and database work. But it's surprising that this is happening now at your place. Not transitioning to .NET? Or do you mean VB .NET? I know you hate .NET, so I suppose you'd moan if it was C# too.

                                Kevin

                                realJSOPR Offline
                                realJSOPR Offline
                                realJSOP
                                wrote on last edited by
                                #32

                                Like almost everyone else here, we have no choice. In each and every dreary case, we're maintaining old code, and there is no funding for conversions. I hate my job.

                                "Why don't you tie a kerosene-soaked rag around your ankles so the ants won't climb up and eat your candy ass..." - Dale Earnhardt, 1997
                                -----
                                "...the staggering layers of obscenity in your statement make it a work of art on so many levels." - Jason Jystad, 10/26/2001

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                                • A Al Beback

                                  John Simmons / outlaw programmer wrote:

                                  evil incarnation of Visual Baisc.

                                  It takes time, but you will be assimilated. :) When you start looking at how easy and quickly business apps can be written with it, you might actually start liking it, a little. The syntax? Yep, it sucks. But the IDE practically fills in (and indents) all that wonderful verbosity for you, so you don't feel the pain.


                                  SUPPORT OUR TROOPS

                                  realJSOPR Offline
                                  realJSOPR Offline
                                  realJSOP
                                  wrote on last edited by
                                  #33

                                  I prefer the verbosity because it means *I* have control over what's happening and when. I can promise I will never start liking VB.

                                  "Why don't you tie a kerosene-soaked rag around your ankles so the ants won't climb up and eat your candy ass..." - Dale Earnhardt, 1997
                                  -----
                                  "...the staggering layers of obscenity in your statement make it a work of art on so many levels." - Jason Jystad, 10/26/2001

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                                  • N NealAB

                                    Does this mean that my VB program will be able to build a string that describes VB procedure and then run it (passing in params somehow)? And that my procedure will be able to find itself and change itself while it is running? Or is that too much to ask.

                                    C Offline
                                    C Offline
                                    Chris Austin
                                    wrote on last edited by
                                    #34

                                    Or you can use delegates to inject code dynamically in C#.

                                    My Blog A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects. - -Lazarus Long

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                                    • S Shog9 0

                                      Al Beback wrote:

                                      When you start looking at how easy and quickly business apps can be written with it, you might actually start liking it, a little.

                                      See also: Stockholm Syndrome...

                                      ----

                                      It appears that everybody is under the impression that I approve of the documentation. You probably also blame Ken Burns for supporting slavery.

                                      --Raymond Chen on MSDN

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                                      C Offline
                                      Chris Austin
                                      wrote on last edited by
                                      #35

                                      :laugh:

                                      My Blog A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects. - -Lazarus Long

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                                      • N NealAB

                                        Does this mean that my VB program will be able to build a string that describes VB procedure and then run it (passing in params somehow)? And that my procedure will be able to find itself and change itself while it is running? Or is that too much to ask.

                                        B Offline
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                                        Brady Kelly
                                        wrote on last edited by
                                        #36

                                        You can do that in VB6 with the CallByName[^] function. When I discovered this it was the coolest thing since sliced bread, as I could use controls arrays, with a Tag property on each control indicating which property it was 'bound' to.

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                                        • N Nish Nishant

                                          John Simmons / outlaw programmer wrote:

                                          You have to explain to them what you mean by "typed". their first response is likely to be something like, "Of course my code is typed. Do you think i magically project it onto the screen with the power of my mind?"

                                          Cruel! :laugh:

                                          Regards, Nish


                                          Nish’s thoughts on MFC, C++/CLI and .NET (my blog)
                                          My latest book : C++/CLI in Action / Amazon.com link

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                                          Rajesh R Subramanian
                                          wrote on last edited by
                                          #37

                                          Nishant Sivakumar wrote:

                                          Cruel!

                                          Not at all!

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